 |  | 
Marduk
join:2004-09-05
West Chester, PA
 ·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by dadkins  :If the TOS is not to your liking, don't get the service! Don't give me this "Only Provider" BS. Yeah, but it's really the only viable provider for many people. | |
| | | 
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA | Re: No Likey? *Viable* is subjective...
Ever hear of Sat?
Got Dialup?
Sprint/Verizon data plans?
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | nathill
join:2004-05-03
Bloomington, IN | Re: No Likey? "Viable" in my case is satellite or 25K dialup. | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by nathill :"Viable" in my case is satellite or 25K dialup. Exactly!
*IF* Comcast and their TOS was SO bad, I would get myself a wireless card for VZ or Sprint.
If there was no coberage for VZ or Sprint, I would likely opt for dialup.
Bitching about the TOS doesn't affect anything... it's just bitching! 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | | | 
karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
iraq
 ·Fairpoint Communic..
| Re: No Likey? Actually, you're wrong. Bitching causes BAD PRESS, which is exactly what a monopoly cannot afford. Bitching alerts the public to how the megacorps are ripping people off. Bitching is what finally gets the politicians to pass laws to reign in their monopolistic ways.
Bitching is always the best solution.
--
The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity! | |
| | | | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: No Likey? said by karlmarx :Actually, you're wrong. Bitching causes BAD PRESS, which is exactly what a monopoly cannot afford. Bitching alerts the public to how the megacorps are ripping people off. Bitching is what finally gets the politicians to pass laws to reign in their monopolistic ways. Bitching is always the best solution. No, Lobbying(payola) gets Politicians to change laws.
Bitching is just that - bitching.
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | | | | | 
S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by dadkins :said by karlmarx :Actually, you're wrong. Bitching causes BAD PRESS, which is exactly what a monopoly cannot afford. Bitching alerts the public to how the megacorps are ripping people off. Bitching is what finally gets the politicians to pass laws to reign in their monopolistic ways. Bitching is always the best solution. No, Lobbying(payola) gets Politicians to change laws. Bitching is just that - bitching. But lobbying dosent keep politicians elected. Sooner or later, pols have to listen to their constituancy...especially if theres enough people bitching about it! | |
| | | | | | | | | | Grafton
join:2006-08-26
Morgantown, WV
·Comcast
| doesnt sound like you ever had to use/depend on sat or dialup
sat is more frustrating than dial-up = higher latency's about 7x more, 1500ms round trip to 200ms dial up
then there's dial-ups horrible ungodly slow speed ( todays web pages are huge for dialup ) and necessity for a phone line.
as for the data plans that is a viable service option but dont know much about it | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: No Likey? said by Grafton :doesnt sound like you ever had to use/depend on sat or dialup sat is more frustrating than dial-up = higher latency's about 7x more, 1500ms round trip to 200ms dial up then there's dial-ups horrible ungodly slow speed ( todays web pages are huge for dialup ) and necessity for a phone line. as for the data plans that is a viable service option but dont know much about it Yes I have! I had dialup via Bay Area Internet Solutions.
I wanted faster.
I looked at Comcast and READ the TOS/AUP - acceptable!
I agreed!
Here we are today 4 years later and I have even opted to pay the $10.00 Extra for more speed!
Like I posted in the original post: "... don't get it then bitch!"
"Only Option" is bullshit!
If y'all really want connectivity... you can get connected!
Dialup is $9.99
Want faster?
Might cost a bit more than $9.99, but Sat will work!
Latency or FAP on Sat? Sure!
What do you expect? The damn thing is 20,000 miles away!
That's a hell of a first hop! 
*BUT* it is faster than dialup!
If Comcast is the only service that has low latency, and fast speed, then YOU must decide if the TOS is acceptable or not.
If not, don't get it! DUH!
If yes, Cool! 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | | | 
Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL
| Re: No Likey? While you do have a valid point, you are overexagerating the availability and feasability of the otehr options.
Sat is only an option if thats the only thing you can get.
While dial-up is available everywhere, even when it was in its heyday, some locations still had to dial long distance to the nearest ISP. Now that most of the smaller dial up firms have gone away, there arent as many local numbers as there used to be. I used to be able to find 20 numbers local, last time I looked a few years ago, there were only 3.
So, even if it was free, some people would still get long distance charges. So not really a feasable option.
Just in case you are wondering, I have Comcast, the highest tier available in my area (6/768) and I am very pleased with it. Over the last 2 years, I've had less that 30 min of downtime. I have had some problems, but it was back when CC was upgrading so I kind of expected odd speeds and such. (My upload was 1.2m while my download was 800k). And everytime I go to the CC office or have to call them, I always get the friendliest people, so theres no customer service problems in this area.
Oh and I have a choice of 2 other providers as well. Att/Bellsouth DSL and Knology cable. | |
| | | | | | TIGERON
join:2008-03-11
Pacifica, CA | Twightlight-zone bandwidth limitations, and lying to the public of their hidden traffic-shaping policies....sure dadkins, you're getting a great deal.
utopia.net is the answer to get rid of these corporate monopolies. | |
| | | | ShadezeRO
join:2006-04-24
Fort Lauderdale, FL
·AT&T Southeast
| said by dadkins :*Viable* is subjective... Ever hear of Sat? Got Dialup? Sprint/Verizon data plans? >Sat
Overpriced
>Dial-up
Ancient
>Sprint/Verizon
Not available in all area's. At least not "3g" type speeds. | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by ShadezeRO :>Sat Overpriced >Dial-up Ancient >Sprint/Verizon Not available in all area's. At least not "3g" type speeds. >TOS unacceptable but you still get it
Piss, snivel, and whine? 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: No Likey? »www.tgdaily.com/content/view/37039/113/
Los Angeles (CA) - The first quarter of 2008 was a huge success for Blu-ray, as sales grew by 351 percent over the same period last year, reports trade publication Home Media Magazine.
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL
| You also have to remember that DVD had been around for ~7 years before it became the dominant format. I was the first in my family to get a DVD player, and it was 12/00 and a PS2.
And BD will probably have a slower uptake because you need an HD set or a BD is pointless. With DVD you didnt have to buy a $600-$1000 tv AND a $400 player, you just needed the $400 player. | |
| | | | | | 
HotRodFoto
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Denver, CO
| Re: No Likey? Damn dadkins, u have a Comcast Fanboy Tatt or something on yer forehead? Come on, people ARE going to bitch, and they have every right to. And sorry, but Sat is HARDLY a viable option. Give it a rest and stop trolling, if people want a REAL alternative, tell them the truth and that they should order Comcast Workplace which has NO Sandvine. | |
| | | | | | | bicker
join:2007-05-10
Burlington, MA
| Re: No Likey? Oh gosh -- cry me a river. People have a right to decide whether they want to purchase something or not. THAT is what people have a right to. I think we can see clear evidence here of how we've failed to raise our children right: That sickly sense of entitlement oozing from some messages here is something that in our generation would never have exhibited. Despicable. | |
| | | |
Marduk
join:2004-09-05
West Chester, PA
·Comcast
| said by dadkins :*Viable* is subjective... Ever hear of Sat? Got Dialup? Sprint/Verizon data plans? Latency. Can't play games on SAT.
Dialup is not fast enough, plus VoIP wont work on Dialup, or SAT.
Sprint/Verizon? No...
Viable seems less and less subjective.
Well I can't say that Comcast is my only viable alternative anymore. As of last year, Verizon Fios became available.
Until then it was a Comcast monopoly. | |
| | | bicker
join:2007-05-10
Burlington, MA | Which means that the service Comcast is offering is the best of the options. | |
| | | | 
phill
@comcast.net | Re: No Likey? well we know Comcast's response now | |
| | | | | bicker
join:2007-05-10
Burlington, MA
1 edit | Re: No Likey? No, you don't. Comcast is too polite to give you the truth, a baldly with a little pretense as I will.
And another thing... it is incredibly CRAVEN to assume that anyone who disagrees with your puerile antipathy towards Comcast is a Comcast person. Should I assume that you MUST work for DirecTV since you're saying bad things about Comcast?
Grow up. | |
| | RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
·AT&T Midwest
| said by dadkins :If the TOS is not to your liking, don't get the service! Typical corporate defense. How about working to improve the product instead of defending sleazy service terms? You are evidently one of the lucky ones who (1) get decent service and (2) aren't being affected by their lackluster network performance in some much bigger markets.
The "if you don't like it, leave" parroting is very tired.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
| | | | | | | RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11 | Re: No Likey? You continue to indirectly defend this, which I guess is expected. You added nothing but more of the same.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by RadioDoc :You continue to indirectly defend this, which I guess is expected. You added nothing but more of the same. Still... not defending anything except common sense.
You no likely, no getey. Simple enough?
I accepted their TOS & AUP.
I'm not complaining.
Service is fine.
I live in The S.F. Bay Area(not rinkydink area).
One last time:
If for any reason *ANY* service has something in the Terms Of Service that you don't like or disagree with, you shouldn't get the service, right?
Geez! 
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
1 edit | Re: No Likey?You have made the assumption that I am defending Comcast and/or their TOS.
You are quite wrong.
Don't like the price of gas at the corner gas station, go down the street a ways and get some other gas from a different station.
Don't like the TOS of Comcast, go get connectivity from another provider.
What's so hard to understand?
Guess common sense doesn't apply to internet connectivity.
Ok, cool!
Guess I should cancel Comcast, get dialup and then come here and bitch that it is too slow.
Would that be better?
I don't get something then bitch about it.
DUH!
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | | | vicorjh
Premium
join:2007-06-24
Arlington, MA
| Re: No Likey? True, if you have the option and you don't like to TOS then don't go for the service.
However, nowadays, many of the TOS agreements from the providers allow the provider to modify and update the TOS at anytime and for any reason. And, in many cases, the provider doesn't even have to notify you of the changes.
Add to that, the providers try to lock you into long-term agreements.
So, unless you're willing to "check-in" on the TOS on a regular basis, how do you really know if sometime down the road your "contract" doesn't materially affect you.
TOS used to be utilized simply to protect the provider from frivolous lawsuits based on normal operating issues. Now it seems the TOS a written in such a way to allow the provider to generate additional revenue streams while at the same time failing to provide the advertised service. One, being the ability for the provider to intercept your data for use in targeted marketing. Or, possibly, allowing the provider to throttle your connection under the guise of network management (while at the same time advertising "unlimited" use).
The other issue with the TOS from some/many of these providers is that the legalize is written in a way that the common consumer cannot actually understand they may be giving up some their rights. Should they hire a lawyer to interpret the TOS? Or, possibly the provider is hiding behind legal mumbo jumbo while promising the sun.
If you need internet connectivity for work, where do you go to avoid restrictive TOS? Buy a T1?
It's easy to say don't get the service. Though that is an overly simplified solution.  | |
| | | | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by vicorjh :If you need internet connectivity for work, where do you go to avoid restrictive TOS? Buy a T1? It's easy to say don't get the service. Though that is an overly simplified solution. Yes! If you are going to use your connection for WORK, you should get some sort of business service.
Residential Services are not intended for buisness use(hence the Business class of services).
Look, to everyone:
If for any reason the ISDP you use(whichever one you use) has anything now, or changes it in the future to some unacceptable level, drop them!
PLEASE stop paying for a service with a TOS that is crap and bitching about it.
If it is so damn bad... why in God's name are you still paying for it? Geez Louise!
WTF people?
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | 
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
 ·Skype
| You and I both have Comcast, so we know what the service is really like. But you and I have had Comcast for years. If someone was signing up for their first broadband service, wouldn't the Subscriber Agreement and AUP give them pause?
Fortunately, for Comcast and most of their CableCo and TelCo cousins, people get the service before reading them.
In fact, I just moved to an apartment a few months ago and signed up with Comcast. So, as "Mr. New Customer," my service was already activated several days before I was presented with my first screen showing the Subscriber Agreement (which only referred to the AUP by name).
(Yes, I admit it, I was installing the software. I was using the automation to provision the modem.)
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
| |
| | | | | 
Monster Rain
Premium
join:2002-08-03
USA
| said by RadioDoc :You continue to indirectly defend this, which I guess is expected. You added nothing but more of the same. It's easy to see why your an EX mod. | |
| | | | | | RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
·AT&T Midwest
| Re: No Likey? said by Monster Rain :said by RadioDoc :You continue to indirectly defend this, which I guess is expected. You added nothing but more of the same. It's easy to see why your an EX mod. Could say it is easy to see you are a moron. But that would be wrong.
--
Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
| | | | 
Tails
join:2007-09-25
Sanford, NC
·Windstream
| Hmm.. Ok, I guess what you are saying is that people just need to suck it and take the slow speed if they hate Comcast's ToS. Sounds like you NEVER had to deal with satellite or dialup. If you had bad service with Comcast and could never get it resolved, then I don't think you would be singing about Comcast's service as much as you are now. | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: Hmm.. said by Tails :Ok, I guess what you are saying is that people just need to suck it and take the slow speed if they hate Comcast's ToS. Sounds like you NEVER had to deal with satellite or dialup. If you had bad service with Comcast and could never get it resolved, then I don't think you would be singing about Comcast's service as much as you are now. Try reading the whole thread:
»Re: No Likey?
I have had dialup.
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | | 
Titus Pullo
I came, I saw, I slept
join:2004-06-26
·Embarq
| Re: No Likey? said by dadkins :I'm not defending it! I'm trying to get people to use a little common sense. Good luck with that!"if you don't like it, leave" Same thing has been said about The United States of America for years... and? Not a very good analogy, is it? Leaving a country vs a corporate TOS that snorts horseshyte with a Hoover.The thing is, don't even get it to start with then you won't have to leave! If you get it even though the TOS says something that you don't like and you start whining about it - well, that's not too bright! One problem with a TOS agreement is that it's like shifting sands; they tell you the TOS can change at any time. So you may agree with it at the outset but years later realize you're living under a Nazi regime with lousy -- or no -- alternatives. I don't bother bashing Comcast because I dropped them some time ago rather than bitch. I'm still hanging onto their TV service, and would go Dish but they're just as bad with the sign up offers that vanish in the wind a year or less down the road. That's me in bold, BTW. I'm feeling real lazy today ...
-- | |
| | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA | Re: No Likey? Thank you!
Yeah. Common Sense seems to be at a premium... | |
| | | | | | 
BabyBear
Keep wise ...with Night-Owl
join:2007-01-11
| Re: No Likey? said by dadkins :Thank you! Yeah. Common Sense seems to be at a premium... Thats cause people with the "common sense" either took your advice and 'moved to another country', or are so busy trying to turn down Comcast retention offers so they can sign up for their more beloved NEW ISP's service or we are just using that "common sense" for once to just shake our heads, laugh a bit at the whining about whining rants and moved on. | |
| | | | | | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by BabyBear :just using that "common sense" for once to just shake our heads, laugh a bit at the whining about whining rants and moved on. LOL!
Great example! Thanks!
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | 
ib50MbSoon
Formerly TwoKDialup
Premium
join:2002-06-07
Coloma, MI
| said by RadioDoc :The "if you don't like it, leave" parroting is very tired. I believe some telco shill coined that phrase was years ago when Ameritech started redlining DSL deployment and AT&T failed miserably at upgrading their cable systems. As far as I know, DSL is still not available at my address. I haven't seen any Pew-Verse lawn fridges sprouting up so apparently it won't be any time soon either.
But thankfully, Comcast bought out AT&T Cable and fixed T's phucking train wreck of a cable system or I'd still be on T's 2k dialup.
However, the bottom line is that I subscribe to all of Comcast's services and they all perform flawlessly. I couldn't care less about the TOS since it doesn't effect me.
Have a nice day, you silly rabbit! 
--
Comcast has spoiled me rotten! | |
| | | | NormanS
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: No Likey? said by ib50MbSoon :But thankfully, Comcast bought out AT&T Cable and fixed T's phucking train wreck of a cable system or I'd still be on T's 2k dialup. If you were covered by Ameritech as your ILEC, then the "T" dial-up would have been with AT&T Worldnet Services; at that time a different company than either Ameritech, or SBC, which subsequently bought Ameritech.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
| | | | | RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
·AT&T Midwest
| Re: No Likey? said by NormanS :said by ib50MbSoon :But thankfully, Comcast bought out AT&T Cable and fixed T's phucking train wreck of a cable system or I'd still be on T's 2k dialup. If you were covered by Ameritech as your ILEC, then the "T" dial-up would have been with AT&T Worldnet Services; at that time a different company than either Ameritech, or SBC, which subsequently bought Ameritech. He's so stoned he doesn't even remember who the cable company was back then. Don't bother.
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Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
| | | | | | notwrth10
join:2007-03-03
1001EB | Re: No Likey? He will be the next one we are reading about that kills a
customer.
I like to call it "The Comcastic Fast Death"
Has a nice ring to it does it not? | |
| | | | notwrth10
join:2007-03-03
1001EB
| I could be way off but I think the rabbit is more harmless than what Janice Ordidge got. I am sure she would have been happier with a vrad box instead of one of these. I am sure she probably would have chose "slow DSL" as opposed to "fast death". Maybe if Janice had AT&T she could have lived longer!
comcastic box
I am guessing poor Janice got an upgrade right? or would this be considered a downgrade? Doesn't he just seem so comcastic to you?
Comcast subcontractor that delivered the service Janice got!
Comcast: They just "kill" for the competition! | |
| | | | RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11
·AT&T Midwest
| said by ib50MbSoon :Have a nice day, you silly rabbit! We'll wave at you in your box under the I-94 Coloma exit overpass as we drive by next month. C-ya!
--
Toolmaster of La Grange. | |
| | | | |
See 7 replies to this post | |
| Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| how many can even fully understand a TOS or EULA, ive tried reading both types of document and there is some plain english but the rest is that Legalese bullshit that only a lawyer can figure out.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
| | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? As with ANY legal document, if you cannot read or understand it, ya really shouldn't agree to it.
Get someone that can read/understand it and have them explain what it says.
I understood enough of it to accept it.
If anything ever pops up that I just cannot deal with - CYA!
I sure as hell aint coming here and sniveling about it! Ya know?
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | | |
Choochoocachoo
@charter.com
| Re: No Likey? said by dadkins
I sure as hell aint coming here and sniveling about it! Ya know?
[/BQUOTE :Who here is? You're confusing an article with a forum post. In fact, you're the only one who's really sniveling about anything. | |
| | | | | | | | | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| said by dadkins :As with ANY legal document, if you cannot read or understand it, ya really shouldn't agree to it. Get someone that can read/understand it and have them explain what it says. I understood enough of it to accept it. If anything ever pops up that I just cannot deal with - CYA! I sure as hell aint coming here and sniveling about it! Ya know? i basicly just need the basic idea of it, many ISPs infact have similar basic ground rules. my favorite is people who run a business over residental cable plans and then demand prompt service and SLA class refunds because they are loosing tons of money. yet they dont call commercial services which can offer faster truck rolls.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
| | 
stomp357
join:2003-04-13
Lake Charles, LA
·Suddenlink
| said by dadkins :If the TOS is not to your liking, don't get the service! Don't give me this "Only Provider" BS. Either you accept it or not - don't get it then bitch! I agreed and got the service! While I may not approve of the whole Sandvine horseshit, if it was such a POS I would cancel. Sandvine on BT vs 16mbps... Hmmm. I'm still here, aint I? *SO FAR*, my service has been great! That's 4 years and counting... started at 1500kbps x 256kbps and now at 16000kbps x 2000kbps. Sure beats the hell out of what AT&T(SBC) has ever tried to offer me! YMMV Don't you know? "A squeaky wheel gets a greasing." | |
| | |
dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| Re: No Likey? said by stomp357 : Don't you know? "A squeaky wheel gets a greasing." Don't you know, Lobbyists have the grease bucket?
The ISP can do any damn thing they wish!
It is up to you and I to decide to accept or deny the service.
NO ONE is holding a gun to y'alls heads and forcing you to get Comcast or any other ISP's service - are they?
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
| | 
knightmb
Everybody Lies
join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
·AT&T DSL Service
| said by dadkins :If the TOS is not to your liking, don't get the service! That may worked before the 21 century, but now Internet is considered by many to be as important as Electricity and Water (including myself) My electric and water service have terms of service as well, but they all fit on half a page and doesn't have to detail things out like "if your water pressure isn't at 80 psi, it's part of a water traffic management system that will penalize everyone in your neighborhood if one of you is wasting water".
quote:
Don't give me this "Only Provider" BS.
Either you accept it or not - don't get it then bitch!
That's a great idea, maybe my water company should do the same thing. If you don't like the service, then don't get water. If you don't like the electric company charging late fees, then don't get electric service. Go with other providers in your area right?
quote:
I agreed and got the service!
As did everyone that has Comcast, AT&T, etc.
quote:
While I may not approve of the whole Sandvine horseshit,
if it was such a POS I would cancel.
Sandvine on BT vs 16mbps... Hmmm.
I'm still here, aint I?
Do you even know if they are using Sandvine in your region of service? I would imagine that if you can BT at full upload speed, then the answer would be moot.
quote:
*SO FAR*, my service has been great!
That's 4 years and counting... started at 1500kbps x 256kbps and now at 16000kbps x 2000kbps.
Sure beats the hell out of what AT&T(SBC) has ever tried to offer me!
YMMV
Be glad you have good service, a lot of people don't. I've have good service with Comcast as well, but I'm on a different tier of service that most here.
I think the best way to sum up your post would be better stated as "If you don't like the TOS and you have another choice of provider that can provide similar service then don't complain."
Otherwise the "don't complain about the TOS when you don't have a choice" is a bit of a oxymoron. | |
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See 19 replies to this post | |
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user851
@comcast.net
1 edit | I don't see how one provider is a BS reason. It is a dang good one. Dial up or faster than dial up with a messed up TOS? Most will still go with the messed up TOS because if you remember how slow dial up is, you remember that you definitely do not want that. Most of the territories in the USA are in fact a monopoly and the rest are mainly duopolies. There are a few sections where it is actually more of a competitive market. If you happen to be in a competitive market then be thankful that you are one of the few blessed ones.
Give me a fiber optic service in my area or any other at all and chances are I will highly consider changing provider and leaving Comcast. I live in a monopolistic area like most and it sucks. Only thing worst than a monopoly is no broadband whatsoever in the area. | |
| | | NormanS
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: No Likey? said by user851 :
Most of the territories in the USA are in fact a monopoly...
Qwest covers the largest geogpraphic part of the U.S. If you qualify for DSL, you have a choice of ISPs; Qwest won't provision DSL service unless you choose an ISP. And you don't have to choose Qwest.
and the rest are mainly duopolies. There are a few sections where it is actually more of a competitive market. If you happen to be in a competitive market then be thankful that you are one of the few blessed ones.
I don't know how representative California is, but there are two primary ILECs here, AT&T and Verizon. Each region has a number of CLEC options.
Give me a fiber optic service in my area or any other at all and chances are I will highly consider changing provider and leaving Comcast. I live in a monopolistic area like most and it sucks. Only thing worst than a monopoly is no broadband whatsoever in the area.
FTTH will likely come from another duopolistic provider. Even in California, I don't think AT&T, or Verizon, allow the CLECs to resell FTTH services. (I've heard that there are a handful of "Greenfield Communities" in this state where AT&T has deployed FTTH.)
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
| | | |
WaitingForFIOS
@rr.com
| Re: No Likey? said by NormanS :said by user851 :
I don't know how representative California is, but there are two primary ILECs here, AT&T and Verizon. Each region has a number of CLEC options. Give me a fiber optic service in my area or any other at all and chances are I will highly consider changing provider and leaving Comcast. I live in a monopolistic area like most and it sucks. Only thing worst than a monopoly is no broadband whatsoever in the area.
FTTH will likely come from another duopolistic provider. Even in California, I don't think AT&T, or Verizon, allow the CLECs to resell FTTH services. (I've heard that there are a handful of "Greenfield Communities" in this state where AT&T has deployed FTTH.) Verizon, in California, does indeed allow ISPs to resell FIOS, at least for now. As for CLECs, no, there are none. I repeat, there are no "CLEC options" you refer to.
Unless we have permanent line-sharing requirements, and/or a spin-off of the copper plant to a coop status, we will never have local access competition beyond a duopoly. Last mile is a natural monopoly, and it should be regulated as such.
Instead, we get lots of rhetoric about "competition" that doesn't exist, and unregulated pricing for monopolies. | |
| | | | | NormanS
Premium,MVM
join:2001-02-14
San Jose, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
| Re: No Likey? said by WaitingForFIOS :
As for CLECs, no, there are none. I repeat, there are no "CLEC options" you refer to.
DSL Extreme. Speakasy. Covad. All are available to me; possibly others, as well. All over California. For both AT&T, and Verizon.
--
Norman
~Oh Lord, why have you come
~To Konnyu, with the Lion and the Drum | |
| | 
Quaoar
join:2004-08-11
Fort Collins, CO
| You are correct, up to a point.
Comcast, in return for user's accepting its terms of service, has an obligation to provide the users with proof positive that users are getting the service specifications that Comcast is selling.
Unfortunately, Comcast has yet to provide any third-party verifiable method for guaranteeing that they are providing a specific user with the user's contracted performance every second of every day, in return for the user's agreeing to the TOS.
You will counter that Comcast has no contract with its users, but that is a serious obfuscation of the fact that users pay for a given level of service and Comcast accepts payment for a given level of service that Comcast has no way to guarantee the level of service in a proof-positive method satisfactory to a third party.
Terms of service are OK, but there apparently is no counter responsibility on the part of Comcast to its customers. This is not merely a theoretical argument. In return for user's adherence to the TOS, that Comcast must reciprocate with a demonstrable guarantee that the user is being provided what is paid for is clearly missing.
The equation cuts both ways: customers adhere to the TOS, Comcast provides proof positive that the customer is being provided, 87600/7/52, a service level that Comcast has taken payment for.
Comcast cannot, or will not, do what is required on their part, so the TOS is null and void unless and until Comcast does what is required: a simple method for each customer to verify that their HSI service is at least what the customer pays for, and can be verified by a neutral third party.
Absent Comcast's ability to provide proof of service level, their TOS is nothing more than toilet paper blowing in the wind. A contract that is ignored on one side is null and void. Suck it up.
Q | |
| | | | zalternate
join:2007-02-22
BC
·TELUS
| Xplornets one sided contract How about Xplornet/Telesat satellite internet in Canada.
All this with the big ad on their front page of "unleash the power of the online world, on your terms".
Xplornet provides the Service on a "reasonable efforts" basis and does not guarantee upload or download speeds.
From:: 3. THE SERVICE & SPEED:
»www.xplornet.com/legal.php?id=2
And from::::
22. DISCLAIMER AND LIMITATION OF LIABILITY:
THE ENTIRE RISK AS TO THE QUALITY AND PERFORMANCE OF THE SERVICE IS WITH YOU. | |
| | 
hopeflicker
Capitalism breeds greed
Premium
join:2003-04-03
Long Beach, CA | Re: Xplornets one sided contract TOS dont mean shit. Some people think it's like the law. LOL
TOS is hardly enforced IMO | |
|
Monster Rain
Premium
join:2002-08-03
USA | Creds said by BBR NEWS DEPT :
Comcast Nominated for Having Worst ToS by InfoWorld Who is InfoWorld again? Are we suppose to care what every blogger on the net thinks about their ISP? | |
| | redhatnation
Premium
join:2005-06-02
Woodbridge, VA
·Comcast
| Re: Creds said by Monster Rain :said by BBR NEWS DEPT :
Comcast Nominated for Having Worst ToS by InfoWorld Who is InfoWorld again? Are we suppose to care what every blogger on the net thinks about their ISP? Who's this guy, "Farve4", and are we supposed to care?
It's a topic of conversation. Attacking the messenger only distracts from the issue. | |
| 
mod_wastrel
join:2008-03-28
·magicjack.com
| ToS... = CYA. Rhymes with POS.
The customer is never right. However, complain all you want to... the squeaky wheel may get some grease if enough people do it, and their PR machine has to go into overdrive to deal with it: bad PR means fewer new customers. (Or was complaining prohibited by the ToS?) | |
| Spawne32
join:2007-03-20
Blackwood, NJ | lol well they dont call it comcrap for nothing  | |
| 
HappyBunny
Hi. Cram It.
Premium
join:2001-06-23
Long Beach, CA
·Charter Pipeline
| Would this hold up in court? Okay in attempt to not just have this thread disintegrate into a total rant:
This part concerns me: consent to and authorize Comcast, its agents, suppliers, and affiliates to reproduce, publish, distribute, and display the content worldwide and (iii) warrant that you have the right to provide this authorization. You acknowledge that material posted or transmitted using HSI may be copied, republished or distributed by third parties, and you agree to indemnify, defend and hold harmless Comcast, its agents, suppliers, and affiliates for any harm resulting from these actions.
I am a graphic designer and I regularly transmit files to clients and commercial printers. Would that give consent to them to just take the magazine I just created (stealing my work and my client's project) and [print it themselves and sell it? The TOS doesn't say what they will do with these items, or whether or not they can profit from it.
They could steal my living from me in this fashion.
I don't have Comcast, so this is just a "what if" for me, but I am sure other people who use the internet for their original work would feel this same concern. What if you were an attorney and transmitted privileged info? A therapist who emailed a report on someone's mental health? Or a doctor who sent patient records to another doctor? All of these are possible and some would result in a lawsuit where Comcast to "publish them and display them worldwide".
There *is* an expectation of privacy (as much as exists on the internet) if you are NOT doing something illegal (child porn, for example). And certainly no one expects to have their information stolen by the ISP! | |
| | 
SLD
Premium
join:2002-04-17 | Re: Would this hold up in court? That's just another reason to use encryption when transferring files. I agree the TOS is ridiculous, but I usually see that text when ISPs are hosting customer's content, so they are claiming rights to display the content that you provide. | |
| |
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| I do think that paragraph can be improved:
Authorization. Comcast does not claim any ownership of any material that you publish, transmit or distribute using HSI. By using HSI to publish, transmit or distribute material or content, you (i) warrant that the material or content complies with the provisions of this Agreement, (ii) consent to and authorize Comcast, its agents, suppliers, and affiliates to transmit your instructions and data to a remote Internet host which may reproduce, publish, distribute, and display the content worldwide and (iii) warrant that you have the right to provide this authorization. You acknowledge that material posted or transmitted using HSI may be copied, republished or distributed by third parties, and you agree to indemnify, defend and hold harmless Comcast, its agents, suppliers, and affiliates for any harm resulting from these actions.
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon
HTTP is the new Bandwidth Hog...
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| | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | could this be part of their personal webpages? where since they are publicly available on the net comcast cant tell you they are secure.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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NetFixer
Freedom is NOT Free
Premium
join:2004-06-24
Murfreesboro, TN
·Vonage
 ·Cingular Wireless
·AT&T CallVantage
·AT&T Southeast
| said by HappyBunny :I am a graphic designer and I regularly transmit files to clients and commercial printers. Would that give consent to them to just take the magazine I just created (stealing my work and my client's project) and [print it themselves and sell it? The TOS doesn't say what they will do with these items, or whether or not they can profit from it. They could steal my living from me in this fashion. I don't know if this indirect method of obtaining rights to its subscribers intellectual property has ever been actually used, but as written it certainly gives them publication and redistribution rights to anything a subscriber transmits over a Comcast HSI connection.
BTW, it is not stealing, since by simply using their HSI service, the subscriber has agreed to grant Comcast publication and distribution rights to such material.
This is just one of the reasons why I no longer use their HSI service.
Comcast is not the only ISP to make such a blanket claim on their subscriber's intellectual property. I used to use MSN's ISDN service before better faster internet access options were available to me. MSN not only claimed publication and distribution rights, but they went so far as to actually claim ownership. That was not originally part of their TOS when I subscribed to their service, but was added at a later date, and I stopped using their ISP service shortly after those terms were added to their TOS. As dadkins said, "If the TOS is not to your liking..."
--
We can never have enough of nature.
We need to witness our own limits transgressed, and some life pasturing freely where we never wander.
Test your firewall. | |
| 
Dagda1175
join:2001-06-17
Goleta, CA | Same idiots who can't pay their mortgage? We need debtors prisons and maybe they can double to include people who generally don't understand contracts they sign and clearly don't understand. | |
| | 
jrobert69
How High?
Premium
join:2001-05-19
Rochester, NH
·Metrocast Communic..
| Re: Same idiots who can't pay their mortgage? Debtors prison, thats a fairly stupid idea. Accountability starts where the policies to protect were loopholed to take advantage.Those are the ones that should go to jail.
What we need are contracts written for the average consumer to understand and assist in their decision making, not one that takes advantage of it.
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Spring at last | |
| | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| Debtors prisons where a poor concept anyway, the lendor looses out as someone in jail cant work and make money to pay it off. they where tried at one point in history, there is reason we do not have them now. they failed.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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fishmaster
Premium
join:2004-10-08
Rockford, IL
1 edit | Is This True!! Gee..I wonder what brought this about...*as I am recalling a few CS experiences and the reading of the Full TOS myself*...Oh yeah, now i see it.
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Browse A lot - Sign In Little - Post Even Less | |
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Comcast Nominated for Having Worst ToS
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