dslreports logo
Comcast Now Third Largest Phone Company
Passes Qwest with explosive digital voice growth...

Sure, we've given Comcast some grief over the years, but one thing that can't be denied is the speed at which the company absolutely dominated of the VoIP (sorry, Digital Voice) market. Today Comcast reached out to us to note that they're now the third largest residential phone company in the United States, only behind AT&T and Verizon. As of the fourth quarter of last year, the cable giant had leap-frogged over Qwest with 6.47 million VoIP customers, compared to 5.961 million (and dropping) lines for Qwest.

"Customers are choosing Comcast phone services because of the cost savings," Comcast Spokesman Charlie Douglas insists, claiming that Comcast service is 20 - 30% less than traditional phone service. The speed at which Comcast got VoIP deployed means they're grabbing the lion's share of the landline defectors coming from the baby bells. The fact that Comcast service is substantially more costly than independent VoIP carriers didn't seem to phase consumers, who are increasingly drawn to triple play promotional deals.

Comcast of course would argue that the higher price reflects the fact that Comcast's Digital Voice is a completely different service from their broadband service, and untouched by Comcast's new traffic management scheme. That ruffled the FCC's feathers recently, but isn't likely to see FCC action, given we've seen no evidence the throttling system deteriorates indie VoIP quality (they worked with Vonage to ensure as much). Most reasonable network neutrality advocates also aren't interested in preventing a carrier from prioritizing their own phone services.

The result is that Comcast's Digital Voice service quality gets higher marks than independent operators when it comes to audio quality. Meanwhile, outfits like Vonage continue to struggle with customer defections. One telecom analyst firm consultant tells us that independent operators hold less than 10% of the market now -- a number that continues to drop. The recent Sunrocket kerfuffle did little to help the impression that independent VoIP is going the way of the dodo -- at least among mainstream consumers wary of unfamiliar brands.

The next phase of the game involves AT&T and Verizon finally taking VoIP seriously. Traditionally terrified of expediting eroding landline revenues, both carriers have been tinkering in the residential VoIP market only half-heartedly. That should finally change this year, with both AT&T and Verizon planning major assaults on the sector. Verizon's re-branded Voicewing service officially dies March 31, to be replaced by their new Digital Voice service. After killing CallVantage, AT&T is also cooking up a more serious VoIP product.
view:
topics flat nest 

RadioDoc

join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL

RadioDoc

Is this really good for Comcast?

Being number one in the churn-heavy, low-profit residential market is like being the #1 discount airline. Business lines are where it's at revenue-wise, and Comcast's offerings there are pretty lame.

I wouldn't be surprised if AT&T and Verizon weren't secretly cheering them on.

LeftOfSanity
People Suck.
join:2005-11-06
Dover, DE

LeftOfSanity

Member

Re: Is this really good for Comcast?

said by RadioDoc:

Being number one in the churn-heavy, low-profit residential market is like being the #1 discount airline. Business lines are where it's at revenue-wise, and Comcast's offerings there are pretty lame.

I wouldn't be surprised if AT&T and Verizon weren't secretly cheering them on.
Comcast really hurt you in the past huh?

Seriously dude, I commend you, you are dedicated to your anti-Comcast cause. Gotta respect that.

Your like that ex who just doesn't quit.

So what are the business offerings? Can you elaborate?

RadioDoc

join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL

RadioDoc

Re: Is this really good for Comcast?

What the hell are you talking about?

I don't consider...
said by www.comcastbusinessservices.com :
"Business Class 6Mbps Internet, one full-featured Business Class Voice line and Business Class Basic TV service, $99.00/month with a 1 year contract"

..to be competitive.

hambone42
Peace, through superior firepower
Premium Member
join:2002-02-02
Manassas, VA

hambone42

Premium Member

Re: Is this really good for Comcast?

said by RadioDoc:

What the hell are you talking about?

I don't consider...
said by www.comcastbusinessservices.com :
"Business Class 6Mbps Internet, one full-featured Business Class Voice line and Business Class Basic TV service, $99.00/month with a 1 year contract"

..to be competitive.
Actually, it looks pretty competitive against Comcast's own residential services, especially if you have an add-on VoIP provider. I'm spending somewhere around $90/month for 8/768 HSI and the full analog CATV package, and another $20/month on Vonage (disclaimer: these figures include taxes/fees, and the figure quoted above probably doesn't). I'd gladly trade the extra TV channels that I don't watch much anyway for more reliable HSI with decent tech support and the ability to run servers if I so chose.

Where did you find that bundle on the business site, BTW? I could only find individual services listed, and they collectively added up to more than $99.

RadioDoc

join:2000-05-11
La Grange, IL

RadioDoc

Re: Is this really good for Comcast?

Maybe it is a regional thing. I just used my office phone number and that popped up, literally, in a javascript-launched window. It was the first thing offered but they are in a dogfight on this system right now anyway, bleeding customers left and right.




You're right about it looking good against Comcast's other services, but you have to take the cable TV which is just cramming the bill. Equivalent AT&T Internet and phone service runs about 2/3 that. Plus AT&T allows servers while Comcast does not, even on their "business class" plan, an Comcast requires a 1 year contract. The price then increases to 'normal' which knocks them right off the table ($49.95 for one phone line + $59.95 for 6 meg HSI, no TV).

ComCraptic
@bellsouth.net

ComCraptic to LeftOfSanity

Anon

to LeftOfSanity
Been hitting the sarcasm bottle a little heavy haven't ya?

His point is valid. Residential users *typically* cost more in the service & support arenas. They are more expensive to aquire, and have the least loyality. Listen to all the cry babies on some of these posts...wanting a 100 Gig, uncapped internet pipe for 6 cents a month. they don't get what they want so they leave, and bounce around carriers. Business class users want to be a partner..thus the reason they are willing to sign 1-5 year contracts.

Is it possible the heads of T and VZ are giggling and secretly wanting ComCrap to take all residential lines...yea it's possible, but not probable.

NY Tel
Premium Member
join:2004-04-09
Smithtown, NY

NY Tel

Premium Member

Does not bode well

No reference to Karl's name but this does not bode well for independent voip companies does it now?
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO
·Google Fiber

me1212

Member

Re: Does not bode well

ya never know. if they(smaller VoIPs) did more advertising(like on the tv) it would most likely help. and once vonage fails(we all know it will happen look at their stocks[well the last time I checked]) A better independent VoIP will come along(which may already be here). I know there are of VoIPs way better than CCDV(well in tech support and friendliness) reliability depends on where you live some CC areas are most stable than others(my grand-parents said it[cc] was not doing so well on up time not too long ago). But there will always be some non-cableco VoIPs, if people want them.
westdc
join:2009-01-25
Amissville, VA

westdc

Member

Re: Does not bode well

said by me1212:

ya never know. if they(smaller VoIPs) did more advertising(like on the tv) it would most likely help. and once vonage fails(we all know it will happen look at their stocks[well the last time I checked]) A better independent VoIP will come along(which may already be here). I know there are of VoIPs way better than CCDV(well in tech support and friendliness) reliability depends on where you live some CC areas are most stable than others(my grand-parents said it[cc] was not doing so well on up time not too long ago). But there will always be some non-cableco VoIPs, if people want them.
said by me1212:

ya never know. if they(smaller VoIPs) did more advertising(like on the tv) it would most likely help. and once vonage fails(we all know it will happen look at their stocks[well the last time I checked]) A better independent VoIP will come along(which may already be here). I know there are of VoIPs way better than CCDV(well in tech support and friendliness) reliability depends on where you live some CC areas are most stable than others(my grand-parents said it[cc] was not doing so well on up time not too long ago). But there will always be some non-cableco VoIPs, if people want them.
Look for T or V to pick up Vonage (customers & equipment) when Vonage goes broke
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO

me1212

Member

Re: Does not bode well

T? V?
Porkroller
join:2002-01-31
Grosse Ile, MI

Porkroller

Member

Re: Does not bode well

I'm guessing V is a typo.

T is the stock ticker symbol for AT&T.
Vz is Verizon's.
Lion84
join:2007-08-10
Marietta, GA

1 edit

Lion84 to NY Tel

Member

to NY Tel
When our Triple Play intro package is up, I'm considering going to an independent VOIP company. Without the Triple Play intro pricing, Comcast Digital Voice is rather expensive.
kaila
join:2000-10-11
Lincolnshire, IL

kaila to NY Tel

Member

to NY Tel
said by NY Tel:

.... this does not bode well for independent voip companies does it now?
They'll always be room for those that differentiate their services. The VoIP tech chat forum is full of indie providers, none of which will get near Comcast's numbers, but offer solutions CDV cannot match. Simultaneous calls, IP Phone support, Asterisk support, custom CID, are just a few.

woody7
Premium Member
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA

woody7

Premium Member

hmmmmm....

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by woody7:

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....
Bingo. Time for all of the fee's and taxes.

Robert
Premium Member
join:2001-08-25
Miami, FL

1 recommendation

Robert

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by ptrowski:

said by woody7:

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....
Bingo. Time for all of the fee's and taxes.
Who are you trying to punish, Comcast or the consumer?

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

1 recommendation

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by Robert:
said by ptrowski:
said by woody7:

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....
Bingo. Time for all of the fee's and taxes.
Who are you trying to punish, Comcast or the consumer?
Comcast. Personally I would not want it to happen, but at what point does a company no longer get away saying they are not a "phone company" also?

My smaller indie voip companies get charged for it, so why is Comcast so special?

Robert
Premium Member
join:2001-08-25
Miami, FL

1 recommendation

Robert

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by ptrowski:

Comcast. Personally I would not want it to happen, but at what point does a company no longer get away saying they are not a "phone company" also?

My smaller indie voip companies get charged for it, so why is Comcast so special?
It was a rhetorical question. You would only be punishing the customers.

How can you ever advocate raising taxes?

You should be advocating lower taxes and fees on independent VOIP companies. Never advocate raising taxes to "punish" a company - it never works.

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by Robert:
said by ptrowski:

Comcast. Personally I would not want it to happen, but at what point does a company no longer get away saying they are not a "phone company" also?

My smaller indie voip companies get charged for it, so why is Comcast so special?
It was a rhetorical question. You would only be punishing the customers.

How can you ever advocate raising taxes?

You should be advocating lower taxes and fees on independent VOIP companies. Never advocate raising taxes to "punish" a company - it never works.
Lowering them as we all know will NEVER happen. Let's be real here. Once they get their hands into the potential money source the states and the feds would never let it go.

I am a realist here. I would LOVE to see them lowered. I have seen the indies protest in to no avail. They then either go out of business or pass it along.

So Comcast can get all the publicity, press releases etc bragging about it but then turn around and say "but we are different"? Come on.

Again, I don't advocate adding them, it is more of a statement saying at what point can they get away with using the "but we are not REALLY a phone company" excuse?

BillRoland
Premium Member
join:2001-01-21
Ocala, FL

BillRoland

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by ptrowski:

Again, I don't advocate adding them, it is more of a statement saying at what point can they get away with using the "but we are not REALLY a phone company" excuse?
Never, hopefully, because they are not a phone company. They don't own or maintain a POTS network, and I would imagine Comcast Digital Voice to Comcast Digital Voice calls never touch the PSTN. Its analogous to saying a satellite company is really a cable company, because they it also carries channels that let you watch TV. The end result may be the same, but the two are entirely different animals.

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by BillRoland:
said by ptrowski:

Again, I don't advocate adding them, it is more of a statement saying at what point can they get away with using the "but we are not REALLY a phone company" excuse?
Never, hopefully, because they are not a phone company. They don't own or maintain a POTS network, and I would imagine Comcast Digital Voice to Comcast Digital Voice calls never touch the PSTN. Its analogous to saying a satellite company is really a cable company, because they it also carries channels that let you watch TV. The end result may be the same, but the two are entirely different animals.
Neither does an indie voip company though so I have a hard time buying that they are different.
For the cable vs satellite comparison we are talking about the delivery of data, not really the way it is delivered.

jt7
@comcast.net

jt7 to ptrowski

Anon

to ptrowski
you should not say anything. if comcast starts paying tax on it then it would be past down to cusomers.
heatsker151
join:2007-10-14
Lebanon, PA

heatsker151

Member

Re: hmmmmm....

I suspect Comcast customers are already paying many of the same fees as other VoIP and POTS customers are. My bill (State of PA) has the Universal Connectivity Charge, Regulatory Recovery fee, and a separate charge for state sales tax on Digital Voice. What other taxes do other telco customers pay that Comcast customers don't pay?

Brad B
Premium Member
join:2005-07-07
Everett, WA

Brad B to ptrowski

Premium Member

to ptrowski
said by ptrowski:

said by woody7:

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....
Bingo. Time for all of the fee's and taxes.
Do you realize what you're saying? Taxes and fees get passed onto the consumer. I don't want any new taxes and fees.

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

1 recommendation

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by Brad B:
said by ptrowski:
said by woody7:

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....
Bingo. Time for all of the fee's and taxes.
Do you realize what you're saying? Taxes and fees get passed onto the consumer. I don't want any new taxes and fees.
Of course I do. But again Viatalk, Voipo, etc. are all smaller indie voip companies get hit with them. Why is Comcast or any cable company excempt?
me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO

me1212

Member

Re: hmmmmm....

I agree CC should NOT be exempt. I would rather have the smaller VoIPs not have taxes like CC, but if they(smaller VoIPs) must have the taxes CC should too.

woody7
Premium Member
join:2000-10-13
Torrance, CA

woody7 to Brad B

Premium Member

to Brad B
if you walk like a duck, and you quack like a duck, then you must be a duck.....you can't have it both ways....also did you see the winking smiley?

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

1 recommendation

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: hmmmmm....

said by woody7:

if you walk like a duck, and you quack like a duck, then you must be a duck.....you can't have it both ways....also did you see the winking smiley?
Well put, smileys and all.
travelguy
join:1999-09-03
Bismarck, ND
Asus RT-AC68
Ubiquiti NSM5

travelguy to Brad B

Member

to Brad B
said by Brad B:

Do you realize what you're saying? Taxes and fees get passed onto the consumer. I don't want any new taxes and fees.
I wish more people understood this. All taxes get paid by consumers. The myth that corporations pay taxes is embraced by politicians who like to hide the fact that they are picking people's pockets without them knowing it and people that need a refresher course in economics.
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx to Brad B

Member

to Brad B
It's just levelling the playing field. How can landlines compete when they get a tax burden $20 higher than digital voice That's right, they can't.

en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA

en102 to woody7

Member

to woody7
said by woody7:

Then they should be treated like the "telcos"

Taxed to hell.....
Living in SoCal, I already pay enough taxes. I don't need any more.
Rob2647
join:2008-08-12
Rochester, MI

Rob2647

Member

When the promotion runs out

we'll see how many people ditch digital voice. There are plenty of cheaper VOIP carriers out there. Why bother with comcasts bloaded, traffic shaped network.

••••••••••••••••••
macroff
join:2001-02-23
Sandy, UT

macroff

Member

So....

Doesn't really seem to be hurting Qwest financially, though. When you look at the total number of lines (residential/business pots, dsl, wireless, video), it hasn't changed hardly at all over the past two years. The ARUP is increasing per customer (up 21% over the past two years) and revenue is level. Qwest is not hurting because of this and is nowhere near dead.
Rick5
Premium Member
join:2001-02-06

1 recommendation

Rick5

Premium Member

Speaking of Grief

How much have I had to endure on this website for predicting for the last two years EXACTLY what is now coming to fruition?

Comcast. The third largest PHONE COMPANY.

This company is absolutely kicking a$$ and taking names to have accomplished that. And, what's to say that it's going to stop here? There's always second..and then first place as well.
I repeatedly warned of the very precarious position that the telco's were quickly finding themselves in and except for Verizon and their dedication to a fios rollout, were completely ignoring what was quickly becoming a major disaster in the making. And this doesn't mean that Verizon gets to succeed either. It's going to be TOUGH to do in reverse and capture a significant slice of the cable tv business. Especially with their very long...very expensive rollout.

What happens now with Docsis 3.0 and Comcasts nationwide rollout of that. Does this become the final nail in the coffin of companies like AT&T?

Time will tell.

But one thing is sure. Anyone who says that Giant can't be toppled had better think again.

~Rick

••••••••••

ninjatutle
Premium
join:2006-01-02
San Ramon, CA

ninjatutle

Member

Did they ever get 9-1-1 to work?

Or are people still dropping dead from calls not being routed through properly?

»www.emsresponder.com/web ··· -/1$1212

»itcanhappentoyou.wordpress.com/

••••••••••••••••

fatmanskinny
Premium Member
join:2004-01-04
Wandering

fatmanskinny

Premium Member

Next story.....

Comcast is the largest cable, phone and internet provider.

tubbynet
reminds me of the danse russe
MVM
join:2008-01-16
Gilbert, AZ

tubbynet

MVM

more like a telco than we think...?

well, their customer service is horrible, they (conceivably) hold on to their bread and butter service for too long, they charge to much and hide items under the line with taxes and unfees...

sounds like they are well on their way to being a telco already!

q.
twill1989
join:2009-01-03
Goose Creek, SC

twill1989

Member

Re: more like a telco than we think...?

said by tubbynet:

well, their customer service is horrible, they (conceivably) hold on to their bread and butter service for too long, they charge to much and hide items under the line with taxes and unfees...

sounds like they are well on their way to being a telco already!

q.
Seriously? Comcast customer service is comparable to AT&T, Verizon, or even Qwest? I remember reading in, I believe, the ASCI report that Comcast had worse customer satisfaction than most government offices, including the IRS. Come on...

Sly
Premium Member
join:2004-02-20
Tennessee

Sly

Premium Member

triple play is a joke

Yea, Comcast called me the other day to offer me triple play. I told them that I wasn't interested and that I had Packet8 VoIP, it is cheaper and has more features... That didn't phase them. They just kept talking and I hung up.

Have had Packet8 since 2003 and plan on keeping them until they kick me away...

kmb40
join:2004-08-02
Fort Washington, MD

kmb40

Member

AT&T and Verizon planning major assaults on the sector

"AT&T and Verizon planning major assaults on the sector". Yeah, right, now why does that sound familiar.

Maybe because traditional Telco's are always planning & talking instead of doing!

I highly doubt if any traditional Telco's will catch Comcast in this space.