 Gogo1
join:2004-05-27 Brooklyn, NY
| Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! "DOCSIS 3.0) will allow the cable provider to increase standard definition channels from 100 to 200+"
Bit pointless when only enough decent content is made to fill about five hours (generous) of air time a week across all time slots and all channels. What will they do with the other 33595 TV hours? Reruns? Infomercials? | |
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 |   GOLFnSUN Enjoy the sun Premium join:2002-03-03 Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! said by Gogo1 :Bit pointless when only enough decent content is made to fill about five hours (generous) of air time a week across all time slots and all channels. What will they do with the other 33595 TV hours? Reruns? Infomercials? If you like sports, there are many more hours of HD available than that. -- My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page Ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk? | |
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 |   needforspeed59 Cruise Ship Just Passing Through
join:2001-05-02 Glendale, AZ
| It sure doesn't take long for someone to crap on what seems like a pretty good-news story. What equates to qulaity air time is completely subjective. Heck, opinions in our home vary from me, my wife and my two kids. Myself; I am looking forward to more HD programming. I love movies in HD. More speed? Bring it on, baby! -- Great success! High five! | |
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 |  |   funchords Hello Premium,MVM join:2001-03-11 Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! said by AMDUSER :If it was me, I would install the Vyyo Inc 3 Ghz spectrum overlay. It would effectively upgrade the cable system to 3 Ghz without having to rebuild the cable systems. In some areas, Cox is deploying it, » www.cable360.net/ct/news/thewire/22781.html . That would allow for quite a bit more channel bonding as well. Thanks! Can you please give a couple of sentences that puts this into meaning for those of us who are on the primer? What exactly is happening here?  -- Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon More features, more fun, Join BroadbandReports.com, it's free...
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·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! What this does is add quite a bit of capacity to the cable system. It doubles downstream capacity and adding four times the amount of upstream bandwidth.[Depending on how it is setup .] The other part about it, is that it will work with existing equipment. There is some work needed, like amps and cable taps changed to a 3 Ghz capable one, and some equipment at the headend will have to be added.
This would add room for quite a bit of HD, faster internet, and more channels without upgrading to FTTP. It is also considerable less, $125 per home passed, vs. $1,500 - $2,000 for FTTP.
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···id=85046 .
This may help explain it, better than I can.. »vyyo.myspin.com/assets/flash/spe···lay.html | |
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 |  |   imrf Premium join:2002-06-06 Utica, MI
·WOW Internet and C..
1 edit | Just curious, have you looked into how that works? From what I just read, it's that same ultra-wideband crap that's flopped a bunch of times. They don't upgrade the whole network to 3Ghz, rather it overlays and injects data at certain points in the network. | |
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 |  |  |   anonimuz
@shawcable.net | Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! All they are doing is putting in 3Ghz passives. In other words, mainline splitters and taps. The plant is still at the mercy of their actives (amplifiers), which stated is 1 Ghz. It'll be a while before they start mass producing 3 Gig amps. | |
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 |  |  |  |   Fubar
join:2001-02-20 Phoenix, AZ | Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! The attenuation that 3ghz signal would cause would require all plant to be rebuilt to compensate....
It' can get bad enough on a 750 plant I would hate to be at the end of a line on a 3ghz plant.... | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  fiberguy My views are my own. Premium join:2005-05-20
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! Correct.
Now to another point. I think sometimes that people need to stop reading b2b press releases for their information. The 3ghz gear is trying to be pushed to gain sales. It's a pure business move of someone trying to hawk their gear. In the real world, as to where it means anything to the consumer, it's not being implemented because it's a huge mess for cable operators to implement. (as you said above)
This just brings us back to the "it works in the lab, but lets see it in the field" point. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |   Smokey I killed the Wabbit Premium join:2003-05-20 Va Beach clubs: | Wasn't Cox talking about deploying that on just a "few select" plant runs? Mainly bushiness areas to bring down the costs to service medium businesses? -- Para Bellum!! | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |   Fubar
join:2001-02-20 Phoenix, AZ
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! said by Smokey :Wasn't Cox talking about deploying that on just a "few select" plant runs? Mainly bushiness areas to bring down the costs to service medium businesses? 3ghz? Not that I ever heard... | |
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 |  |   noneyabidness
@comcast.net
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! Why not just abandon separate HD/SDTV and DOCSIS channels altogether and convert everything to DOCSIS?
Television programming could be handled by IPTV either through an MSO's established service or third parties.
In essence, you sell bandwidth (in conjunction with preconfigured IPTV settings) and give consumers the choice of how they use this bandwidth. | |
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 |  |  |  fiberguy My views are my own. Premium join:2005-05-20
| Re: Now comes with twice as many crap channels as before! said by noneyabidness :
In essence, you sell bandwidth (in conjunction with preconfigured IPTV settings) and give consumers the choice of how they use this bandwidth. This very point you're making has been brought up by Comcast back in the late 90's and again in about 2004. I've stated the same thing here and cited this point many times.
It's what they are working towards, however, as you know, while telco is doing it, there is still more issues for a cable system to implement this technology and make it stable enough to work. | |
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  Dogfather Premium join:2007-12-26 Laguna Hills, CA | It's easy to "conquer" bandwidth when you have 40GB caps While they're not enforced now there is nothing saying they couldn't in the future. | |
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 |   major marco Res Firma Mitescere Nescit Premium join:2003-02-13 Stepford, CA clubs:
| Re: It's easy to "conquer" bandwidth when you have 40GB caps said by Dogfather :While they're not enforced now there is nothing saying they couldn't in the future. Cox/oc does in fact cap/throttle. Ever try to download anything 50 megs and over? Try it sometime. There may not be an enforcement of capping, per se, but the throttling is sure abundantly enforced. The nanosecond FIOS ever becomes available in Stepford, I'll drop Cox services quicker than you can say bandwidth. Docsis 3 will start to look exactly like what it is.......a joke and a half. -- The Toll
Tracking Lord Stanley
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join:2008-05-22
| Re: Karl, you Ignorant Slut said by sirghost :I got one question for you. How is this article attacking cable and being pro telco? Based on all the smilies at the end of the post, I think that was sarcasm. -- --- Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab. | |
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 |  |  |   funchords Hello Premium,MVM join:2001-03-11 Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| Re: Karl, you Ignorant Slut said by NetAdmin :said by sirghost :I got one question for you. How is this article attacking cable and being pro telco? Based on all the smilies at the end of the post, I think that was sarcasm. -- yep. Our friend Karl gets unfairly bashed pretty good by some who think he's shilling for the Telco industry. -- Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- Hillsboro, Oregon More features, more fun, Join BroadbandReports.com, it's free...
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 |  |   joako Premium join:2000-09-07 /dev/null
·AT&T U-Verse
| Re: Of Course said by tschmidt :said by kfsutops :Of Course there is no bandwidth crunch. Nobody really believed that did they? The "bandwidth crunch" is pretty much limited to the First-Mile access network. Both ADSL and DOCSIS have some pretty severe constraints. /tom How does ADSL have "severe constraints" in the last mile? Unless you mean the speed limitation is the "constraint?" -- 09:F9:11:02:9D:74:E3:5B:D8:41:56:C5:63:56:88:C0 | |
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  fastman
@cogentco.com | ricky bobby If you ever met Jay Rolls, you would be dumbfounded how he ever made the position of VP of Tech. | |
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 |   a4960623
@comcast.net | Re: ricky bobby No kidding!
This "VP" once thought that AppleTalk was a routeable protocol! Seriously! | |
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 Ulmo
join:2005-09-22 San Jose, CA
·Comcast
·SONIC.NET
1 edit | Those 3 things would actually fix bandwidth concerns for at least the next 5 years, I agree.
When they upgrade their customers to SDV, they ought to throw in H.264 as well (or at least XVID). That way, they can deliver higher quality per cost, or lower cost per quality, or both.
Is this affordable in their market plan? I mean, they only charge a gazillion dollars per month, and this is going to cost them at least a small bunch of money to implement.
Unfortunately, they are content providers, not pipe providers, so there's so much management that is in their hands, that it might be too much, if you get their utility. | |
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 |  ajwees41 Premium join:2002-05-10 Omaha, NE
·Cox HSI
| Re: Those 3 things said by Ulmo :would actually fix bandwidth concerns for at least the next 5 years, I agree. When they upgrade their customers to SDV, they ought to throw in H.264 as well (or at least XVID). That way, they can deliver higher quality per cost, or lower cost per quality, or both. Is this affordable in their market plan? I mean, they only charge a gazillion dollars per month, and this is going to cost them at least a small bunch of money to implement. Unfortunately, they are content providers, not pipe providers, so there's so much management that is in their hands, that it might be too much, if you get their utility. that would kind of hard since the older style non hd hd/dvr don't see the H.264 or XVID codec new boxes boxes would be needed. | |
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 |  cornelius785
join:2006-10-26 Worcester, MA
| i'd also like to see a more modern and efficient source encoding scheme, but you have to make sure the cable boxes are capable of decoding the compressed video stream. i have a feeling that the cable industry is going to be changing a lot over the next few years. there are all sorts of new encoding schemes now, cablecard similar technologies, network infrastructure upgrades, and probably others. i suppose the same can be said for the telcos. could be an interesting several years ahead. | |
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 |  |  ajwees41 Premium join:2002-05-10 Omaha, NE
·Cox HSI
| Re: Those 3 things said by cornelius785 :i'd also like to see a more modern and efficient source encoding scheme, but you have to make sure the cable boxes are capable of decoding the compressed video stream. i have a feeling that the cable industry is going to be changing a lot over the next few years. there are all sorts of new encoding schemes now, cablecard similar technologies, network infrastructure upgrades, and probably others. i suppose the same can be said for the telcos. could be an interesting several years ahead. cable card is not encoding, but security. | |
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  pnh102 Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty Premium join:2002-05-02 Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| No Point in SDTV quote: The upgrade ... will allow the cable provider to increase standard definition channels from 100 to 200+ and HD channels from 8 to 100+.
Great. Cox is investing in yesterday's technology. Why bother increasing the number of SD channels at all when HD programming can more easily be crappified to be viewable on any SD television?
Is Cox going to invest more money in horse and buggy technology too? -- "At the moment of conception." | |
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 |   NetAdmin CCNA
join:2008-05-22
| Re: No Point in SDTV said by pnh102 :Great. Cox is investing in yesterday's technology. Why bother increasing the number of SD channels at all when HD programming can more easily be crappified to be viewable on any SD television? Is Cox going to invest more money in horse and buggy technology too? Some channels are still only broadcasting in SD, in fact, most of them still are right now. As long as you have content providers only broadcasting in SD, you are going to have to accommodate both until every broadcaster goes HD, and then you can down-convert at the box.
Cox isn't investing in yesterday's technology, they are accommodating broadcasters who are still behind the curve. -- --- Drilling for more oil is akin to giving a methhead the keys to the meth lab. | |
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 |  |   inteller Sociopaths always win.
join:2003-12-08 Tulsa, OK
| Re: No Point in SDTV it is good actually. Viewership in those crap SD channels will go so low that they will either convert or vanish from existence. Here is hoping QVC stays in SD forever till the end. -- "WHEN THE LAUGH TRACK STARTS THEN THE FUN STARTS!" | |
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 |  hihi
join:2007-05-06 Port Orange, FL
| Re: Caps said by iansltx :If you look at it, technically they shouldn't have a bandwidth crunch at all right now; their caps top out at 75 GB/month! Granted, they're lax about enforcing those caps, but really, the ope is that they'll at least increase caps to Comcast levels when they do upgrade the network. Also, wonder what "affordable" means in the context of a 25 Mbps connection. $63-ish per month with cable like Comcast's new D3 22/5 tier? What will be the upload speed? Honestly I'd much rather have a 15 Mbps symmetric connection than 25/2 or 25/5. 20/20 (like FiOS) would be better, but that's about the extent of the bandwidth I'd want  Too bad cable can't do it without upstream channel bonding...something Comcast has elected not to do yet. I rather have 30/15 or 15/7.5 2to1 is good to me 1 to 1 is not an option or a wetdream that can only happen in japan, korea or country that doesn't shape your usage...
100/10 50/5 10/1 the reason for 10/1 ratio is this... it is not meant for uploading but at 2/1 the uploading is still decent much like 56k modem they do not want us to upload anything they do not want us to have any freedom its a slaveband aka enslavement of your connection | |
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join:2007-02-19 Golden, CO | Re: Caps FiOS has a smmetric tier, and none of their tiers are worse than 5:1 ratio. Then again, my Comcast service is 4:1... | |
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 jester121
join:2003-08-09 Lake Zurich, IL
·surpasshosting
·ViaTalk
| Idiot There's nothing in today's technology that is going to be relevant 10 years from now, and any exec who think so is incompetent.
Recall that 10 years ago, AOL dialup was still the major player in "internet" service, and very few even had cable internet. DSL was just beginning to come onto the scene with 768/128 being the norm. My Blackberry today has more processing power (and far more storage) than my PC did 10 years ago.
Technological advancements generally don't scale in a linear fashion either, so I hardly expect things to slow down. | |
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 |  Sammer
join:2005-12-22 Canonsburg, PA
| Re: Idiot said by jester121 :There's nothing in today's technology that is going to be relevant 10 years from now, and any exec who think so is incompetent. Actually the one thing that will still be relevant 10 years from now are fiber optic lines. | |
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 |   SDKiwi VIP join:2002-05-27 El Cajon, CA
| said by jester121 :There's nothing in today's technology that is going to be relevant 10 years from now, and any exec who think so is incompetent. Recall that 10 years ago, AOL dialup was still the major player in "internet" service, and very few even had cable internet. DSL was just beginning to come onto the scene with 768/128 being the norm. My Blackberry today has more processing power (and far more storage) than my PC did 10 years ago. Technological advancements generally don't scale in a linear fashion either, so I hardly expect things to slow down. I agree with some of your comments but not your original statement. Technology in terms of hardware....I agree that will not last 10 years. But, I think the conversation is more about underlying architectures which last a lot longer than specific hardware.
DOCSIS has been in production for just about 12 years now and in the next 1-2 years, we will see a quadrupling of DOCSIS bandwidth delivery, both upstream and downstream. I can see those doubling again if we can resolve some upstream spectrum issues. IPV6 will be embraced as well, another architectural example where IPV4 has been around for decades.
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  dvd536 as Mr. Pink as they come Premium join:2001-04-27 Phoenix, AZ | 25000/4000 yeah. in fios areas. | |
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  John Keels
@bellsouth.net | Bandwidth Schmandwidth Well, I kinda figured that they were using the "bandwidth problem" as an excuse to squeeze more money out of people. | |
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  cypherstream Looking forward to the future of things. Premium,MVM join:2004-12-02 Reading, PA clubs:
| Leave it to Cox Why is it that only Cox will make a public announcement that they are going for all 1 GHz systems? Why can't cable GIANT, Comcast make any such announcement? Sure you could get stuck with Comcast easily with their large footprint, but that should also return more dollars to spend for upgrades. You think the #1 cable company would actually be #1 in technology as well? Nope, you get no such announcements. Their strategy is removing analog. Although that works, what's better, 54 to 1000 MHz of pure digital, or 54 to 750 MHz of pure digital. I don't care if Comcast goes all digital, but still if they had headroom to 1 GHz it would help future proof the network.
Comcast has too many Motorola plants which cannot do switched digital video with their antiquated 1990's I-Guide. That's planned for release A28, but were only on A25. It took 20 months to upgrade from I-Guide A24 to A25. Doesn't look like Comcast has any priorities in the video department. All of that focus went into CDV, marketing and HSI. | |
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 |   inteller Sociopaths always win.
join:2003-12-08 Tulsa, OK | Re: Leave it to Cox Cox is a giant. They are just private so you don't know their true size. This is one time I can say being private has its advantages because they can conduct upgrades without being under the mercy of shareholders who don't know shit. | |
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