Criticism Continues Over AT&T's Wireless NetworkMeanwhile, MMS functionality has three weeks to appear... 08:50AM Thursday Sep 03 2009 by Karl Bodetags: business · wireless · bandwidth · consumers · AT&TAT&T has spent much of this week doing damage control on all the negative press their wireless network has been getting, pointing to 850 MHz network upgrades in New York, New Jersey and Houston. The New York Times apparently wasn't playing along, running a lengthy piece yesterday again lambasting the carrier for capacity issues. All AT&T can do is remind the press than they're adding 2,100 cell towers and 100,000 new backhaul links, but by the time the upgrades are complete, their exclusive contract may be dead and users could be moving on to other carriers. Meanwhile, Techcrunch reminds everyone that AT&T technically has three weeks to enable MMS functionality in order to stick to their promise of delivering it by the end of summer.
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baineschile
2600
Premium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Really though Is there any tech company that isnt continually criticized? Comcaast for bad customer service, ATT for wireless network, FIOS for billing....the list goes on and on. | |
|  | openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA | Re: Really though They're easy and visible targets. Not much different than the health care reform debate and other discussions that have a potential to affect a large cross section of the population. | |
| | 
NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
 ·VOIPo
| If these companies don't want to be criticized, there's a simple solution: do things right in the first place.
I'm expected to do things correctly at my job and deliver results daily. Why is it so hard for companies like AT&T, Comcast, and Verizon who have billions of dollars in resources to do the same?
They need to start following some simple rules:
1. If you can't deliver on a promise, don't make it.
2. When you quote timelines for users, be sure that it includes realistic estimates, adequately takes risks into account, and has adequate management reserves.
3. If you fail in an area (customer service, for example), analyze why this is happening and implement changes in a timely manner. This should be simple to implement, especially when it comes to things like computerized billing.
4. Tell the truth. This is something that, unfortunately, is sorely lacking in most large companies these days. And it's one of the things that can cost you both customers and employees quickly, depending upon how large of a lie is told.
Sadly, it seems that companies like AT&T like to over-hype themselves, and when backed into a corner (like what's happened with their shabby data network and the iPhone) try to make all types of excuses and put use limitations on their products.
For example: AT&T needs to understand that when customers pay for a data plan they expect to actually be able to use the data they've paid for. That means that things like streaming video and VoIP over 3G should be allowed and not hampered/restricted. When advertising a data connection as "unlimited" it is disingenuous (to say the least) to do otherwise.
--
Trusting the Democrats to fix our economy and give us health care is like trusting the fox with keys to the henhouse, a brand new gas stove, and a pantry full of goodies for side dishes. In the end, all will be dead and nothing but lies will be told. | |
| | | axiomatic
join:2006-08-23
Tomball, TX | Re: Really though Right on!
I agree with all of these points. | |
| | | 
anonattuser
@solidspace.com
 from:
hottboiinnc 
| Have you ever worked in the business world? in my experience I've never seen a single company follow these rules, the big guys just get more complaints because they have more users.
It's the same everywhere, because making a buck will always come first to a corporation. | |
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NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
·VOIPo
| Re: Really though I work at a rather large firm that actually abides by these types of rules. It isn't that difficult, if management is good and sets the right tone.
Following these types of rules also makes good business sense. I guess your "real world" business is run quite a bit differently than the one I work for.
--
ObamaCare encourages euthanization of the old, pays for abortions of the almost-new, and rations care for all those in between while raising your taxes to pay for it. Government rationed, government controlled health cartels screw the middle class. | |
| | | | axiomatic
join:2006-08-23
Tomball, TX | Yeah I do. I'm a network engineer for the largest PC/Server manufacturer on the planet. My particular division is fairly ethical, but yes, upper management could not be more corrupt.
So yes I agree with you. | |
| | | | joker5656
join:2006-06-23
Dallas, GA
 ·Charter Pipeline
| said by anonattuser :
Have you ever worked in the business world? in my experience I've never seen a single company follow these rules, the big guys just get more complaints because they have more users.
It's the same everywhere, because making a buck will always come first to a corporation.
you left something out, when they implement things it goes through alot of hands not just a few so it takes longer. | |
| | | ackman
join:2000-10-04
Acworth, GA | Very well said. | |
| | | ggma1126
ggma1126
Premium
join:2008-08-30
Claymont, DE | In verizon fios billing case I can't believe with all their resources that they don't have a centralized billing system as it is each of verizon's (companies) departments so to speak each have their own billing systems thus creating mucho problems | |
| amungus
Premium
join:2004-11-26
America
clubs:
| oh hamburgers Ah good ol' GSM. So glad I'm not with a carrier that uses it.
I'm seriously surprised there still isn't MMS on an iPhone. Of all the things to not have... Granted, it's usually super-profitable for carriers, and should be pretty much free (maybe except for pic/video messages), but to not have it at all has to kind of suck.
Honestly can't believe iPhones are on AT&T only. Sure, some cities have faster data services, but when you're somewhere that doesn't, you might as well start looking for some wi-fi.
Here's to hoping Verizon, or somebody with CDMA (and a more consistent network) can someday get iPhones on their network.
Neat little gadgets - sadly lackluster network. Otherwise I would have probably bought one by now. Probably doesn't matter to the hardcore, I know, but seriously, if I got an iPhone, the FIRST thing I'd want it to do WELL and reliably, is be a phone, not just a call-dropping, non-battery replaceable shiny little status symbol. | |
| | dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
 ·Covad Communications
| Re: oh hamburgers said by amungus :Ah good ol' GSM. So glad I'm not with a carrier that uses it. I'm seriously surprised there still isn't MMS on an iPhone. Of all the things to not have... Granted, it's usually super-profitable for carriers, and should be pretty much free (maybe except for pic/video messages), but to not have it at all has to kind of suck. Honestly can't believe iPhones are on AT&T only. Sure, some cities have faster data services, but when you're somewhere that doesn't, you might as well start looking for some wi-fi. Here's to hoping Verizon, or somebody with CDMA (and a more consistent network) can someday get iPhones on their network. Neat little gadgets - sadly lackluster network. Otherwise I would have probably bought one by now. Probably doesn't matter to the hardcore, I know, but seriously, if I got an iPhone, the FIRST thing I'd want it to do WELL and reliably, is be a phone, not just a call-dropping, non-battery replaceable shiny little status symbol. Here is the problem: it's not that AT&T has a bad network. They have a very good network. But iPhone users use a lot of bandwidth. They hog the network. So if the iPhone were on Verizon, they Verizon would have the same problem and people would be blasting Verizon.
Let's blame all carriers. They push technology with glitzy ads but none of them actually work as advertised.
I say October 1st. should be "Let's all smash our iPhones, Blackberries, and Pre's day." We can rid ourselves of this problem once and forever. | |
| | | | | | | dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| Re: oh hamburgers said by iansltx :The "if the iPhone was on Verizon, Verizon would crash" thing is a myth. CDMA + EvDO is a more spectrally efficient tech (1.25 MHz channels) than HSPA/GSM (5 MHz channels). You can put six voice channels and a full (up+down) data carrier on CDMA in 10MHz if you want. You can't do that with GSM. Why else do you reckon that both major unlimited providers (CricKet, MetroPCS) use CDMA? I don't hear Sprint users complaining about the network with their new Pres...ever. I don't hear Verizon peeps complaining about their phones on VZ's voice and data network...ever. It's just AT&T, and even then the 2G network is solid. It's just 3G that is still crap in many places. CDMA can't do simultaneous voice and data at the same time. So really the experience with the iPhone would be less (just as it is with the PRE).
But there is some hope for those of you that hate AT&T. If (and I really doubt this) Verizon were to get the iPhone, they would launch it on LTE, not CDMA.
There is no way that Apple wants to build and test variants of the iPhone on different radios. That's not profitable. Right now one phone design works worldwide (except for China which needs no Wifi).
Sorry Verizon people, stop saying "The iPhone is coming to Verizon". By the time it does, the iPhone will be old technology and no one will want it, just like the Razr.
Verizon had their chance and lost. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| Re: oh hamburgers said by iansltx :The iPhone is two years old and isn't "old hat" yet. The iPod is much older and people still think it's cool. Your logic fails there. Additionally, there are PLENTY of manufacturers who are profitable and make their devices for different technologies. heard of HTC? Samsung? Lastly, voice + data simultaneously, while nice, isn't a make-or-break deal and I'd rather be able to do one or the other than to have neither due to network congestion. Plus, the next CDMA spec (if CDMA sticks around in the face of WiMAX and LTE, which I think it will) has the provision for simultaneous voice and data. I love how CDMA fanboys go the the theoretical "next" CDMA when approached with limitations of simultaneous voice and data. It is very practical. I have my iPhone tethered and I can say, make a phone call. Can't do that on Verizon.
There is no need for logic. Just a simple review of the inadequate capabilities of CDMA (and not the theoretical next gen that no one is adopting).
And any technology that is approaching a year old is old.
Personally even though I have an iPhone I cheer for the PRE.
But like I sad earlier. Let's all smash our phones and be free of the telco tyrannies. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| Re: oh hamburgers said by iansltx :The "next" CDMA isn't theoretical. It's very practical. It just wont be rolled out for another year.. Also, some people don't need the newest greatest bestest thing out there. My first-gen iphone works just fine...it's not worth several hundred dollars to upgrade to the next gen. That said, I'll probably be getting a new phone in a few months on Sprint. My iMac (late 2007) will get an upgrade to Snow Leopard when that comes in the mail from Amazon. It's been a solid computer and I haven't had any need to upgrade it. My HTC Mogul lived out two years on-contract before I got the Touch Pro... Also, if you want to talk theoretical look at LTE. Latest and greatest...which isn't out yet. WiMAX OTOH can do speeds comparable to DOCSIS 2 cable in the eal world. Which comes to the capacity thing again; AT&T and Verizon each have 22 MHz of spectrum on the 700MHz band. Clearwire has something like 120 MHz in the 2500MHz band. That's enough for twelve non-overlapping 10MHz WiMAX channels, or about 400 Mbps of capacity with the current system. Pretty crazy huh? But I am tethering and talking on my iPhone right now, not a year from now. So HSPA wins over CDMA in this case.
No one has signed up to use the next gen CDMA. Sprint is reselling WiMax. Verizon is switching to LTE. CDMA is a goner.
I still say any consumer technology that is more than a year old is just plain old. Consumers want the latest and greatest, subsidized, and always available (at least until the next thing is out).
So let's end this cycle and all smash our phones. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |
GSMTech
@comcast.net
| Re: oh hamburgers said by iansltx :On smashing phones, you first. Personally I like living in the 21st century. If I wanted nothing to do with a telco I'd simply discontinue service and sell my equipment...and switch majors (from Computer Science). Also, CDMA is going to be around for a few more years, just like GSM is still around with HSPA. WiMAX is on a totally different spectrum band so why not? As such, I think CDMA probably has one more revision before it stops being updated. I'm not talking about EvDO Rev. B, but I think the tech will continue to improve until WiMAX has been overlaid 100% over CDMA areas. Which will be awhile. CDMA is a dead technology. Like dcdeadbeat said, no one is continuing down its path. Everyone is jumping ship to LTE. Sprint will be the only one in the future with CDMA. They sold off their WiMax to Clear and will resell it back with backwards compatibility with CDMA (dual mode radios).
LTE will have the advantage by a long shot. And by extension, so will the GSM providers like T-Mobile and ATT. | |
| | |
NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
·VOIPo
| So then why is it that people were complaining about AT&T's lackluster network before the iPhone came out? I'm sorry to say that you've bought in to the corporate propaganda that AT&T tries to push out to everyone.
It's a sorry excuse, really. It's not like AT&T didn't know that the iPhone was coming, and that they had no idea of its potential. They've had quite a while to bring their network up to snuff-- even before the iPhone was a glimmer in Steve Jobs's eye.
I've been with AT&T for many years, and have never been truly satisfied with them. It's just that until now, I haven't been dissatisfied enough with them to want to leave. But that's changing. Corporate greed, inadequate infrastructure, and poor customer service are causing me to think about taking my 5 lines elsewhere. The sad thing is that even if I do I don't truly believe that I'm likely to have substantially different results... Oh well, at least if I move to Sprint I might be able to save a few bucks.
--
Trusting the Democrats to fix our economy and give us health care is like trusting the fox with keys to the henhouse, a brand new gas stove, and a pantry full of goodies for side dishes. In the end, all will be dead and nothing but lies will be told. | |
| | | | dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| Re: oh hamburgers said by NOVA_Guy :So then why is it that people were complaining about AT&T's lackluster network before the iPhone came out? I'm sorry to say that you've bought in to the corporate propaganda that AT&T tries to push out to everyone. It's a sorry excuse, really. It's not like AT&T didn't know that the iPhone was coming, and that they had no idea of its potential. They've had quite a while to bring their network up to snuff-- even before the iPhone was a glimmer in Steve Jobs's eye. I've been with AT&T for many years, and have never been truly satisfied with them. It's just that until now, I haven't been dissatisfied enough with them to want to leave. But that's changing. Corporate greed, inadequate infrastructure, and poor customer service are causing me to think about taking my 5 lines elsewhere. The sad thing is that even if I do I don't truly believe that I'm likely to have substantially different results... Oh well, at least if I move to Sprint I might be able to save a few bucks. I work in IT so I didn't buy into any propaganda. I have real world experience with all of the networks. And guess what, they all work about the same.
Do these people that claim the network sucks actually own an iPhone? Or do they just like complaining. | |
| | | | | amungus
Premium
join:2004-11-26
America
clubs:
| Re: oh hamburgers I've used an iPhone, but do not own one.
Personally just not a fan of GSM networks for phone calls as it's based on TDMA.
T-Mobile also uses GSM, which I also do not care for when it comes to phone calls.
Perhaps it's better in some areas, but CDMA for phone calls still seems to be far more reliable overall.
What's funny is that in AT&T "3G" areas, the data is actually served via a variant of CDMA
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_···s_System
In some cases there are also "blends" of both TDMA/CDMA
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TD-CDMA
...Speaking only from personal experience, I just happen to think that TDMA sucks badly for voice, and since GSM is based on this, it's not surprising to see the same randomly dropped calls...
Again, in some places, it's probably "better" but I still think it just doesn't work as reliably. Call me a "fanboy" or whatever you wish, I'm just voicing my own opinion and don't have a stake in things either way.
I also agree w/Ian that simultaneous voice/data doesn't make/break a deal for me either.
Hopefully a good standard will eventually take hold and prove to be the best for every carrier, and there will be reliable wireless service for both voice and data, no matter who you sign up with. Oh, and it'd be nice to add any phone to any carrier too...
...One can dream... | |
| | | | | | dcdeadbeat
join:2008-10-07
Washington, DC
·Covad Communications
| Re: oh hamburgers said by amungus :I've used an iPhone, but do not own one. Personally just not a fan of GSM networks for phone calls as it's based on TDMA. T-Mobile also uses GSM, which I also do not care for when it comes to phone calls. Perhaps it's better in some areas, but CDMA for phone calls still seems to be far more reliable overall. What's funny is that in AT&T "3G" areas, the data is actually served via a variant of CDMA » en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Universal_···s_SystemIn some cases there are also "blends" of both TDMA/CDMA » en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TD-CDMA...Speaking only from personal experience, I just happen to think that TDMA sucks badly for voice, and since GSM is based on this, it's not surprising to see the same randomly dropped calls... Again, in some places, it's probably "better" but I still think it just doesn't work as reliably. Call me a "fanboy" or whatever you wish, I'm just voicing my own opinion and don't have a stake in things either way. I also agree w/Ian that simultaneous voice/data doesn't make/break a deal for me either. Hopefully a good standard will eventually take hold and prove to be the best for every carrier, and there will be reliable wireless service for both voice and data, no matter who you sign up with. Oh, and it'd be nice to add any phone to any carrier too... ...One can dream... This standard already exists. It is called LTE. The problem is that there is no voice component agreed upon just yet. So any company that implements it will have to use VOIP.
Also be careful about Wikipedia articles about cell phone technologies. While it is true that AT&T uses W-CDMA, that is not the same as Verizon's CDMA2000 technology. W-CDMA is better known as HSPA (or even the older UMTS).
HSPA allows for simultaneous voice and data. CDMA2000 does not.
LTE is the upgrade path for AT&T, Verizon, and just about every other cell company in the world (except Sprint which is reselling WiMax from Clear).
Once LTE is available, I would expect to see iphones on Verizon but not until then. | |
| | | 
TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Brooklyn NYC
·Verizon Online DSL
|  AT&T 3g Steadily downhill in NYC
Since I only have 1Meg DSL service at home, I used to keep iPhone on 3g, now I keep it on Wifi, as the 3g is not only slow, but herky-jerkey.
If I could switch carriers without incurring a penalty, I would do so in a heartbeat. I am hoping that when my contract is up with AT&T, there will be an alternate option.
Bob
--
"If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
| |
| | mpeirce
join:2002-03-22
Lewis Center, OH | Re: AT&T 3g Steadily downhill in NYC Sometime it pays to live out in the boonies.
Here, outside of Columbus Ohio, the 3G speeds are pretty good. I just ran a speed test (speedtest.net) and it was 1273/305 on my iPhone GS. | |
| | cabot
join:2002-07-11
Apo, AE | Hey Bob
Drop the iphone and service, you will have more money for food..... | |
| | |
TamaraB
Question The Current Paradigm
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Brooklyn NYC
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: AT&T 3g Steadily downhill in NYC said by cabot :Hey Bob Drop the iphone and service, you will have more money for food..... Hmmmmm.... It's my one and only phone, soon to be my one and only Inet access. No problem with food any longer, I got a nice FoodStamp allotment; isn't life a bitch? I can eat better than you now, and not spend a dime. Eat your rotten heart out  Even have money for dating; some cool sexy women out there! Whoopie!!!
Bob
--
"If we believe absurdities, we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
| |
| k1ll3rdr4g0n
join:2005-03-19
Homer Glen, IL
| 3 weeks later... My crystal ball is telling me 1 of 2 things will happen:
iPhone users still don't have MMS. iPhone user's still purchase iPhones - regardless of Apple's monarchy control over the device. Users claim it works better than WM devices even though they can only install "iFart" and "iDrink".
OR
Breaking: AT&T requires iPhone users to pay MORE for text messaging than WM users. Both AT&T and Apple claim the "experience" is "better" on the iPhone thus is why people need to pay more - even though there is no different in functionality of text messaging between the devices. | |
| | 
ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium
join:2005-03-14
Putnam, CT
clubs:
·VOIPo
·Metrocast Communic..
·AT&T DSL Service
·ViaTalk
| Re: 3 weeks later... said by k1ll3rdr4g0n :My crystal ball is telling me 1 of 2 things will happen: iPhone users still don't have MMS. iPhone user's still purchase iPhones - regardless of Apple's monarchy control over the device. Users claim it works better than WM devices even though they can only install "iFart" and "iDrink". OR Breaking: AT&T requires iPhone users to pay MORE for text messaging than WM users. Both AT&T and Apple claim the "experience" is "better" on the iPhone thus is why people need to pay more - even though there is no different in functionality of text messaging between the devices. Boy you don't give up do you? If people like the device, who the hell cares? Is it affecting you personally? Doubtful. There won't be a different rate plan based on device OS. Nice try though. I would be floored personally if AT&T (reminding you that not having MMS is an AT&T issue, not an Apple issue) actually got MMS up and running by the 21st.
But enough is enough already.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."
Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org | |
| | |
NOVA_Guy
Obama- Commander in Thief
Premium
join:2002-03-05
·VOIPo
| Re: 3 weeks later... If AT&T doesn't have MMS running by the 21st I wonder if I could cancel my line without penalties then... since AT&T would essentially be breaking their end of the contract by not providing service.
Perhaps then I could move one line over to Sprint as a test, to see how well the Palm Pre works on their network compared to my current iPhone experience.
--
Trusting the Democrats to fix our economy and give us health care is like trusting the fox with keys to the henhouse, a brand new gas stove, and a pantry full of goodies for side dishes. In the end, all will be dead and nothing but lies will be told. | |
| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | k1ll3rdr4g0n
join:2005-03-19
Homer Glen, IL
| said by GeekJedi :said by k1ll3rdr4g0n :Users claim it works better than WM devices even though they can only install "iFart" and "iDrink". Or LogMeIn or Tomtom or VNC or YouTube or Google Earth or Crash Kart or VoIP Walkie Talkie...those are just a few of the apps I have. Come to think of it, I don't have iFart or iDrink on mine. So it appears to me that you might be a little uneducated. OR Breaking: You're a troll. Seems to me like you have an iPhone, and I didn't need a crystal ball for that one.
Lets go down the list:
The logmein iPhone app isn't free, albiet convient, isn't free. Here is an alternative to VNC remote desktop system for Windows..
But, why would you want to remote your desktop from a small screen is beyond me apparently. I would just as quickly whip out my netbook and use ICSControl to use the data connection on my phone on my netbook without having to pay some ungodly fee or void the warranty of my device.
As far as Tom Tom, why do you need to pay for a GPS software when you have Google Maps. If you are that attached to Tom Tom then it is available for the Windows Mobile platform. Strapped for cash, then how about amAze?
VNC client? Really? I haven't used VNC in YEARS. The only platform that I would think of using that on is Linux, which if you want remote desktop on that I would recommend NoMachine. But, if for some reason you really REALLY want to use VNC, you can do this on Windows Mobile. Covering the Windows front the more recent WM devices I have bought have a RDP client pre-installed. Which leaves the Mac front...which I guess you need to use VNC. If you are using VNC for tech-support - do yourself a favor and use Croosloop instead.
Youtube comes pre-installed on modern WM devices. For those with WM devices who have missed the boat here is a friendly link!
I didn't realize that iPhone's have Google Earth, but it goes back to my original argument - why on Earth (pun intended) would you use an application like Google Earth on a small screen. Would it not make sense to use it on a large(r) monitor on your desktop? I can understand Google Maps, which WM users can get, to use a maps/GPS system...but I just can't see why you would want to use Google Earth on a small screen device. I could defiantly see you using it on the Apple tablet if/when it ever comes out however.
Albeit, "Crash Kart" is a iPhone exclusive game (which I am kind of confused on why you would even mention it), it does beg the question of what you believe the function of your device really is. To me I see my WM as a tool; not a toy. Perhaps you see the iPhone as a toy and not a tool. Everything that I use on a day-to-day basis I view as a tool to help me become better organized, live my life better, keep track of my servers...ect ect.
But, since we don't want Windows Mobile to feel lonely...Microsoft has the ability for you to use Direct3D on WM devices. OpenGL is great and all (especially for being free and opensource), but there are reasons why DirectX is more popular than OpenGL for game development.
I found your "walkie-talkie VOIP" app but it cost's $2. I did however find something quite interesting for WM devices (of course that's free). If you really want to talk VOIP applications, sit down let's talk about Skype. Nah, I won't go THAT low.
Now, let's talk about YOU.  .
You missed my obvious attempt at sarcasm, which we both know the only apps on the Apple store is not "iFart" and "iDrink". I was trying to make a point however, that there *appears* to be more novelty applications in the app store than actual apps that allow you to be more productive in your day-to-day actions. Especially, when you read news about applications like the "I am rich" app; and Google Voice getting pulled...you have to wonder what is actually IN the app store if Apple pulls things that are useful but lets "I am rich" slip through the cracks. Is that not a fair deduction?
No matter, I am not uneducated - especially not when it comes to the mobile platform. Though, calling someone else uneducated without providing hard evidence to back yourself up does raise a few eyebrows no?
Through my previous paragraphs I have shown that only 3/7 of the applications you provided as a sample (which 1 is an iPhone exclusive, which I wouldn't normally count but many will complain so I'll include in the stats) do not have direct WM counter-parts. The rest all seem to have some sort of version on WM platform, in fact usually the version on the WM platform is cheaper (usually free) than what you can get on the iPhone. In fact the only application I linked to that you need to pay for is Tom-Tom which again there is an alternative free version of that service in another flavor.
I do not believe I ever say that WM devices are better than iPhone (and if I did I am wrong, just making this clear so you can better understand my position). Each device has it's pros and cons. But, for those who believe that the iPhone can do a lot of things that the WM platform can't...are wrong, period.
Most applications that you can think of on the iPhone most likely have a WM counter-part. Do you really think that Apple's idea of not having multiple apps that do the same thing a good idea? I'm sorry but I like competition because it usually breeds innovation and competitive pricing (USUALLY). Do you really believe that it's a good idea for Apple to tell you what you can and can't install on a device that you paid for?
Don't even give me any of that "I jailbroke it, so now it work's great" spiel - I thought all Apple products are just supposed to "work out of the box"? That is my beef with Apple, they are not thinking about the customer; they are thinking FOR the customer. I like my devices the way I like my boxes; rooted and under my full control! . I don't know about you but I wouldn't support a company who doesn't put the wants of the customer first - and don't tell me that people wouldn't like to have full control over their device. Yeah, sure, Apple may prevent you from doing that so you don't fubar the device and blame Apple - but isn't that kind of giving the impression that they are selling the devices to uhh..."simple" people?
It is all going back to the argument that Mac's are better than PCs. Well, lets examine what is inside of a Mac; PC parts. So, I ask you - how can a Mac be any better than a PC when the internal guts are the same?
Here are some leaving questions for you:
Why would you buy a device just to have to jailbreak it to bring it to it's full potential?
Why on both Android and WM you can install 3rd party applications but on the iPhone you can't?
Do you consider the iPhone as a toy or tool? You can't have it both ways, to me I really consider the iPhone as a toy due to its fundamental lacking of a modern operating system feature: multi-tasking. Again, don't go down the road of "jailbreaking" because this is supposed to be a device that is supposed to just "work out of the box" no?
In fact in my little amount of research, it appears the iPhone costs MORE in out-of-pocket costs than having a WM device. Appearances can be deceiving - but if you just humor me and try to find the WM counter-part to whatever application you currently have on your iPhone, I think you will also see what I came to that conclusion. | |
| tuminatr
join:2003-03-19
Saint Paul, MN
·Qwest.net
| i think its funny If apple has the best device how come there are so many misses
1 no mms
2 no multitasking
3 no tethering
4 no removable battery (umm it is a cell phone)
5 no expandable memory
6 prohibitory app approval process
7 carrier limitation can only buy with at&t
8 can't buy insurance
9 no push email
10 limited corporate email support not up to par with bb and wm | |
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See 16 replies to this post | |
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anonattuser
@solidspace.com
| iPhone not perfect but I like it I have an iPhone 3GS in central NJ and I love the phone itself everything just works, the interface is brilliant, I've used alot of touch devices and nothing comes even close the the ease of use and brilliance of the iphone touch interface and while it's somewhat annoying that the app store controls what is available, the truth is that if it didn't it would be like a pc, crashing incompatibilies etc.
For my computer I prefer the flexibility of a PC user, I am a pc user and probably always will be, but for a phone I prefer something that just works and being their are like 65k apps available for the iphone I'm not really suffering for lack of software. I've found an app for everything I wanted to do on my iphone.
I'm sure the network sucks big time in many areas, I'm lucky I guess in the areas I am normally in I get a constitant about 400-600k/s and often reach 1.2mbps in certain areas, which is more than useable for wireless internet, as a comparision I actually used to get much slower speeds 200-300k/s on verizons 3g network. My iphone is also connected via wifi at home and work and then the device is simply screaming fast.
I guess that's the benefit of living in the suburbs. I hope AT&T gets it's act together with their network for the rest of 3G users because the iphone is a brillant device when the network is working correctly | |
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com_uter
@rcn.com
| 19th in the world There are lots of companies that have good reputations for customer service (e.g. Apple).
AT&T and Verizon have put America 19th in the world in terms of internet access, and top in the world in terms of cell phone plan cost.
MMS is already available in many other countries, as is tethering.
How are we supposed to compete in a world economy where we pay twice as much for phone service, internet (not to mention competing against countries with free health care and free college education too).
Competition is good, if the incumbents don't want local competition, then they should give Americans the best services at the cheapest rates in the world. | |
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David
No,there is another.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-05-30
Granite City, IL
clubs: | it's set to deploy (MMS) According to sources Sept. 25th. | |
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