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DirecTV To Offer MPEG-4 HD TiVO
Relationship begins to wam again...

Some time ago, DirecTV decided to seriously scale down their relationship with TiVo in order to push customers toward their own HD-DVR hardware (the HR20s). Older "DirecTiVo" customers still saw their series 2 hardware supported, but they weren't able to net any of the interesting broadband perks TiVo has since developed, and they were left behind in the transition to MPEG-4. Recently, that relationship has started to warm again, as it's rumored that new DirecTV owners Liberty Media are fans of TiVO technology.

Despite a vested interest in having users use their own DVRs, Liberty's love of TiVO would seem to be supported by a new DirecTV announcement today that the company will be unveiling a new MPEG-4 capable HD DVR from TiVO.
quote:
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Under the terms of the non-exclusive arrangement, DIRECTV and TiVo will work together to develop a version of the TiVo(R) service for DIRECTV's broadband-enabled HD DVR platform. The product will support the latest TiVo and DIRECTV features and services, including TiVo's Universal Swivel Search and TiVo KidZone.
DirecTV users will have to wait for it, however. It's not expected to ship until the second half of 2009. Like the HR20, the new DVR will be able to use DirecTV's new broadband video on demand platform, which allows video content to be delivered over any terrestrial broadband connection (something that's sure to thrill cable and phone companies).
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium Member
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK

KrK

Premium Member

Progress.

I don't have DirecTV or a TIVO at the moment, but this still seems like a good idea to me.

Camelot One
MVM
join:2001-11-21
Bloomington, IN

Camelot One

MVM

Re: Progress.

said by KrK:

I don't have DirecTV or a TIVO at the moment, but this still seems like a good idea to me.
I DO have DirecTV, and their HR20-700. It was tough for me to switch from my HR10-250 DirecTivo box at first, partly because things were in different places, but mostly because the software on the HR20 was pretty buggy early on.

But they have since worked out the major kinks, and most of the minor ones, and the features far exceed anything I've seen from Tivo. Add to that the incredibly long turn around time for firmware releases on the DirecTivo boxes compared to 2-3 week fix times on the HR20, and I'm not so sure switching back to Tivo is a good idea.

myosh
join:2001-05-03
Cupertino, CA

myosh

Member

Might lure me away from Comcast

As a current Comcast subscriber with two HD TiVos (Series3 and TiVoHD), the HD DirecTiVo would make for a compelling reason to dump Comcast and switch to DirecTV. Cost will be important but Comcast will probably go through 2 rounds of rate increases by the time the HD DirecTiVo launches.
ffink20001
join:2002-12-18
Norwich, CT

1 recommendation

ffink20001

Member

Finally

About time I loved my Old DIrectv TIVO which with it's suggestions feature turned me on to alot of new shows. The NEW DVR is just buggy as hell and Randomely freezes and has no Suggestions.
psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX

psx_defector

Member

Finally......

A reason not to drop DirecTV.

Their DVR sucks compared to even a series 1 DirecTiVO.

Now we just have to wait.

Phil
Rojo Sol
Premium Member
join:2001-06-11
Downers Grove, IL

Phil

Premium Member

Re: Finally......

Would it not be safe to day that TiVo is far superior to any DVR offered by a cable provider? I know that the HD DVR from Time Warner down right lacks dozens of features and/or functionality you think would come standard.

KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium Member
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
Netgear WNDR3700v2
Zoom 5341J

KrK

Premium Member

Re: Finally......

You'd think.... but there's this thing called patents.

For example, Dish's PVR's are generally well liked... but they are embroiled in a patent dispute with TIVO.

So, it's possible many the features you like aren't present simply because of said patent issues.
psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX

1 recommendation

psx_defector

Member

Re: Finally......

The one feature I wanted in the DTV PVR and has been claimed as a TiVo "patent" is the ability to flip between the tuners.

So I'm watching one show, commerical comes on. I hit pause, hit down, flip to the other tuner and surf the channels. Once I feel I'm done with that, flip back to the first tuner, and hit play.

Comes in really handy when watching football, especially with the 50 dozen or so commerical breaks that happen.

I've tested and worked with just about every DVR solution from ReplayTV to Myth to TiVo to U-Verse. Even throw in an UltimateTV unit for good measure. The ability to record, schedule, and playback is everywhere. It's the look, feel, and touch of TiVo that makes me stay with it. DirecTV's HR20 isn't bad compared to some other ones but the fluidity and refinement in the TiVo is what makes it better.

Some people just don't care about it, but as someone who watches WAYYYYYYYY too much TV, I need a DVR that works very well. It also doesn't hurt that the TiVos are upgradeable and hackable. My DSR6000 is already on it's 4th upgrade. The only thing I can do to the HR20 is add a eSATA drive, which kills the internal drive. First thing I do when I get my HD TiVo is to upgrade it to two 750GB hard drives.

KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium Member
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
Netgear WNDR3700v2
Zoom 5341J

KrK

Premium Member

Re: Finally......

I've got a replayTV. Also hackable. It originally had a 40GB drive in there, but I changed it out some time ago to a 250GB.

I love it's commercial auto-skipping feature, but it's getting long in the tooth now and has no support for HD.
apollo80
join:2002-01-31
Richmond, VA

apollo80

Member

Re: Finally......

said by KrK:

I've got a replayTV. Also hackable. It originally had a 40GB drive in there, but I changed it out some time ago to a 250GB.

I love it's commercial auto-skipping feature, but it's getting long in the tooth now and has no support for HD.
While it doesn't have support for HD, if you hook an HD tuner or HD cable box into the ReplayTv via Svideo and record an HD downconverted source(the highest quality input the ReplayTv will take is SVideo), and then play back the dvr with the progressive 480p option, the video quality looks equal to watching a DVD in progressive scan.

While not HD, it's good enough...
psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX

psx_defector

Member

Re: Finally......

Ummmmmmmmmmm, no. 480p is no better than 480i. You might as well gouge my eyes out and tell me I'm looking at a Rembrandt.

This is why HD hasn't taken off as well as it should. People get an "HDTV" and still feed it crappy sources. And they say is looks great.

There is a stark difference in NTSC and ATSC.

TomClancy
Freedom Isn't Free
join:2003-04-23
...

TomClancy

Member

Re: Finally......

Maybe 480p than 480i isn't better on a LCD but on a CRT it is.

But recorded 480i converted to 480p is same crap. (Garbage in, garbage out.)

Heterman
Premium Member
join:2004-02-28
Fayetteville, AR

Heterman to psx_defector

Premium Member

to psx_defector
said by psx_defector:

The one feature I wanted in the DTV PVR and has been claimed as a TiVo "patent" is the ability to flip between the tuners.

So I'm watching one show, commerical comes on. I hit pause, hit down, flip to the other tuner and surf the channels. Once I feel I'm done with that, flip back to the first tuner, and hit play.
That is what makes me the most unhappy about the HR20/21. I want that capability back as fast as possible.

Dmoralize
join:2004-12-17
Nazareth, PA

Dmoralize

Member

I like the HR20

In order to receive the glut of new HD channels I was sorta forced to switch to DirecTV's HD DVR from my HD DirecTivo. I liked the Tivo unit a lot but the HR20 won me over big time. I think the interface is far better than the Tivo. I wouldn't think of switching at this point. And mine isn't buggy at all. I haven't had a single problem with it.

I always think choice is a good thing though. So this is potentially a decent move for the company.

bassjunky
join:2005-05-12
Aubrey, TX

bassjunky

Member

how much?

I have the HR21 and subscribe to their HD package. While it's not quite as user-friendly as a Tivo, I haven't found it buggy and really don't have any complaints. But a newer mpeg-4 Tivo box would rock. I wonder if it will be just as expensive to upgrade or convert to as the HR20/21s were...

keyboard5684
Sam
join:2001-08-01
Pittsburgh, PA

keyboard5684

Member

Re: how much?

My upgrade was free, and I like it as well. Every 6 months they give me a new offer to upgrade to an HD DVR, and they are nice. I have 2 Tivo's left and really could care less if it goes.

I have never had a freeze up, buggy issue, or anything like that. I think a lot of people that do have those may have issues with high-def and there TV. Even low def has bugs, so it may be your TV. They are all digital now except there may be an analog tuner, this makes them just as buggy as anything else we buy. The sad thing is how do we upgrade the firmware of our TV?

dbmaven
There's no shortage
Mod
join:1999-10-26
Sty in Sky

dbmaven

Mod

Pricing will be very interesting....

How much were the HR10-250's (DirecTiVOs) when they came out?
Something like $1000.00 ?
Eventually they came down - but they were not cheap.

For the vocal minority of people who were/are TiVO fanatics, this is certainly welcome news.

Like someone else mentioned, I've never had reboot/missed recording or any other issues with my HR2x's. And with the additional features DirecTV has been adding/testing/working on, right now I have no interest in switching. A year is a very long time - so we'll really have to wait and see what the new TiVO looks like and how it performs against what DirecTV has at that time.

From a "why are they doing this" perspective - that's the interesting question. It's possible that financially it will make more sense for them to keep their own branded DVRs as a "base" line, and sell the TiVO enabled units as an 'upscale' alternative. If so, it's possible that development on the HR2x units will be scaled back to just fixes and stability, with no new features. With what I've seen in the pipeline, that's a stretch - but who knows.

aaronwt
Premium Member
join:2004-11-07
Woodbridge, VA
Asus RT-AX89

aaronwt

Premium Member

Re: Pricing will be very interesting....

They were very expensive. i bought seven of them when they came out in May 2004 and sold four of them for over $1600 each which was able to cover most of the cost of the three I kept.
said by dbmaven:

How much were the HR10-250's (DirecTiVOs) when they came out?
Something like $1000.00 ?
Eventually they came down - but they were not cheap.

For the vocal minority of people who were/are TiVO fanatics, this is certainly welcome news.

Like someone else mentioned, I've never had reboot/missed recording or any other issues with my HR2x's. And with the additional features DirecTV has been adding/testing/working on, right now I have no interest in switching. A year is a very long time - so we'll really have to wait and see what the new TiVO looks like and how it performs against what DirecTV has at that time.

From a "why are they doing this" perspective - that's the interesting question. It's possible that financially it will make more sense for them to keep their own branded DVRs as a "base" line, and sell the TiVO enabled units as an 'upscale' alternative. If so, it's possible that development on the HR2x units will be scaled back to just fixes and stability, with no new features. With what I've seen in the pipeline, that's a stretch - but who knows.

djrobx
Premium Member
join:2000-05-31
Reno, NV

1 edit

djrobx to dbmaven

Premium Member

to dbmaven
said by dbmaven:

How much were the HR10-250's (DirecTiVOs) when they came out?
Something like $1000.00 ?
Eventually they came down - but they were not cheap.
This is exactly how DirecTV lost my business to Comcast. They wanted $1000 for a box that everyone knew would be made obsolete within a relatively short period of time because of lack of MPEG-4.

Renting a pair of DCT-6412s for $10 per month each from Comcast was a no-brainer compared to dropping $2,000. I hated losing my beloved TiVos, but I learned that TiVo's extra features really weren't that important, and we've gotten by just fine on alternative DVR platforms.

By the time Series3 CableCARD TiVos came out, I completely lost my interest in TiVo. Big upfront cost, monthly fees, and cablecard rental? Way too expensive. More power to you if you can afford that.
quote:
A year is a very long time - so we'll really have to wait and see what the new TiVO looks like and how it performs against what DirecTV has at that time.
Which brings up my other problem with TiVo. I appreciate that they want a reliable, consistent interface, but their software is just too slow to evolve. It took way too long to get something as simple as folders. The ADS plastered all over my mother's expensive Series3 box are just a big slap in the face, too

TransEng
join:2008-09-04
Nashville, TN

TransEng to dbmaven

Member

to dbmaven
I don't know about being a Tivo fanatic but I can tell you that I had an HR-10 and loved the functionality. Then, I was stupid enough to upgrade to the Direct HD-DVR and I have regretted it ever since. I have a hard time getting "won" over when I lost the buffers that I used regularly, the damned thing locks up about 3 times a week, recording starts 3 min late, sound and picture goes out of sync daily, and the list goes on. I also love the notification that tells me that I have lost the sat on the other tuner. It continually pops up on a program I am watching that has not lost sat and I feel so informed. The Direct apologist tell me that I would probably be unhappy if I bought a car and they had moved the clock location. In this case that would be true since they put the clock in the trunk. You can also be directed to a website with all the "work arounds" listed. I never needed work arounds before and I am a bit tired of being a beta tester for Direct and paying them for the priv. I am glad you have never had any of these issues with your HR-20. If you did you would probably get tired of contacting them and having them give you a phone number that when called, connects you to someone that is more interested in trying to upgrade you rather that fix your problem. I have been a Direct customer since the beginning of they service offering so I speak from experience when I say many years I was happy with the service but I am about ready to dump them.
MightyPez
join:2002-05-01
Saint Paul, MN

MightyPez

Member

I am intrigued

I have no real problems with my HR20 from DirecTV, but previous to that I had a series 2 DirecTivo box. One thing I loved about it was that with a little know-how, you could do some pretty interesting modifications to it. Pop in a bigger hard drive, copy some of the contents from the Tivo to a PC over the network, etc.

If these new Tivos are as "hackable" then I would be very interested.

newview
Ex .. Ex .. Exactly
Premium Member
join:2001-10-01
Parsonsburg, MD

newview

Premium Member

I really don't care . . .

which technology is finally powering my DirecTV DVR, as long as it provides a way to SKIP those annoying, incessant, inane commercials. THAT would be a deal-breaker for me.

DaMaGeINC
The Lan Man
Premium Member
join:2002-06-08
Greenville, SC

DaMaGeINC

Premium Member

Cool

I love innovation in the industry. Take something and make it better. I am all for that. As long as I see you trying to compete with the times, then you are ""good"" in my book.

ravencajun
Premium Member
join:2004-08-12
Houston, TX

ravencajun

Premium Member

Re: Cool

I am so glad to see this news. I was just saying this week how much I miss my direct tv tivo, the dvr they gave me when the tivo died is horrible, it freezes up, reboots, makes me redo complete setup, loses shows and just locks up right in the middle of stuff till I have to just unplug it from the wall to get it to do anything huge POS!

The next time I call them which will probably be tomorrow I will tell them I want a tivo back.

at least we have hope for the future
poolek
join:2003-11-04
Austin, TX

poolek

Member

Nice...

I switched to Dish from Direct when I transitioned to HD a couple of years ago. While the Dish 622 DRV has been trouble free and offers most of the core features expected, it's still not as nice as the old DirecTivo that I had.

Assuming the price is reasonable, I'd move back to DirecTV just to get this product.
JBT
Premium Member
join:2002-12-06
Odessa, FL

JBT

Premium Member

hmm I signed up for Dish.

Dang... I wish I had heard about this before. I signed up for dish a couple of months ago... I would have waited if I had known this was coming.

The Beer
I Love It When A Plan Comes Together
Premium Member
join:2001-07-24
Lincoln, NE

1 edit

The Beer

Premium Member

And now they do it

Seriously I went back to Cable so I could have a HD Tivo and never looked back.

I like the broadband goodies but I would go back to DirecTV for this, too bad you prob can't find any of the units out there.

EDIT: OH SNAP! Shame on you Karl for using that picture!
It's a new unit YIPPIE!
slomike2
join:2007-07-18
San Luis Obispo, CA

1 recommendation

slomike2

Member

I will finally get HD

I have been avoiding going to HD because I didn't want to give up my DirecTiVos. Now it looks like the wait may have been worth it.

This is a dream come true.

New TiVo with New DirecTV.

-Mike

dbmaven
There's no shortage
Mod
join:1999-10-26
Sty in Sky

dbmaven

Mod

Re: I will finally get HD

As long as you're willing to wait until late 2009...

For any DirecTV subs out there - your days of getting HD with DirecTiVO are seriously dwindling. The last MPEG-2 HD channels go dark in stages starting this month - the last near the end of the year.....

wesm
Premium Member
join:1999-07-29
Seattle, WA

wesm

Premium Member

Re: I will finally get HD

I'm getting a DirecTiVo-HD (the old kind) tomorrow. Why? To record OTA HD programming. DirecTV has forced many apartment dwellers to give up what little HD we had (or buy new receivers) by switching to a new cabling technology: SWM, also known as MFH2 for apartments/other MDUs. The new kit is not compatible with any of the legacy receivers, and I almost wonder if that was by design. Therefore, this DirecTiVo-HD will probably never see HD over the satellite, but that's fine. It will tide me over until the shiny new kit arrives next year.

For those of you who know: I sincerely hope this doesn't turn out like the HDPC-20.

iowemetoyouthree
@comcast.net

iowemetoyouthree

Anon

DirecTV and Tivo

I still have two Samsung 80 hour DirecTV/Tivos that work perefectly. I never liked DirecTV's own version of DVR because the software is buggy and I didn't like the look and feel. However..... I am not sure that "video on demand" for a satellite service is going to pan out because of the data caps that DSL and Cable Modem services are going to impose. When I can download a movie right off the dish then it will be time for video on demand for satellite service.
Joe12345678
join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL

Joe12345678

Member

They should make a 4-5+ tunner full house TIVO with mini box

They should make a 4-5+ tunner + OTA full house TIVO with mini box at each tv with e-sata add a drive the H2x boxes are replace the built in disk.

tazman01
join:2002-02-10
NY

tazman01

Member

TIVO is much better

I have 2 direct tv dvrs - one is their version SD R15 model, it's ok, for the bedroom where we don't watch much tv, but it was buggy, still is at times, but serviceable for free.

I couldn't live without my TIVO series 2 I built, got a Philips 704, yanked out the 40gb hd, put in a new 300gb hd and was set. It really is the software, the smootness, quick response time, etc. TIVO is so much better, can't wait.
ltjordan
join:2001-12-02
Hyattsville, MD

ltjordan

Member

Re: Tivo HD Mpeg.

That is great news. An HD Tivo is worth the wait.