'DirecTiVO' Users Get Updates Again

Without MPEG4 support, the HD Tivo is a lame duck. If Tivo really wants to remain in favor with DirecTV's customers, they will have to come out with some MPEG4 HD hardware.

The series 3 works with Cable/FiOS but not dbs.

If you're talking about the HR10-250, you are right, it's pretty much over for that thing, at least HD wise. For all the other S2 and S2.5 SD DirecTiVos? Nothing will change.

It has nothing to do with Tivo, DirecTV is the one that releases the boxes using Tivo software. DirecTV has to chose to start using Tivo again and release new boxes.

....it'll be over. No one with two brain cells to rub together are is going to buy an expensive box, even at $299, when you can rent a box from Comcast w TiVo for YEARS before you'd realize that cost. And you'd have a warranty the whole time.

Maybe but the problem with your scenario is that after you have paid for the box you'll continue paying for it for as long as you have the service. Thats not exactly a huge benefit!

Ahhh, that's where you shove a high hard one up Comcast's ass by playing their own game: tote up the cost of the box in monthly fees and when you reach the magic number the box somehow slips and falls on the floor but you call and say "my box quit working" - done.
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A monthly desktop thread is what happens when a Paris Hilton mentality mates with a computer

I am in the boat right now where I am considering a move to Comcast. However, paying $300 for a new box isn't attractive to me. Even if the Comcast Tivo rental is $15 a month (which is seriously inflated), it will take 20 months just to break even.

I remember when cable modems first came out and the price on those were about $300. You could rent a modem for $10, and that was the right thing to do at the time. Now these cable modems aren't worth renting even at $3 a month because you can get them so inexpensively.

Actually no, because by the time you "pay" for what a owned TiVo box would cost there will be a newer and better model out, so you would just take in your old box and get a new one. Sounds good to me!

Do you own any TiVos? Because if you do then you understand that the only difference between the boxes are their physical capabilities i.e. (storage capacity, HD tuners).

That means that the TiVo Series 2 I purchased in 05 does exactly the same thing as the Series 2 DT that I purchased this year. Buying the boxes outright is the better deal because both boxes get the same software updates and have the same capabilities limited only by their hardware. So essentially, TiVo boxes will always have the lates TiVo software only one can record two shows at onece and one cannot and both boxes are paid for.

yes, and when those boxes break out of warranty, who is going to replace them? You are, at full cost. When my Tivo STB breaks, I take it back to the cable co, and I get the latest STB box thats out....for nothing more than my monthly rental fee. And your Series 2 will NEVER record in HD....so every time a major feature like that comes out, you will be stuck buying a new box to take advantage.

True my Series 2 will never record HD but being as I've had my boxes for some time I already know that. And its not an issue for be because I don't subscribe to HD channels and I don't have a plasma or LCD HD TV. Yes I'll have to replace my TiVos if they break but I'll always have all the features offered by TiVo. Your box supplied by Comcast will likely be locked out of updates just at the DirectTiVo boxes were. Thats the difference!

you clod, RTFA! DirecTiVos are going to get updates again, and Comcast and TiVo are under CONTRACT to provide software updates. Keep living in your dreamland.

Which would explain why I used the word (were) when I described the DirectTiVo

Not to mention the monthly fee TiVo charges would be included in the monthly rental fee from Comcast, I would assume, so even after your pay off the box, you'd only then start paying what would be the equivalent of TiVos monthly fee. I can't see Comcast charging for the box rental and then a TiVo subscription.

DirecTV charges $5.99 total for DVR service, regardless of the number of DVR receivers, and regardless of the brand/type of DVR(be it TiVo or in-house).

They also charge a $4.99 per box mirroring fee.

I have three boxes. My charges are calculated like this:

$5.99: DirecTV DVR Subscription
$4.99: Mirroring fee
$4.99: Mirroring fee
------------------------------
$15.97 for three DVR boxes

What does Comcast currently charge for having three DVR boxes?

For Comcast, you pay for box rental so it going to be about $10 per box so you would pay probably about $30 for 3 Tivos. However, why would you want 3? Heck, even if you buy your own, you have to rent the cable cards.

To me, it about the same price both ways. If its the same price, why not rent? At least then if the box doesn't work, you can get a new one.

I want three because I'm not the only person living here.

You can optionally get the DirecTV protection plan for $5 per month.

Within the last few months, I've had three problems:

1. Because of a flood in my home, the dish multiswitch got soaked with water and stopped working. They sent someone to install a new one.


2. One of my four-year-old HDVR2's tuners stopped working. They overnighted a new DVR.


3. The hard drive in my upgraded TiVo died. They overnighted a new DVR.

I own all of my boxes, but because of the protection plan, all three problems were fixed at no additional charge, with the total money spent still costing less than what Comcast would have charged. And not only that, I only signed up for the protection plan *the day after* the first problem had happened, and that problem was still covered.

As a new subscriber to Directv, I'm I forced to purchase the Directv Protection Plan. I thought if the new R-15 failed, Directv would have to send a new one anyway?

The Comcast Tivo still won't have all the capabilities of a standalone Tivo (nor, admittedly, vice versa). In fact, there are a number of seemingly arbitrary changes from the standard Tivo UI (not just those that stem from the different hardware or available services) that were made at Comcast's request. And of course, Comcast doesn't cover the country, nor does everyone even in Comcast areas wish to subscribe to Comcast.

.. nor will Tivo's relationship with comcast be exclusive. They will eventually get into bed with other providers as well. Additionally, one of the ideas of the Comcast/Tivo relationship (not to mention the DVR in general) is a tool to attract customers to the service in the first place.. if it wasn't an attraction, they never would have offered the DVR service in the first place.

That is, nobody who cares about having a reasonably sized hard disk in their unit or whatever features the standalones have that the Comcast TiVo doesn't.

Also, I'm not so sure that the problems with the Motorola and SA boxes aren't the hardware itself rather than the software. I guess time will tell.

My DirecTiVO already does all those things thanks to some hacks. No big deal here. I'm betting these "updates" from DirecTV and Tivo won't be as good as what is already available on-line from the community of Tivo hackers.

Whether or not the DVR hits the floor you still have to start paying a lease on a new box the following month. If you pay off your TiVo box you own it. If you want to sell it on eBay so that you can buy a different one you can.

If you work from home you can probably depreciate the cost of the TiVo as a business expense. I am not a tax professional but I have heard of people doing that before.

My wife and I moved this weekend. We decided we would try cable out and see how it went. I have been using DirecTV with TiVo since 2000. I would say that my experience so far with the Scientific-Atlanta box is mediocre at best. I just think the TiVo folks have this type of device figured out. It is all they build so they are looking to build the best product possible. It costs more sure. It's no different than buying a computer with more features or a faster processor. You get what you pay for.

If I can have DirecTV and TiVo in HD I would sign up in a minute but for now I will be buying the new TiVo this week and sticking with cable.

And whether or not you own your Tivo box, you still pay a monthly fee for it as well. So if you pay off your Tivo box, you will likely still have a monthly fee just to use it.

It's also pretty sad that people would cheat on their taxes to even think about writing off their Tivo.. or that anyone would even think, care, or even have/want to resort to that level in the first place over a DVR.

If I were that concerned over Tivo or a DVR from cable/satellite with what ever software, price wins every time so long as I can find a program, record it, watch it at another time and even possibly control live TV.

Seriously.. what am I missing with the DVR society? Is this another 'thing' like anything Apple? Is the DVR pop culture now or what? Personally, I think there's something to be said about the strong opinions around the DVR.. it's because of what people are forced (or feel they are forced) to pay for them, which says something, for this service and people want tits perfect.

A much less expensive monthly fee than what one pays for the cable company DVR, in most cases, though. And the Comcast/Cox/whoever TiVo will be even more expensive than the "normal" cable DVR.

You're looking at it as a monthly fee. What about that other $299.99 cost for the box that you don't pay to the cable or satellite, .. no, wait.. cable.. (Satellite charges some of their customers)

Comcast Dual Tuner HD-DVR $11.99 a month.

Now.. let's look at TIVO..

$12.95 per month
with 3-year commitment

$14.95 per month
with 2-year commitment

$16.95 per month
with 1-year commitment
Reduced from $19.95

$19.95 per month
no commitment. OUCH!

If you want to fork over your money in advance (never a good idea)

1 year for $179
= $14.92 per month
Reduced from $199

2 years for $299
= $12.46 per month

3 years for $349 $299
= $8.31 per month

Wait.. there's more.

Early termination fee.. on a freakin' Tivo???
$200.00

Their 1 year commit plan saves you $3.00 a month for $36.00 per year, but if you cancel, they want $200 for doing so.

Their 2 year commit saves you only $90.48 for the year, but still socks you with a $200 early term.

EVEN THEIR 3 YEAR term saves you only $140.16 a month but hits you with $200 in early term.

Can you say sheeple?

Sorry.. the Tivo is still far more expensive when you calculate EVERYTHING involved in being provided their "service"... you HAVE to include the cost of the hardware no matter WHO provided it to you when you want to make a comparison.

By far, the cost of a provider provided DVR with or with out Tivo software is STILL by far cheaper and a better value than Tivo.

Tivo.. the next Apple product.. want not call it the iTivo?

Unlike you, I consider the box a value, as it is mine and I can sell it if I decide I no longer want it.

Your value judgement is not the same as mine. I consider the cost of the box worth the added benefit of having the TiVo over the unreliable cable DVR I was previously using. That I end up saving money over what Cox charges for their DVR is just icing on the cake.

Cox charges $15.25 all in for their DVR, not the $11.99 that Comcast charges. Additionally, there are no additional outlet fees and Cable Cards themselves are only $1.99 a month, so for someone else, the monthly fee is about $3 less. For me, since I have a series 2 with lifetime service (I've gotten a lot more than $199 worth of value out of that!), the other TiVos are only $6.95 a month. That's $4.32 less than the monthly cost of Cox's DVR and it's a much better product. The numbers only look better if you compare it to what Comcast and Cox will be charging for DVRs with TiVo.

Unlike you, I see a value in the better DVR functionality of the TiVo, thus making it worth $300 or even $600. All a $300 HD TiVo means is that I'll probably end up with more than one. At $600 I couldn't justify that expense.

My post is based on arguments in this forum. If you knew me, you'd know how I place value which is more like you. However, people around here commonly believe that everything is about the lowest price possible.

The argument I am countering is that of the person who says Tivo is cheaper. Tivo is not cheaper when you look at it in the long run.

HOWEVER, to your post, you say the box is yours.. which is is. However, you own the responsibility to repair it or replace it if it goes bad. There is value to leasing one. With Tivo, you'd think you lease it because if you don't pay the fee, the tivo, albeit yours, is a door stop.

I am one of those people that if, for example, my computer gives me problems that I have to spend too much time repairing, I simply replace it. I purchased a 65" CRT read projection Sony HD.. a year later a plasma came out that I liked, so I replaced it.

My spending habits are not like some around here and I too place value differently. I place value on things not based on utilitarian needs.. I place value on something based on if I 1) like it.. and 2) want it. I also place value on some realistic ideals too.. such as can I get the same thing for a better price (SAME thing) from a provider or vendor I trust? Sometimes I pay more to use a vendor I trust more than the one that has the lowest price. (that's the contractor in me. Sometimes I'll pay more now, than less now and more later)

As for our judgments being the same or not.. again, I don't consider the box, in this case, a value at all since it has a required lease fee. If a rented box goes bad, I call the provider to replace it. To sell that box? well, since it has a 2 year requirement, I don't see selling it as something that I can do for a while. in 2 years, an eternity in the eyes of electronics, it's worth less than I paid and not going to get back near what I paid. In your case, you see it as a deposit you can get back. I see it as extra cost. Take that cost, divide by months had, then the DVR from cox works the same and it's their problem.

HOWEVER, like you said, and I agree, if you have it because you really enjoy it.. then you're getting what you want and that's what counts. (by the way.. isn't that lifetime service only life time of the box? so when/if that box dies, aren't you screwed? or did that policy change?)

Given that any of the HDTiVos (especially upgraded, which all of my TiVos are, including the Series 3) would likely sell for more than $200, I don't really consider the ETF to be significant.

Of course, the only reason I'd want out of the contract would be to get another TiVo. They let you transfer the contract to another box.

It helps that I upgrade my TiVos as a matter of course. In fact, one of my biggest complaints about the cable DVRs is that you can't get one with a big hard drive (160GB on an HD DVR is nearly useless) and they can't be upgraded, although to be fair some cable providers using the SA box have the eSATA port enabled. AFAIK, none of the Motorola systems have it enabled.

As far as lifetime goes, it is the lifetime of the box, but if you send it to TiVo for repair/replacement, they'll transfer the lifetime to the new box.

That said, failures that can't be easily fixed are rare. Almost all problems are related to the hard drive. I did have to replace a power supply in my first run Series 2, though. That cost me $70.

Besides, in the long run, on some providers the TiVo is slightly cheaper. The difference is completely insignificant, and as you point out you lose out on the easy replacement benefit. TiVo does provide discounted replacements after the warranty period is up. $50 is fairly common.

I have my HR10-250 with an extra 500G drive in it. Does this mean I lost hundreds of hours of stuff I've recorded? Will I be able to modify the new 20-250 and drop a big drive into it, or can I add an external drive? I have no plans of accepting some box that only records a few hours of stuff that I can't expand on.

There is no "20-250"

The only thing in this press release is the fact that DirecTV and TiVo have revived a relationship. TiVo will provide software updates for the HR10-250, and other TiVo Series 2 based DirecTV receiver/DVRs.

They would have to had revived it.. as soon as Tivo makes it's debut on Comcast, Direct has lost another advantage over cable.

The two can only one up either other for so long.. but satellite will eventually hit it's limit and become a small player.

I believe the cw is that the DirecTV and Tivo relationship are getting warmer (and will soon become much more so) is because of the sale of DirecTV to Liberty Media, who has an ownership stake in Tivo. The HR20 is made by NDS, which is a NewsCorp company, so essentially DirecTV was buying the DVRs in-house. Liberty Media will have no incentive to stick with NDS, and every incentive to cozy up to Tivo (YEA!) I am waiting on HD to see if this happens. Isn't the sale supposed to close soon?

A quickie on cost. I just bought an R-10 on E-bay for $42, $10 shipping, unit was a new refurb, so basically I got a new DirecTivo SD for about $50, and it's mine. As it is my second R-10, and I used it to replace the bedroom receiver, I have no additional costs. And all my gear is mine.