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 timcuthBraves FanPremium
join:2000-09-18
Pelham, AL |  Wired phone system
Tim | |
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 |  cdruGo ColtsPremium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7 | Re: Wired phone system said by timcuth:So, now we rediscover the strength of the old Ma Bell landline telephone system.
I'm curious to know the percentage of wired systems that also went down. It wouldn't surprise me if that number was near 25% as well. Cell sites rely on wired backhaul connections to central offices, data centers, etc. A tree falling on a overhead lines are pretty nondiscriminatory as to whether it's cable, telephone, power, fiber, etc or some combination of all of the above. There were also numerous flooded COs and data centers that had affected wired services and would also trickle down to affect cable and cell service as well. | |
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| | | | Re: Wired phone system My family just went to FIOS and were without phone service in the promised eight hours. And I expect they'll be down for quite a while - completely unreachable.
They just migrated from underground copper service. Know why? Because Verizon had no interest in fixing their copper service. One phone line that hasn't worked at all in months and another that was unusable due to an extremely loud buzzing.
So basically, telecoms don't want to pay for reliability and they're doing everything they can to get out of it. Maybe, just maybe, this will be a wake up call on that front. | |
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| | | | | Re: Wired phone system Verizon is forcing fiber in my area too. In most cases people want the fast internet and TV service and the phone goes along for the ride. (this applies to Cable co. phone too) . The days of the phone being dependable are quickly becoming a memory of years past. For those that say the tree can fall on the old copper land line as well thats true but in most cases a neighbors phone would still work . Back to the fiber (FiOS) 8 hour battery backup in a several day outage its just not going far and many homes lack a genny. Same issue with cable phone if it has battery backup at all. | |
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| | | CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| quote:
So basically, telecoms don't want to pay for reliability and they're doing everything they can to get out of it. Maybe, just maybe, this will be a wake up call on that front.
No offense but the 'Wake-up Call' has been out (and mostly ignored) for several years now. They neglect the copper plant in order to force people to FIOS and wireless... some people defend them vigorously claiming copper is a dead technology and no one is on it anymore anyway. This is a direct result of the PSC relaxing rules on POTS to the point where it is basically unregulated. | |
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| | | | But what percentage of landlines are overhead anymore? Even in my small rural location they have buried the cables. | |
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| | | cdruGo ColtsPremium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7 | Re: Wired phone system said by PastTense:But what percentage of landlines are overhead anymore? Even in my small rural location they have buried the cables. Around here, a ton. Residetial neighborhoods built in the last 35 years or so are mostly underground. But between those and what is considered "downtown" in my city, it's mostly aerial still. Out in the country, unless a developer has created a neighborhood and buried the line, most country houses on rural roads are also aerial. And regardless of age, many of the trunk lines are still aerial. | |
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| |  JimThePCGuyFormerly known as schja01.Premium,MVM
join:2000-04-27
Morton Grove, IL | said by cdru:said by timcuth:So, now we rediscover the strength of the old Ma Bell landline telephone system.
I'm curious to know the percentage of wired systems that also went down. It wouldn't surprise me if that number was near 25% as well. Cell sites rely on wired backhaul connections to central offices, data centers, etc. A tree falling on a overhead lines are pretty nondiscriminatory as to whether it's cable, telephone, power, fiber, etc or some combination of all of the above. There were also numerous flooded COs and data centers that had affected wired services and would also trickle down to affect cable and cell service as well. This article says the wired system faired better than wireless.
"Outages for landline phones are said to be much less widespread."
»bit.ly/TXqfqg | |
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| | | What it reflects is the need to require backup power for cell towers, the same way pressure was brought to bear on pre-breeakup AT&T to have generators and backup batteries for the PTSN, which was correctly viewed as a National Security asset that required national attention (with the PTSN being replaced by cell and digital, the bureaucrats and politicians in D.C. need to realize these systems are the next generation replacement). Both the Bush and Obama administrations have been loath to impose regulations that mandate back up power at cell towers. In 2005, the FCC had a proposed rule that would have required there to be 8 hours of backup power at all cell sites. The usual suspects lobbied to have it killed, successfully. The Obama administration has continued to ignore the issue. That said, the magnitude of this storm was on such a scale that even with backup power at every cell site there would still be problems. The public view and pressure being placed upon the big 3 carriers will probably ensure that they will work to restore service as quickly as possible. They don't want momentum to build on the Hill and in the Executive Branch to take away their existing autonomy. My sympathies to those affected by Sandy. | |
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| | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | Re: Wired phone system National Security? I suppose anything is possible but given today's technology and "global" military/CIA, if they depend on the US wired or cell infrastructure to keep us safe, we should all be scared. These resources did not provide even one square mile of coverage in Iraq or Afghanistan.
I was watching a NatGeo (or Discovery?) program about Air Force One and while it inter-links to the land and wireless networks, it uses satellites. I'd also bet that the down-link interconnects are ridiculously redundant and strategically placed. I also expect this is the norm for other branches of government that deal with matters of national security. | |
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| | | openbox9Premium
join:2004-01-26
japan
kudos:2 | Re: Wired phone system Communications is a critical infrastructure sector and is a national security issue. National security isn't just provided by DoD and CIA and it isn't just conducting operations in Iraq and Afghanistan.
DHS Critical Infrastructure Sectors | |
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| | | | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | Re: Wired phone system My bad. I didn't know national security had such a broad definition. I was thinking external threats to our sovereignty and it's really any threat that would have significant impact on America's way of life. | |
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| | | | Well I have been hearing a little buzz about micro-cell systems or wifi being an answer for the future. Is this the kind of thing that can kill that??
Most of you are probably more in tune with tech than I am so are my thoughts off base?? | |
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| | CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| FYI, most of the cell sites in NYc do have battery back-up and/or diesel generators. The problem is that the back-end fiber equipment either doesn't have backup power or the batteries have been neglected for YEARS (Verizon doesn't maintain them) and provide power for about 5 seconds after the failure. | |
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| | lame so much for Verizon and AT&T's reputation for keeping cell sites going in power outages and being that "reliable" alternative to a landline.. | |
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| | | Re: lame Do you ever criticize the cable industry? | |
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| |  The LimitPremium
join:2007-09-25
Greensboro, NC
kudos:2 | Re: lame The same could be said about your opinion on all things morally ethical in the corporate world. He has a point though. | |
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| | | | | Re: lame PEOPLE acting morally ethical is what you're referring to. | |
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| | Reviews:
 ·ooma
 ·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
| said by ITALIAN926:Do you ever criticize the cable industry?
Sure, for all of about 5 minutes Comcast was flirting with the idea of changing over to FTTP but has since recoiled from this idea in the immediate future.. the longer it takes to get started, the costlier it will become. Charging for cablemodem rental isn't exactly on my kudos list either. | |
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| | | | Sprint was the only carrier that was still up. | |
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| brad
join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON | said by tmc8080:so much for Verizon and AT&T's reputation for keeping cell sites going in power outages and being that "reliable" alternative to a landline..
cell sites were never considered a reliable alternative to a POTS line. | |
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| | | Re: Here's the solution It's a solution for a handful of customers - not millions in a geographical region flocking to the service after a storm. The system would simply be overwhelmed. | |
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| |  MoracCat god
join:2001-08-30
Riverside, NJ
kudos:1
·Comcast
| Re: Here's the solution That works if you want to talk to random people on the other side of the world. Not so much if you want to get in touch with a specific person.
Not to mention that it requires getting a license from the FCC and a giant antenna.
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The Comcast Disney Avatar has been retired. | |
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| | |  Simba7I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT | Re: Here's the solution I'm sure the entire east coast isn't void of HAM's. Just get in contact with one and he could relay a message to someone that has working comms. | |
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| | | | CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Here's the solution That is exactly what happens during a disaster like this where other forms of communication don't work. There is a HAM present at each of the Red Cross emergency shelters specifically for this purpose as a matter of fact. If anyone is curious, do some research on ARES
As itguy05 said, the test is not too hard to pass for the basic level. Most of the guys use the 2 meter band with a walkie-talkie type radio (with a small antenna) or a mobile in the car for fairly local communication. The larger antennas are for lower frequencies that can go around the world. It is an extremely interesting 'hobby' with things like moon-bounce communications, digital modes, satellites, direction finding, 10+ GHz microwaves... I would have thought that more of the people in here would have been HAMs considering so many are technically minded.
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| | | | | said by Morac:That works if you want to talk to random people on the other side of the world. Not so much if you want to get in touch with a specific person.
Not to mention that it requires getting a license from the FCC and a giant antenna.
License from the FCC is easy - you have to learn a few things (Morse Code is not one of them).
And you don't need a giant antenna - one of these:
»www.wouxun.us/category.php?category_id=54
would do well for local communications. | |
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| | | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | »www.arrl.org/files/file/Hambands_color.pdf
Some frequencies require a large antenna but that's perhaps a classic opinion. There are lots of frequencies. In fact some are really prime and perhaps even envied by the wireless industry. | |
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2 edits | u instead of trying to be part of the solution all you want to do is sit here and bicker about who sucks and who rules... how about >we have people injured and without services and we need to get in there and make things right. Point fingers later! | |
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| | Bright side Look at the bright side. The east coast will be getting brand new gear and your quality of service will likely go up because of it. The downside is that you have to go without for a while till it all gets fixed.
(note: not saying the storm was a good thing... very sad, very traumatizing, only that there is a bright side to the telcom aspects.) | |
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 TomekPremium
join:2002-01-30
Valley Stream, NY | In my part of Long Island My local cellphone tower is behaving erratically, my phone jumps from 4G to no-G and anything in between. I have to drive half mile north for good signal.
Since I am FIOS customer by battery backup was done after 8 hours. I don't have generator and i will be stuck for days without power. I was able to connect car battery via inverter and FIOS works fine. Internet and phone (not enough juice for TV).
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Semper Fi | |
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|  Jim_in_VA
join:2004-07-11
Cobbs Creek, VA
kudos:4 | Re: In my part of Long Island that sucks, hang in there Tomek. Hope it comes back on soon.
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... need help? »evdo-tips.com/ | |
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| sk1939Premium
join:2010-10-23
Washington, DC
kudos:9 Reviews:
 ·T-Mobile US
| said by Tomek:My local cellphone tower is behaving erratically, my phone jumps from 4G to no-G and anything in between. I have to drive half mile north for good signal.
Since I am FIOS customer by battery backup was done after 8 hours. I don't have generator and i will be stuck for days without power. I was able to connect car battery via inverter and FIOS works fine. Internet and phone (not enough juice for TV).
Just be sure you have the battery in a well ventilated the space to avoid hydrogen buildup. | |
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A user friendly Q&A on cell service problems
