 pandoraPremium join:2001-06-01 Outland kudos:1 | Outrageous
This is just outrageous. | |
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 |  | | Re: Outrageous Is anyone under the illusion that a carrier will ever say 'yes' to an installation? | |
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 |  quetwoThat VoIP GuyPremium join:2004-09-04 East Lansing, MI | said by pandora:This is just outrageous. They have the license to that frequency. I've seen lots of bad installations that cause cell phones to not work near them... | |
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·VOIPo
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| Which carrier do I register with? My signal booster works for a wide spectrum of frequencies covering pretty much all of the carriers. If one says no but the others say yes, do I have to shut it down?
Uh, I mean if I had one that is... yeah... -- +++ATH0 | |
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| said by pandora:This is just outrageous. You probably wouldn't think that if you had people broadcasting on the very same frequencies that you paid billions of dollars to obtain an exclusive license for. | |
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 |  | | It's crazy that you have to get permission from the license older of that frequency to place a device that uses their licensed frequency. That's just outrageous! -- I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company. | |
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 |  |  WhatNowPremium join:2009-05-06 Charlotte, NC | Re: Outrageous If it was just receive it would not be a problem but it also transmits which means it could overpower the signal you need on your phone if you are in an Apartment complex on the edge of a cell tower signal.
The reg should have been written that the only time there would be enforcement is if the booster was causing interference in a local area. It could be you do not have any problems today but in 3 years the area builds up and a booster is causing problems. | |
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 bbeesleyVIP join:2003-08-07 Richardson, TX kudos:5 | Interesting It appears that the FCC is well intentioned here, hoping to ensure that boosters don't interfere with service in an area.
"In order to ensure that boosters do not result in degraded performance on commercial, private, and public safety wireless networks, we adopt stringent, industry consensus-based technical rules for Consumer Signal Boosters, which incorporate sufficient safeguards to mitigate interference to wireless networks. "
But I am concerned that they place the registration process in the hands of the carriers.
"Consumers may continue to use existing signal boosters provided they (1) have the consent of their provider, and (2) register the booster with that provider."
on the surface, this seems relatively benign. Carriers have a vested interest in ensuring both that their customers can effectively use their service and that the service to other customers isn't degraded but I am concerned that this "registration process" will potentially include a fee and that this fee will most likely be recurring. Much like the monthly recurring fee to activate my device as a personal hotspot.
Would have preferred that the registration be through a third party with no fiduciary interest in the process.
of course, this is a common problem with attempts at regulation and a strong argument for keeping the government out of the business of attempting to expand fiber access. | |
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| Re: Interesting I see one major flaw of this whole thing: carriers would have to admit that their signal strength sucks in a lot of places, which they do not want to do, thus, they would deny tons of these simply to add to the illusion that their signal strength is awesome everywhere. | |
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 rradina join:2000-08-08 Chesterfield, MO | Somewhat Makes Sense I don't know that much about these devices but it's probably safe to assume all are not created equal. Logically, they are probably offered with at least two architectures:
Passive - A device with a "strategically placed" antenna that transmits to the tower on behalf of the device by electronically improving the transmit location. To the cell network, it just appears as if someone is operating their cell phone on the roof or perhaps outside where sufficient signal exists. Logically, this shouldn't create any greater disruption than actually operating the phone in that same location.
Active - Similar but due to extreme distance or poor geography, a significantly amplified signal is sent to the tower on behalf of the device.
The former seems benign and as long as it's FCC certified not to exceed the transmit power of a typical network device, I don't see why carrier permission is required. However, when operated in the wrong location, the latter could do more harm than good and the carrier probably should approve its operation. | |
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 |  dnoyeBFerrous Phallus join:2000-10-09 Southfield, MI Reviews:
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| Re: Somewhat Makes Sense I don't see what harm is possible unless the device is defective. And if its only about defective devices, then its the FCC that should be approving them. But IIRC, the FCC already does.
The digital phones should not put out the full power unless its required. And it shouldn't be required unless reception/transmission is bad. And if transmission is already bad, how is this affecting other users nearby?
i believe this is protectionism. Plus I think the companies don't want it know for instance that people in a certain neighborhood all have power boosters because there is poor coverage.
Anyway, I'm no fan of increased power output of these devices. Health issues are already in question. -- dnoyeB "Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard. " Ecclesiastes 9:16
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 |  |  rradina join:2000-08-08 Chesterfield, MO | Re: Somewhat Makes Sense Agreed but what if someone buys the "active" device I mention above and operates it in a context where a passive device is appropriate? Granted, I'm making a lot of assumptions here but it seems logical to conclude there might be two basic device types. One that's electronically acting as a remote device. As long as it's FCC approved, it's basically just virtualizing the location of the device so that it's in an optimal spot for reception. There's no greater risk from this device than a defective handset, right?
However, if there's a second class of device with high power capability for remote areas where service is extremely spotty, this could be detrimental if used in the wrong context. Agreed?
I guess if all devices are the first class (again assuming two classes of devices even exist), I agree. There doesn't seem to be any carrier intervention required. However, if the second, high power device exists, perhaps only that device needs carrier approval? | |
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 |  Camelot OnePremium,MVM join:2001-11-21 Greenwood, IN kudos:1 | I can't find anything that lays out what grounds the carrier needs to show to deny the boosters. So give it a year, and you will see a whole new line of "Carrier Approved" - aka, sold only by the carrier at a massive markup - devices. And only those devices will be approved for use. It is going to be the new version of cable boxes. | |
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 |  |  rradina join:2000-08-08 Chesterfield, MO | Re: Somewhat Makes Sense Frankly, that's troubling but not as troubling as if the carrier charged another MONTHLY @$@%@#$ fee to operate the damn thing! Microsoft mastered the "phone home" era with "Genuine Advantage". Raise your hand if you think a carrier will sell you one of these without it phoning home for permission to operate.
-- Cricket sounds and no raised hands --
Thought so... | |
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| Manufacturers Should Get "FCC Certification" Manufacturers should get their devices type certified by the Carriers and or FCC . Don't leave to consumers as they my end up purchasing a unit that can't be registered. -- The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. | |
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 |  LinklistPremium join:2002-03-03 Longport, NJ kudos:5 | Re: Manufacturers Should Get "FCC Certification" said by pende_tim:Manufacturers should get their devices type certified by the Carriers and or FCC . Don't leave to consumers as they my end up purchasing a unit that can't be registered. They already are FCC approved. -- I will be perfectly happy if the budget cuts specified in the Budget Control Act go into effect. 3 cheers for the sequester. Take the money from the drunken federal spenders. | |
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| Re: Manufacturers Should Get "FCC Certification" So if I have a generic broadband booster that amplifies in the 700, 800 and PCS bands, and in turn works on Verizon, AT&T, Sprint, T mobile, etc do I need to register it with all the carriers in my area? -- The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. | |
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 |  |  |  LinklistPremium join:2002-03-03 Longport, NJ kudos:5 1 edit | Re: Manufacturers Should Get "FCC Certification" said by pende_tim:So if I have a generic broadband booster that amplifies in the 700, 800 and PCS bands, and in turn works on Verizon, AT&T, Sprint, T mobile, etc do I need to register it with all the carriers in my area? Not until the FCC rules kick in and then only with your carrier. Id have to read the actual FCC order to see what they demand. But then I personally would do nothing unless the carrier or FCC contacted me with a complaint, which is very unlikely.
P.S. Each carrier has to develop a registration system and then communicate with all their customers demanding they register signal boosters. What chance do you think that communication will be by insert in a monthly bill and that a VERY small % of consumers will ever see it?
-- I will be perfectly happy if the budget cuts specified in the Budget Control Act go into effect. 3 cheers for the sequester. Take the money from the drunken federal spenders. | |
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| Re: Manufacturers Should Get "FCC Certification" I do not expect the FCC to come knocking at my door either, but technically this could be a cluster.... Let's say I have AT&T and dutifully register. My son comes to visit and he has verizon. Technically am I in violation at this point? -- The difference between genius and stupidity is that genius has its limits. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  LinklistPremium join:2002-03-03 Longport, NJ kudos:5 | Re: Manufacturers Should Get "FCC Certification" said by pende_tim:I do not expect the FCC to come knocking at my door either, but technically this could be a cluster.... Let's say I have AT&T and dutifully register. My son comes to visit and he has verizon. Technically am I in violation at this point? Maybe. The order I read didn't make that clear. Though you bring up a good point. Maybe the carriers will create a shared database between carriers. -- I will be perfectly happy if the budget cuts specified in the Budget Control Act go into effect. 3 cheers for the sequester. Take the money from the drunken federal spenders. | |
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 westdc join:2009-01-25 Amissville, VA kudos:1 | Only If I tell them. | |
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 |  bbeesleyVIP join:2003-08-07 Richardson, TX kudos:5 | Re: Only said by westdc:If I tell them. or until the FCC receives a complaint. then you will have to shut it down
"we intend to exercise the discretion allowed by our rules and direct the Enforcement Bureau in this limited context to provide a consumer that has not registered a booster and/or obtained consent from a carrier a warning.....Consumers receiving a warning must promptly remedy violations; otherwise, they may be subject to forfeitures." | |
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 |  |  westdc join:2009-01-25 Amissville, VA kudos:1 | Re: Only What equipment? I don't have no stinking equipment? | |
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| Re: Only said by westdc:What equipment? I don't have no stinking equipment? Guess you've never heard of spectrum analyzers and triangulation. Be careful ignoring FCC regs, they have the civil authority to seize any equipment you own that is being used for unlawful broadcasts, and can refer particularly egregious cases to the US Attorney for criminal prosecution. These are licensed frequencies, unless you paid for a cellular/PCS license you really don't have any legal or moral right to broadcast on them with equipment the license holder hasn't approved.
Random musing, but there is a bit of a double standard here too. People here are begging for the FCC to put teeth into broadband regulation, but simultaneously bemoan them when they carry out their traditional responsibility of regulating the use of the public airwaves. | |
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 tkdslr join:2004-04-24 Pompano Beach, FL Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
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| Hmm.. I wonder if I'll need to cert my Empty can of Peaches(29oz).. plus a little bubble wrap, makes a great Cantenna for my Samsung Smart phone..
But you've got to figure out where the antenna is located inside the phone, location of the towers, and do some calculations to get the measurements just right.
As far as usefulness.. It blue-tooth's to my cordless phones.. USB charging/tether sticks out of the front. | |
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| Re: Hmm.. I wonder if I'll need to cert my said by tkdslr:Empty can of Peaches(29oz).. plus a little bubble wrap, makes a great Cantenna for my Samsung Smart phone..
But you've got to figure out where the antenna is located inside the phone, location of the towers, and do some calculations to get the measurements just right.
As far as usefulness.. It blue-tooth's to my cordless phones.. USB charging/tether sticks out of the front.
Is that something like two soup cans connected with string?  | |
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 |  patcat88 join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY kudos:1 | You have voided the FCC type approval for the wireless device. Please turn around and put your hands on the wall. | |
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 skeechanAi OtsukaholicPremium join:2012-01-26 AA169|170 kudos:2 | Don't even the "poor" quality products... ...require FCC device approval?
If so, who is to blame that the supposedly inferior products cause interference problems?
I am not aware of any circumstance where you can just import some junk and have it broadcast...legally at least. | |
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 |  Max SignalPremium join:2008-03-07 Buffalo, NY kudos:1 | Re: Don't even the "poor" quality products... said by skeechan:...require FCC device approval?
If so, who is to blame that the supposedly inferior products cause interference problems?
I am not aware of any circumstance where you can just import some junk and have it broadcast...legally at least. It is called EBAY -- »www.maximumsignal.net/ | |
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 |  |  See 6 replies to this post |
 Mr Matt join:2008-01-29 Eustis, FL kudos:1 Reviews:
·CenturyLink
·Comcast
·Embarq Now Centu..
| Telephone equipment can be registered why not signal booster During my career I represented three companies, first at the FCC registration meetings and later the Electronics Industry Association meetings to set standards for the registration of telephone terminal equipment. If telephone sets and other terminal equipment can be registered with the FCC why can't Cellular Telephone signal booster be applied. They are much simpler. Wired telephone handsets were even registered with different ringer equivalence number for connection to GTE Automatic Electric Exchanges and Bell System Western Electric Exchanges.
If the wireless carriers want to establish monthly charges for using signal boosters that is beyond the limits of hypocrisy. It is the same BS of charging a wireless customer to use a microcell and their data throughput allocation (CAP) because the wireless carriers are to cheap to install sufficient cell sites in the area.
Any legitimate booster manufacture would be able to have their equipment performance evaluated to see that they meet standards established by the FCC wireless carriers and equipment manufactures. It took several years to establish standards for wired telephones. | |
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 | | Not true The rule says, "We note that Verizon Wireless, T-Mobile, Sprint, AT&T, and the RTG member companies have made voluntary commitments to consent to all Consumer Signal Boosters that meet the Network Protection Standard.42 Therefore, we expect that subscribers of these companies will not need to specifically seek consent from these providers, or other providers who make similar blanket consent commitments, for Consumer Signal Boosters that meet the Network Protection Standard.
We expect that this blanket protection will apply to cell boosters made by reliable manufacturers. | |
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 chip89 join:2012-07-05 Independence, OH 3 edits | Airwave I know with the airwave it is put in a database allready when A friend bought One a few years ago I helped him set It up and you needed to call a number to put in a database so you could use it. | |
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 | | Do signal boosters cost less ... than the femtocells that carriers let you buy from them? Do they have higher transmit power? I don't see the point otherwise. | |
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 |  | | Re: Do signal boosters cost less One benefit to a signal booster as opposed to a femtocell is that the signal booster does not require an internet connection, all it does is rebroadcast the wireless signal whereas a femtocell uses your internet connection to handle the cell phones connected to it. -- Most people don't think clearly when they're on fire.
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| Re: Do signal boosters cost less I suppose that would be an issue if there were no wireline Internet service or existing service comes with a data allowance. But besides that, what's the difference?
Both are supposed to be low-wattage broadcast devices. From a quick google search, the boosters you can buy on your own cost more than the femtocells many carriers probably give away for free. | |
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 |  joakoPremium join:2000-09-07 /dev/null kudos:5 Reviews:
·Comcast
| Yes. You buy the hardware and up to now that is it, no need to register or notify the provider. There is no cost for the service and you are not helping (at your expense) to off-load traffic from the carrier's network. -- PRescott7-2097 | |
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 |  | | said by Network Guy:... than the femtocells that carriers let you buy from them? Do they have higher transmit power? I don't see the point otherwise. I have one of the Wilson units in my vehicle, and it gave me 100% coverage when travelling in rural areas where my handset would previously go into "no service" mode. I've used it at hunting cabins and other remote locations as well. A femtocell would be useless in any application where you didn't have access to broadband internet via a landline. | |
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 |  | | Re: From my cold dead hands That's pretty neat! | |
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 |  |  NetFixerFrom my cold dead handsPremium join:2004-06-24 The Boro Reviews:
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1 edit | Re: From my cold dead hands The management of the apartment complex where I live is pretty easy to get along with. They had no problems with my erecting the cage around my patio and installing a pet door so that my cats had free access to fresh air and sunshine, or with attaching the antenna mast to the cage structure. I do suspect, though, that if my patio were "front facing" instead of being hidden from public view, it might not have been allowed.
Unfortunately, the easily visible external antenna will make it even easier for the FCC goon squad to locate me. 
I tried one of WiEx's window mount antennas first, but I could not get a strong enough signal for that to work. -- A well-regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. | |
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| Re: From my cold dead hands I honestly don't think FCC will knock on your door if that indoor repeater doesn't emanate too far beyond your indoor walls.
Based on the specs I saw in zBoost site, that unit looks like it could transmit up to 3 watts max based on the square footage coverage it claims to do.
As for the antenna... well.. You can always dress it up and hope it doesn't screw up ingress.  | |
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 |  |  |  joakoPremium join:2000-09-07 /dev/null kudos:5 | It's not an antenna, it's a flag pole.
Paint it and hang a flag. -- PRescott7-2097 | |
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 BiggA join:2005-11-23 EARTH Reviews:
·Comcast
| Good idea Now that I see Wilson electronics are pre-approved, this looks like a good idea. With a few exceptions, everything not made by Wilson just looks shady in the first place, and they do sometimes interfere, because they are poorly made. Wilson Electronics is the one brand in this market you know you can trust for a good product. | |
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 joakoPremium join:2000-09-07 /dev/null kudos:5 | Car Amp So I need AT&T to approve the OEM equipment amplifier in my car?
iPhone docks in center console, amplifier in trunk, antenna in rear bumper. -- PRescott7-2097 | |
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 | | Interference Could be an Issue, but Glad I got a Wilson I guess I should be glad I chose a Wilson DB Pro for my coverage problems. Frankly, when I bought it, I thought it was illegal, but since I get 1 bar of signal with Sprint PCS **standing on my roof**, and no service inside the house, I had no choice but to invest in one of these. Not perfect, but as long as I keep the phone in a few specific places in the house near the indoor panel antenna, I can make and receive calls. Will see what happens with the trees come into bloom whether I lose all signal completely. PCS needs a booster just about everywhere. Long live iDEN! Down with PCS. | |
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 IowaCowboyWant to go back to IowaPremium join:2010-10-16 Springfield, MA Reviews:
·Comcast
·Verizon Broadban..
| Building access I personally think there should be a mandate that the owners of commercial buildings allow cell providers to install repeaters in those buildings. I know of one instance (according to a VZW employee) where mall management at Eastfield Mall refused to allow VZW to install a repeater in the facility and that site was a dead zone for VZW except for the food court where you might get one bar. The only reason that mall has reception now is VZW added their hardware to a cell site located in a nearby self-storage place.
I personally think if the cell provider wants to install a repeater in a commercial building and they offer a reasonable fee for the privilege, then the building owner should be required to grant access. -- I've experienced ImOn (when they were McLeod USA), Mediacom, Comcast, and Time Warner. They are much better than broadcast TV.
I have not and will not cut the cord. | |
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 Max SignalPremium join:2008-03-07 Buffalo, NY kudos:1 1 edit | Nice Statement from Wilson Wonderful statement from Wilson . But let's see them make a new amplifier that will now pass these new standards and actually has some power . That is the challenge all the fail safes the FCC now wants built into every amplifier from this point on are going to be a challenge . No current amplifier on the market would meet all of them . It is going to be a real challenge to get amplifiers passed in the future . All the amplifier companies's engineers are really going to earn their paychecks.
The last paragraph is totally wrong Mr Bode . No where even Wilson's statement does it say there older units are sanctioned under the new rules . -- »www.maximumsignal.net/ | |
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