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FTTH Council Wants 100Mbps For All
But like most groups, ignores why it won't happen...
by Karl Bode Friday 26-Sep-2008 tags: legal · coverage · business · Op/Ed · Politics
This week a coalition of groups, including CWA, FTTH Council, TechNet, and the Information Technology Industry Council sent a letter to Congress repeating calls for a national broadband policy that delivers 10Mbps to everyone by 2010, and 100Mbps for everyone by 2015. This is the same call to action the groups made last year, and hasn't seen much traction since -- for a reason the group doesn't mention.

Last year, the council began their push for a "100Mbps Nation." This year, their hopeful call to arms focuses more specifically on the passage of two Congressional resolutions. Both Senate Resolution 191 and House resolution 1292 don't really create national broadband policies -- they simply set the framework to begin thinking about it. The companion bills are spearheaded by John D. Rockefeller IV (D-WV) and Representative Anna Eshoo (D-CA), and do little more than set vague, national deployment goals:

"By establishing these ambitious national goals, Congress can communicate to the nation a robust vision of telecommunications infrastructure which will encourage a vibrant economy and enhance the social welfare of all Americans," the organizations wrote. "We believe the Rockefeller-Eshoo resolution is an important measure for America's broadband future."

Every month or two seems to see a new group (like "Internet for Everyone") calling out for a national broadband policy, but no policy ever emerges. None of these groups take aim at the real reason their pushes perpetually fail. While theyr'e quick to identify problems with competition and penetration, they rarely identify the core disease when tracked down to the root: incumbent ISP lobbyist influence in Washington.

Perhaps groups calling out for a 100Mbps nation would be better served cleaning up the pay-to-play political system first, given all of these proposals are killed by incumbent ISP lobbyists long before they reach fruition. Why? Progressive proposals might force the nation's largest carriers to deploy services into more rural markets and/or bolster competition in the marketplace, both of which would significantly impact revenue.

If you think that the constant call to develop a national broadband policy in 2008 means that such a policy is inevitable, you're partly right. The nation's largest carriers, frightened of such calls, have joined forces to create something that vaguely looks like a national broadband policy, but really works to protect incumbent interests while keeping more progressive proposals at bay. Of course, "spotty 5Mbps for all" won't have quite the same ring.

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Hazy Arc

join:2006-04-10
Greenwood, SC

Interesting...

It's interesting that we are shooting for 10Mbps by 2010...when the article directly above this one states that Japan is already deploying symmetrical 1Gbps connections for $50 a month.

How sad.

Cabal
Premium
join:2007-01-21
Austin, TX

Re: Interesting...

Sure, for everyone that can afford a single-family dwelling in Tokyo.
PDXPLT

join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR

Re: Interesting...

said by Cabal:

Sure, for everyone that can afford a single-family dwelling in Tokyo.
Plus those living in apartments up to three stories high. Which is alot. Tokyo isn't a city exclusively dominated by high-rise apartments, like some other Asian cities.
NewMariner

join:2005-06-24

Who's Picking up the Tab?

And who do they suggest to pick up the tab on this? As a tax payer, I sure would not vote for this. I dont care what how fast anyone can download their pr0n. We have to many pressing issues to fix...such as right now our economy, then healthcare, then welfare, and the many other programs we already have that are broken.

Lets fix those first before getting another program together that will falter and be broken.

Hazy Arc

join:2006-04-10
Greenwood, SC

Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

We should work on a 100% broadband footprint before we worry about increasing connection speeds for those who already have broadband.

Romney2012
Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe in
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said by NewMariner:

And who do they suggest to pick up the tab on this? As a tax payer, I sure would not vote for this. I dont care what how fast anyone can download their pr0n. We have to many pressing issues to fix...such as right now our economy, then healthcare, then welfare, and the many other programs we already have that are broken.

Lets fix those first before getting another program together that will falter and be broken.
Good point.

And this statement shows a good amount of naiveté:

Perhaps groups calling out for a 100Mbps nation would be better served cleaning up the pay-to-play political system first.


That task could take decades to accomplish. Unless of course the economy totally collapses this weekend.
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Matt
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said by NewMariner:

And who do they suggest to pick up the tab on this? As a tax payer, I sure would not vote for this.
And as a taxpayer, I certainly would. Isn't democracy grand?
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by Matt:

And as a taxpayer, I certainly would. Isn't democracy grand?
Aside from the fact that we have never lived in a democracy, I must ask, why burden the taxpayers who don't want to pay for this with the cost, especially when the government isn't legally allowed to be tasked with this project (of course that invalidates about 60% of all federal expenditures)?

There's nothing stopping all of the people who want to make this happen from pooling their own money into a private venture that can make this happen.
--
"At the moment of conception."

Matt
All noise, no signal.
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Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by pnh102:

said by Matt:

And as a taxpayer, I certainly would. Isn't democracy grand?
Aside from the fact that we have never lived in a democracy, I must ask, why burden the taxpayers who don't want to pay for this with the cost, especially when the government isn't legally allowed to be tasked with this project (of course that invalidates about 60% of all federal expenditures)?

There's nothing stopping all of the people who want to make this happen from pooling their own money into a private venture that can make this happen.
Yes, we live in a Republic, but idealistically we are a democracy: »usinfo.state.gov/products/pubs/w···tdm2.htm

Anyway, I am burdened with thousands of things I want nothing to do with now. And why are they legally not allowed to get involved? Are you equating their involvement with building the infrastructure? If so, that is remarkably shortsighted. There is a myriad of ways the government can get involved to make this happen.

After all, it took government involvement to make the interstate system and national power grid happen and those have been wildly successful and very reliable.
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
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Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by Matt:

Yes, we live in a Republic, but idealistically we are a democracy: »usinfo.state.gov/products/pubs/w···tdm2.htm
What can I say, if the State Department claims that we are a democracy when the Constitution states that we are a republic, the the State Department is wrong.
said by Matt:

Anyway, I am burdened with thousands of things I want nothing to do with now.
Well, nothing of this scope can be done in one's spare time. Planning and building something takes dedication and effort. What would have happened if someone like Alexander Graham Bell, Henry Ford or Thomas Edison waited around for the government to do the things they succeeded in doing?
said by Matt:

And why are they legally not allowed to get involved?
...
After all, it took government involvement to make the interstate system and national power grid happen and those have been wildly successful and very reliable.
The interstate highway system was built under the auspices of national defense. The Constitution grants the government wide latitude to do things under the auspices of national defense.

Building a taxpayer financed content delivery service isn't one of those things.
--
"At the moment of conception."

SillyRabbit

@tds.net

Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by pnh102:

said by Matt:
After all, it took government involvement to make the interstate system and national power grid happen and those have been wildly successful and very reliable.
The interstate highway system was built under the auspices of national defense. The Constitution grants the government wide latitude to do things under the auspices of national defense.

Building a taxpayer financed content delivery service isn't one of those things.
Sure it is.... Wink, wink... Under the auspices of national defense. Dooh!

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
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Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by SillyRabbit :

Sure it is.... Wink, wink... Under the auspices of national defense. Dooh!
Yes, it is.

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Federal-Ai···_of_1956
--
"At the moment of conception."
Sammer

join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA
said by pnh102:

There's nothing stopping all of the people who want to make this happen from pooling their own money into a private venture that can make this happen.
Try it and unless you're an incumbent see how fast you get sued!

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by Sammer:

Try it and unless you're an incumbent see how fast you get sued!
Do it privately.

I thank companies who sue governments who waste money on this BS.
--
"At the moment of conception."

SillyRabbit

@tds.net
said by pnh102:

said by Matt:
Aside from the fact that we have never lived in a democracy, I must ask, why burden the taxpayers who don't want to pay for this with the cost, especially when the government isn't legally allowed to be tasked with this project (of course that invalidates about 60% of all federal expenditures)?
By your logic, why burden the taxpayers who don't want to pay taxes for the children of other people's education? I know I don't want to be burdened with that crap.

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by SillyRabbit :

By your logic, why burden the taxpayers who don't want to pay taxes for the children of other people's education? I know I don't want to be burdened with that crap.
Exactly!
--
"At the moment of conception."

Matt
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Re: Who's Picking up the Tab?

said by pnh102:

said by SillyRabbit :

By your logic, why burden the taxpayers who don't want to pay taxes for the children of other people's education? I know I don't want to be burdened with that crap.
Exactly!


I suggest you go buy an island.
--
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pbarrow
Premium
join:2003-09-16
Montgomery, AL
kudos:1
You are paying for it all anyway.
How many price increase has your ISP had in recent years? Or are you new to the internet?
In 2001 when Charter bought out AT&T @home I was paying 29.95 for 3M - then it went to 39.95 - then 5Meg came along and it went to 41.95 then 44.95 - and that's with me owning my own modem.

I would rather have Gov involved in the expansion and maybe regulating and limiting prices than the ISP bilking me with bi-annual and annual prices increases and decreasing performance and capacity problems.

I'm quite happy have the Public Service Commission regulate ATT here. My phone bill has only increase a couple of $ in 8 years and I've only had phone service go out 2 times.
Sure can't say the same for my Cable service.
nasadude

join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD

a day late and a dollar short

Japan in 2008: 1Gbps symmetrical

U.S. in 2015: 100Mbps, maybe symmetrical, probably not

DoctorDoom
Troll hunter
Premium
join:2006-09-19
Becket, MA

Re: a day late and a dollar short

quote:
Japan in 2008: 1Gbps symmetrical

U.S. in 2015: 100Mbps, maybe symmetrical, probably not
Japan: 145,883 square miles
US: 3,794,083. square miles

Japan population: 127,288,419 (July 2008 est.)
US population: 303,824,646 (July 2008 est.)

Japan pop density: 872/square mile
US pop density: 80/square mile

• In 2000, 79.2% of the US population was in urban areas ( source ). Thus 20.8% of the US population is spread out in 94.6% of the US that is classified as rural ( source ).

• 3,718,712 x 94.6 = 3,517,902 square miles that are rural

• 303,824,646 x 20.8% = 63,195,526 people in 94.6% of the US.

• The rural population density is thus about 18 people per square mile.

Since the 18/mi² are certain to be in families, reducing the number of potential customers, what incentive is there to hardwire that 94.6% of America for broadband?
boast

join:2005-09-03
Miami, FL

Re: a day late and a dollar short

plus, japan has a richer economy. America can't afford this stuff. We should be glad we even have internet.

BF69
Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN
said by DoctorDoom:

quote:
Japan in 2008: 1Gbps symmetrical

U.S. in 2015: 100Mbps, maybe symmetrical, probably not
Japan: 145,883 square miles
US: 3,794,083. square miles

Japan population: 127,288,419 (July 2008 est.)
US population: 303,824,646 (July 2008 est.)

Japan pop density: 872/square mile
US pop density: 80/square mile

• In 2000, 79.2% of the US population was in urban areas ( source ). Thus 20.8% of the US population is spread out in 94.6% of the US that is classified as rural ( source ).

• 3,718,712 x 94.6 = 3,517,902 square miles that are rural

• 303,824,646 x 20.8% = 63,195,526 people in 94.6% of the US.

• The rural population density is thus about 18 people per square mile.

Since the 18/mi² are certain to be in families, reducing the number of potential customers, what incentive is there to hardwire that 94.6% of America for broadband?
All your numbers still don't explain why the 80% that live in the 5% of land area don't have speeds anywhere near Japan. Quit making excuses. Rhode Island has 1000 people per quare mile and still can't do any better than average 6.7 Mbps download.

maartena
Elmo
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It could be done.....

....were it not for the fact that we have a 600 billion war tab, a possible 700 billion bail-out tab if it gets approved, and almost 10 trillion dollars of national debt.

With all the bills this country still has to pay, adding one that finances a few billion or so to bring 10 Mbps to Nothing, AZ, Pop 19, is not very high on the priority list.

As a matter of fact, i'll gladly give up half of my internet speed if it means they actually get to fix things like social security and healthcare.

Right now it doesn't look like either presidential candidate can do what they are promising looking at the state of the economy, and we want to ask congress for a broadband policy?

Good luck with that.
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nasadude

join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
Reviews:
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Re: It could be done.....

it could be done if the govt would regulate the industry and enable competition.

the mantra of "facilities based competition" hasn't worked for CLECs because the incumbents fight tooth and nail and lawyer against any entity that promises competition. Look how hard they fight muni fiber deployments.

It won't take a huge influx of government money to get cheaper, faster broadband, it will take a competitive market.

A well regulated, competitive market won't happen until our congress and the FCC are no longer owned by the industries they regulate.

Vchat20
Landing is the REAL challenge
Premium
join:2003-09-16
Columbus, OH

Re: It could be done.....

said by nasadude:

it could be done if the govt would regulate the industry and enable competition.

the mantra of "facilities based competition" hasn't worked for CLECs because the incumbents fight tooth and nail and lawyer against any entity that promises competition. Look how hard they fight muni fiber deployments.

It won't take a huge influx of government money to get cheaper, faster broadband, it will take a competitive market.

A well regulated, competitive market won't happen until our congress and the FCC are no longer owned by the industries they regulate.
QFT
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1 edit
If they could fix those social security, healthcare, and cut the debt in half in 10 years, I'll gladly give up my braodband entirely.
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Rueal

@direcpc.com

Broadband for eveyone would be nice!

Hi all! I live out of the "limits" of broadband and cable, and I would be happy with just a 1mbs connection. My neighbors have HughesNet and it Blowz! "They let me feed off it with WiFi" as I have no dial-up connection, and even when it's not FAP'ed it goes EXTREMELY SLOW due to all the other poor saps who get online during the day. So this US scale broadband coverage would be a very good thing IMHO. Also, WiMax needs to come out!!!

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
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Stupid Idea

Didn't we just see the result of the Federal Government's "Mortgage For Everyone" program?
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"At the moment of conception."

SillyRabbit

@tds.net

Re: Stupid Idea

said by pnh102:

Didn't we just see the result of the Federal Government's "Mortgage For Everyone" program?
Dooh, apples and oranges. Fallacy much?

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Re: Stupid Idea

said by SillyRabbit :

Dooh, apples and oranges. Fallacy much?
You're right. There's no mortgage crisis at all. I misspoke.
--
"At the moment of conception."

NetAdmin1
CCNA

join:2008-05-22
said by pnh102:

Didn't we just see the result of the Federal Government's "Mortgage For Everyone" program?
AND the finance industry's practices of creating whacking lending schemes to entice borrowers; creating the scams known as credit derivatives; and for doing things with investor money that any average person would say were stupid and fiscally over the top...

AND the borrowers who went and fell for the crazy mortgage offers and purchased homes that THEY should have known were out of their price range..

AND the credit industry for loosening up the lending criteria or just plain ignoring it...

AND the corporate credit rating companies who were releasing glowing ratings on companies who were HEAVILY invested in credit derivative scams and other bogus and bullshit schemes to make money.

PLENTY of blame to go around. Industry certainly bears MOST of it this time for getting too greedy and putting its blinders on.
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See 7 replies to this post

Duramax08
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About Freakin Time.

I asked my congressmen if they would do some kind of incentives for companies that lay down fiber. This is good though. Well a start at least.
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mad100mbits

@optonline.net

how fast?

how many ren & stimpy episodes can you send in 1 second?

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=vN6NtWw5···=related
AquaSport
California - Sun, Surf, Traffic Jams

join:2007-05-03
California

Why Pay More?

Why should I pay to have 10 Mbps or 15 Mbps internet, when I'm fine with the 6 Mbps connection that I already have?

Netflix InstantWatch for the computer has three different qualities for instant streaming: Under 1 Mbps connection, 1-2 Mbps Connection, and 3 Mbps and Up. Seems like 6 is overkill right now, so why would I want to pay more taxes beefing up an appliance that works fine as-is?

Seems like a new tax to add more cell towers on major highways (for providers like at&t, Verizon Wireless, T-Mobile, Metro PCS, etc.) makes a lot more sense than a tax to speed up internet that is already fast enough for daily use... right?

I'd say: do things that improve safety (better wireless coverage, for example) 1st, and do other things later.
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***********
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