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Gadget Blogs Help Sell New Google Phone
Faster, meaner, sleeker than Droid, but T-Mobile only?
The gadget blogs are starting to get some face time with Google's new phone, the Nexus One -- and Gizmodo suggests that the device is "better in every way" than the Motorola Droid. More interesting than the phone itself perhaps is the fact that Google wants to use the phone to shift the U.S. market away from the subsidized handset and long term contract system -- toward the more European approach of buying a cellphone first, then shopping for your carrier. Except that's impossible if, as Engadget's leaked specs suggest, the phone hardware is only really compatible with T-Mobile's broadband network. It looks like the device will sort of go on sale January 5 -- by invite only.
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NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN

1 edit

NeoandGeo

Member

.

So they want us to step away from subsidized phones by keeping the "value" of the phone astronomically high compared to the price of manufacturing.

There is a word for this kind of ignorance.

EDIT: I am assuming the cost will be comparable to the average price of $600 for a smartphone.

Contents
Contents
join:2003-04-10
Circle Pines, MN

Contents

Member

Re: .

said by NeoandGeo:

So they want us to step away from subsidized phones by keeping the "value" of the phone astronomically high compared to the price of manufacturing.

There is a word for this kind of ignorance.

EDIT: I am assuming the cost will be comparable to the average price of $600 for a smartphone.
The rumor has it that it will be $199 directly from Google.

"According to Android&Me the Google Phone could be competitively priced at $199, subsidized by Google and not by a carrier (they would make money off of advertisements when people use Google services)."

Source: »www.tmonews.com/2009/12/ ··· ary-5th/

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: .

said by Contents:

said by NeoandGeo:

So they want us to step away from subsidized phones by keeping the "value" of the phone astronomically high compared to the price of manufacturing.

There is a word for this kind of ignorance.

EDIT: I am assuming the cost will be comparable to the average price of $600 for a smartphone.
The rumor has it that it will be $199 directly from Google.

"According to Android&Me the Google Phone could be competitively priced at $199, subsidized by Google and not by a carrier (they would make money off of advertisements when people use Google services)."

Source: »www.tmonews.com/2009/12/ ··· ary-5th/
I wonder what kinds of ads Google is talking about.

phxmark
What Country Are We Living In?
join:2000-12-27
Glendale, AZ

phxmark

Member

Re: .

I wonder what kinds of ads Google is talking about.
Probably like the 30 second ones you get when using free VOIP services before every call you make.
hottboiinnc4
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH

hottboiinnc4

Member

Re: .

what ads on their VoIP services?
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx to Gbcue

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to Gbcue
Maybe Google Maps will pop up sponsored results at the top of the list when you search for something.
NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN

NeoandGeo to Contents

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to Contents
That would be a good step forward into forcing the cellco's to be competitive.
openbox9
Premium Member
join:2004-01-26
71144

openbox9

Premium Member

Re: .

How so? You'll still need to pay the carriers for service, otherwise you're spending $199 on a paperweight.

banditws6
Shrinking Time and Distance
Premium Member
join:2001-08-18
Frisco, TX

banditws6

Premium Member

Locked to T-Mobile?

I actually applaud Google's effort to try to move us more toward the European approach to mobile phones, as during my travels I've appreciated the ability to buy a phone and then, separately, the SIM of my choice, without having to worry about contract terms.

However, if Google's hardware is only compatible with one domestic carrier, what is the point?

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

said by banditws6:

I actually applaud Google's effort to try to move us more toward the European approach to mobile phones, as during my travels I've appreciated the ability to buy a phone and then, separately, the SIM of my choice, without having to worry about contract terms.

However, if Google's hardware is only compatible with one domestic carrier, what is the point?
It is compatible with AT&T, just not 3G which in reality makes it hardly competitive.
pules
join:2001-01-10
Los Angeles, CA

pules

Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

not like ATT 3G is working anyway?

"HSPA 900 / 1700 / 2100, 7.2Mbps down and 2Mbps up -- in other words, yes to T-Mobile 3G and no to AT&T 3G, though you'll still be fine on EDGE"

With those radio frequencies, wouldn't the N1 be compatible with global GSM networks?

banditws6
Shrinking Time and Distance
Premium Member
join:2001-08-18
Frisco, TX

1 recommendation

banditws6 to ptrowski

Premium Member

to ptrowski
You're right, that's what it looked like -- EDGE only -- which would disqualify it outright for me.

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue to banditws6

Premium Member

to banditws6
It's not like AT&T even wants you to use it on their network anyways...

»AT&T Wireless: Please Don't Use Our Product [62] comments

ptrowski
Got Helix?
Premium Member
join:2005-03-14
Woodstock, CT

ptrowski

Premium Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

said by Gbcue:

It's not like AT&T even wants you to use it on their network anyways...

»AT&T Wireless: Please Don't Use Our Product [62] comments
Yes, we get the love of T-Mobile you have. One could also say that T-Mobile doesn't take 3G seriously yet due to a small footprint which is getting better. I am not looking to get into a pissing match about providers.

I look at it the same as people who want to use an iPhone 3G on T-Mobile. Can it be done? Sure.
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

TMo is making a big deal about 3G...they're listing each market as it launches. They're also on the fast path for upgrades to HSPA+. Who knows...maybe they'll beat AT&T in the 3G horserace a year or two from now.
elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA

elray to banditws6

Member

to banditws6
said by banditws6:

I actually applaud Google's effort to try to move us more toward the European approach to mobile phones ...

However, if Google's hardware is only compatible with one domestic carrier, what is the point?
Welcome to Google's concept of "choice".

Be careful what you wish for.

biggbrother
Premium Member
join:2001-11-07
Providence, RI

biggbrother

Premium Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

said by elray:
said by banditws6:

I actually applaud Google's effort to try to move us more toward the European approach to mobile phones ...

However, if Google's hardware is only compatible with one domestic carrier, what is the point?
Welcome to Google's concept of "choice".

Be careful what you wish for.
The phone is GSM. It works on both AT&T and T-Mobile, the only major U.S. GSM providers. Unfortunately, they use different spectrum for their 3G services. This isn't Google fault.

It's the exact opposite problem for iPhone 3G and 3GS users, who are restricted to Edge on T-Mobile's network.

Motorola is working on a radio that can use either frequency. The technology doesn;t exist yet. is Google responsible for the tech not being ready yet?

CDMA (Verizon & Sprint) is crap. It requires sticking to the current system.

banditws6
Shrinking Time and Distance
Premium Member
join:2001-08-18
Frisco, TX

banditws6

Premium Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

I had no idea that the technology to support both spectrums does not even exist yet.

Is there a "global standard" GSM spectrum that either AT&T or T-Mobile is not conforming to? Whichever one isn't conforming is the one that deserves my eye-roll.

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

1 edit

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

said by banditws6:

I had no idea that the technology to support both spectrums does not even exist yet.

Is there a "global standard" GSM spectrum that either AT&T or T-Mobile is not conforming to? Whichever one isn't conforming is the one that deserves my eye-roll.
According to Wikipedia, »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Un ··· s_System

The specific frequency bands originally defined by the UMTS standard are 1885–2025 MHz for the mobile-to-base (uplink) and 2110–2200 MHz for the base-to-mobile (downlink). In the US, 1710–1755 MHz and 2110–2155 MHz will be used instead, as the 1900 MHz band was already utilized.[6] While UMTS2100 is the most widely-deployed UMTS band, some countries' UMTS operators use the 850 MHz and/or 1900 MHz bands (independently, meaning uplink and downlink are within the same band), notably in the US by AT&T Mobility, New Zealand by Telecom New Zealand on the XT Mobile Network and in Australia by Telstra on the Next G network.

T-Mobile is operating within UMTS "spec" while AT&T is out of spec for 3G deployment frequencies.
bsoft
join:2004-03-28
Boulder, CO

bsoft to banditws6

Member

to banditws6
It does, it just costs money. Qualcomm (and others) charge for UMTS IP (specifically WCDMA) per band, so most devices don't implement more bands than are necessary. There is also added cost in the hardware, but my understanding is that the licensing fees are more significant.
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx to banditws6

Member

to banditws6
AT&T can use it, but isn't compatible with the phone's 3G. Also, there are a number of carriers that have 1700 spectrum other than T-Mobile. THey just aren't built out much...yet.

Also, international customers will be able to use 3G with no problem, since the phone has the standard 2100 band in addition to the 900 band, which is being used by an increasing number of providers to deploy 3G on. Sort of like 850 is being used in the US by AT&T....coverage is much better that way.

tmh
@verizon.net

tmh

Anon

Re: Locked to T-Mobile?

said by iansltx:

Also, international customers will be able to use 3G with no problem, since the phone has the standard 2100 band in addition to the 900 band, which is being used by an increasing number of providers to deploy 3G on.
Yessss! Finally, a 3G phone that takes a SIM card and works both here and abroad. Thank you Jesus.

biggbrother
Premium Member
join:2001-11-07
Providence, RI

biggbrother to banditws6

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to banditws6
And here is the endeavor by Motorola to bridge the gap:

»mobile.engadget.com/2009 ··· obile-u/

dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium Member
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ

dvd536 to banditws6

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to banditws6
said by banditws6:

I actually applaud Google's effort to try to move us more toward the European approach to mobile phones, as during my travels I've appreciated the ability to buy a phone and then, separately, the SIM of my choice, without having to worry about contract terms.

However, if Google's hardware is only compatible with one domestic carrier, what is the point?
At least its not saddled to the crappiest network in america like the iphone is[i know you can jailbreak them but thats not the point]

R4M0N
Brazilian Soccer Ownz Joo
join:2000-10-04
Glen Allen, VA

1 edit

R4M0N

Member

It's not the phone, it's the data plan

The only think keeping me from getting a "smart phone" is the value of the data plans out there.

I'm not about to shell out that much money monthly for some seriously limited internet access that I can't even opt out of.

If I wasn't forced to bundle a data plan, I would have gotten a smart phone a long time ago so I could use it with wi-fi and not wireless broadband.

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: It's not the phone, it's the data plan

said by R4M0N:

The only think keeping me from getting a "smart phone" is the value of the data plans out there.

I'm not about to shell out that much money monthly for some seriously limited internet access that I can't even opt out of.

If I wasn't forced to bundle a data plan, I would have gotten a smart phone a long time ago so I could use it with wi-fi and not wireless broadband.
What are you wanting to do with a smartphone without it's "smart" capabilities?

Sounds like you just want a dumbphone.
bt
join:2009-02-26
canada

1 recommendation

bt

Member

Re: It's not the phone, it's the data plan

There are a whole lot of "smart" capabilities that don't require a data plan to use, and the ones that do require an external connection can still be used over Wi-Fi networks.

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: It's not the phone, it's the data plan

said by bt:

There are a whole lot of "smart" capabilities that don't require a data plan to use, and the ones that do require an external connection can still be used over Wi-Fi networks.
Then it sounds like you want an iPod Touch with Skype...

R4M0N
Brazilian Soccer Ownz Joo
join:2000-10-04
Glen Allen, VA

3 edits

R4M0N

Member

Re: It's not the phone, it's the data plan

said by Gbcue:

said by bt:

There are a whole lot of "smart" capabilities that don't require a data plan to use, and the ones that do require an external connection can still be used over Wi-Fi networks.
Then it sounds like you want an iPod Touch with Skype...
Sounds like you're just arguing for the sake of arguing... Considering you completely ignored the sentence where I said I would like to use its smart capabilities over wi-fi, not wireless broadband.

BT nailed it on the head. I want a cell phone where I can choose to use its smart capabilities over wi-fi and not have to be raped by a data plan.

An "ipod touch with skype" doesn't even come close to being a cellphone.
NeoandGeo
join:2003-05-10
Harrison, TN

NeoandGeo to R4M0N

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I used to think the data plans were lame until I got the Droid, which actually seems usable for real web browsing even on 3g. On the XV6800 and Samsung Omnia, I felt used for paying $30 a month for something that was a pain in the ass to use.

tacoma
Bleeding Dodger Blue
Premium Member
join:2001-05-18
Murrieta, CA

tacoma

Premium Member

INVITE ONLY?

CAN I HAVE AN INVITE?

Mizex
WTF?
Premium Member
join:2002-03-11
Miami, FL

1 edit

Mizex

Premium Member

cdma version please?

I am very interested in seeing where the Nexus One goes. I just got my Hero in November and I love it. I hope they release a couple of models making it compatible with all carriers. I wouldn't mind getting one if it is $199 but kind of stuck with cdma for now.

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: cdma version please?

said by Mizex:

I am very interested in seeing where the Nexus One goes. I just got my Hero in November and I love it. I hope they release a couple of models making it compatible with all carriers. I wouldn't mind getting one if it is $199 but kind of stuck with cdma for now.
It goes anywhere there's GSM reception...

AVD
Respice, Adspice, Prospice
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Onion, NJ

2 edits

AVD

Premium Member

keep watching google.com/phone

google.com/phone puts up a funny 404 error

compare it to

google.com/nexus

[screenshot google.com/phone] [screenshot google.com/nexus]

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: keep watching google.com/phone

»www.google.com/nexusone

Also puts up that funny 404 error. Not standard, that is.

gbro84
Premium Member
join:2007-04-17
Azusa, CA

1 recommendation

gbro84

Premium Member

i'm no electrical engineer but...

how come manufacturers don't just put the support for all worldwide frequencies into their phones? I understand there's probably a battery life issue, but maybe manufacturers can have the phone automatically determine what frequency to use based on physical location using GPS or something to save battery? just a thought...

the Nokia N900 doesn't have the AT&T 3G bands either, so that was definitely a deal breaker for me. otherwise i would have jumped right on it... if this new google phone doesn't support AT&T 3G, then i'm not going to buy it either. AT&T might annoy the crap out of me sometimes but my company discount sure is nice

•••••••••
AstroBoy
join:2008-08-08
Parkville, MD

AstroBoy

Member

Will the service cost less if you buy the phone first?

Will the service cost less if you buy the phone first?

I bet not. But it should.

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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080

Member

universal prepaid google phone

How about a phone that works with ALL pre-paid services? Now that would be a neat trick.. there are so many..
This way you'd have your pick of the cheapest rates in the wireless industry and an insurance policy that they won't raise rates, since your not captive to a company.

Yeah, fantasy.. I know, but we can dream... apparently, Google's imagination isn't big enough!
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Re: universal prepaid google phone

That would be one expensive phone. Also some prepaids won't let in phones that aren't their own models (Virgin Mobile and Tracfone come to mind).

Also, the cheapest (except for data) prepaid provider out there (Page Plus Cellular) is on Verizon. Doubt that Google would support a CDMA 850/1900 only phone.
ISurfTooMuch
join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL

ISurfTooMuch to tmc8080

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to tmc8080
Well, if it's unlocked, you can just insert whichever prepaid SIM you want. And, if you get a Google Voice number, just have it forward to the number assigned to that SIM, and your number will never have to change.

Of course, this won't work for CDMA carriers, but that's because CDMA doesn't use a SIM, and CDMA carriers have to decide to allow a phone to connect to their network.

openupshop
join:2000-11-25
Chandler, AZ

openupshop

Member

Countdown on google.com

Go to google.com don't enter nothing in the search field and hit im feeling lucky. You will see a countdown timer..not sure if it's for the Nexus One.

••••
Taget
join:2004-07-29

Taget

Member

Hopefully they make a CDMA version too..

...for MetroPCS. Seems to be a natural marriage given both have a similar philosophy in terms of provider subsidies.
MetallicAnt
join:2000-10-04
Broomall, PA

MetallicAnt

Member

GSM More Open Then CDMA

Nexus One / T-Mobile HSPA 7.2

Doesn't get better then that.

T-Mobile IMHO is by far the most open of all the networks in the US. The only thing is their 3g network isn't that widespread yet. Verizon Wireless blows because of their locked down network even though they provide the most 3g coverage, and ATT's 3g has such high latency.

ArrayList
DevOps
Premium Member
join:2005-03-19
Mullica Hill, NJ

ArrayList

Premium Member

Re: GSM More Open Then CDMA

really makes me wonder where tmo will be in 5-10 years. how much more growth they have. if this kind of stuff keep sup they have a lot of potential.

Elite
Kiss My Ass
join:2002-10-03
New Haven, CT
Synology RT2600ac
TP-Link TC-7650
ARRIS SB8200

1 edit

Elite

Member

How terrible

While the Nexus One seems like a pretty slick phone, I'm upset that it's only available for the TMo 3G frequencies. Had it supported AT&T 3G, I would've probably purchased one to use alongside my iPhone 3GS.

But honestly, that's pretty unrealistic. Apple doesn't like the Android platform, as it's possibly the only cellphone platform that could compete with the almighty iPhone. Google isn't going to push their platform by making a handset for AT&T. They'll stick with TMo and VZW in their crusade against AT&T and Apple. Remember the G1? TMo 3G only. And obviously the iPhone doesn't work with TMo 3G either...

It's really a matter of tit-for-tat. Apple makes 3 handsets for AT&T. Google pushes their Android platform by releasing 2 "iPhone killer" handsets for TMo and 1 for VZW. (Droid, G1, Nexus One, not including the other Android handsets.)

Each major carrier gets one exclusive handset on either platform. Apple and AT&T are on one side of the equation. Google, TMo, and VZM are on the other.

Do you really think Apple is gonna make a new iPhone for VZW or TMo? Not likely, if both providers continue selling more and more handsets on the Android platform in an attempt to de-throne the iPhone.

There are *currently*, no Android handsets on AT&T. There's a Moto Android handset rumored to be coming to AT&T, but it won't have any Google apps on it (Google it). Is Google playing favorites? I think so. VZM and TMo on the other hand, are both expected to continue launching many more Android handsets in 2010.

Let the handset and carrier wars continue.

Btw, for all you AT&T 3G bashers... I just pulled 1,333Kbit down, 293Kbit up, and 273ms ping on my iPhone 3GS in the DSLR Speedtest app. Sure it could be faster, but at least it's over 1Mbit and I've got full service. Works for me...

Edit: The only company who really isn't playing favorites is RIM, as they've got some nice handsets for every carrier, and a lot of their handsets support all sorts of 3G CDMA and HSDPA frequencies. Don't forget that RIM has been producing handsets much longer than Apple and long before Google's Android platform. It's too bad Apple wiped the floor with RIM when they released the iPhone though.

jsz0
Premium Member
join:2008-01-23
Jewett City, CT

jsz0

Premium Member

Re: How terrible

I think you might be jumping the gun a bit on the Apple conspiracy. Verizon & Sprint launched their first Android handsets within the last 2 months. The Sony Android phone is headed to AT&T next year I believe. HTC's leaked GSM roadmap for next year shows several models that support AT&T 3G frequencies.

PBellGSM
@sigmanet.com

PBellGSM

Anon

Companies make decisions for political reasons


I'm sure if Google wanted to create a device compatible with AT&T off the bat they would but they chose not to. AT&T went for the jugglar and is finding ways to make Google pay more for interconnection calls. AT&T also created a smear campaign against Google's endeavors.

AT&T hasn't exactly been huge supporters of the Android OS either.

To be honest, everyone who claims Google is missing out by excluding the 850/1900 MHz band is missing the point. It's not our concern as consumers whether they miss out or not. To me it just sounds like user annoyance that they can't have the hottest phone on a network of their choice.

I'm not blaming anyone for feeling jealous, but as a T-Mobile customer I'm stuck using EDGE if I want to use the iPhone.

AT&T, despite its network mismanagement has lured millions of users from other carriers onto its network just for the iPhone. T-Mobile many not have a US network the size of Verizon's but if there is enough of a buzz this new hot phone may cause users to leave their existing carrier and port over.

T-Mobile has a lot to gain by partnering and helping to promote this device. I believe that is why they are furiously rushing to grow their HSDPA network with plans to upgrade it to HSPA and HSPA+ next year.

Also, as a former Verizon Wireless subscriber, I too read the forums and heard all the VZW and AT&T employees bad mouthing T-Mobile telling me they were terrible everywhere and they sucked..

Well you know what? They don't where I live. I would have never known it if I didn't give them a chance. There network may not be as hot in some places, but then again maybe the Nexus One isn't for you either?

If an AT&T tech savvy user really wants this phone and wants to use the 3G network associated with it they can switch carriers. If that option isn't feasible then they can just suck it up and wait for the new iPhone and be done with themselves already.

Elite
Kiss My Ass
join:2002-10-03
New Haven, CT
Synology RT2600ac
TP-Link TC-7650
ARRIS SB8200

Elite

Member

One more thing

One last thought...

If Apple decides to tell AT&T to get lost and releases the 4th gen handset in June 2010 with no AT&T 3G support and exclusively for either TMo or VZM, do you think Google is going to sell as many Android handsets on that carrier?

The answer is no. Plenty of people are already flocking to AT&T from VZM or TMo solely for an iPhone. Anyone buying an Android handset is buying one because they either:

a) Want an iPhone but are unwilling to switch carriers, so they're settling for the next best alternative, which is, in their eyes, an Android smartphone.

b) Really likes the Android platform for one reason or another and wants one instead of an iPhone.

If VZM or TMo get an iPhone, everyone who would fall under category "a" is going to react with "HOLY SHIT CARRIER X HAS THE IPHONE NOW OMG OMG OMG". They're gonna buy the iPhone. They're not gonna settle for an Android when they know the can get an iPhone, which isn't going to help Android sales (obviously in case "a" and not case "b").

/End rant.

•••

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium Member
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC

Matt3

Premium Member

Win for Android Platform

This is just another win for the Android platform, but the device isn't meant to compete with the Droid and isn't necessarily faster. Android 2.1 is running on this device and when you see it hacked onto a Droid, the Droid is stunningly faster than the Droid running 2.0.1. Secondly, I'll never, ever own a phone with just a software keyboard again. They suck. Bad. And third, T-Mobile? No thanks.

So while this isn't meant to compete with the Droid, the HTC Hero/Droid Eris sales number might be cannibalized when the phone comes to CDMA/LTE however.

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