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2 edits | Re: Charge? my bro used to pay $80 i send in packet8 VOIP box work great until they move him to another base this passed month
oh yeah the speeds were crap sometimes less then 28k modem but packet8 work perfectly don't ask me how.... 
(3000 ping to packet8 servers this we tested on an internet cafe they had //not on actual line he had install in his room) | |
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| | | What can we do.... What can we do in this community to help support these guys? Create/edit/improve the how-to guides? Help identify cost efficient bandwidth?
I got the impression that financial contributions are tricky, but is that really the case? | |
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|  DaMaGeINCThe Lan ManPremium
join:2002-06-08
Greenville, SC
kudos:2 | Re: Charge? Here is a pic of one of the NOC's | |
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|  kamm
join:2001-02-14
Brooklyn, NY
3 edits | Umm surprise? One of our phone companies have a DoD-granted monopoly on phone systems, charging shocking fees to call home...
Guess which phone company is it...
HINT: the same one that grants illegally full access to NSA.
It's not war - it's business. Welcome to Bush World. | |
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| | Yup My bro has one of those  | |
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 DerchPremium
join:2004-10-16
Cross Plains, WI | Billions for Nothing I think it's ridiculous that we spend Billions a month in Iraq and we can only provide 12 computers for every 1,000 troops. | |
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|  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:1
1 edit | Re: Billions for Nothing Is there ANY WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH FOR THE LOVE OF PETE please please PRETTY PLEASE can we not go down the political route with this one?
Just once, people. ONCE is ALL I'M ASKING.
It's actually a very interesting story, and shows the ingenuity of people in the field..
Also, I think someone should be looking into just how these guys are setting all of this stuff up. It may be useful for bringing internet service to areas in the US hit by natural disasters.... | |
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| |  hopeflickerCapitalism breeds greedPremium
join:2003-04-03
Long Beach, CA
kudos:1 | Re: Billions for Nothing said by N3OGH:Is there ANY WAY ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH FOR THE LOVE OF PETE please please PRETTY PLEASE can we not go down the political route with this one? Just once, people. ONCE is ALL I'M ASKING. It's actually a very interesting story, and shows the ingenuity of people in the field.. Also, I think someone should be looking into just how these guys are setting all of this stuff up. It may be useful for bringing internet service to areas in the US hit by natural disasters.... It's that GW Bush's fault!
Yeah, that's right. 
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Science will prove that "the creator" does not exist. | |
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| | | | Really didn't see anything political about this particular comment, but I do understand your point about how the discussion often deteriorates to political mudslinging( I felt the same air about this comment but chose to give the poster the benefit of a doubt since they didn't get specific) I tend to agree that their (military personnel) needs to be more done for a person and their families if they choose to put their lives on the line for ALL of us in the free world to exercise freedom. | |
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| |  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
1 edit | This would be a good area for the Dell, Gateway, HP, etc to help. They could give cut rate prices on new lap tops to troops overseas, there are also a large numbers of used laptops that are returned to these outfits from business leases, these could be offered at an even cheaper price. They could also offer a block price for X number of units an then encourage organizations such as the VFW, American Legion, etc to purchase these "blocks" to send to the troops. Looking at this with a long term view this would be a way of engendering brand loyalty. An example of this is would be WWII troops purchasing only Fords, or GM cars after the war because one of these outfits made the M4 Sherman tank, JEEP, trucks, etc, they fought through the war with.
Being a Navy Vet' it is worth noting sailors have much better access to the internet on board ship. I am of course biased but the Navy does take better care of its people then the Army does especially in the three hots and a cot department. 
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The older I get the more I prefer the company of my dogs over that of man kind. | |
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| | | | | Re: Billions for Nothing, and your chicks for free Hell, not cut rate prices, how about some refurbished ones or the ones people decided they didn't want. it's already taken a hit on the price, might as well put to a good cause. | |
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| | | | TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
1 edit | Re: Billions for Nothing, and your chicks for free said by HawkI911:Hell, not cut rate prices, how about some refurbished ones or the ones people decided they didn't want. it's already taken a hit on the price, might as well put to a good cause. You bet instead of giving these computers away to 3rd world countries given-em to our Sailors, Marines, and Troops.
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The older I get the more I prefer the company of my dogs over that of man kind. | |
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| | | | | I believe someone is confused here. I can't recall the last time a company slashed their prices for the government. I hear they pay $100 for a regular hammer. Come on, get real!
I am all for the troops having computers, but as a post on this thread already made a point. This isn't a war, this is business. | |
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| | DerchPremium
join:2004-10-16
Cross Plains, WI | Hey, I'm not trying to get political (granted I should have worded me subject line better). I'm "concerned" that most troops don't have access to computers. | |
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| | | N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:1 | Re: Billions for Nothing Cool.
I guess after seeing it happen so often on BBR, it's an oddity when it doesn't happen.
I still hope it doesn't happen, but I have my doubts. Sooner or later, anything that can remotely tied to politics ends in something resembling the proverbial playground shoving match of politics around here... | |
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| |  nixenRockin' the BoxenPremium
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA | said by N3OGH:It's actually a very interesting story, and shows the ingenuity of people in the field.. The crucible of war has often times caused a great deal of ingenuity in the ranks.
-tom | |
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| | | | I'm actually curious about how the military is monitoring these home-grown ISPs. | |
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| | | | How can you NOT go down the political road with this? It's another example of the Repubs shafting the troops again. | |
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| | | How about control?
I agree that soldiers need some downtime and should be able to email their families but being a soldier is not a 9 to 5 job. Don't think the Germans let the Americans call or write home during D-Day. 
Now, if they do this ad-hoc connection on their own time while off-duty, then fine by me unless the commander has other ideas. | |
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| | | And i thought i paid alot for internet access | |
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TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY | Way Cool I always get a kick out of the names our GI's come up with for things and people they deal with. Hajjinets, how appropriate a name, taken from the Arabic word for pilgrimage and in a way this is what is happening a cyber world pilgrimage home.
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The older I get the more I prefer the company of my dogs over that of man kind. | |
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|  scrummie02BentleyPremium
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA | Re: Way Cool Haji is also a slang term for middle eastern folks....
Like Jerry's for Germans or Tommy's for British.. | |
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 Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium
join:2002-03-03
USA
kudos:4 |  Ingenuity at its best
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Join Red Room Forum
BLOG tkjunkmail.blogspot.com
My Web Page | |
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| KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | Re: Ingenuity at its best i love the Hackjob NOCs, reminds me much of how my sound system is wired cause im too cheap to buy real speaker wire so i Macgyvered it with variations of lamp and thermostat wire.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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| | Neccesity is the mother of the invention | |
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Folic
join:2004-10-03
Milwaukee, WI | Lol.. They have better internet penatration in Iraq then in the US w00t...lol jk | |
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| | Apples and Oranges I'm having a hard time reconciling the stats they give with my own, admittedly limited, experience. My brother-in-law is career navy. He has been all over. Bosnia, Korean DMZ, and now, occasionally, Qatar. He has had Internet access every where he's been. Sometimes it's been the only luxury he's had. The discrepancy may lie in that Iraq is a forward area. We can't expect the military to build a Googleplex in the middle of the f'en desert obviously.
The stat given is computers per 1000 troops but the quote then talks about internet access. Obviously different things. Here is my understanding. Generally the troops provide their own computers for off-time use. Email is free. ISP availability varies depending on where you are. If you are stationed on a large base you will probably have access to free broadband. If you are in a remote location you may only have dialup. In the case of Iraq you may be lucky to even have power. There are a lot of combat troops out there with little more than a cot and a tent. I think it is very misleading to lump all everything together and just call it 1% penetration. | |
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| | | Re: Apples and Oranges Just a side note...
Maybe they dont want tons of lap tops over there. Sure it would be nice but think of what could go WRONG. It would be disaster if someone wrote some virus/trojan/worm/whatever that triangulated positions via people wireless cards in there laptops. | |
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| | | | Re: Apples and Oranges Ya my cousin was in Iraq and he was pretty much able to email me every day except when they went out on missions for 2-3 days. I think this is a BS story. I've never had trouble contacting by email friends and relatives in Iraq. Also for safety and security purposes I can understand why they must monitor and limit their use. For example I couldnt send attachments or files to my cousins. | |
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| | | | | Re: Apples and Oranges said by AzzKicker:Ya my cousin was in Iraq and he was pretty much able to email me every day except when they went out on missions for 2-3 days. I think this is a BS story. .... Thanks for the backup.. that is pretty much what I thought. | |
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| | | | | | Not BS at all. If the military has a hard time affording body armor for every soldier why is it so hard to believe they can't get every soldier a computer? A good number of enlisted families are on welfare back here in the states you know. And for someone who's career military and most likely an officer there may be a different level of support for officers than there is for enlisted folks. | |
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| | | | | | | Re: Not BS at all. said by NDPTAL85:If the military has a hard time affording body armor for every soldier why is it so hard to believe they can't get every soldier a computer? A good number of enlisted families are on welfare back here in the states you know. And for someone who's career military and most likely an officer there may be a different level of support for officers than there is for enlisted folks. Again, more BS. They have a hard time affording body armor because that takes more of a beating than a computer sitting back at camp.DUH. Thats a no brainer. Like I said. I know a lot of guys over in Iraq and family members there and have never had a hard time emailing them on a daily basis. Now thats my REAL WORLD experience. I don't need some bs story to tell me. | |
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RayWPremium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
kudos:1 | Sorry to get political. Why are not the big incumbents getting down on these guys? The guys in the field are creating their own nets and are not getting the big guys involved. Granted they are a few more miles away than most of the lawsuits currently taking place, but it may prove out that if a bunch of grunts in the field can do it than a city with many more resources should be able to do even better. And that might be bad for the incumbents' new car/vacation purchases this month.
Just a thought
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I am not lost, I find myself every time. | |
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| cgigate
join:2003-05-12
Fort Worth, TX | Re: Sorry to get political. US troop should not be allowed to use Internet | |
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| | | | Re: Sorry to get political. why is that? | |
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| | | scrummie02BentleyPremium
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA | Re: Sorry to get political. don't feed the troll. | |
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| KearnstdElf WizardPremium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ | Iraq wasnt a Bellsouth region so there is nobody to sue these guys for a "Muni net".
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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| | RayWPremium
join:2001-09-01
Layton, UT
kudos:1 | Re: Sorry to get political. Well, they are American citizens, some of whom live in BellSouth. And if they can do it there.....
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I am not lost, I find myself every time. | |
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 sapoCruising Down Memory LanePremium
join:2002-09-16
Sacramento, CA
kudos:1 |  Huh?
Misleading title. | |
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|  John GaltForward, MarchPremium
join:2004-09-30
Happy Camp
kudos:3 | Re: Huh? said by sapo:Where is the hacking here... Misleading title. Oh, give Karl some latitude here...it is an "editor thing"...a "play-on-words".
Hack...Iraq...notice how they rhyme.
Get it?
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A is A | |
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| | | | Re: Huh? Oh KARL posted it? Figures that liberal idiot would put a misleading title about US troops. | |
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| | | Real hacking rather than the media definition. Hardware hacking. Putting together their own ISP because there's no other choice. | |
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|  Spider ManRead Christopher Hitchens.Premium
join:2002-12-11
Thornhill, ON | D U M B A S S | |
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| | Lawsuits coming.... How long until AT&T/SBC/BellSouth start the lawsuit machine up to sue these guys out of business? Kinda like they sue evertime a Muni project comes up? | |
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| | And the computers? I don't understand the point or need for all this internet access when the real problem is the 6-12 computers for 1,000 trips. How is anyone utilizing the bandwidth without a computer? | |
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| | Seems to Me.... That one of the most basic ways we could take care of our troops is to keep them in communication with their families back home. 6-12 PCs for every 1000 troops? Cmon.......thats ridiculous. | |
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 TomekPremium
join:2002-01-30
Valley Stream, NY | HajiNet When I was there HajiNet was pretty much unrestricted "local" internet. There are lots of providers I seen, from Turkey, Saudi Arabia. It was going on for a while now. Some bases restrict that access due to OPSEC (contain information) since those connections are subject to spying.
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Semper Fi | |
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 jubangyPremium
join:2005-03-26
Erie, PA
 ·ViaTalk
| isp I think the 6-12 pc's for 1000 troops is ridiculous. Internet service should be a standard of living for them and if the US was smart they would get them better net and pc's it could even cheapen the phone bills up and also allow the troops to video conference with their families instead of the old phone call. Doing that might even help boost some of the moral for some who are down because they missed a kids birthday or even worse missed their kid being born. I think it would be a good idea to donate a few lappies to them with web cams.. | |
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| | | Re: isp (combining quite a few posts in reply) the way I'm reading the article is that one unit way out in the middle of the sticks has a few computer geeks that packed in all their pc gear (or had it shipped in later... they still get snail mail you know, even if it does take a few months to get to you. ) and set up a LAN for them to play WoW or something on it, and one of those embedded reporters over there saw it and guestimated this whole thing up out of thin air, (or at least a bit of rarefied air ), with a little bit of research the reporter realized that this is the "gotta have a zinger of a headline" era and cooked the rest up. I'm more inclined to gloss over the ratio's they have and take the article for "a neat idea, that just isn't big enough on it's own" than for an accurate representation of actual pc use over there.
it's not so much the fact that there are only 12 per 1000... it's the economics/logistics of more pcs to users... think about it... if we have the (supposedly ideal) 1:1 ratio of pc to user, then the only way for the military to really move those things around is to have them issued at bootcamp (here is your uniforms, gun, field pack, ammo, oh yeah here is your mil-spec pc, don't break it/lose it/get a virus/surf p**n sites, etc...) now you've just added that much more s**t for that poor schlub to carry around. plus, think about power supplies in order to operate them in general... that's that much more to ship into the area in the first place.
OH YEAH!, guess who has to PAY for all of that?!( you know, those $500 toilet seats, and $100 hammers... all for those 7 little letters: "MILSPEC"...)
Who pays: YOU DO!... now instead of complaining about your taxes going to fix roads, or welfare (or whatever you complain about now) if that happens, you'll be sitting there nagging about how it was "in my days in the military we only had 12:1000 pc/user ratios" and also that "it ain't right i gotta slave away here to pay for some punk-a***d boot-camp to get the latest pcs for FREE... why don't he just buy his own and take it with him, like 'I' had to do?!"
as for phone bill, granted my experiences are a bit skewed to using only built-up ports, not the boonies, but while i was over there in the navy, any port we pulled into had a phone center that was already free for use. some of the bases even had a pc center with about 30-40 pcs, free for use, but you had a time limit of 30 minutes, so the next guy gets to use it as well. if you were lucky there was no line. there were lines at most of the ones i saw, even if they they were open 24/7. you would also need to provide personnel to make sure the time limits were enforced as well... or suprisingly moral goes DOWN, as people hog the pc claiming "just a minute more!", and that's one more job that somebody to fill in for, in addition their other duties, like guard post, or machine gun operator at the main gate access point , you know those silly things we can do away with so they have more time off to play online games over there just to keep morale higher?!
as for the internet connection and access prices... what do YOU pay right now? yeah it ain't cheap over there, but they aren't in a big city either... AND if i remember right, the article didn't say if it was a per-minute or a per-month charge or whatever, did it? as for the net being wireless, well.. look at what a wired lan needs, do you think the military is going to provide that for free.. or use it "for official use only" type of stuff, so yeah they'd end up have to outsource the isp stuff and pay for thru the nose if the users wanted to do anything on their own (P2P, p**n, etc...)
someone else already mentioned the OPSEC (sure you CAN do it, but not right NOW) angle of tracking a pc/laptop via the wireless cards, and before you say that they *can't* do that, look at how many of the pilots that hit the WTC were trained BY US in the first place... where there is a will there is a way... also, think about this; some types of explosives are set off just by the simple fact of a radio signal hits them... no detonator, no electronic signature, no nothin'... now granted, I'm not sure that the freq used by wireless cards and those types of explosives are the same, but even if it weren't, all "they" would have to do is put one of those cheaper-by-the-dozen wireless access finders into the detonator ciruit and if just ONE person was using his/her laptop during that "long boring convoy from point 'A' to point 'B'...." BANG! there goes the I.E.D., and we get a new report here that 4 more Marines were killed... all because you wanted better video-phone capability...
I'll bet that after this article came out, that a few units that were running these things were told to shut them down, or else... the ultimate reason being nothing better than they are NOT under the military's control.
don't get me wrong, i am a firm believer that morale, and such is better WITH PC's, but there are times when we have to be realistic about when and where access should be en/discouraged for the viability of the mission to succeed (the 'stated' mission, anyway) i think this is one of them, these 'Hajinets' should be more closely monitored/regulated by the military for OPSEC reasons alone, let alone the logistics of providing power for them out in the boonies where we'd have to ship in more generators/fuel, than we already do. and if you try to say that it is a miniscule amount, you're wrong, those generators suck fuel very quickly... as an experiment to prove me wrong, put your whole house onto a generator and tell me the fuel use you go thru during a week of "normal use" lights, heat, fridge, stove, pc's etc... (yes, i acknowledge gas heat and stoves, but there are no gas pipes out in the sticks, are there? hmm!, and it DOES get cold t night!) and remember there will be a LOT MORE odd-ball stuff not found in the typical home like huge security floodlights, and alarm systems, radio transmitters and recievers, motor-pool equip, welding gear, etc... as well as it all has to be kept operational 24 hrs a day. (or at least able to *be operated* at any time 24/7) add in your man-hours spent refueling, and making sure that it stays running 24/7... now multiply that by however many units you want this to apply to...
oops, sorry i went on for so long like that, i kinda got carried away, | |
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