 
ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA | SMS, number port fee, etc, all cash cows Much like every other add-on, texting is a total cash cow for wireless providers. | |
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telcolackey
The Truth? You can't handle the truth
join:2007-04-06
Death Valley, CA | Broadband costs And people keep complaining about speed and costs associated with broadband. Do the same math on that service and compare it with wireless and dedicated circuits. | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
4 edits | Re: Broadband costs The point of the article is that it doesn't cost where SMS is concerned. The wireless providers are gouging customers big time, to the tune of $1,000.00 per MB. While I can understand that processing 6500 messages costs money even the biggest telco shill would acknowledge that processing the messages at .15-.30 each (since they charge both outgoing AND incoming) is a very high margin operation. | |
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LiamJunket
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Ocean City, NJ
 ·Comcast
3 edits | Re: Broadband costs And the method of calculating cost by "Mobile Jones" is, as usual, bogus. The cost to the cell provider isn't on how many bytes are transmitted. The cost is based on use of a channel(from a limited number of channels) on the cell tower and how long it takes to grab the wireless spectrum, establish the connection, and then transmit, and then take down the connection. Every time someone sends a 20 byte message, all those costs are incurred and they far exceed the costs of some theoretical bandwidth usage. And then every time a new message is sent(20 secs later for example), the whole process starts all over again.
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
 ·DSL EXTREME
| Re: Broadband costs Hell ya its high (this stuff, and forced signing of these kind of plans for discounts on devices) ticks me off. I've actually put a block on all SMS/MMS/Text on my phone. Email is much cheaper than MMS/SMS for the consumer.
On another note: I USED to have SMS/MMS when I was with the original AT&T Wireless - they offered unlimited FREE inbound messaging (SMS/MMS/txt email). I somehow don't think that the cost of this service has increased.
This is similar to AT&T charging $5/month for caller ID.
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join:2007-02-25
Rumford, ME | Re: Broadband costs
I pay $7.75 | |
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LiamJunket
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Ocean City, NJ
·Comcast
| said by ColorBASIC  :Yeah, and they're charging up to .30 per message. You want to claim that SMS isn't high margin? Yes, it is high. Don't like the price, then don't use it. I have SMS blocked on my cellphone inbound and outbound.
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
| Re: Broadband costs Don't like it/don't use it is a different issue from whether or not it's a cash cow. I use SMS all the time for per personal and business so I use a prepaid option but it doesn't change the fact that AT&T is making a mint on it.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire | |
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tiger72
SexaT duorP
Premium
join:2001-03-28
Saint Louis, MO
clubs:
 ·T-Mobile US
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by LiamJunket :And the method of calculating cost by "Mobile Jones" is, as usual, bogus. The cost to the cell provider isn't on how many bytes are transmitted. The cost is based on use of a channel(from a limited number of channels) on the cell tower and how long it takes to grab the wireless spectrum, establish the connection, and then transmit, and then take down the connection. Every time someone sends a 20 byte message, all those costs are incurred and they far exceed the costs of some theoretical bandwidth usage. And then every time a new message is sent(20 secs later for example), the whole process starts all over again. My my my! So costly! It's a downright miracle that people can make telephone calls with their cell phones!
practically instantaneous sending of a 20Byte message takes mere seconds, and doesn't hog the channel like talking does, yet talking on a cell phone is now bargain-bin stuff.
hrrrmmm....
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Anonuser
join:2003-01-03
Milwaukee, WI
| Re: SMS, number port fee, etc, all cash cows Interesting. I have following for $30/month.
500 anytime
unlimited nights and weekends at 7pm
unlimited pcs powervision+picture mail
unlimited roaming
unlimited texting in and out (non international)
unlimited sprint to sprint.
Got the above, no harassing retentions. I called up to renew my SERO contract, and the lady said, as long as I was on the phone, would I like unlimited text messaging and nights starting at 7 for no additional charge? I of course said yes 
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| macmouse
Premium
join:2002-05-30
Saratoga, CA
| the reason there is the 160 character limit for SMS (over CDMA network - it is like 140 with GSM) is because that is the size of the data payload for a /single/ data frame for the protocol.
every second or so (whatever the timing is), your cell phone sends a "im still here" signal, which is a standard packet with the appropiate headers with a empty payload. So, when you send a SMS, data is entered into that status update packet that is routinely sent out (and why there is a slight delay before it is sent out, because it is waiting for its turn).
Thus, in effect it costs the company nothing in airtime cost because that air time would be intentionally left empty anyway (and a tiny fraction of a cent in data network costs). | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA | Re: SMS, number port fee, etc, all cash cows Holy smokes...so it's just 'free money' to the provider. | |
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| | | macmouse
Premium
join:2002-05-30
Saratoga, CA
| Re: SMS, number port fee, etc, all cash cows yeah. that is why you can send/recieve a text message when the system is overloaded (and all of voice channels are in use).
For that matter, It costs them (the company) /more/ to handle voice (or even inet) connections from a technical standpoint. and yet you pay *extra* for it in the US (vs free in europe, japan,etc). I can't come up with any logical reasons on why they are doing it this way... | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA | Re: SMS, number port fee, etc, all cash cows Nice to know that .30/message is well earned by AT&T.  | |
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| jesseb_66
join:2002-12-06
Tucson, AZ | Re: Ah text messaging Pretty much the reason I don't text. I just use email on my BB... | |
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dogma
Premium
join:2002-08-15
Boulder City, NV
| What message is sooo important that the recipient must receive it in 20 seconds?
1700 inbound Soviet ICBM's just appeared on your radar screen?
Magnitude 8.4 quake created tsunami raises your fishing boat with a 75' swell?
WoW raid instance? | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
| Re: Ah text messaging People substitute SMS for IM and don't want to spend 3 hours having a simple exchange.
Not everyone has time to wait around for the reply, otherwise they would just email the person.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | Re: Ah text messaging I'll just use my work Blackberry email - unlimited.
Its as quick as mms/sms, and no message length restrictions.
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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justin
Australian
join:1999-05-28
Brooklyn, NY
Host:
IPv6
Business Connectiv..
Home/Office setup ..
Console/Handheld g..
Console Tech
| said by dogma :What message is sooo important that the recipient must receive it in 20 seconds? It isn't about that.
I use it most frequently with friends/family when we're meeting up or just doing humdrum stuff: "don't forget to.." "r u home.." "driving there now.." "can u buy some milk as well.." "gonna be 5 mins late.." "its raining  " "call me when u get a minute" .. (etc)
All this stuff could be done with voicemail (or a call) but that takes much longer, and interrupts the other person more.
Why do we have IM on this site when we could just be posting or emailing? | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
3 edits | Re: Ah text messaging I use texting in meetings when I need quick answers to questions but can't get up and make the call or don't want people in the room even hearing MY side of the conversation. Without a quick send (and reply) the feature would be useless. I also use it in places I don't want to make a racket, like a movie theater, restaurant or somewhere else where I am but can't talk or wait to get to a place I can talk.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire | |
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dogma
Premium
join:2002-08-15
Boulder City, NV
| Re: Ah text messaging You young whipper-snappers use the technology available to you, and fully integrate it into your lifestyle. I, on the other hand, am an old fart...who can remember when there was no such thing as FedEx.
Somehow we got along without it. And we loved it!
Bring back steam engines and leather belts. | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA
| Re: Ah text messaging My customers have become spoiled with instant answers. It wasn't too long ago that it was business as usual to wait 24 hours for a quote or delivery estimate. Now they're pissed if you take 30 minutes, or can't answer the question on the phone.
I loved being able to take my time doing stuff, but so long as there is a competitor willing to bust ass, I have to bust ass to match them meaning I have to have instant answers and be instantly available to my employees and customers 24/7. SMS, along with FileMaker Mobile are the primary tools I use to meet these obligations.
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Macintosh Users Group Serving the Inland Empire | |
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click_310
Eat my shorts
join:2002-12-06
Savannah, GA | Hmm... you forgot a common SMS sent from the office.
"This is one boring meeting!"
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justin
Australian
join:1999-05-28
Brooklyn, NY | Re: Ah text messaging whats a meeting? oh .. those .. I think I have about 1 a year. | |
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click_310
Eat my shorts
join:2002-12-06
Savannah, GA | Re: Ah text messaging Wanna swap jobs? 
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| tbone2006
join:2006-07-22
Abilene, TX | You should see how the young people text, I can't read a damn word.
c u 8ter | |
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DOStradamus
MVM
join:2003-11-04
Santa Rosa, CA
| said by biggbrother :Even the small up-and-comers like MetroPCS, who offer attractive pricing and contract options don't offer free texting. Not "free", technically, but SMS is billed the same as voice and 'net access with my mPCS account -- FLAT RATE!
How much? A tad more than fifty bucks a month...
-NK
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jc100
join:2002-04-10 | SMS Sprint charges for receiving and incoming unless you buy unlimited. I think unlimited SMS is 5 dollars a month. So then, you'd be free to send what you want, unless there are invisible caps. | |
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diehardspeed
Premium
join:2003-05-14
Salt Lake City, UT
| SMS via Email Good thing my 8525 lets you store 3 emails per contact! Just make one of them be the SMS TXT email address.
[ #@mmode.com, #@wireless.att.com, #@vtext.com, #@messaging.sprintpcs.com, #@tmomail.net, and others.]
So ya, with an unlimited data plan i don't understand why that would not include SMS messaging! | |
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| kpfogey
join:2001-12-28
Huntersville, NC
| Re: SMS via Email said by diehardspeed :Good thing my 8525 lets you store 3 emails per contact! Just make one of them be the SMS TXT email address. [ #@mmode.com, #@wireless.att.com, #@vtext.com, #@messaging.sprintpcs.com, #@tmomail.net, and others.] So ya, with an unlimited data plan i don't understand why that would not include SMS messaging! #@teleflip.com works great for all the major US carriers. according to their website, the following US-only carriers are supported:
t-mobile
AT&T (Cingular)
Verizon
Amp’d
Sprint/Nextel
Boost
Alltel
Virgin
Suncom
Cellular South
nTelos
Midwest Wireless
US Cellular | |
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computerman0
join:2006-07-19
Houston, TX | OMG the pain Well wow this is way worse then the data plans in which they charge you 2 arms and a foot for data man im staying with the plans even if i dont send many eeeekkkk. and yet the service still sucks what gives? | |
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| xo
join:2007-06-15
Perry, FL | Re: OMG the pain holy run on sentence, batman! | |
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mjwise
join:2007-05-09
Ann Arbor, MI | Text messaging? no thx. Thankfully, Verizon lets me block all text messaging. Waste of time and money. I already have e-mail and voice mail on my phone, no reason for anything more. | |
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packetscan
Premium
join:2004-10-19
Bridgeport, CT
clubs: | OPEN Spectrum And the FCC thinks we don't need open spectrum?
Come on.. Wake up
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Fox McCloud
Crazy like a fox.
join:2006-07-23
·Embarq
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Gee...I'm glad Thank goodness for Sprint; I have free unlimited texting with them....
Seriously, texting is a huge rip-off for the consumer, in general; a $5 charge a month (all carriers) for unlimited texting is more than enough.....but they'll never do this; they're making hundreds of thousands of dollars on texting; ever hear of the amount of stories out there where people racked up over $100 a month in texting bills? Ha! As long as that exists, these companies will continue with this scheme because the revenues are insanely high. | |
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stewped
join:2003-02-05
Spring Hill, KS
2 edits | it isn't a necessity, it is a frivolity. the truth of it all is that SMS is not a data service. SMS is a relic of the old 2G days, i mean 1985! if it were an IP-based service, then it would be included in the unlimited data plan. but it isn't. it is completely different. i don't believe a single carrier charges for IM services (IP based), yet all of them offer IM clients on phones - included in the unlimited data (IP) plans.
the main thing you're all avoiding is something called the free market.  if $0.15 per message or $15 a month were too much, people wouldn't use it and the cost would be lowered. people use, and OVER-use, text messaging - even choosing to subscribe to joke-a-day text messages at an additional $9.99 a month or $0.50 or even $0.99 a message! as long as people are willing to buy something, there is no such thing as overcharging. if no one bought it, the price would be lowered or the product would be eliminated. its how the market works. and $15 a month is a helluva lot better then a few hundred bucks some parents see when their kids abuse this type of archaic email. if its too expensive, call up your carrier and have them block it.
anytime calls up complaining of SPAM SMS they get credited. in instances of a $100 or more bill, carriers will credit them that month if they sign up for an unlimited plan. if you repeatedly get a huge bill and want credited, you're abusing your relationship with the provider.
if the subject is so important you cannot wait for a face to face, why not just give them a call?  it isn't just an SMS device, after all. it includes a phone feature as well. | |
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retrogame
join:2003-04-14
Auburn, MA
·Charter Pipeline
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: it isn't a necessity, it is a frivolity. I don't know any carrier that sells a device with an IP based IM client on it, all of them are SMS based and the incoming/outgoing IM's are charged just as text messages are, which can eat up even a 1000 message plan very quickly. There are IP-based clients that are available, but most of them are $30-40 to purchase.
Now if you purchase an unbranded phone, that's a different story. Sony provides a program called "My Friends" on thier phones, which is IP/GPRS based, but the carrier's remove this and replace it with an SMS based IM program. How nice of them. | |
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| | cmaenginsb
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-19
Palmdale, CA | Re: it isn't a necessity, it is a frivolity. My old Nextel phone had an AOL IM client on it that was part of the data plan back as early as 2003. | |
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Bink63
I want MY Country BACK
Premium
join:2002-10-06
Everywhere
| Funny you should mention that...
I have a Sprint BlackBerry 8830 with ONLY the unlimited BB data plan & no voice plan and my Nextel i880 has unlimited calling and PTT, but no data services. My Mogul has unlimited text, EVDO data and picture mail included with my 500 anytime minutes.
Being in the technical field has some perks! | |
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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY
| Wanna buy an iphone? Them's iphone prices you be speaking of.. which is to say..
When did you realize your getting RIPPED OFF?!?
BTW, that's if the message is received on the other end or not, which is to say, NO GUARANTEE of reception/transmission.. the service is best effort, as is, kind of thing... no QOS guarantees. However, in a "free market" people are addicted to more than "OIL", they're addicted to their petty habits/conveniences as well, go figure.
Instant message on a wifi application, not phone to phone sms if you want cheap/free bandwidth. | |
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dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
| DAMN! Y'all are getting burned!
Messaging Option Pay Per Msg
5¢ per txt, IM, email message sent/received; 25¢ per pix sent/received.
Virgin Mobile...
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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See 6 replies to this post |
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jgkolt
Premium
join:2004-02-21
Lakewood, OH
clubs:
| sms The sms messaging does not go out over the normal evdo or 1xrtt lines. I don't know too much about the technology but i know you can block the internet on the phone and text messaging still works. mms messaging doesnt because that uses the internet connection. Anyone care to elaborate.
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Help me get free trades.3 free if you sign up, $7 after. PM Me | |
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alanhdsl
Premium
join:1999-10-09
Phoenix, AZ
·Qwest.net
| Price != Cost Any business is going to set the maximum price that they can get people to pay. This is only indirectly connected to the cost of providing the service. 32oz of Coke doesn't cost $4, but that's what they charge at the movie theater.
The cell companies' question is going to be, will cutting the price increase our profit? If not, there's no reason for them to do it. | |
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compuwizz
join:2001-03-05
Blacksburg, VA
| It costs more because... It probably costs the carriers more than what they make it out to be because the messages flow over SS7 links which not just anyone can order. So add Verisign and Neustar to the evil doers of SMS messaging because they are the authorities in SS7 in the US. | |
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johndoe303
join:2003-01-01
Boca Raton, FL | I pay nothing with Sprint SERO.. I also don't pay for data. I pay 49.99 before my 15% corp discount..
1250 Anytime Minutes, n&w 7pm, unl txt, unl data, unl pic & vd mail, and unl m2m.
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WRTSL54GS v2 + WRT54G v2 | |
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iansltx
@spcsdns.net
| Re: I pay nothing with Sprint SERO.. I also don't pay for data. Same here. Except I pay $30 plus junk fees (I want to say 25% added onto my bill...and some of 'em are carrier-imposed so it's just wrong) for 500 minutes and the above.
I was on prepaid and didn't use very many minutes (like 150) but now I use a lot more minutes (which is fine with me...I'm covered) and have used 550 texts so far this month. So since supply went up, demand went up . I have unlimited text, so I signed up for Twitter and Facebook alerts.
Then again, that's just gravy when looking at the fact that I get unlimited email messages on my phone, with no character limit. I've used...dunno...more email messages than text message more'n'likely if I actually had to count them.
So for me the cost per MB of data, even including text, is negligable. Since I live in an EvDO area and download podcasts over the air to my Mogul, then tether to do some light surfing (mind you, light) when I'm away from WiFi and other means of connection with my laptop. RIght now I'm using 1xRTT and will probably use 3MB or so on this quick 'net browsing session.
This one session would cost me $30 on a pay-per-kilobyte plan...my whole cellular plan costs that much!
Moral of the story: if you use it a good bit, get unlimited and stop complaining. If you use it and stay in a relatively small location range, get an unlimited plan from the local carrier (there's one in my area called Pocket...I'm not with them anymore because I roam around a bit...or get CricKet or such) and pay $3-$5 for unlimited text messaging...and they usually include unlimited picture messaging in that price. Price per MB? Well, if you send a few hundred texts a month you're paying a penny per KB...
...sorry to keep going with this post, but I appreciate the usage of text message. For stuff like IM, less advanced phones use text. Plus you have stuff like Google SMS, again for less advanced phones. And for quick notes (which don't really need to be quick...you can put like 25-30 words in a message if you must...and I do with my keyboard-equipped Mogul) that you don't want to annoy people to call 'em ith or suchlike, that are compatible with 99.99% of cell phones out there, text works!
It's interesting to find out exactly how texting works, and how it's a highly efficient cash-cow of a 2G technology, and it enlightens you to the fact that in a free economy the price is what you pay for it...or don't, unless competition wants to ompete in that area. In my opinion, you have a few choices with texting, which is of course overpriced: turn it off (costs you $0), get a texting plan (or phone plan) that'll fit your needs and give yu a better per-message rate, or look at prepaid plans where minutes invariably cost 2-3x as much as text messages...and use them if you don't talk much!
So to su up, there are those of us who want\need text, and there are ways to get it that don't involve enriching the best. Case closed. | |
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KrazyDawg
join:2001-02-07
Vallejo, CA
clubs: | Verizon's Rate Is Higher Verizon charges $0.15 not $0.10 | |
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bohn
join:2006-05-30
Scarborough, ON
| Ted Rogers holds most of the guinness book of records Kids games, he took my marbles she took my marbles. You wanna see communism at it's finest just look north up to Canada. It's called Rogers portable internet. The biggest jip known to mankind. Anyone that can dream up anything that's a bigger rip-off on earth or this universe i'd like to know. | |
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How Much Are You Paying For SMS Bandwidth?
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