ISPs Failing to Quickly Tackle Bot Menace Scams stay on-line for months, sometimes longer A rise in Trojan infections is resulting in a parallel explosion in spam spewing, Phish website hosting zombie boxes. Cybercriminals are now making more off of Internet fraud than via the drug trade, according to law enforcement officials. Unfortunately, as our readers have been discovering, a number of ISPs are failing to properly identify and eliminate infected PCs on their networks, even after being clearly notified of their existence. We wanted to know why. This Paypal phishing scam, tracked by our users, was in operation for close to a month on BellSouth's network. Our resident scambusters alerted the telco's abuse department of its existence a little more than three weeks ago. We asked BellSouth why these scams - which can potentially lure hundreds or thousands of victims during an ISPs period of inaction - aren't taken down more quickly. BellSouth Media Relations officer Nadine Randall simply assured us BellSouth's abuse department was "keenly focused on customer satisfaction." "Response times vary based on industry and company needs," said Randall. "Beyond that, I cannot comment on the specific issue or timing." Shortly after our conversation, the infected host disappeared. BellSouth isn't alone when it comes to inadequate responses. Several other ISPs are as bad or worse, according to our resident security experts and scambusters. This infected Roadrunner residential account had been running a Chase bank phishing scam for nearly forty days before being taken down after repeated requests from our users. Likewise this Optimum On-line user was compromised for almost a month and was finally taken off-line yesterday. Why are ISPs not responding to these threats more quickly? Can it be blamed on typical bureaucratic malaise, or is this a conscious effort by ISPs to avoid accountability for infected residential machines? Talking grandma through cleaning up her infected Windows ME PC can likely eat away at support dollars and efficiency. According to DSLReports.com user Krispy, the network security administrator for Canadian cable ISP Cogeco, the delay is often caused by a disconnect between an ISP's network ops crew and higher management. "It's difficult for finance to sanction funds for something that *appears* to bring in no revenue and also *appears* to actually frustrate customers," she tells us. According to her, many ISP security departments are severely understaffed and overwhelmed; so consumed by daily maintenance, there's little time left for statistical analysis showing the benefits of a clean network. "Botnets do not prevail for lack of caring on the part of security departments in most ISPs, it's due to lack of knowledgeable human, financial or technical resources and the lack of support from upper management," she opines. Matt Carothers, Manager of Abuse for Cox Communications, seems to agree. Cox is frequently cited by our resident scambusters as usually quick to respond to complaints. According to Carothers, executives at Cox, from CTO to VP, understand that a proactive stance benefits both customers and the Internet at large. "This understanding gives our abuse department the leeway to apply creative solutions to problems and to take controversial but necessary actions such as blocking outbound port 25," Carothers tells us. The company takes a two pronged approach to the problem, he says. The first is proactive abuse prevention, which includes blocking outbound port 25 (more technical specifics on that here -Ed.), blackholing phishing sites, blocking trojan control servers, and providing free security software to Cox customers (something we complained about last year, but is all but standard industry practice now). The second, he says, is efficient report response. Carothers says the abuse@cox.net mailbox is approximately 85% automated, and in many cases, issues can be resolved from start to finish with no manual labor at all. "In the other cases, our systems perform enough investigation that an engineer can simply review the findings and decide what action to take," he says. Another network engineer of a major ISP (who wanted to remain anonymous) agrees: automation, creativity, and funding are the keys. Many ISPs are taking an automated "walled garden" approach to the problem, using netflow (a cisco app that runs on the CMTS/routers) or similar tools to monitor the source, destination, protocol and other traffic specifics, looking for abnormally high numbers of ICMP flows or other traffic indicative of malware infected hosts. When a particular machine sets off the triggers, ISPs send out automated alerts to their provisioning department to suspend the account and the modem. The impacted user can then only view pages set by the ISP; this can be anything from instructions on how to clean their system, to security update websites or web-based antivirus applications. This keeps the infected machine off the Internet, but also eases the strain on an ISPs support department by trying to guide the user through cleaning up their own system before calling support. Insiders tell us these systems have their own technical flaws; but they also state that customers fail to read and follow the warnings and instructions. Microsoft recently stated that of the 270 million users who used their free scanning software from January 2005 through March 2006, 3.5 million were found to have been infected by a Trojan - and were currently being used to either spam, or as host for a phishing scam. Security firm Sophos reports that among the 1,538 new threats discovered in May, 85.1% were Trojan horses. A common thread among the ISP security professionals we spoke to is that many ISP executives treat network security like the black-sheep of the family; spending little on abuse solution development, and leaving them consistently understaffed. Criminals aren't waiting for these executives to wake up.
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 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Follow the money... "...BellSouth's abuse department was "keenly focused on customer satisfaction."
Um yeah. What they fail to tell you is the line about "generating traffic". When you learn that traffic is money, and they don't care what traffic, then its money. Your ISP gets a rate based on flow. Now, flow ebbs in and out. But let's say your rate is based on a large number of traffic. Well, what happens when that traffic is stopped to a trickle?
You pay more.
So it actually pays to have spam, bots, phishing...as it means traffic. Who cares if the users gets it, as its not attacking the ISP's end. Now, if bots were shutting down routers, and switches and servers...watch how quickly it cleans up.
Someone told me this once when I asked them to just shutdown specific traffic. Nope, was his answer. | |
|  |  Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | Re: Follow the money... Abuse departments are nothing but cost centers at all the ISPs. They bring in no money and annoy customers who they come in contact with. Therefore, they have small budgets and small staffs and most of their time is spent dealing with DMCA takedown requests.
Result: they spend virtually no time at all on zombie PCs on their network. And don't look for that to change anytime soon. Only if class action lawsuits are filed against the ISPs over this practice by lawyers representing customers whose identities have been stolen will this ever change. -- -- Join Red Room Forum BLOG tkjunkmail.blogspot.com My Web Page | |
|  |  |  tsu9 join:2001-08-17 Wheeling, IL | Re: Follow the money... Maybe the ISPs could funnel the misspent bribe lobbyist funding into the abuse department (in addtion to actually funding other much-needed things).
....nah. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: Follow the money... You can make a difference!
cableties wrote:
"Result: they spend virtually no time at all on zombie PCs on their network. "
Actually, I think a difference can be made. I put in place the following web page, after learning that my ISP had been put on black lists for spam, due mainly to the large number of zombie PCs that were running rampant:
»pages.infinit.net/filmore/educateYourISP.htm
Then, I began to "mass report" the zombies on my ISP's network, using the report forms on their abuse site. I mentioned that such-and-such IP had a likely trojan horse infection, and that it was likely sending out spams according to senderbase.org - that because of the black-listing for spam my own emails were being refused by certain recipients.
These reports create a sort of "back log" in the ISP customer-support "cost-center". I would follow-up with phone calls from time to time.
Why go to all this trouble? Well, the lovely thing about Montreal, Canada is the lack of competition for ISPs. There are two: Videotron and Sympatico. Both had (have?) terrible reputations for hosting spam zombies.
I never thought it would work, but my ISP *did* eliminate a fair number of zombies. The problem *does* still exist, but the numbers of zombies is in the tens, as opposed to the thousands over a year ago when I began my "campaign".
The problem with the numbers reported today, however, is that the senderbase.org reports are based on volume of email. The assumption is that high-volume cable-modem (or dynamic IP addressed) sites are likely spam-bots.
Spammers have since gotten smarter, and zombies are exploited less. This means that the spammers try for greater numbers in their bot-net armies, but the individual soldiers do less "evil" work to keep under the radar. | |
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 |  | | So let me see if I have this right....
You are saying ISP's are paid by the amount of traffic they generate with their customers?
Maybe I am stupid, but I always thought ISP's purchased traffic either straight up (T1, all customers share) or through a dynamic pool (T3 capabilities, but only charged as needed). Either way the more traffic on their network the more they have to pay or the more issues their customers have fighting for bandwidth.
Doesn't seem to hold your conspiracy theory together very well. | |
|  |  roamer1sticking it out at you join:2001-03-24 Atlanta, GA | said by cableties:Um yeah. What they fail to tell you is the line about "generating traffic". When you learn that traffic is money, and they don't care what traffic, then its money. Your ISP gets a rate based on flow. Now, flow ebbs in and out. But let's say your rate is based on a large number of traffic. Well, what happens when that traffic is stopped to a trickle? You pay more. You have it reversed -- the more traffic an ISP sends and receives, the more they pay. Settlement-free peering is usually where the "flow" model comes into play and muddies the waters a bit, but SFP is largely irrelevant for consumer-oriented providers in general and BellSouth in particular.
-SC -- "it seems like all you ever buy is Abercrombie and cell phones" --a friend | |
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 N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | People need to take security more seriously Thing is, most users don't know they're host to this garbage. Most of them aren't running firewalls, or virus software.
It's obvious that a firewall is a mandatory item in any broadband users bag of tools/toys. Broadband providers should be making firewall usage mandatory at this point. A decent router with a built in firewall is the cheapest investment in computer security a broadband user can make. | |
|  |  izyPremium,MVM join:2000-09-21 endless loop kudos:1 | Re: People need to take security more seriously I'd have to disagree. ISP's cannot "force" users to run anything on their computers. The can "advise" but not "force"
It is however an ISP's responsibility to prevent network abuse on THEIR networks, such as a hosted phishing site.
What does it take a whole 5 minutes for an ISP's tech to knock a phished system off their network???
It's innevitable that a phishing site will pop-up on ANY ISP's network, it's the speediness of the ISP to respond to such reports of these sites and knock them offline ASAP. It would be interesting if justin could create some statistics on response times per ISP when it comes to fixing these problems. The data is all there in »/phishtrack  | |
|  |  |  InsderThere never was a second I in my namePremium join:2005-04-27 Salem, MA | Re: People need to take security more seriously Trust me, I've been getting better response times from Asian providers and european providers than from the US. A US provider, Paetec, had a phish come up and back down three times before they finally stopped letting the customer handle it, while Belgicom of Belgium took the site offline within a day and emailed me back telling me it's taken care of. It's insane how bad US support is, it's like nobody cares. Even HiNet of China sends me better responses than most US ISPs. -- The one, the only, the Insder. :: Fighting phishing for life. | |
|  |  |  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium join:2003-11-11 Philly burbs kudos:1 | said by izy:I'd have to disagree. ISP's cannot "force" users to run anything on their computers. The can "advise" but not "force"... Why not? It's their network, you abide by their terms. Have you read your TOS lately? My ISP Verizon has some pretty heavy handed language in it.
Example:
"Verizon may terminate the Service upon notice to you for any reason."
And the acceptable use policy specifically states:
Verizon reserves the right to deny Service to you, or immediately to terminate your Service for material breach, if your use of the Service or your use of an alias or the aliases of additional users on your account, whether explicitly or implicitly, and in the sole discretion of Verizon: (a) is obscene, indecent, pornographic, sadistic, cruel or racist in nature, or of a sexually explicit or graphic nature; (b) espouses, promotes or incites bigotry, hatred or racism; (c) might be legally actionable for any reason, (d) is objectionable for any reason, or (e) in any manner violates the terms of this Acceptable Use Policy."
So, you're going to tell me that an ISP that states in their TOS that they can terminate my service for downloading the latest "girls gone wild" video, or looking at porno pictures can't tell me I have to use a firewall?? | |
|  |  |  |  izyPremium,MVM join:2000-09-21 endless loop kudos:1 | Re: People need to take security more seriously said by N3OGH:So, you're going to tell me that an ISP that states in their TOS that they can terminate my service for downloading the latest "girls gone wild" video, or looking at porno pictures can't tell me I have to use a firewall?? Yup, they can monitor/restrict the flow of data to and from your computer but they can not tell you what software you must have installed on your PC. Now if they forced users to run a hardware firewall that would be great, but if my ISP told me to run a software firewall I'd drop them like a bad habit. | |
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said by izy:I'd have to disagree. ISP's cannot "force" users to run anything on their computers. The can "advise" but not "force" said by izy:It is however an ISP's responsibility to prevent network abuse on THEIR networks, such as a hosted phishing site. The above 2 statements seem to be playing both sides of the field.
If someone is affecting network performance because they have been comprimised, then the ISP is well within their rights to disconnect them until they fix their machine. Therefore, they can "force" a customer to clean their system or not be allowed back on.
The very same argument can be used to those so-called "bandwidth hogs" that others complain about when they use too much downloading whatever they want.
ISPs need to be careful that they don't siconnect just anyone and use the "comprimised system" excuse to cover up a mistake. That being said, I have seen many of the scams exposed here and they have more than enough evidence to support their claims. | |
|  |  |  |  izyPremium,MVM join:2000-09-21 endless loop kudos:1 1 edit | Re: People need to take security more seriously said by moonpuppy:If someone is affecting network performance because they have been comprimised, then the ISP is well within their rights to disconnect them until they fix their machine. Therefore, they can "force" a customer to clean their system or not be allowed back on. You need to re-read my statement. | |
|  |  |  |  |  | | Re: People need to take security more seriously I did. A few times actually.
A user can be forced to run anti-malware progrmas IF they have been compromised once before if they want to be allowed back on the network. | |
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 |  | | said by N3OGH:Thing is, most users don't know they're host to this garbage. Most of them aren't running firewalls, or virus software. It's obvious that a firewall is a mandatory item in any broadband users bag of tools/toys. Broadband providers should be making firewall usage mandatory at this point. A decent router with a built in firewall is the cheapest investment in computer security a broadband user can make. At this point, most know but don't care... it's cheaper and easier to not care, and every so often ask a friend to help fix it (or make a family member feel obligated).
The *only* way you'll fix this problem is if there are stiff fines for offenses... If your computer is hijacked, it will cost you $100/offense. Until then, nothing will happen, because nobody cares.
Right now there's no real consequences, hence nobody cares. | |
|  |  |  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus join:2001-06-20 Cheyenne, WY 4 edits | We believe in Customer Service AT&T's Abuse Department |
At big Telco we believe in Abuse mitigation and we staff our Abuse department 24/7. Our abuse team numbers in the thousands and this staff of trained cockroaches are waiting to help you. | |
|  |  |  |  removedPremium,VIP join:2002-02-08 Houston, TX kudos:36 | Re: We believe in Customer Service said by Transmaster:At AT&T BellSouth we believe in Abuse mitigation and we staff our Abuse department 24/7. Our abuse team numbers in the thousands and our staff of trained cockroaches are waiting to help you. BellSouth is more like it. AT&T has gotten things done fairly quickly (well, much less than 40 days!) in most of our cases... -- irc.removed.us - #dslr | DSLR Phishtracker | Morning Glory Comics | Email: removed@dslr.net | Phone: 718-606-4100 | |
|  |  |  |  |  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus join:2001-06-20 Cheyenne, WY | Re: We believe in Customer Service point taken changed it to Big Telco  | |
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 |  |  |  | | You mean they actually have a desk?  | |
|  |  |  |  |  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus join:2001-06-20 Cheyenne, WY | Re: We believe in Customer Service Well no, this may look like a desk but it really is the apartment for all of the support staff.  -- The older I get the more I prefer the company of my dogs over that of man kind. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  | | Re: We believe in Customer Service I'm putting you on ignore until you send me a case of keyboards. | |
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 |  |  |  |  Combat ChuckToo Many CannibalsPremium join:2001-11-29 Erie, PA | Re: People need to take security more seriously Exactly. My experience with people who are infected with crap more than once: The first time they're scared. The second time they're just angry. The third time they couldn't care less as long as the computer still works.
What are you supposed to do when the users don't care? Your only options are to turn them off and then they go to a provider who doesn't care, or you babysit which takes a lot of time and the user potentially goes to another provider that doesn't complain as much. -- gau gau | |
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approval from: catseyenu 
| instant disconnect If a computer is infected it should be removed from the network until fixed. {period} | |
|  |  nwrickertsand groperPremium,MVM join:2004-09-04 Geneva, IL kudos:7 | Re: instant disconnect If an ISP does not act responsibly, maybe the entire ISP should be removed from the network.
That would get their attention. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: instant disconnect you've got my vote  | |
|  |  |  hobgoblinSortof AgoblinPremium join:2001-11-25 Orchard Park, NY kudos:4 | said by nwrickert:If an ISP does not act responsibly, maybe the entire ISP should be removed from the network. That would get their attention. Yeah....very clever idea. -- "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Ralph Waldo Emerson | |
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 |  | | I absolutely agree. If you cant protect your computer they you are off the net. People will learn real fast. But ISP's want to sell service so this will not happen | |
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 nwrickertsand groperPremium,MVM join:2004-09-04 Geneva, IL kudos:7 | Where is the department of homeland insecurity? Why doesn't DHS take the problem of bot networks more seriously? | |
|  | | More money than drug trade? I find it hard to believe that Internet fraud has surpassed the drug trade in revenue, but of course I could be wrong. | |
|  catseyenuAck PfftPremium join:2001-11-17 Fix East | Not All US ISP's Are Created Equal As a member of the BBR Phish Team I can attest that we've had dismal response from some US ISPs. What stands out in stark contrast is the response from Cox. As a Cox customer for over 6 years I can attest that they really get it and do an exceptional job taking swift and decisive action against anything that threatens their customer or network integrity. When it come to pointing my family, neighbors or business associates to a provider I'm comfortable they're in good hands with Cox. The other ISPs could learn something from their example. | |
|  |  amungusPremium join:2004-11-26 America Reviews:
·AT&T DSL Service
| interesting can't believe this problem is so out of hand that these crooks can make money hand over fist beyond the drug trade.
glad to hear Cox is being somewhat proactive about the situation... but there is obviously a much larger problem...
when I first signed up for Cox, I told my roommate NOT to let them connect me directly to their modem, or at least to LEAVE it that way! ..when I got home a few hours later, I was staring at a modem hooked directly to my box.
They simply should not allow ANYONE to connect to the cable infrastructure without a hardware router/firewall. I immediately went out and bought a cheap (relatively... $100 at the time) Netgear router/switch... we also had to share the connection between our two computers... Still a decent little router for being wired, has 8MB of RAM and good LAN performance. It's effectiveness in keeping the nasty away from the house was/is priceless.
IMO there should be some way to require the ISP to either rent/sell some sort of router/switched/firewall or modem combo thereof. From what I understand, many DSL modems already do this... a friend of mine has one such unit from SBC, but still uses my old router/switch unit anyway because he doesn't trust 'em for one, and just to have a switch...
Cable works differently than DSL, and all these tests every so often about how fast you can become infected are just getting much worse, and much nastier. I just don't see how the cable co's can simply ignore these things. I also doubt a DSL line would get you "infected" as quickly as a wide open cable connection... are there tests on both???
Another problem, what is the ISP to do, just cut off their customers with no explanation??? Call these people and tell them they've been cut because their computer has been hijacked??? It's got to be a problem with logistics and sheer laziness.
To start giving out real protection instead (or at least in conjunction with) of halfway clunky, voluntarily installed software is the best proactive solution...
a condum (software, which many ISP's already give away...) and a chastity belt (hardware) for the internet. | |
|  |  | | Re: interesting The isp's have "dropped the ball". | |
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 | | Why? ..Because there is no law that says that it is illegal to aid and abet a criminal online. This is a job for law enforcement, but law enforcement is too busy doing, er, exactly what? Whatever that is, that is not protecting the public. | |
|  |  rogPremium join:2002-07-03 BC | Re: Why? I'd be real careful with that line of reasoning unless you're a RIAA agent.  | |
|  |  |  2 edits | Re: Why? Ahem...
"Law Enforcement" has it's hands full just trying to enforce the millions of laws on the books over the entire country.
The only time you hear about them is when they take down some lowlife who has made a royal irritation of himself, such as spamming millions of e mails, or, viruses/worms that get into major corporations/media/military/government networks and cause havoc.
Or, when you hear of some lame assed sherriffs deputy impersonating young girls to try and trap some hapless dufus when they should be out on the streets fighting crime (and, before you get on your high horse and spew indignation: I do not mean these comments on this subject to indicate my actual stance on pedophiles and their use of the internet for this purpose).
The only way the ISP's will be forced to police their networks is when the laws and lawsuits start flying over the ever increasing problem of identity theft, which is inevitable.
Identity theft is one of the biggest pains in the ass ever for the person who's identity is stolen and that pain WILL translate to complaints and pressure on lawmakers.
It will probably result in some long overdue policing of the credit reporting agencies too, since they are at the heart of the consumers problem and heartburn. They are another system that has gotten entirely out of hand and have much too much power destroy a consumers life, or, cripple them for years.
Never mind that, under the Social Security act, ones SS# Is not supposed to be used as a universal ID number as it is now for this very reason and it IS illegal to use it so.
The law is just not enforced because your SS# has gotten far too entrenched in the economy and trying to get another form of universal ID fails time after time because the american people oppose it.
Corporations know this, which is why they (mostly) wont try to deny you service for refusing to give them your SS#, especially if you dont go for their whining or veiled threats of doing so. THAT is illegal too and they know it.
Proof is in the puddin: I routinely refuse to provide my SS#. I am NEVER refused. The only reason they want it in the first place is so that they can REPORT YOU TO THE CREDIT BUREAUS.
They know that doing so can hobble/destroy you for years if you need credit and it is the only real way they have to get back at you if you dont pay, since most businesses will NOT sue you, unless you owe thousands because it simply is not cost effective for them to spend money on lawyers to do so.
Never mind that, even though a bad debt is supposed to only stay on your credit bureau record for 7 years (9 for bankruptcy), your bad debt will be sold time and time again to various companies that try to collect such bad debts and, each time this happens and they contact you then report you to the credit bureau, THE CLOCK STARTS ALL OVER AGAIN, thereby bypassing the law that says 7 years because as far as the bureau is concerned, it is a new debtor reporting you.
The fact is that very few have a LEGITIMATE reason, such as for drivers licenses, the IRS (who WILL issue you a "Taxpayer number" different from your SS# if you ask them too, as will those states who use the SS# as the license number)and banks (allthough it escapes me WHY since you are only using them for a service by applying for a account.).
The reason they really want it, of course, is the IRS, just in case, and because of debit cards, to REPORT YOU TO THE CREDIT BUREAUS, which they do regularly.
This is, of course, why the credit card offers start coming shortly after you open an account and sign up for utilities.
The ripple effect implications of cracking down on spammers, identity thieves and phishers, let alone the credit bureaus are stunning if one stops and considers. | |
|  |  |  |  | | Re: Why? said by Fatal Vector:Ahem... Identity theft is one of the biggest pains in the ass ever for the person who's identity is stolen and that pain WILL translate to complaints and pressure on lawmakers. And what are the penalties for identity theft? Apparently, not harsh enough because some people commit this crime over and over again.
The old TV show "Max Headroom" commented that, in the future, "Credit Fraud" was more serious than murder.
We need much stiffer penalties against credit fraud both for individuals that commit it and companies that facilitate it. | |
|  |  |  |  |  | | Re: Why? I said: "when the laws and lawsuits start flying", as they inevitably will. Pressure on congress and state legislatures WILL mount as more and more instances of ID theft happen and people are caught up in the quagmire of the credit bureaus treating THEM like they are liars, cheats and criminals when they try to undo the damage done to their credit histories and reputations.
The laws WILL change concerning credit, etc and the credit bureaus had better wake up and smell the coffee before the wrath of lawmakers falls on them.
It may take some time, but it WILL happen and there will be massive changes in how credit, etc works in this country, since credit is at the heart of the economy.
One thing is for sure: The holliday is definately over for the credit card companies and credit bureaus.
They have had it good for a long time, but ID theft will prove to be their downfall because people value their reputations and get really riled when they are treated like the criminal when they are innocent.
As I said: The ripple effect consequences to business, consumers and the economy will be stunning to behold once lawmakers start taking up ID theft laws. It will be federal most likely under the interstate commerice banner, allthough, doubtless, states will get in their licks too.
I, for one, will be glad to see these arrogant shits get theirs, finally. As I'm sure will many of you. | |
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 | | Zombies how would you know if your PC a zombie even with all the AV's out there they are still getting people's PC's to become zombies | |
|  |  | | Re: Zombies Ahem...
I would think you might suspect if you had half a brain, when the activity light on your modem is constatly flashing, even when you are not on the internet and your computer runs like crap because the CPU 's attention is constantly being used for the zombie spam. | |
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 | | The internet would be a much better place. Great Article. It would be nice to see Internet Service Providers be a little more responsible and much more proactive. The internet would be a much better place. | |
|  jubangyPremium join:2005-03-26 Erie, PA Reviews:
·ViaTalk
| Too Lazy Is the final answer. If people are too lazy to invest a little time into protecting their stuff then the hell with them they should be booted. this whole mind set where everything should be point and click is real old, like anything else there is always changes that need to be made and learning to read and take care of ones self is definitely one of them. of course, this is the day and age where no one likes to take responsibility for their own actions anymore, thanks to all the smooth talking lawyers and what have you. " Gee sir, its ok we wont shut you off we know you were abused 50 years ago"...give it a rest get off your ass and take care of yourself or deal with what you have coming. But then there's also the other side of the coin to, give me a call i'll gladly fix you up for a price... | |
|  |  | | Re: Too Lazy "this whole mind set where everything should be point and click is real old"
Joe is like this because, up till now, he has really not needed much brains to operate his stereo, TV, etc. Most consumers like Joe and Jane dont care how it works as long as it works when they flip the switch, or, press the button.
Most people are stunningly stupid when it comes to a computer and just want to point and click. This is exacerbated by companies like Microsoft and the "security suite makers who want to make their software as simple as they can for this very reason, as well as to avoid any responsibilities (and the costs thereof) of actually making software that works, reliably, with security on by default and actually requiring Joe and Jane to LEARN something.
This is because, once again, of the fact that a corporations ONLY motivation for EVERTHING they do is MONEY and accumulating as much of same as they can.
I am of the opinion that such companies will, eventually, be forced to take some responsibility, as will Joe and Jane, as the fraud problems get worse on the internet.
Sooner or later, these problems will hit a tipping point, as does, inevitably, all criminal activity (since criminals and fraudsters are just like corporations in their basic motivations), and they will be forced to do so by laws and tort.
It will be interesting to watch, I have no doubt. | |
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 | | Sounds like SNAFU(Situation Normal All Fouled Up) as usual of course.  | |
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