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Ikanos Pushes 300 Mbps Over Single Pair (200 Meters)
by Karl Bode 08:39AM Friday Jul 26 2013
Ikanos this week announced that they've made another advancement in VDSL technology, delivering speeds of 300 Mbps for 200 Meters over a single copper pair. The breakthrough was accomplished using Ikanos current chipset technology, which is also able to deliver 150Mbps aggregate throughput (110Mbps downstream and 40Mbps upstream) at a distance of 500 meters. Ikanos is aiming the technology at carriers deploying fiber "in which gigabit broadband connectivity is the desired outcome" but "the carrier is unable to reach all the way inside a subscriber’s residence, typically because the home or building owner does not allow the construction required to lay the additional fiber."

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Mellow
Premium
join:2001-11-16
Salisbury, MD

FTTF (fiber to the fridge)

Congrats to everyone that has lawn fridges, you will be able to get faster speeds in about... ohhh... 2 years.

buddahbless

join:2005-03-21
Premium
Reviews:
·T-Mobile US

Not impressive at all

Really this is the best that can be accomplished then this is a sad day for DSL. I would like you to impress me , no I really mean impress me! 300 mbps over only 200 meters is not revolutionary. Now 300 mbps over 18000 meters on a single pair of copper ( notice i said meters not feet) would impress me. Its the only thing that would get ATT up off there behinds and upgrade us sad DSL customers and even reach out to those rural areas that are still living with dial up or are at the mercy of satellite internet or overpriced LTE.
rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

Re: Not impressive at all

I think 100/50 at 6000 ft without bonding would do wonders and it should be attainable. IMO, it would allow telcos to compete with cable much more effectively. Yes, that still means they need to push a lot of FTTN but at least there could be ONE fridge per subdivision and not one at every street crossing. Maybe I'm naive but it seems reasonable to believe that running fiber next to a main street and then running laterals every mile would be cheaper than doing the same every block. Eventually they have to do FTTC or FTTH but cable seems to be baby stepping their way to FTTH and in the process, kicking the telco's butts. Granted, coax has far more capabilities than a pair of unshielded copper wires but it still seems there could be more done with copper over some sort of mid distance. Advancements at 200M seem best suited for FTTC or FTTNC (fiber to the neighbor's curb).
brad152

join:2006-07-27
Phoenix, AZ
Reviews:
·CenturyLink

1 recommendation

Re: Not impressive at all

Well considering this is mostly for apartment buildings (Verizon FiOS uses VDSL to deliver the last bit of FiOS in apartment buildings that they cannot run direct fiber), this is actually a good thing.

For instance, i live in a Condo, but CenturyLink cannot change the interior lines so when Prism launches here, some of the buildings are going to have issues getting it (my line handle's about 40/3 on VDSL2 with the DSLAM about a block away), with this technology, all CL would have to do is put a fiber node on the side of my building and then i'd be able to get 300Mbps if i wanted too (i cannot see myself as a single person needing that much, but the option would be nice - especially if i decided to go with IPTV through CenturyLink and drop Dish Network)

There is a place for this, and it's not long distances. Copper lines just experience too much spectral interference to give the kind of speeds you are asking for over long distance, especially in old neighborhoods.
rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

Re: Not impressive at all

If we're talking short distances, DSM seems like it has a huge future.

Read the second post in this thread.

»Is AT&T investigating use of Vectored VDSL or cuPON?

There are estimates that this could bring 1Gbps over four pair at 1000m. Similar techniques @ 200m are probably even easier. Why settle for 300Mbps?

motorola870

join:2008-12-07
Arlington, TX
kudos:4
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
said by rradina:

I think 100/50 at 6000 ft without bonding would do wonders and it should be attainable. IMO, it would allow telcos to compete with cable much more effectively. Yes, that still means they need to push a lot of FTTN but at least there could be ONE fridge per subdivision and not one at every street crossing. Maybe I'm naive but it seems reasonable to believe that running fiber next to a main street and then running laterals every mile would be cheaper than doing the same every block. Eventually they have to do FTTC or FTTH but cable seems to be baby stepping their way to FTTH and in the process, kicking the telco's butts. Granted, coax has far more capabilities than a pair of unshielded copper wires but it still seems there could be more done with copper over some sort of mid distance. Advancements at 200M seem best suited for FTTC or FTTNC (fiber to the neighbor's curb).

cable has got a long way to go before fiber. Right plans are for 1Gbps over Coax with DOCSIS 3.0 using 24MHz wide OFDM carriers instead of the standard 6MHz 256QAM carrier like DOCSIS1.1-3.0 uses.
rradina

join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO

Re: Not impressive at all

True. Cable may never need to go all the way to the home but they seem to replace the line between pedestal and the house with considerable frequency. (Mine has been replaced twice in 12 years.) At some point, the economics of dragging glass all the way to the CPE will probably save money. Of course I've often thought that replacing the line is done based on eliminating it as a suspect rather than based on true need.
InvalidError

join:2008-02-03
kudos:5
said by buddahbless:

300 mbps over only 200 meters is not revolutionary.

On cat6 wiring, you're right, it isn't.

On wiring that is in 24-25 pairs bundles with no pair shielding and not really optimized for crosstalk at over 10kHz using EXISTING DSLAMs on the other hand, it is - if Ikanos' claims are true, carriers using Ikanos' newest DSLAMs are a mere firmware upgrade away from becoming able to offer higher speeds to subscribers who are close enough to their DSLAMs. While other companies have whitepapers about beyond-VDSL2/ADSL2+ reaching higher speeds in their labs, these aren't production hardware like Ikanos' is.

Lets just hope Ikanos' "VDSL2+" DSLAMs have better compatibility than their original ADSL2+/VDSL2 stingers.
brad152

join:2006-07-27
Phoenix, AZ
Reviews:
·CenturyLink

Re: Not impressive at all

Well considering the article states this:

quote:
Ikanos is aiming the technology at carriers deploying fiber "in which gigabit broadband connectivity is the desired outcome" but "the carrier is unable to reach all the way inside a subscriber’s residence, typically because the home or building owner does not allow the construction required to lay the additional fiber."
It's obviously not meant to replace the curbside DSLAM's, just an end to a fiber connection for an apartment or condo where the internal lines cannot be replaced. In that case, 200 meters is plenty.
InvalidError

join:2008-02-03
kudos:5

Re: Not impressive at all

said by brad152:

It's obviously not meant to replace the curbside DSLAM's, just an end to a fiber connection for an apartment or condo where the internal lines cannot be replaced. In that case, 200 meters is plenty.

Some telcos are already doing 50+Mbps using VDSL2-12a with a 300-500m useful range so getting within 200m for 300+Mbps does not seem too far-fetched.

In a somewhat densely packed urban neighborhood, you can have 50+ potential subscribers within 200m range: 10 apartments at 15m average spacing x 3 floors each x 2 street sides = 60 addresses passed with ~50m to spare for the JWI and from pole to modem. Enough to warrant a 48 ports remote.
sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
kudos:1
If you knew anything about the laws of physics you would be impressed.

buddahbless

join:2005-03-21
Premium
Reviews:
·T-Mobile US

Re: Not impressive at all

said by sonicmerlin:

If you knew anything about the laws of physics you would be impressed.

I actually know plenty about the laws of physics, which is why this drop of water in the pond does not impress me, not to say that its not not a good innovative invention but not that impressive. What this is geared to could be accomplished in other ways, plain and simple. Once you start reaching beyond your current limitations with innovative workarounds you begin to impress someone.

I bet you would be one of the individuals 100 yrs ago that would say "man traveling to the moon, it will never happen."
If you know anything at all you would know... Better to Remain Silent and Be Thought a Fool than to Speak and Remove All Doubt
BiggA
Premium
join:2005-11-23
EARTH
They should just run fiber. They could always wrap buildings if they can't run it inside. Verizon uses flexible fiber for FIOS. The old buildings all got cable in the '80s, they can get fiber now.
dra6o0n

join:2011-08-15
Mississauga, ON
At least DSL can upgrade, Cable for the most part is SCREWED.
silbaco
Premium
join:2009-08-03
USA

Re: Not impressive at all

Not sure about that. DOCSIS 3.1 will be able to deliver gigabit speeds to customers.
Kamus

join:2011-01-27
El Paso, TX

Re: Not impressive at all

said by silbaco:

Not sure about that. DOCSIS 3.1 will be able to deliver gigabit speeds to customers.


So what, really. There's a lot of places that don't even have DOCSIS 3.0 deployed. And a promise of gigabit speeds "eventually" don't mean a whole lot at the speed technology is advancing.
34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON
said by silbaco:

Not sure about that. DOCSIS 3.1 will be able to deliver gigabit speeds to customers.

Unless the MSOs do some serious node splitting DOCSIS 3.1 is about as ready to deliver Gigabit speeds as DOCSIS 3.0 is failing to deliver very high speeds now.
BiggA
Premium
join:2005-11-23
EARTH

Re: Not impressive at all

Comcast passes half the nation's homes alone, and is 100% D3 AFAIK. I have their 50mbps service, and it's great.
34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

Re: Not impressive at all

No idea what you were trying to get at. Doesn't change what I said.
BiggA
Premium
join:2005-11-23
EARTH

Re: Not impressive at all

They're delivering great speeds now.
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·ooma
·Verizon FiOS

by the time..

by the time any REAL progress could be made.. fiber will have been run everywhere.. then it's too late.

for all the stupids trying to develop this.. the technology was a day late and $1 short back in the early 1990's

how much has the DSL deployment metrics changed in the last 23 years? just about NONE of the technologies are capable of 100+ megabits at the distances needed to reach customers (and be competitive with coax or FTTP) . that makes it a proposition that is too expensive and complicated to deploy in the real world.

fiber and coax are going to shoot for gigabit in the next 5 years.. DSL?
Given AT&T's selfish & deluded track record, not much.

I'm betting many AT&T cities can't wait for a google to gobble up a few of AT&T's most profitable ROI wireline geographies (like what's going to happen in Austin, Tx)
34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

Re: by the time..

said by tmc8080:

by the time any REAL progress could be made.. fiber will have been run everywhere.. then it's too late.

It'll be run into most neighborhoods in rural areas but that doesn't reach the end user. It doesn't matter what access technology is used, they're all dependent on fiber to a certain point in the network.

said by tmc8080:

for all the stupids trying to develop this.. the technology was a day late and $1 short back in the early 1990's

So is cable.

said by tmc8080:

just about NONE of the technologies are capable of 100+ megabits at the distances needed to reach customers

That's funny it works for other telcos. Maybe AT&T should figure out how to do things properly.

said by tmc8080:

fiber and coax are going to shoot for gigabit in the next 5 years.. DSL?

So is DSL.

said by tmc8080:

I'm betting many AT&T cities can't wait for a google to gobble up a few of AT&T's most profitable ROI wireline geographies (like what's going to happen in Austin, Tx)

No way that will happen.
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

Re: by the time..

I never thought ANY city in Texas would get google fiber.... let alone be in the top 5 google goes for..
34764170

join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

Re: by the time..

Google has no intention of being an ISP that covers a lot of cities like the bigger guys. They're just cherry picking one city per incumbent carriers geographic region to ruffle some feathers. It is wishful thinking that they're going to start wiring up tons of cities all over the US. Like you would have guessed they would built out in Kansas City first? No. No one would have.
videomatic3

join:2003-12-12
Pleasanton, CA

9999999 Mbps (.1 meters)

zomg look guys infinite bandwidth that nobody can get

mmay149q
Premium
join:2009-03-05
Dallas, TX
kudos:48

You know it's a sad day...

When WiFi is even faster than your home internet connection

»www.newegg.com/Product/Product.a ··· 33320115

1.75Gbps (probably only 700Mbps max throughput possibly if you're lucky, haven't been able to purchase 2 of these and bridge them yet for testing)

It's finding stuff on Newegg like this that makes me want to drop a 1Gbps symmetrical line to a 100ft tower with a omni-directional antenna and a 600mw amplifier and then hook everyone up with directional antennas (that can access it) and resell service, I think people would be pleased if they were getting at least up to 500Mbps, I know this wouldn't always be ideal depending on how many clients you have on that one router, but if I could sign up and get at least up to 200 people on that one tower with $50 - $75 per month monthly service charge it would be well worth it, especially if most people were getting speeds they never dreamed of!

-Matt
--
Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning. -Albert Einstein
davidhoffman
Premium
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA
kudos:3

DSL upgrades.

If the telephone companies deploy the technology on a geographically wide enough basis it would be great, even if it only means that those stuck with 0.768 Mbps DSL will be possibly upgraded to service equal to or above 12Mbps. It sounds lousy compared to 100Gbps FTTH or DOCSIS 3.1 offerings, but it significantly reuses existing wires inside the premises and allows the low cost DIY self install modem kits to be the primary way of connecting subscribers. In my community it would mean the increased possibility of serious competition for the local cable ISPs at the lower speed tiers.