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Last Minute Wrangling On FCC Neutrality Rules
Which still likely won't really be enforced on wireless
by Karl Bode 03:59PM Friday Dec 17 2010
Aside from politicians and lobbyists, nobody knows precisely what's in the FCC's upcoming network neutrality rules, which the FCC will vote on next Tuesday. As we noted earlier this week the FCC is busy making changes to the final rules, FCC Commissioner Clyburn insisting the FCC is working "day and night in the hope of achieving" consensus. That "consensus" will most likely involve rules that don't really cover wireless, protections for wireless being something AT&T and Verizon have fought tooth and nail against. Anonymous sources tell Multichannel News that while there have been some language modifications to please Democratic Commissioner Michael Copps, there still doesn't appear to be movement on applying real rules to wireless -- which could be a problem given recent insight into some of the pricing models being considered by wireless incumbents.

Updated: While the rules are being hashed out, Republicans are trying to attach a rider to a military and veterans construction project bill that would prevent the FCC from enacting network neutrality protections.

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FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5

1 recommendation

Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

Genachowski is burning his bridges with the new Republican House of Rep if he continues to refuse to release the draft of his proposed net neutrality rules before Tuesday's mtg.
»www.broadcastingcable.com/articl···blic.php

The incoming chairs of the House Energy & Commerce Commerce Committee and Communications Subcommittee, along with the vice chair of the latter, have all called on FCC Chairman Julius Genachowski to make public his draft of proposed network neutrality rules.

In a letter Thursday, Fred Upton (R-Mich.) and Greg Walden (R-Ore.) and Lee Terry (R-Neb.) said the public has not had a "realistic and fulsome" chance to vet the proposal

They argued that the network neutrality proposal is likely the most controversial item the commission has considered in a decade. "The stakes are high enough and you should go the extra mile," they said.

And of the publicness of the draft, a senior official said in response to a similar call by Republican Commissioner Meredith Attwell Baker: "We are hard pressed to think of an issue that has been more publicly debated and dissected than preserving a free and open Internet.

An FCC spokesperson had no comment on the legislators' call to release the draft.

gorehound

join:2009-06-19
Portland, ME

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

i think we already now that we as consumers whether republican or democrat will get screwed in our wallets.
won't matter if you are liberal or conservative as we all will pay the bigger bills to the greedy corporations.

FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5
And in case anyone missed it - the reason the House committee chairs want the draft released BEFORE Tuesday is so that public pressure can be applied to the 3 DEM FCC commissioners BEFORE they vote on Tuesday.

S_engineer
Premium
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

Well after 8 years of Repub FCC allowing the ISPs self regulate (the consumer be damned era), maybe we can get some consumer friendly rules for a change!

I'm also looking to buy a bridge to Brooklyn!
--
BF69~~~Please stop suffocating gerbils!
nOv1c3

join:2006-11-08
Whitney, TX
kudos:1

2 recommendations

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

I rather have them self regulate than to have the government jump in and meddle with sh*t , Only thing that well become of it is the end of the Internet as we know it

So Sick of the whiny little Liberals in the world that think the cure all for everything is government intervention :/

S_engineer
Premium
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL

1 edit

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

I'm pretty FAR from being liberal. And I'm certainly not oblivious, as you are, to the purchasing of legislation and regulations by companies (try finding out whom has input on these rules).

Do some homework, LEARN!
--
BF69~~~Please stop suffocating gerbils!
nOv1c3

join:2006-11-08
Whitney, TX
kudos:1

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

When it comes down to it , This well have sh*t to do with Net Neutrality and everything to do with this Administration taking more control over the net , This well be just the first step , Once they get there grubby little hands in it , Its over :/
Expand your moderator at work

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
kudos:42
There's some complicated political BS going on I find interesting here.

1.) One one end, you could assume Genachowski wants things kept secret because he's planning a few things he wants kept from incumbent (AT&T, Verizon, Comcast) lobbyists.

2.) On the other end, you could assume that these lobbyists already know full well what's in the rules, since they played a starring role drafting them and the rules themselves are paper thin.

1. seems unlikely, since Genachowski has clearly shown he has no cojones of any kind.

If 2., then Republican lawmakers are highlighting the fact that they're clueless by opposing largely meaningless rules pushed for by their constituents.
WhatNow
Premium
join:2009-05-06
Charlotte, NC

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

The Republicans know who pays their bills. The Rich and they just got a nice Christmas present.

Harddrive
Proud American and Infidel since 1968.
Premium
join:2000-09-20
DFW
kudos:2

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

that's a no-shitter right there.

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
Actually the rich pay everyones bills. Almost half of the people in this country pay no income taxes.
Expand your moderator at work
sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
kudos:1

1 recommendation

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

said by fifty nine:

Actually the rich pay everyones bills. Almost half of the people in this country pay no income taxes.

Why are people so easily fooled by simple mathematical trickery? Here's a fun little math experiment for you to try. Don't worry, it's not too hard...

Let's say that you and I are stranded on an island. Between the two of us, we have an economy, and to be egalitarian we decide that a fair "flat tax" of 10% of each of our incomes should go into a common fund to pay for common needs like defense, roads, etc. Fair enough?

Now, let's say that 2010 was a decent year for me. I worked hard, sold a bunch of island-themed goods I made by hand, and earned $100,000.

However, maybe 2010 was a gangbusters year for you - you struck a coconut import/export deal and brought in $1,000,000 in income that year. Good for you!!

Now, have you got your calculator ready? Follow along...
At the 10% "flat tax" rate in our economy, I pay in $10,000 out of the $100,000 that I earned to help fund our common needs. Out of the $1,000,000 that you earned, you pay in 10% as well - or $100,000.

This makes the total "tax base" between you and I $110,000 that we can use to maybe build a new road or a bridge, upgrade the radio transmitter we've got on our island ... whatever. Each of us paid in 10% of what we earned.

Seems pretty fair, right? However...
If you do the math backwards, you paid in $100,000 of the $110,000 in our total tax base, which means you paid 90.9% of the taxes! Since I paid in $10,000 of the $110,000 that means I only paid 9.09% of the taxes.

OMGWTFBBQ! How, in a "fair, flat tax" system did you end up paying 90% of the taxes?? It's because you earned 90% of the income on our island. It doesn't matter where the tax rates are (as demonstrated by the "flat tax" between us) -- if you earn ridiculously more, your "share" of the total tax pool will always be larger. It's simple mathematics - numerators and denominators.

Watch, as I demonstrate. Still got your calculator handy? Good. Let's say we give you a "tax cut for the rich" - we'll cut your taxes in half down to 5%. So, now you only have to pay 5% in 2011. And because I'm obviously one of those lazy, no good, welfare queens who refuses to pull myself up from my own bootstraps ... let's punish me by increasing my taxes by 50%, which means I'll be paying 15% in 2011.

For the purposes of making this easy ... let's assume that you and I both make the same amounts in 2011 that we did in 2010 - $1,000,000 for you, and $100,000 for me. Firing up the calculator again, we see that you'll pay in $50,000 in taxes given your 5% rate. I will pay in $15,000 based on my 15% rate. This makes our total "tax base" $65,000 between us.

Out of that $65,000, you paid in $50,000 which means that you paid 76.9% of the taxes, even after having your tax cut in half!! WTF!!

Seriously man, this is just mathematical trickery. If the wealthiest among us wasn't earning >60-70% of the income, they wouldn't be paying 71% of the taxes - and even if you cut the wealthy's taxes in half, they'll still be paying the lion's share of taxes because they earn the lion's share of income. It's really, honestly that simple.

So please stop posting that tripe.

SammyNut

@cox.net

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

This is quite possibly the worst description of the tax system that I have ever read..

You can always tell a liberal when they say someone had a lucky year and happened to make more money than the other person.. I suppose it is impossible that he made more money by busting his ass and working hard.

All it does is prove that the the rich pay more in taxes.

As the original poster pointed out. 50% of the country pays ZERO taxes.. nada .. nothing. So how do you give them a tax cut..? Any reduction in taxes would be welfare as you would be paying money to 50% of the country not taxing them.

As for the flat tax.. that is nice and all but we dont have a flat tax. The tax rates are adjusted according to income.. with the wealthy paying the highest rate.

The 50% of the US that is paying taxes are giving well over 50% of their income to local and federal govts. What would you say is a fair amount 70 80 90 %?
dcuser

join:2002-06-15
North Palm Beach, FL
Would letter-writing help - or be a hopeless waste of time?

It'd be useful if you'd spell out some details about what any one of us "we the people" could do, if anything...

TIA.

FFH5
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ
kudos:5

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

said by dcuser:

Would letter-writing help - or be a hopeless waste of time?

It'd be useful if you'd spell out some details about what any one of us "we the people" could do, if anything...

TIA.

Between now and Tuesday I doubt a letter writing campaign would even have time to reach anyone at the FCC that would read it.

Only threats from Congress will have a chance of getting the FCC to do something before Tuesday.

Harddrive
Proud American and Infidel since 1968.
Premium
join:2000-09-20
DFW
kudos:2

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

i'm sure AT&T and Verizon have already reached out to 'their' members of Congress, if you know what i mean.
--
"Oh no. This is Earth, isn't it." - Thor

Harddrive
Proud American and Infidel since 1968.
Premium
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DFW
kudos:2
it just shows how far the FCC and telecom companies are up each others asses. the telecom companies tell the FCC to keep everything under wraps as long as you can, even up to and including Tuesday's meeting on The Hill with legislators.

i'm pretty sure the ending of Abraham Lincoln's Gettysburg Address is no longer applicable.
"...and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."

as heard in the conference rooms when the major telecom companies and FCC get together...
"Long live the United States of Corporate America!"
--
"Oh no. This is Earth, isn't it." - Thor
chgo_man99

join:2010-01-01
San Jose, CA

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

said by Harddrive:

i'm pretty sure the ending of Abraham Lincoln's Gettysburg Address is no longer applicable.
"...and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth."

as heard in the conference rooms when the major telecom companies and FCC get together...
"Long live the United States of Corporate America!"

modern Roman Empire

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
kudos:42

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

Similar, though fewer vomitoriums and less lead poisoning.

KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK

Re: Genachowski refused to release draft depsite Congress demand

said by Karl Bode:

Similar, though fewer vomitoriums and less lead poisoning.

For now.

We have our versions.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini

DavePR

join:2008-06-04
Canyon Country, CA
FYI a vomitorium is an exit tunnel in a stadium. Anybody who works stadium gigs will tell you this.
WhatNow
Premium
join:2009-05-06
Charlotte, NC

Updated

What does Net Neutrality have to do with the military? That is what is wrong with Congress they play games instead of being putting issues up to be voted on for their merit.

MSauk
MSauk
Premium
join:2002-01-17
Sandy, UT
Reviews:
·Comcast

Re: Updated

I know one thing is for sure, our gov't from the top to the bottom is a complete failure.

Why do we even need a gov't? Lets be honest, it couldn't or wouldn't get much worse then it is already.
--
801 Images

politico

@amenworld.com
It's a common tactic to attach controversial legislation to defense spending bills. No American politician wants to vote no on a defense spending bill because their vote can then be used against them during their re-election.

Candidate X voted no on defense spending bill XYZ, he/she doesn't support the troops, vote for opponent candidate ABC (waves american flag faster), paid for by citizens who support cannon fodder and reap huge military industrial profits.

OneEye

join:2006-04-15
Peachtree City, GA

Net Neutrality

U.S citizens can offer many reasons to be proud of America, but the government keeps offering up reasons to be ashamed.

The betrayal by Republicans and Democrats in Congress and the Obama Administration to allow ISP, Cable, and Wireless lobbyist to write Net Neutrality civil law that pisses on the civil rights of all citizens is an act of treason against the people and government of the United States.
tdouglas22

join:2001-09-25
Memphis, TN

1 recommendation

All this crying is starting a flood....

In case we haven't figured it out by now it's all about money and staying on top. You can't beat that system by fighting against it. It's been around since before this country was founded and it is not going anywhere. Instead of trying to over throw it.... learn how it works and make it work for you.

Many times the rich get richer because they do more than just talk about it... they get out there and do something to make it happen.

Bill Neilson
Premium
join:2009-07-08
Arlington, VA

Yippie...more fake wrangling over something

that will come off as pro-consumer but has little to anything in it that actually protects us
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

wireless broadband market

this market is so screwed up & anticompetitve that the last thing one need worry about is net neutrality. the greedy companies(service providers) will do damage to themselves over time.

Mully

@bellatlantic.COM

Re: wireless broadband market

Define greed? Is that profit? Just how much profit, per cent wise do you think they make? Since profits are not guaranteed should we not be glad they work to make them? And plow some of it back into new services? Since all the big players in the arena are publically traded companies you can own shares in them. Perhaps you have a 401k with shares in them as well. Are you therefore greedy to want to see your 401k go as high as possible?

Net neutrality is just going to be another government boondongle. We should be so lucky as to see it die before it gets started.

politico

@bredbandsbolaget.se

Re: wireless broadband market

That's quite a disingenuous argument. Most large ISP operating in the US are government enforced monopolies that exist through regional franchise agreements. High initial capital costs and legal hurdles create barriers to entry for prospective competitors. Some of the legal hurdles exist to prevent overlapping infrastructure and to encourage initial capital investment for an ILEC or CLEC into a market.

So there in lies the rub. Government enforced monopolies were sanctioned to encourage initial investment and to guarantee ISP a ROI. The problem is that these franchise agreements have become a burden to competition. These monopolies/duopolies have grown through horizontal and vertical mergers in the telcom industry. As the revolving door between private industry and government has become closer, coporations have increasingly been able to co-opt government insert their own employees into agencies and ultimately end up writing legislation that is self-beneficial.

So define greed? Private industry co-opting government to create legislation which furthers their bottom line and creates an anti-competitive market.

Mully

@verizon.com

Re: wireless broadband market

So I suppose to be without sin in your world private industry should not fight for their interests and just let government hand down by decree all the ever changing rules that suits them.
As to the rest of your opinion, how is net neutrality going to solve any of this. Its just who has the bigger pocket gets the bigger ear of the government. It will be more of what you call government enforcement playing to the tune of the highest special interest bidder.
You think somehow net neutrality is going to bring about a massive influx of new mom and pop competition? Are we so suffering now that net neutrality will somehow end that suffering? Google sure thinks so it's spending millions for it.

The greediest of all is government and its never ending encroachment on just about every aspect of our lives.