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Most Successful U.S. Broadband Over Powerline Network Shut Down
And Calling It The 'Most Successful U.S. BPL Network' Isn't Saying Much
by Karl Bode Thursday 08-Apr-2010 tags: business · alternatives · bandwidth
Tipped by Gbcue See Profile
Manassas, Virginia was the first US city to see a real, non-trial launch of broadband over powerline (BPL) technology. The technology was praised by BPL vendors as a viable third pipe competitor, and a fairly unskeptical technology press often repeated the claim. However, BPL spent much of the latest decade floundering because of early implementations' inherent potential for interference with amateur and emergency radio. It was also made irrelevant in the face of next-generation broadband speeds, and the unavoidable fact that many utilities simply didn't want to be broadband providers.

After buying the flailing network from companies who once heralded it as proof BPL was a major broadband player, the city has spent a total of $1.6 million on it, and was pumping an additional $100,000 or so into the network every month. With city residents lured away by faster alternatives, leaders have had the network on life support for months. Now according to the ARRL the city this week finally decided to pull the plug as of July 1. The closure will impact just 520 local residents, which in and of itself kind of tells you what you need to know about BPL:

Once touted as "the most successful BPL deployment in the nation," the City of Manassas, Virginia has decided to get out of the BPL business, once and for all. At a Special Meeting on Monday, April 5, the Manassas City Council -- acting on a recommendation from the Manassas Utilities Commission -- unanimously voted to discontinue Broadband over Powerline (BPL) Internet service as of July 1, 2010 to the approximately 520 residents and businesses who currently subscribe to the service; these customers were told that they have three months to find a new Internet service provider.

It's unfortunate for Manassas, which was hailed by former FCC boss Michael Powell as the pinnacle of broadband achievement just five years ago. Those companies (like Comtek, who took an adversarial role against those worried about interference) have since moved on to pitch their hardware to energy utilities as part of smart energy networking solutions. Powell, who once called BPL the "great broadband hope," has since moved on to a life of highly paid work at telecom think tanks. The city however still sits nursing their wounds from a cash-guzzling network that promised ubiquitous connectivity, but almost immediately become entirely irrelevant.

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Linklist
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
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Taxpayers of Manassas got hosed

This network would never have been built if it was forced to rely on private investment. The only reason it did was because government leaders were hoodwinked by the FCC in to building it. The true unfortunates aren't the 520 households that are subscribed to it, but the taxpayers that had to foot the bill for the experiment.

Gbcue
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Santa Rosa, CA
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Re: Taxpayers of Manassas got hosed

said by Linklist:

This network would never have been built if it was forced to rely on private investment. The only reason it did was because government leaders were hoodwinked by the FCC in to building it. The true unfortunates aren't the 520 households that are subscribed to it, but the taxpayers that had to foot the bill for the experiment.
An experiment is precisely that, an experiment. If nobody experimented on doing anything (regardless of the funding source), many things would not exist today, like the Internet.

It could have been a real flop from DARPA, at tax-payers expense, too!
--
My Blog 2.0
nasadude

join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD

Re: Taxpayers of Manassas got hosed

unfortunately, it was well predicted before this system was even implemented that it was at best a third rate solution to broadband.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
kudos:33

Re: Taxpayers of Manassas got hosed

Yeah, the problems with BPL were pretty well spelled out for any city or town that wanted to investigate it...
eggboard
Premium
join:2000-11-18
Seattle, WA

Re: Taxpayers of Manassas got hosed

BPL was the favorite "third pipe" technology of think-tanks and consultants paid by incumbent first and second pipers (DSL and cable) to pretend that there would be competition instead of monopolies and duopolies.

Who knew that revenue-bond-funded muni fiber might emerge as the actual potential third pipe? It has a lot more legs than BPL.

A few years ago, I thought the Current project in Texas would basically jumpstart BPL because of the scope, investors (Google, among others), necessity, mixed broadband/smart-grid properties, deregulated/unbundled market, etc.

Nope. When Current failed to handle TXU's market, that made it clear that this would never work for broadband.

GPON! GPON! GPON! Forever.

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

Most Successful U.S. Broadband Over Powerline Network

That's like saying "best smelling turd."

Good riddance.
brianiscool

join:2000-08-16
Tampa, FL
kudos:1

hmm

I hope we do a test run on Universal broadband before we launch it everywhere. I don't like the fact communities will be using one 1GB uplink where 30 - 50 people can live in a community.

Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02
kudos:33

Re: hmm

I think this system offered something around 1 Mbps for $25 or so...
jbrewno

join:2010-01-21
Port Byron, NY

Re: hmm

When am i gonna have broad band

ScottWhittle

@verizon.net

Overhyped

BPL was another overhyped "technology" as a Service....just like LMDS with Winstar...'cept that was private funded.
titoyay222
Premium
join:2005-04-27
Cincinnati, OH

cincy

In Cincinnati the BPL service is still up and running. I'm not sure how many subscribers they have though. I do know that they don't offer the service to much of the city. The prices are Ok and speeds are sym. That's prob. the best thing about it. Though, they only offer speeds up to 3mbps up and down.

You can check them out here: »www.current.net/

Noah Vail
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Lorton, VA
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Re: cincy

said by titoyay222:

In Cincinnati the BPL service is still up and running.
You can check them out here: »www.current.net/
I'm not sure they add to their value by allying themselves with Vongo.


Vogon Ent Inc.


Vongo was a scourge upon HP Notebook Owners. Vongo used the same nefarious techniques that Zango and other malware vendors employed to make sure users couldn't be free of their offerings.

NV
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confused_cit

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Hammers interfere with my celectronics

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.

N3OGH
Yo Soy Col. "Bat" Guano
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Philly burbs
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Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
Double standard, NOT.

Your stereo and computer speakers are almost certainly FCC part "15" Devices.

"(1)This device may not cause harmful interference, and (2) this device must accept interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation."

Your computer speakers and stereo have, and most likely always will, take hind teet to Amateur radio operations.

Most of the devices in American homes today that use or generate RF radiation stand in line behind any and all licensed devices and/or operators. Just the nature of the Part 15 device.

In other words, unless you make nice with the guy who's lighting up your stereo speakers (and if I was that guy, I would be in your house installing RF chokes on stuff, just to be a good neighbor), you're shit out of luck.

But, from the sound of it, all you want to do is piss and moan, so I seriously doubt you've taken a technical approach to fixing your problems...
--
Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power

Jack_in_VA
Premium
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Mathews, VA
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Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by N3OGH:

said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
Double standard, NOT.

Your stereo and computer speakers are almost certainly FCC part "15" Devices.

"(1)This device may not cause harmful interference, and (2) this device must accept interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation."

Your computer speakers and stereo have, and most likely always will, take hind teet to Amateur radio operations.

Most of the devices in American homes today that use or generate RF radiation stand in line behind any and all licensed devices and/or operators. Just the nature of the Part 15 device.

In other words, unless you make nice with the guy who's lighting up your stereo speakers (and if I was that guy, I would be in your house installing RF chokes on stuff, just to be a good neighbor), you're shit out of luck.

But, from the sound of it, all you want to do is piss and moan, so I seriously doubt you've taken a technical approach to fixing your problems...
Oh yeah I had one of the big ego Hams next door to me a few years ago who refused to even consider limiting his damage. I got me a 500 watt linear amp, a set of PDL beams, a D104 power mike turned all the way up and aimed it right at his antenna about 25 ft away. It didn't take long for him to get the message and call a truce.

Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro

Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by Jack_in_VA:

said by N3OGH:

said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
Double standard, NOT.

Your stereo and computer speakers are almost certainly FCC part "15" Devices.

"(1)This device may not cause harmful interference, and (2) this device must accept interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation."

Your computer speakers and stereo have, and most likely always will, take hind teet to Amateur radio operations.

Most of the devices in American homes today that use or generate RF radiation stand in line behind any and all licensed devices and/or operators. Just the nature of the Part 15 device.

In other words, unless you make nice with the guy who's lighting up your stereo speakers (and if I was that guy, I would be in your house installing RF chokes on stuff, just to be a good neighbor), you're shit out of luck.

But, from the sound of it, all you want to do is piss and moan, so I seriously doubt you've taken a technical approach to fixing your problems...
Oh yeah I had one of the big ego Hams next door to me a few years ago who refused to even consider limiting his damage. I got me a 500 watt linear amp, a set of PDL beams, a D104 power mike turned all the way up and aimed it right at his antenna about 25 ft away. It didn't take long for him to get the message and call a truce.
Great. So you violated the law to get what you wanted.
Too bad the FCC didn't slap you with a $20,000+ fine. It's not that hard to prove when you're a ham.

-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
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DenverGreg
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join:2010-02-27
Denver, CO

Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

So a self-proclaimed proud libertarian conservative is hiding behind the FCC and it's ability to impose fines at the point of a gun? I suggest that you work on the consistency of your arguments.
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Tzale
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Premium
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NYC Metro

Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by DenverGreg:

So a self-proclaimed proud libertarian conservative is hiding behind the FCC and it's ability to impose fines at the point of a gun? I suggest that you work on the consistency of your arguments.
It's the law. I don't call for people to break the law.
I'm not a fucking anarchist, so I'll chalk you up to being another anti-libertarian who doesn't know crap about the movement.

-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
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Gbcue
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Premium
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Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:8

Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by Tzale:

said by DenverGreg:

So a self-proclaimed proud libertarian conservative is hiding behind the FCC and it's ability to impose fines at the point of a gun? I suggest that you work on the consistency of your arguments.
It's the law. I don't call for people to break the law.
I'm not a fucking anarchist, so I'll chalk you up to being another anti-libertarian who doesn't know crap about the movement.

-Tzale
Where did he say anything about you being an "anarchist"?
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Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
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NYC Metro

Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by Gbcue:

said by Tzale:

said by DenverGreg:

So a self-proclaimed proud libertarian conservative is hiding behind the FCC and it's ability to impose fines at the point of a gun? I suggest that you work on the consistency of your arguments.
It's the law. I don't call for people to break the law.
I'm not a fucking anarchist, so I'll chalk you up to being another anti-libertarian who doesn't know crap about the movement.

-Tzale
Where did he say anything about you being an "anarchist"?
Anarchists are against all government. He seems to be implying that my support of FCC law is hypocritical considering my libertarian views. I am not against all Government. Due to the nature of the radio spectrum, some regulation is necessary. I'm a libertarian, not an anarchist...

-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
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www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY

N3OGH
Yo Soy Col. "Bat" Guano
Premium
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Philly burbs
kudos:1
said by DenverGreg:

So a self-proclaimed proud libertarian conservative is hiding behind the FCC and it's ability to impose fines at the point of a gun? I suggest that you work on the consistency of your arguments.
Funny, I never met anyone from the FCC who carried a gun.

Now the IRS, THAT'S another story.....
--
Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power

rf_engineer

join:2003-08-04
USA
said by Jack_in_VA:

Oh yeah I had one of the big ego Hams next door to me a few years ago who refused to even consider limiting his damage. I got me a 500 watt linear amp, a set of PDL beams, a D104 power mike turned all the way up and aimed it right at his antenna about 25 ft away. It didn't take long for him to get the message and call a truce.
What's his callsign? We'll get him to post his side of the story; somehow I get the feeling we're not getting all the facts.

Gbcue
P.E.
Premium
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:8
said by Jack_in_VA:

said by N3OGH:

said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
Double standard, NOT.

Your stereo and computer speakers are almost certainly FCC part "15" Devices.

"(1)This device may not cause harmful interference, and (2) this device must accept interference received, including interference that may cause undesired operation."

Your computer speakers and stereo have, and most likely always will, take hind teet to Amateur radio operations.

Most of the devices in American homes today that use or generate RF radiation stand in line behind any and all licensed devices and/or operators. Just the nature of the Part 15 device.

In other words, unless you make nice with the guy who's lighting up your stereo speakers (and if I was that guy, I would be in your house installing RF chokes on stuff, just to be a good neighbor), you're shit out of luck.

But, from the sound of it, all you want to do is piss and moan, so I seriously doubt you've taken a technical approach to fixing your problems...
Oh yeah I had one of the big ego Hams next door to me a few years ago who refused to even consider limiting his damage. I got me a 500 watt linear amp, a set of PDL beams, a D104 power mike turned all the way up and aimed it right at his antenna about 25 ft away. It didn't take long for him to get the message and call a truce.
It would have been interesting if the ham cranked up to 1.5kW.
--
My Blog 2.0

Nick Tesla

@atlanticbb.net
Legally FCC only has jurisdiction over radio transmissions that cross state lines.
Although like most Federal agencies they have usurped illegal power to themselves.

rf_engineer

join:2003-08-04
USA

Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by Nick Tesla :

Legally FCC only has jurisdiction over radio transmissions that cross state lines.
Although like most Federal agencies they have usurped illegal power to themselves.
Wrong. That defense was tried recently with two pirate radio station busts in Texas, and several others before.... unsuccessfully. Read Section 301, they have jurisdiction.

Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro
said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
I'm sorry but you need to accept interference from Amateur Radio operators who are LICENSED. We're not responsible for your faulty or inferior electronic equipment / infrastructure. The nice thing is that most of us are tech / electronics geeks and we'd be thrilled to help you fix the problem if you asked like a human being.

-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
"I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."~Ronald Reagan
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www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY

WiFiguru
To infinity... and beyond
Premium
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CLMTCAXF
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Re: Hammers interfere with my celectronics

said by Tzale:

said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
The nice thing is that most of us are tech / electronics geeks and we'd be thrilled to help you fix the problem if you asked like a human being.

-Tzale
AMEN!

Gbcue
P.E.
Premium
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:8
said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
Laughing Out Loud.
--
My Blog 2.0

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2
said by confused_cit :

What bugs me is that hammers scream inference from BPL. One of my neighbors broadcast over my stereo and computer speakers all the time and the FCC hasn't done anything about it. Double standard.
Before you cried to mommy (FCC) have you talked to the ham who you claim was causing interference?

Certainly if any of my neighbors complain to me I'll help them out. I'll even give them filters for free!

But if someone calls the FCC I'll tell them to go pound sand and deal with me via the FCC.

More bees with honey than vinegar.
cornelius785

join:2006-10-26
Worcester, MA
why are you complaining about ham radio operators? have you EVER placed your cell phone next to computer speakers? i've heard computer speakers emit some weird noise seconds before a call or message arrives and the phone rings. so why not go after the cell phone service providers? how about cell phone manufacturers (like apple.... it was an iphone when i heard the speaker emit the noise)???
jacour
Premium
join:2001-12-11
Matthews, NC

This is why they have RF shielding on cable lines

Good riddance to bad rubbish. I am sure nobody will miss the splatter.

73
decifal

join:2007-03-10
Bon Aqua, TN
kudos:1
Reviews:
·Verizon Broadban..

jeesh

I see the F U I got mine mentallity is still here. Millions that were hoping it would work, myself included are sadden to see a real chance of having broadband has fallen.. Most of you don't and will never care, but if for some reason if your service were stripped from you, you'd cry cry cry.. And noone should have to move from an established non rural area just to get broadband.. ((satellite and some wireless don't qualify for true broadband ))

See 8 replies to this post

Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus

join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY

Remember......

You can't polish a turd, but Manassas, Virginia tried.really, really tried

Na Ne NA NA Hey, Hey, Good Bye!!!!

Gbcue
P.E.
Premium
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Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:8

Re: Remember......

said by Transmaster:

You can't polish a turd, but Manassas, Virginia tried.really, really tried

Na Ne NA NA Hey, Hey, Good Bye!!!!
You can, Mythbusters proved it.
--
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Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus

join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
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Re: Remember......

said by Gbcue:

said by Transmaster:

You can't polish a turd, but Manassas, Virginia tried.really, really tried

Na Ne NA NA Hey, Hey, Good Bye!!!!
You can, Mythbusters proved it.
I know I saw that episode, leave it to the Japanese to do something no else has.
--
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._.. _ _ _ ._..
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Tzale
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join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro

Good News

Thank God! Hams can rejoice over this!

-Tzale

scotty21

@myvzw.com

Re: Good News

Ham's still exist, really? Internet radio is where it's at.

Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro

Re: Good News

said by scotty21 :

Ham's still exist, really? Internet radio is where it's at.
Are you kidding me? Clearly you don't know what Amateur Radio is about... We don't play music, we talk using dozens of different 'modes' ranging from FM/AM to SSB (LSB/USB), Satellite Communications (we have our own up there), moonbounce, HF, CW morse), packet radio and tons of other digital modes. There was also 30,000 new hams in the last year. There is a steady trend of new people coming into the Amateur Radio service. We provide a solid backbone in this nation's emergency communications infrastructure.... And for tech geeks, it's the perfect convergence of social fun with electronics and computers.

-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
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PGHammer

join:2003-06-09
Accokeek, MD
Reviews:
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Re: Good News

Heck, Tzale; amateur radio is a lot more than morse code and radio. It includes two different forms of *television* (slow-scan television and fast-scan television, AKA SSTV and FSTV) that are used, among other things, to help train *broadcast* (AKA commercial) radio and television engineers (the business end of any TV stations's operations); the current nearly-automated radio/television transmitter wouldn't *exist* without the pioneering work of the Expert and Technician-class hams! (Over half the commercial radio, and a larger percentage of the commercial television, station engineers not only started in amateur radio, but remain current and involved today.)

Also, to a large extent, amateur radio helped keep Hewlett-Packard alive before computers (same applies to Tektronix and Fluke).

In short, a good portion of what remains of the electronic industry in the United States (and darn near *all* of the PC industry) owes it's livelihood (if not life) to amateur radio and hams.

Do you really want to kill the platinum goose?

Tzale
Proud Libertarian Conservative
Premium
join:2004-01-06
NYC Metro

Re: Good News

said by PGHammer:

Heck, Tzale; amateur radio is a lot more than morse code and radio. It includes two different forms of *television* (slow-scan television and fast-scan television, AKA SSTV and FSTV) that are used, among other things, to help train *broadcast* (AKA commercial) radio and television engineers (the business end of any TV stations's operations); the current nearly-automated radio/television transmitter wouldn't *exist* without the pioneering work of the Expert and Technician-class hams! (Over half the commercial radio, and a larger percentage of the commercial television, station engineers not only started in amateur radio, but remain current and involved today.)

Also, to a large extent, amateur radio helped keep Hewlett-Packard alive before computers (same applies to Tektronix and Fluke).

In short, a good portion of what remains of the electronic industry in the United States (and darn near *all* of the PC industry) owes it's livelihood (if not life) to amateur radio and hams.

Do you really want to kill the platinum goose?
Hell no!

I'm an Amateur Radio operator... I just wrote up a quick post, didn't really feel articulate or detail oriented at the time

But your post is dead on.

-Tzale
--
They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.
-:-
"I believe the very heart and soul of conservatism is libertarianism."~Ronald Reagan
-:-
www.freestateproject.org - LIVE LIBERTY

ctceo
Premium
join:2001-04-26
South Bend, IN
Reviews:
·magicjack.com
·AT&T U-Verse

Very sad

It's a shame to see that they were forced into the anti-competitive world of Comcap & Ma Bell. It's funny how those companies were reluctant to roll out service in some of the more heavily populated zones of BPL until AFTER they saw some other companies getting a chunk of the change.

Perhaps in another timeline, another alternate universe...
--
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fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

Re: Very sad

said by ctceo:

It's a shame to see that they were forced into the anti-competitive world of Comcap & Ma Bell.
Yeah but Manassas has FiOS.

ctceo
Premium
join:2001-04-26
South Bend, IN

Re: Very sad

Now. getting it deployed to your house beforehand was a different bug entirely. and the cost of fios was ridiculous compared to getting BPL.
hematitan

join:2009-07-14
O Fallon, MO

RE: BPL subject

Last summer when I couldn't get DSL I asked an engineer from the electric company here when we would see BPL and he told me around the year 3000.

Dude111
An Awesome Dude
Premium
join:2003-08-04
USA
kudos:11

Re: BPL subject

Im sure everyone down there that likes to listen to AM RADIO are very happy this crap will be terminated!!!

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