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story category NebuAD Hit Hard By PR Disaster
Congressional inquiry and ISP cold shoulder results in layoffs
(old news - 07:56AM Wednesday Aug 13 2008)
tags: legal · business · trouble
Over the last few months, behavioral advertising firm NebuAD has seen their entire business model implode. Charter, Embarq, CenturyTel, Knology, Wide Open West and others, all of whom were either testing or deploying behavioral advertising technology from NebuAD, have either suspended or terminated those plans. The decisions were prompted largely due to Congressional concerns that selling user browsing histories violates several Federal wiretap and privacy laws.

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As you might expect, the fleeing business partners and bad press are having a nasty impact on NebuAD's finances. The Register notes that the company has given their PR agency the boot and laid off "a significant portion" of their workforce. Meanwhile, everyone continues trying to distance themselves from NebuAD -- including Google.

NebuAD could survive by creating an opt-out system that actually works and lobbying Congress to stay off their backs, but several members of Congress are working on regulation that would require all such behavioral advertising systems be opt-in. Obviously, if consumers were clearly informed of such systems (and not just alerted via fine print) ISPs and NebuAD would see a decline in revenue.

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Forums » NebuAD Hit Hard By PR Disaster
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jc1350

join:2004-09-23

1 edit

just like anything else

If my ISP wants to give me FREE access supported by ads, then fine. But, if I'm paying my hard-earned money to an ISP, then they need my explicit permission before they waste the bandwidth I'm paying for with their stupid, annoying ads.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA

Re: just like anything else

You can opt out of the ads

karlmarx

join:2006-09-18
iraq
·Fairpoint Communic..

Re: just like anything else

Or, as is proposed, you can 'opt-in'. I fail to see how you get any benefit by being forced to 'opt-out', when instead, you should get a clear benefit by being allowed to 'opt-in'. It's your data, what you do with your internet connection is between YOU and the site you are connected too. I fail to see how anyone else should see that information. Granted, they have the ability to see that, but that's not what we pay the ISP money for every month. We are paying to allow our computer to connect to another computer (who is also paying an ISP). That's the limit of what we pay for.
--
The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity!
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
·AT&T Southeast

Re: just like anything else

jc1350 See Profile was concerned about wasting bandwidth on targeted ads, hence my comment that s/he can opt-out of the ads to conserve bandwidth.

The discussions for opt-in vs opt-out, value added service, "your date", and what you pay for when you procure service with an ISP are all separate debates.

Dryv1yne

@prkcorp.com

said by karlmarx See Profile :

Or, as is proposed, you can 'opt-in'. I fail to see how you get any benefit by being forced to 'opt-out', when instead, you should get a clear benefit by being allowed to 'opt-in'. It's your data, what you do with your internet connection is between YOU and the site you are connected too. I fail to see how anyone else should see that information. Granted, they have the ability to see that, but that's not what we pay the ISP money for every month. We are paying to allow our computer to connect to another computer (who is also paying an ISP). That's the limit of what we pay for.
If, as you say, the system were opt-in and I got some kind of benefit out it - say a $5 credit on my monthly ISP bill - and could clearly tell from the TOS what my data was being used for then I *MIGHT* consider letting a company like NebuAd track my browsing habits.

Frankly, this is how all such systems should work... allow the consumer to opt-in and then compensate them somehow for access to their personal info that these companies so badly desire. I suppose we can all dream... or form a lobbyist group and pay huge sums of money to our elected representatives to stand up for such common-sense legislation.

SLD
Premium
join:2002-04-17

Re: just like anything else

Pretty scary that someone would give up their privacy for a measly $5/mo.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA

Re: just like anything else

And I would expect that a vast majority of sheep consumers would gladly share their browsing info for a $5 decrease in their bill.

Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA

But not the tracking. Even if you read the fine print of your ISP's TOS to find out that you were being tracked and even if you figured out where to go to opt out of the ads, NebuAD would still be tracking every website you visited with no option for you to turn off the tracking.

It would be much better if they built an opt-in system (with rewards/incentives to get people to sign up).
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA

Re: just like anything else

That wasn't the OP's concern.
jc1350

join:2004-09-23

Re: just like anything else

Not in my post anyway. But as a whole I'm sick and tired of companies treating people's info as a commodity to sell and trade.

I know the law may differ, but in my view, just because I give company A my money in exchange for a product/service, they have no right to sell my contact info to Company B. The default action for all of these BS shenanigans should be "opt-in" with informed consent.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
·AT&T Southeast

Re: just like anything else

Unless consumers actually start reading those little "privacy statements", I wouldn't expect any public outrage sufficient enough to affect change. My philosophy is that if I have something that I don't want someone else to know, I won't share it in a public forum and I most definitely will read all ToS and privacy statements.

TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast


1 edit
said by Jason Levine See Profile :

But not the tracking. Even if you read the fine print of your ISP's TOS to find out that you were being tracked and even if you figured out where to go to opt out of the ads, NebuAD would still be tracking every website you visited with no option for you to turn off the tracking.
Even if Nebuad is totally out of business, the ISPs still have their own activity logs of every site visited. All they did was outsource that activity to Nebuad. They can do their own analysis or use another company. All the death of Nebuad will accomplish will be to TEMPORARILY remove TARGETED ads. It won't end ads and it won't end monitoring.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page
Ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?

Jason Levine
Premium
join:2001-07-13
USA

Re: just like anything else

Except that ISPs by and large don't monitor your connection. They maintain logs, sure, but they don't tally those logs to find out what sites you personally have been visiting.

I actually do think that NebuAd's death would help to keep ISPs from inserting ads into the web pages that their customers view. ISPs, generally, don't want to anger their customers and having more ads popping up simply to earn the ISP extra bucks would anger the customers.

In addition, if the ISP starts placing additional ads on webpages, the website owners might have a case against them. After all, they are using the copyrighted content of those websites for profit without the permission of the contents' owners.
--
-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar. Shooting For A Cause
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jc1350

join:2004-09-23
I shouldn't have to opt-out if I'm paying for service. They should tell me exactly what they want, then ask for my permission. And they should not enable until until they get an explicit "yes." That means no answer/reply = "no."
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA

Re: just like anything else

They do tell you exactly what they want and gain your permission each month that you pay your bill.

knightmb
Everybody Lies

join:2003-12-01
Franklin, TN
·AT&T DSL Service

said by jc1350 See Profile :

If my ISP wants to give me FREE access supported by ads, then fine. But, if I'm paying my hard-earned money to an ISP, then they need my explicit permission before they waste the bandwidth I'm paying for with their stupid, annoying ads.
I am hopeful for a time when the site in my sig will no longer be necessary.
--
Fight NebuAD and the like:
Click Here to pollute their data

TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast

said by jc1350 See Profile :

If my ISP wants to give me FREE access supported by ads, then fine. But, if I'm paying my hard-earned money to an ISP, then they need my explicit permission before they waste the bandwidth I'm paying for with their stupid, annoying ads.
The ISP will still ship ads, Nebuad or no Nebuad. All Nebuad did was allow targeted ads. The ISPs will find another way to do the same thing with another company - like Google(who is no different than Nebuad).
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page
Ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?

seagreen
Premium,Mod
join:2001-05-14
out there
·Rock Island Commun..

Host:
CenturyTel
Wireless Service P..
Southern California
HughesNet Satellite
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Re: just like anything else

said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

like Google(who is no different than Nebuad).
That's baloney. You clearly don't know how NebuAd was designed to work. Nebuad inserts a hardware device in the ISP's network to intercept communications between your computer and the website you are attempting to reach. NebuAd has conceded that its boxes utilized deep packet inspection to pull out URLs and search terms. That profile is then used deliver tailored ads.

In addition NebuAd then delivers a faked additional packet of data into the html code of the page being viewed. It's cross-site scripting and a man-in-the-middle attack. NebuAd is violating core internet protocols - data packets are altered by a device in between your computer and the site you wish to view.

TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast

Re: just like anything else

said by seagreen See Profile :

In addition NebuAd then delivers a faked additional packet of data into the html code of the page being viewed. It's cross-site scripting and a man-in-the-middle attack. NebuAd is violating core internet protocols - data packets are altered by a device in between your computer and the site you wish to view.
Who cares HOW they do it. The result is the same - all the data is collected and used to ship you targeted ads.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page
Ask yourself one question: 'Do I feel lucky?' Well, do ya punk?
viperlmw
Premium
join:2005-01-25
·Qwest.net

Re: just like anything else

said by TKJunkMail See Profile :

said by seagreen See Profile :

In addition NebuAd then delivers a faked additional packet of data into the html code of the page being viewed. It's cross-site scripting and a man-in-the-middle attack. NebuAd is violating core internet protocols - data packets are altered by a device in between your computer and the site you wish to view.
Who cares HOW they do it. The result is the same - all the data is collected and used to ship you targeted ads.
Uhh, TK, try again. There is a HUGE difference between an ISP logging your usage history and what NebuAd does. seagreen summed it up very nicely. Oh, btw, I CARE!
Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ

and now as we head for metered bandwidth, all those fancy multimedia ads will die off(hopefully, website ads with sound should be illegal). paying for CATV and seeing ads is one thing, but i dont pay more for cable if suddenly the ads are sent in HD.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports

NickD
Premium
join:2000-11-17
Princeton Junction, NJ
clubs:

1 edit

Gee I Wonder Why

Common sense is actually being used! Hooray

Advertisers wouldn't want to associate their products with this service

Dryv1yne

@prkcorp.com

Re: Gee I Wonder Why

Let's not get too ahead of ourselves. I'll only believe it when NebuAd either goes completely out of business or is forced to use opt-in.

scelli
Native New Yorker
Premium
join:1999-08-07
USA

said by NickD See Profile :

Common sense is actually being used! Hooray

Advertisers wouldn't want to associate their products with this service
I find this direct quote below from NebuAd regarding what is apparently their business model as more inciting and insulting to the average person than many a profane, tirade-laced rant viewed here at DSLR on a daily basis:

"Today, NebuAd employs about 60 employees, including many leading behavioral scientists and other advanced technology engineers. We have built a sophisticated behavioral targeting system and unique appliance technology, which provide value to the entire online advertising ecosystem. We intend to continue to develop and market our solutions."

Three words immediately come to mind: how dare they!
--
The maximum effective range of an excuse is ZERO meters!

Hazeleyze

join:2003-05-09
Wauseon, OH

Momentary Set Back

A momentary set back until they can come up with another sneaky advertising gimmick.

BabyBear
Keep wise ...with Night-Owl

join:2007-01-11

And I would have gotten away with it.....

if it weren't for you meddling kids! (and scooby!)

Got a feeling somewhere down the road the NebuAd guys will "be back". The potential profit will keep the slimeballs thinking up slimey new ways to sell off anything and everything to do with user's info.

Rogue Wolf
Is Kind Of A Big Deal In Yemen

join:2003-08-12
Troy, NY

Willy Wonka said it best....

"You LOSE! Good DAY, sir."

In other words, keep your mitts off my bits! (and bytes!)

Doctor Four
My other vehicle is a TARDIS
Premium
join:2000-09-05
Dallas, TX
·AT&T U-Verse

In the words of Nelson Muntz...

HA HA!!
scooper

join:2000-07-11
Youngsville, NC

It couldn't have happened to more deserving people.

It couldn't have happened to more deserving people.

scelli
Native New Yorker
Premium
join:1999-08-07
USA

Re: It couldn't have happened to more deserving people.

said by scooper See Profile :

It couldn't have happened to more deserving people.
Here! Here!

Let the whole bunch of 'em hang at dawn. Enough with some Madison Avenue weak-kneed, slack-jawed jellyfish of an advertising punk telling me what I want or don't want.

It's really simple regarding the latter: What I don't want is any of their nonsense.
--
The maximum effective range of an excuse is ZERO meters!

major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:

Same Shit Different Day

Echoing what some have said previously, this is but a minor setback. The NebuAD people will be back just as soon as they figure out how much $$$$$$$$ it's going to cost them to buy a few key Congre$$ional reps to approve their product. Of course, there will be the obligatory bullshit about opting out of tracking, but the reality will be lip service only.

dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast

Hmmm...

... targeted ads - as in ads for similar "things" that I cruise for daily?

Porn?
They will offer up more porn sites?
Probably sites I'm already a member at, huh? Naw, crash and burn already NebuAD!
--
Think outside the Fox... Opera

Kylemaul
Lovin' My Firefox 1.5.x
Premium
join:2001-03-30
North Port, FL
clubs:

Re: Hmmm...

LOL, the porn sites don't even need NebuAd--they have already had a similar system in place for years. Like they'd cut NebuAd in on their action.
haplo2112

join:2003-05-12
Charlton, MA

UH...GOOD...

I hope all the employee's are sleeping on the streets soon.
Forums » NebuAD Hit Hard By PR Disaster


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