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story category New ISP Offers Neutral Net
Copowi launches....
(old news - 04:00PM Monday Aug 20 2007)
tags: business · alternatives · net-neutrality
Two weeks ago a new cooperative named "Copowi" launched that bills itself as the first ISP to offer a network neutrality guarantee. The ISP insists that it's a "social enterprise" and not a traditional business. The company so far only has a few hundred customers, but insists that it will not engage in traffic shaping or other covert bandwidth management techniques.


Service is offered in twelve states, with speeds that range from 256kbps-7Mbps. The 256kbps tier is rather pricey at $33.95; the company also offers a 1.5Mbps tier for $49.95 and a 7Mbps tier for $59.95.

"The net neutrality debate has created a new market segment whose needs are not being met. Until now all this segment could do was comment, demonstrate and petition," says Chris Ellis, co-founder of Copowi. "With Copowi they can now vote with their feet," he says.

Click for full size
As an incumbent reseller, they're still going to be subject to the whims of the ILECs, so it's not clear how robust their promise can be, given they don't have full control of your packets for the entire ride.

It's also worth noting that while network neutrality is a noble premise worth pursuing, most incumbent DSL operators haven't throttled or capped connections yet. With the exception of a few instances of idiocy, they've largely been guilty of blustery rhetoric. They've been playing nice because they're afraid of regulatory action.

If the "neutrality" difference in service then is marginal, do we really think consumers will pay a premium simply to make a statement?

Also see: The Copowi FAQ, their launch press release, and additional coverage from Ars Technica and PC Magazine.

Related:
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  3. Scott Cleland: Google Using 21x The Bandwidth They Pay For
  4. Verizon's Open Development Initiative? So Far It's A Joke
  5. Google Android Not Quite So Open
  6. Obama Nominates New FCC Commissioner
  7. Getting iPhone Slingbox App To Work Over 3G
  8. Clearwire: We'll Hit 80 Markets In 18 Months
Forums » New ISP Offers Neutral Net
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Post a:

justbits
More fiber than ATT can handle
Premium
join:2003-01-08
Chicago, IL

Cowpie?

For some reason, I keep reading "Copowi" as "Cowpie".

ARGONAUT
got ping?

join:2006-01-24
New Albany, IN

Re: Cowpie?

Their red banner looks like something a proctologist would have on the wall.

MxxCon

join:1999-11-19
Brooklyn, NY
clubs:

Re: Cowpie?

communist/socialist proctologist to that

sansri88
Go digtal you analog laggards
Premium
join:2005-12-17
Iselin, NJ
clubs:

Register!

People around Woodbridge! Register! Maybe we can get this service here, have some more competition!

ninjatutle
Premium

join:2006-01-02
San Ramon, CA

Resellers can do this?

Arent they just leeching?
viperlmw
Premium
join:2005-01-25
·Qwest.net

Re: Resellers can do this?

If a Reseller has it's own bandwidth to the ATM network, resellers can do almost anything they want, except dispatch techs to work on the infrastructure.

I will go out on a limb and suggest this company is currently on the Qwest network, as I have tried several states on their page, and the Qwest states seem to work. Also, the tiers (256, 1.5M, 7M) sure look like Qwest tiers.
hottboiinnc
ME

join:2003-10-15
Toledo, OH

Re: Resellers can do this?

Verizon has a 7M tier as well.

en102
Canadian, eh?

join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
·DSL EXTREME

Re: Resellers can do this?

True, but Verizon doesn't use the 'steep' tiers that Qwest does, where the tiers are:
1. 256kbps: its a little better than dialup
2. 1.5Mbps: Decent for average person (and probably available to the majority of customers)
3. 7Mbps: For those that / need more than 1.5Mbps, and can get it.
--
Canada = Hollywood North

Siryak

join:2005-11-26

Competition,,,,

Ah...Isn't competition a beautiful thing.
axus

join:2001-06-18
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Cox HSI

Re: Competition,,,,

Heh what they say they are competing on isn't a point of competition yet. I'm sure it will be, but they're running this campaign a little early. Plus, its vs. Qwest, not like there is much challenge. I think its just the only selling point marketing could come up with.

Hopefully they will be around in a few years when it really is needed, then everyone can switch to them.

inteller
Sociopaths always win.

join:2003-12-08
Tulsa, OK

loose the communist propoganda looking ad

I'm all about net neutrality, but loose the communist looking ad campaign. there is nothing chic about communism.
--
"WHEN THE LAUGH TRACK STARTS THEN THE FUN STARTS!"

morbo
Complete Your Transaction

join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs:

Re: loose the communist propoganda looking ad

it's lose not loose.

"there is nothing chic about" spelling mistakes.

N3OGH
Bear patrol must be working like a charm
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs

Re: loose the communist propoganda looking ad

Or grammar Nazis....
Done_Posting
Shoot to kill
Premium
join:2003-08-22
Toledo, OH
·buckeye cable

Re: loose the communist propoganda looking ad

said by N3OGH See Profile :

Or grammar Nazis....
He's perfectly in the right for pointing out that someone either made a typo or doesn't know the difference between loose / lose. Whichever the case may be, it's pretty annoying for those of us with a firm grasp of the English language.

- Tate

--
Happiness is an OC-48 in your basement...
Blackened
Your Freedom Fries Are Stale

join:2003-09-29

Red Scare, Red Scare! Ahhhhhhh!!!

That damn evil Communist Pro Net Neutrality ISP. How dare they use a red banner with fingers pointed toward the air. Quick, to the batcav-- I mean to the closet to get the guns and tin foil hats!
bmn
? ? ?
Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
·Packet8

said by inteller See Profile :

there is nothing chic about communism.
Wrong communism... You mean Communism, capital C.
--
Prove it...
Save the Internet Time (NTP) service, use the pool.

inteller
Sociopaths always win.

join:2003-12-08
Tulsa, OK

1 edit

Re: loose the communist propoganda looking ad

you and morbo should get together for a spelling and grammar circle jerk.

EDIT: add tater_gunz too.

--
"WHEN THE LAUGH TRACK STARTS THEN THE FUN STARTS!"
bmn
? ? ?
Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
·Packet8

Re: loose the communist propoganda looking ad

said by inteller See Profile :

you and morbo should get together for a spelling and grammar circle jerk.
You should know the difference between communism and Communism before you talk about them that way people won't have to correct you...
--
Prove it...
Save the Internet Time (NTP) service, use the pool.

major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:

Absolutely!

If the "neutrality" difference in service then is marginal, do we really think consumers will pay a premium simply to make a statement?
I would think the Pearl Jam fiasco is proof enough already that the DeathStar and others like them are more than willing many times over to censor content that is counter to their financial best interests. AT&T and other self-appointed Internet gatekeepers are not to be trusted. Ever. Period.
--
The Toll


batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:

Neutral Net is good.

A Net-Neutrality law will bring about pay per bit broadband much like pay per killo watt electric service. I think that is the way it should be.

Of course the 5% that use 80% can't afford it but that is not my problem.

justbits
More fiber than ATT can handle
Premium
join:2003-01-08
Chicago, IL

Re: Neutral Net is good.

Pay per bit broadband will be your problem too when somebody decides to DDOS you.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL

Re: Neutral Net is good.

said by justbits See Profile :

Pay per bit broadband will be your problem too when somebody decides to DDOS you.
I don't have the ability to be attacked. Dynamic IP and all you know. I am talking about residential broadband. Commercial broadband will stay as it is.
BosstonesOwn

join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
·Comcast Formerly ..

Re: Neutral Net is good.

said by batterup See Profile :

said by justbits See Profile :

Pay per bit broadband will be your problem too when somebody decides to DDOS you.
I don't have the ability to be attacked. Dynamic IP and all you know. I am talking about residential broadband. Commercial broadband will stay as it is.
First off just because your on a dynamic ip doesn't mean you can't be ddos'ed. You really don't know much about this interweb thing do you.

And even with a new ip every time your passing on your ddos to another person who is getting hit and billed for your actions. Real responsible person you are.
--
"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!"

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL

Re: Neutral Net is good.

said by BosstonesOwn See Profile :

said by batterup See Profile :

said by justbits See Profile :

Pay per bit broadband will be your problem too when somebody decides to DDOS you.
I don't have the ability to be attacked. Dynamic IP and all you know. I am talking about residential broadband. Commercial broadband will stay as it is.
First off just because your on a dynamic ip doesn't mean you can't be ddos'ed. You really don't know much about this interweb thing do you.

And even with a new ip every time your passing on your ddos to another person who is getting hit and billed for your actions. Real responsible person you are.
What are you talking about. Do you know what a Distributed Denial of Service attack is? Are you suggesting I am stupid and don't know what my PC is doing? Do you know what you are saying?
BosstonesOwn

join:2002-12-15
Everett, MA
clubs:
·Comcast
·Comcast Formerly ..

Re: Neutral Net is good.

Yes I do. You do know that they can attack your router or pc right ? And make it report to a dynamic dns service server or even a bot net right ? You know , fun stuff like that has been around awhile , just very main stream.
--
"It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!"

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL

Re: Neutral Net is good.

said by BosstonesOwn See Profile :

Yes I do. You do know that they can attack your router or pc right ? And make it report to a dynamic dns service server or even a bot net right ? You know , fun stuff like that has been around awhile , just very main stream.
I fart in the general direction of such attacks. My PC and I are one with the force.

halfband
Premium
join:2002-06-01
Huntsville, AL
·Comcast


2 edits

pick any two

Someone posted something in another thread that went something like:
Fast
Unfiltered
Cheap
Pick any two.

Looks like this trades Higher costs for Unfiltered.

I would like to know if they are just testing the market for this or if their whole business plan revolves around it.
JSRoman
Premium
join:2005-03-10
Callahan, FL

Destined to go bankrupt.

The ISP insists that it's a "social enterprise" and not a traditional business.

Unless they own the network there is not much to this but a communist inspired logo.
--
»www.seabee.navy.mil

major marco
Res Firma Mitescere Nescit
Premium
join:2003-02-13
Stepford, CA
clubs:

Re: Destined to go bankrupt.

said by JSRoman See Profile :

Unless they own the network there is not much to this but a communist inspired logo.
Do you even know what the concept of communism is. Somehow, I seriously doubt that you or any of the other dittoheads throwing around the word do.
--
The Toll

JSRoman
Premium
join:2005-03-10
Callahan, FL


1 edit

Re: Destined to go bankrupt.

said by major marco See Profile :

said by JSRoman See Profile :

Unless they own the network there is not much to this but a communist inspired logo.
Do you even know what the concept of communism is. Somehow, I seriously doubt that you or any of the other dittoheads throwing around the word do.
The main part of my comment was they don't own the network and unless they got some deep pockets when all of sudden Qwest or whoever they are piggybacking on,jacks their rates for not managing their network and causing slowdowns, all this talk from them of "network neutrality guarantee" is just crap.

Here are some examples for you since you seem to be imagery challenged. Sorry but the logo the chose just screams out socialism/communism inspired. Notice the similarities in colors and shapes.

»www.workers.org/2005/us/fist.gif

»www.spreadshirt.com/shop.php?op=···115ca1fd

»backspace.com/notes/links/2006/0···mage.php

»www.answers.com/topic/funerali-w2-jpg

»stdensetsu.homestead.com/files/b···1941.jpg

Before I forget , I got your dittohead right here, ASSWIPE!
--
»www.seabee.navy.mil

Fox McCloud
Crazy like a fox.

join:2006-07-23

Oh boy....

just what we need a Net Neutrality network......

can you say "end of the Internet"?
bmn
? ? ?
Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
·Packet8

Re: Oh boy....

How does this spell the "end of the internet" ? It maybe unfiltered, but it doesn't mean they are going to stand around while a user sprays the internet with spam or viruses. You can do exactly what these guys are wile maintaining network security by removing the problem WHEN it appears.
--
Prove it...
Save the Internet Time (NTP) service, use the pool.

Fox McCloud
Crazy like a fox.

join:2006-07-23
·Embarq
·Sprint Mobile Broa..

Re: Oh boy....

said by bmn See Profile :

How does this spell the "end of the internet" ? It maybe unfiltered, but it doesn't mean they are going to stand around while a user sprays the internet with spam or viruses. You can do exactly what these guys are wile maintaining network security by removing the problem WHEN it appears.
in short, I'm opposed to network neutrality on any level; while it appears to be all good and fine in the beginning, it ultimately spells ruin for easy transfer of information, in the long run; only businesses and corporations benefit in the long run.

I'm sure it won't be evident, at first, but I'd be willing to be quite a bit that once it becomes widespread and starts catching on, it'll greatly GREATLY hinder the Internet.
bmn
? ? ?
Premium,ExMod 2003-06
join:2001-03-15
hiatus
·Packet8

Re: Oh boy....

said by Fox McCloud See Profile :

in short, I'm opposed to network neutrality on any level; while it appears to be all good and fine in the beginning, it ultimately spells ruin for easy transfer of information, in the long run; only businesses and corporations benefit in the long run.
I don't know about that. Net neutrality would insure that information you wish to send, be it an email or video, will be permitted to pass unhindered. Changing the current internet modus operandi to one where providers can stack the deck by charging for differential service is more likely to benefit large businesses and corporations. For example, Google and Yahoo can EASILY afford to pay the QoS extortion fees that providers will want, however, a small, independent website run by an individual or small group or a small business won't be able to pay up. Their site will be adversely affected.

I'm sure it won't be evident, at first, but I'd be willing to be quite a bit that once it becomes widespread and starts catching on, it'll greatly GREATLY hinder the Internet.
Considering the internet has been operating in a basically neutral state since its inception, I don't think the line of reasoning that it will hinder internet development is contrary to the history of the internet. The neutral nature of the internet until now has actually allowed the internet to develop as quickly as it does because it means anyone can provide contents, services and products.
--
Prove it...
Save the Internet Time (NTP) service, use the pool.

CableUser

@pacbell.net

Sounds good.

I might check out ol' "Cowpie", lol. I'll see what this ISP has to offer.

It may be a better deal than Comcast.
keyboard5684

join:2001-08-01
Youngsville, PA
·Teliax VOIP
·WestPAnet Inc.
·WestPAnet Inc. CA..
·Verizon Online DSL

There NOT doing it

But a large company certainly could. They would have to be able to guarantee that every single packet was not touched (other than routing, etc) from one end to the other. This could be done to some extreme but unless you have a presence everywhere you can only guarantee most of the network is neutral, which may be good enough.

No, I say this is a mom and pop reseller whom somehow got on here as news CANNOT live up to this claim.

MSauk
MSauk
Premium
join:2002-01-17
Sandy, UT

This site scares me

I am not sure what to think. Prices seem really good, the website is powered by Drupal and the logo looks like crapola.

Would you trust this company with your money and sign up?
--
I don't need no stinking Signature

MLou
Premium
join:2007-05-01
Madison, WI

Count me in

Just added my name to their list.

As much as I love my local Charter HSI, I'm all for competition. This should be a piece of cake to get people here in Madison, WI to sign up.

nekkidtruth
You fail at life.
Premium
join:2002-05-20
London, ON
·Rogers Hi-Speed

Ubuntu

Wow impressive. They even offer free Ubuntu installation CD's.

It would be interesting to find out if they offer technical support for either installing it, or setting up their network etc. As impressive as it is for them to offer the OS to it's customers, I'm thinking it'll only be a matter of time before they re-think that decision. The newbies will be all over them
--
Weeeeeee

netwire
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Mooresboro, NC

Overpriced much?

Their Dial-up options are a bit over priced for this day and age, heck I pay $6/mo now for dial-up.
Forums » New ISP Offers Neutral Net


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