  pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
1 recommendation |
pnh102
Premium Member
2011-Jun-20 9:47 am
FineGive people like this the moral solace and validation that they want... don't purchase their high end offerings.  Of course, there's absolutely no point in getting a high speed connection with any data cap anyway. This is just icing on the cake. | |
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1 recommendation |
talz13
Member
2011-Jun-20 10:15 am
Re: FineYep, if I find a 1gbps connection with a 5TB monthly cap for $70/month I'll pass it on by, since it would only take 11 hours to burn through that cap.
See, the other side can be taken too. (Not that I'm promoting usage caps, just that there could conceivably be a reasonable number somewhere up there, way above an unchanging 250GB) | |
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| | elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
1 recommendation |
elray
Member
2011-Jun-20 11:43 am
Re: Finesaid by talz13:Yep, if I find a 1gbps connection with a 5TB monthly cap for $70/month I'll pass it on by, since it would only take 11 hours to burn through that cap.
See, the other side can be taken too. (Not that I'm promoting usage caps, just that there could conceivably be a reasonable number somewhere up there, way above an unchanging 250GB)
Caps do change, as demonstrated by Shaw / Telus. In the US, we'll probably see AT&T remove broadband caps within two years in the face of mounting political and legal pressure - the result of their incredibly incompetent and inaccurate metering technology, not the validity of UBB. Comcast set a very high bar with 250GB; they won't want to be losing hordes of customers - no doubt, they'll raise it. ISPs do not want churn. As for the "need" for 1Gbps, there isn't, and won't ever be a justified use. But that won't stop the populists from claiming otherwise and expecting the rest of us to subsidize it. In the Pay-tv realm, 4K HD channels might be able to take down 40Mbits/each, but the internet is NOT a cable-tv-network-replacement. | |
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1 recommendation |
talz13
Member
2011-Jun-20 11:57 am
Re: Finesaid by elray:As for the "need" for 1Gbps, there isn't, and won't ever be a justified use. But that won't stop the populists from claiming otherwise and expecting the rest of us to subsidize it. In the Pay-tv realm, 4K HD channels might be able to take down 40Mbits/each, but the internet is NOT a cable-tv-network-replacement.
How can you say there will NEVER be a justified use for gigabit internet when the cloud is picking up steam and more and more complex interactions are taking place online? I sure wouldn't want to have a cloud filesystem running off of 15mbps! I had to copy several tens of gigabytes yesterday off my laptop with its 100mbps connection, and was glad when it finally completed so I could go back to using my gigabit LAN on the rest of my PCs at home. | |
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2 recommendations |
Re: Fine"How can you say there will NEVER be a justified use for gigabit internet "
There will most certainly be a need for 1Gb and even 10Gb just not today. Think about how fast 100Mbps seemed when the majority of consumers were using 28.8. Back when 28.8 was common place what would you have done with 100Mb? | |
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2 recommendations |
to elray
"Comcast set a very high bar with 250GB"
ranks right there with:
"a PC will never need more than 640k RAM" | |
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Re: Finesaid by WernerSchutz:"Comcast set a very high bar with 250GB"
ranks right there with:
"a PC will never need more than 640k RAM"
As long as you don't claim Bill Gated said that. | |
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| | |  GuspazGuspaz
MVM
join:2001-11-05
Montreal, QC
1 recommendation |
to elray
There are some justified uses for 1Gbps, but not many. I can think of some uses, such as online backup solutions, or moving data around without using sneakernet. But most use cases don't need anywhere near this level of speed, it's true. But to say that there "won't ever be a justified use" is silly, especially when there are such uses today.
I can see 3D 4K video getting into the 200-250Mbps range based on current bitrates, that's already exceeding 100Mbps, justifying higher speeds. Such a video service doesn't exist today, but it will some day.
As for your statement about "the internet is NOT a cable-tv-network-replacement", that's laughable. The internet carries information, and it enables whatever information-driven service a provider and consumer wishes to provide and consume. Your statement is just as patently ridiculous as if one were to say "The internet is NOT a mail replacement." Who are you to say that e-mail is not a perfectly valid use of the Internet? Who are you to say that subscription television is not a perfectly valid use of the Internet? | |
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Re: FineOK, for arguments sake lets assume that very few things would really require a connection that fast and very few consumers would really use a 1GB connection to its full potential. In that scenario a cable provider and their subscriber would still greatly benefit from having the fastest connection they could possibly have.
How? Well the consumer would get on the network and get the data they want in a fraction of the time it would take them to get it with a much smaller connection, thus freeing up the bandwidth for the next customer that wants some data from the network. So if a vast majority of your subscribers are not "abusers and pirates" then the vast majority (95% is it?) of the users of that cable company will have a much better experience using that connection and would be much more satisfied customers.
Even with streaming media. They can get on the network, cache the entire movie before the opening credits even start and thus their network would be sitting their practically idol for the next hour:45 while they watch the movie in a high bit rate (thus quality) version. Again, making them much more satisfied customers. | |
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| | | | | cramer
Premium Member
join:2007-04-10
Raleigh, NC Westell 6100
Cisco PIX 501
1 recommendation |
cramer
Premium Member
2011-Jun-20 6:22 pm
Re: FineExactly! My cablemodem (TW / Earthlink) is 10/1 now. A process that would take 1 hour there would take 36 seconds on a gigabit connection.
Does my office LAN need to be gigabit? No. People can get their work done even at 10Mbps -- we're only connected to the internet (and rest of the company) @ 6 anyway. The difference is everything takes an eternity to do. If I have to drop back to even 100Mbps -- switch fails and the only spare is an older 10/100 switch -- people bitch loudly, and constantly.
Honestly, gigabit "last mile" wouldn't make much of a difference at all today. Even @ 10Mbps, no one can keep it saturated 24/7. Even my 35 hour "On Demand" download only averaged 5.6Mbps. (100% legal DirecTV On Demand content, btw.) | |
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| | | duranr
join:2006-10-14
Leonia, NJ
1 recommendation |
to elray
said by elray:As for the "need" for 1Gbps, there isn't, and won't ever be a justified use. But that won't stop the populists from claiming otherwise and expecting the rest of us to subsidize it. In the Pay-tv realm, 4K HD channels might be able to take down 40Mbits/each, but the internet is NOT a cable-tv-network-replacement.
So you've looked into the future and saw that we all have Gigabit Internet and there were no applications at all that required or even benefited from it? You have very Myopic views of the progression of Technology. If you look at the current progress made, Much of the web as it is today, would not exist or even be possible if we were still using the 56k Modems from over a decade ago. Services such as Steam and iTunes Store would not be feasible today were it not for broadband of some sort. Peripheral Technology such WiFi likely would not exist, etc. The point is, we won't know what is possible with that kind of speed until someone offers it and makes it broadly available (and affordable). Please don't presume that just because you don't have a need for something, that no else does and therefore it should not exist. | |
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| | | | cramer
Premium Member
join:2007-04-10
Raleigh, NC Westell 6100
Cisco PIX 501
1 recommendation |
cramer
Premium Member
2011-Jun-21 3:47 pm
Re: FineTo be fair, there was internet distribution of applications in the modem days. We wrote much smaller, simpler, and efficient programs back then... every bit and cpu clock cycle was important. (also because no one liked having a 10 floppy disk set for a single game.) Today, bloat and inefficiency are the norms because there's no pressure to be frugal, and optimizations take time. High speed networks, 50G blue-rays, TB hard drives, GHz cpus... nobody notices when you waste a great deal of it. | |
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| | | | elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA
1 recommendation |
to duranr
said by duranr:So you've looked into the future and saw that we all have Gigabit Internet and there were no applications at all that required or even benefited from it? I've looked into the future for a very long time - and I don't see where anyone "needs" said bandwidth in the home. Wants, sure. But not "needs". Streaming video, online backup, Voip, etc, are wants, not needs. said by duranr:You have very Myopic views of the progression of Technology. Not at all. I'm looking at cost/benefit, where the populists here continue to want ME to pay a higher basic rate (backdoor tax) to support THEIR uses. said by duranr:If you look at the current progress made, Much of the web as it is today, would not exist or even be possible if we were still using the 56k Modems from over a decade ago. Services such as Steam and iTunes Store would not be feasible today were it not for broadband of some sort. Peripheral Technology such WiFi likely would not exist, etc.
The point is, we won't know what is possible with that kind of speed until someone offers it and makes it broadly available (and affordable). That's a nice theory, but I don't see anything on the web today that constitutes "progress" - Steam and the iPhone Store? You're kidding, right? said by duranr:Please don't presume that just because you don't have a need for something, that no else does and therefore it should not exist.
Please don't presume that just because you have a want for something, that the rest of us should subsidize it. | |
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4 recommendations |
to pnh102
You know what's really strange? The only use I see for the sort of upper executive pay we see in corporations right now are for criminally involved activities. (drugs, prostitutes, bribes) | |
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Re: Finesaid by Angrychair:You know what's really strange? The only use I see for the sort of upper executive pay we see in corporations right now are for criminally involved activities. (drugs, prostitutes, bribes)
Here here. Corporate Executive pay has risen 28% since 2008, while median pay has risen 1% in the same time frame. The very same people who caused the economic crisis are still profiting, when they should be barred from ever working an executive job ever again, or perhaps even living in a cozy little jail cell. | |
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to Angrychair
said by Angrychair:You know what's really strange? The only use I see for the sort of upper executive pay we see in corporations right now are for criminally involved activities. (drugs, prostitutes, bribes)
^^2nd^^ with extra !!!!!'s | |
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| Draytek Vigor2860Vac
EnGenius EAP600
Obihai OBi100
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to pnh102
I use filesharing quite a bit, and have come to the conclusion that as long as caps are in place, there really is no point in having a fast connection for unattended downloads. I don't care if it takes 3 minutes or 30 minutes to download an MKV file that I am not watching in real-time. | |
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It's not the only useBut it will probably be a major use for it. Bit Torrent currently makes up a large share of internet traffic, and even full quality HD streaming doesn't take more than a few Mbps. As for 10GBps, among the people I've talked to, I've only heard of one place so far having a real need for 10 Gig Ethernet in their environment. That's not to say that in the future we wouldn't need it but right now I think that maybe we need to make broadband more reliable and getting better speeds for all instead of getting faster speed tiers for a select few. | |
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| nitzan
Premium Member
join:2008-02-27 |
nitzan
Premium Member
2011-Jun-20 10:14 am
Re: It's not the only usesaid by fifty nine:Bit Torrent currently makes up a large share of internet traffic, and even full quality HD streaming doesn't take more than a few Mbps. Maybe today. But what about next year? what about in 5 years? 10 years? higher speeds are like roads - current roads can only safely support cars driving at around 65-100 MPH so most cars are built to support that and no passenger cars are built to support 700 MPH because it won't be able to travel on any road at that speed anyway. Same with applications- if there aren't any pipes larger than 3 Mbps then all applications will be built assuming 3Mpbs as the upper limit of what they can use. But if you increased capacity to 1GBps then all of a sudden you'll see applications pop up which require tens of Mbps to operate, and later hundreds of Mbps. HD movie streaming, later 3D and other technology streaming - there'll be plenty of applications that break the current pipes - as soon as capacity is increased so will those applications. As far as the executive who said that- if he was my employee I'd fire him for lack of vision. | |
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Re: It's not the only usesaid by nitzan:said by fifty nine:Bit Torrent currently makes up a large share of internet traffic, and even full quality HD streaming doesn't take more than a few Mbps. Maybe today. But what about next year? what about in 5 years? 10 years? higher speeds are like roads - current roads can only safely support cars driving at around 65-100 MPH so most cars are built to support that and no passenger cars are built to support 700 MPH because it won't be able to travel on any road at that speed anyway. Same with applications- if there aren't any pipes larger than 3 Mbps then all applications will be built assuming 3Mpbs as the upper limit of what they can use. But if you increased capacity to 1GBps then all of a sudden you'll see applications pop up which require tens of Mbps to operate, and later hundreds of Mbps. HD movie streaming, later 3D and other technology streaming - there'll be plenty of applications that break the current pipes - as soon as capacity is increased so will those applications. The amount of bandwidth for streaming is actually going down due to better compression. I do agree that there will be apps later on, and we should push to 1Gbps and beyond, regardless of what the application could be. As far as the executive who said that- if he was my employee I'd fire him for lack of vision.
But your business isn't reselling real time entertainment, afaik. The comment was completely appropriate in context. Cable operators always need to please their programming suppliers or risk losing the core of their business. That's not to say that it wouldn't make people angry that he'd say such a thing, but he has to protect his company's interests. | |
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1 recommendation |
Re: It's not the only useThe programming suppliers need the cable companies just as much as the cable companies need the programming suppliers. They are completely dependent on each other right now and will be as long as they continue to milk us consumers.
I use the work milk, because the programming suppliers can choose to take their content online as well and distribute it themselves or through a company like netflix. Reason they won't do that anytime soon.... is because right now they can force bundles and inflate their prices because they are able to hide their inferior content behind that and their good stuff people actually want from them. | |
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to fifty nine
Lets see, how about online backup? With 1Gbps, you wouldn't have to wait hours on end to do a backup of your files which could be several GB's of data.
How about for hosting a few gaming servers, like for Source games? Some of the paid servers can get expensive so why not use your bandwidth.
How about better HD streaming that has less video artifacts? Maybe like Bluray quality bandwidth, around 40Mbps.
How about real-time remote gaming through a virtual gaming console? Sort of like a Remote Desktop Connection. Possibility...
What about hosting a FTP server?
Just a few I thought of off the top of my head.
Also look at how many technologies and services that have popped up since the advent of broadband service. To make a statement that people do not need it just shows lack of foresight. | |
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1 recommendation |
Re: It's not the only useBlu-ray Disc does not need 40Mbps. It needs maybe 12-20Mbps if that much. Compression is getting better all the time, so that number may actually drop.
Hosting servers isn't what a residential connection is for. If "hosting servers" is what you want a lot of bandwidth on a residential connection then that's a non-starter.
That's not to say a 1Gbps connection won't be useful, but I believe that the assessment that it will be used for piracy today is correct. | |
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1 recommendation |
Re: It's not the only useHosting severs isnt what a residential connection is for? Are you kidding? Who are you to say what a person does with their bandwidth. You sound like the cable execs. Bluray bandwidth quote:
What is the quality of Blu-ray Disc video?
Blu-ray Disc offers HDTV video quality that far surpasses any other medium or broadcast format available today. With High Definition video with a resolution of up to 1920x1080 and up to a [u]54 Mbit/sec[/u] bandwidth (roughly double that of a normal HDTV broadcast), no other format can match Blu-ray Disc's video quality.
» www.blu-raydisc.com/en/T ··· deo.aspxYou can only compress things to a point before the video quality starts to degrade. Compression is only in place because the bandwidth to support better video isn't there yet for most. | |
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| | | | BlueC
join:2009-11-26
Minneapolis, MN |
BlueC
Member
2011-Jun-20 12:31 pm
Re: It's not the only useThe server thing is a valid argument. With the exception of personal server use (FTP, etc).
Anyone running servers utilizing high bandwidth is more than likely doing it for a profit, thus requiring commercial internet service.
Otherwise businesses would just grab a cheap residential connection for use, since it costs considerably less.
Blu-ray rips are around 5-10mbps for the bitrate, from my experience. The compression doesn't make things all that bad either. You could reasonably stream a blu-ray movie (with the proper compression) at under 10mbps. | |
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| | | | | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO |
Re: It's not the only useMy kids host game servers. Their friends connect for free. I assue you, there's no profit in it. My 1Mbps upstream can support about 10 friends. I'm sure they'd love to get more freinds connected if we had more upstream. They also use video conferencing and again, I'm sure they'd love to get more folks on at the same time if the upstream supported it. It's hard to make broad statements like this which is why most of us believe the cable guy who said this is out of touch. The real question isn't need but whether or not any company can simultaneously provide 1Gbps for a reasonable percentage of their customers. A year ago my company spoke with Charter about business service for our office. I asked Charter about their capacity and whether or not they prioritize business traffic. This was their response (again, a year ago):
... Our Internet drains are: MO: Qwest 10Gbps, XO 10Gbps, IL: Qwest 10Gbps, Level3 2.5Gbps... ...We currently do not prioritize business traffic over residential traffic because we have plenty of Internet bandwidth for all our customers...
If this is typical of a large residential cable plant, I don't think it's feasible to serve many simultaneous 1Gbps connections without significant investment in beefing up their Internet "drains". | |
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to sandman_1
said by sandman_1:Hosting severs isnt what a residential connection is for? Are you kidding? Who are you to say what a person does with their bandwidth. You sound like the cable execs. The person who writes the TOS of your residential connection says what you can do with your bandwidth. And they say that the residential connections they sell is not for running servers. This is unlikely to change. There are connections that allow you to run servers. These are called business class connections. Bluray bandwidth quote:
What is the quality of Blu-ray Disc video?
Blu-ray Disc offers HDTV video quality that far surpasses any other medium or broadcast format available today. With High Definition video with a resolution of up to 1920x1080 and up to a [u]54 Mbit/sec[/u] bandwidth (roughly double that of a normal HDTV broadcast), no other format can match Blu-ray Disc's video quality.
» www.blu-raydisc.com/en/T ··· deo.aspxYou can only compress things to a point before the video quality starts to degrade. Compression is only in place because the bandwidth to support better video isn't there yet for most. Compression is there to more efficiently use resources. Beyond 20Mbps with current codecs you are at the point of diminishing returns. Running bitrates as high as 54Mbps will be indistinguishable from 20Mbps. Future codecs will actually decrease bandwidth requirements. | |
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Re: It's not the only useReally? Where does it say that? » help.twcable.com/html/tw ··· aup.htmlPlease show me where it says I can't. Like I said, you can only compress something so much before you either can't compress it further or the video starts to degrade. And you make claims yet show nothing to support them. | |
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kjhbjkbkhb
Anon
2011-Jun-20 2:14 pm
Re: It's not the only useThe ISP Service may not be used to engage in any conduct that interferes with Operator's ability to provide service to others, including the use of excessive bandwidth. | |
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Re: It's not the only useRight, which I am not doing. And it doesn't specify "server". If I was actually running a business off of my line, then I could see your point. But servicing just a few family and friends over FTP or through a game server is hardly interfering with the "Operators ability to provide service to others". | |
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| | | | | | | |  rebus9
join:2002-03-26
Tampa Bay |
rebus9
Member
2011-Jun-20 9:46 pm
Re: It's not the only usesaid by sandman_1:But servicing just a few family and friends over FTP or through a game server is hardly interfering with the "Operators ability to provide service to others". Right. And even at that, business broadband is delivered over the same infrastructure as residential. So if business class circuits can safely run servers, so can residential. Making biz class mandatory to run a server from your living room is just a way of extracting a few extra dollars from you. | |
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to fifty nine
said by fifty nine:said by sandman_1:Hosting severs isnt what a residential connection is for? Are you kidding? Who are you to say what a person does with their bandwidth. You sound like the cable execs. The person who writes the TOS of your residential connection says what you can do with your bandwidth. And they say that the residential connections they sell is not for running servers. This is unlikely to change. There are connections that allow you to run servers. These are called business class connections. Bluray bandwidth quote:
What is the quality of Blu-ray Disc video?
Blu-ray Disc offers HDTV video quality that far surpasses any other medium or broadcast format available today. With High Definition video with a resolution of up to 1920x1080 and up to a [u]54 Mbit/sec[/u] bandwidth (roughly double that of a normal HDTV broadcast), no other format can match Blu-ray Disc's video quality.
» www.blu-raydisc.com/en/T ··· deo.aspxYou can only compress things to a point before the video quality starts to degrade. Compression is only in place because the bandwidth to support better video isn't there yet for most. Compression is there to more efficiently use resources. Beyond 20Mbps with current codecs you are at the point of diminishing returns. Running bitrates as high as 54Mbps will be indistinguishable from 20Mbps. Future codecs will actually decrease bandwidth requirements. That TOS was written in a time when bandwidth was actually expensive. If you have fiber to the home bandwidth is virtually unlimited, and transit and backbone costs are exponentially deflating at 35% a year. If we had a true competitive market ISP's would be falling over themselves to eliminate restrictions and offer more services, including hosting your own server. | |
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to fifty nine
I have FTTH residential account with static IP and I am running 6 servers off of it and my ISP dont give a crap about it. I am even in US. | |
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| | | rebus9
join:2002-03-26
Tampa Bay
1 recommendation |
to fifty nine
said by fifty nine:Hosting servers isn't what a residential connection is for. If "hosting servers" is what you want a lot of bandwidth on a residential connection then that's a non-starter. Wrong. Microsoft already sells the consumer-oriented Windows Home Server. One of its features is sharing files and media with friends/family outside the home. Anyone running a remotely accessible security system to watch the home while at work is technically "running a server". Fast forward a few years. New "green" homes will have remote-controlled appliances, environmental controls, security systems, etc. Maybe even a remotely controlled pet management system to dispense food/water, or open a door and spool out the leash to let Fido go potty while you're away. One day we'll cluster our video game consoles together for interactive multi-player action without having to channel everything through a gaming server. That would make your console technically a server. And that media player where you dump all your digial pics and vids? Models already exist to share media with friends/family online. That makes it a server. The idea of "no servers on a residential connection" is soooo 20th century. said by fifty nine:That's not to say a 1Gbps connection won't be useful, but I believe that the assessment that it will be used for piracy today is correct. That it will be used for piracy is correct in some cases. That it means anyone buying Gigabit service is a pirate is misguided. I telecommute 100% of the time. As part of my job, I routinely build updated OS images (patched, customized, with apps pre-installed) and transfer them to staging servers at the datacenter. Even the double-digit Mbps upload speed of my FIOS connection is beginning to feel slow because the images keep getting larger. A 1 Gbps connection would cut a 15 minute upload time down to about 30 seconds. I also agree with the off-site backup use. I do regular backups of my PC and store to a portable USB disk. A full backup, compressed, is around 700 GB and would take nearly 3 days uploading 24x7 over FIOS. Doable, but horribly impractical. A 1 Gbps connection would transfer that in under 2 hours; perfect for running backups overnight. There are plenty of legitimate uses for 1 Gbps right now in 2011. High speed is not just for pirates and cyber-criminals. | |
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| | | |  BoogeymanDrive it like you stole it
Premium Member
join:2002-12-17
Wasilla, AK |
Re: It's not the only useAnd thats just for single user usage. I'm taking care of my father right now and when he is streaming his MLB.tv game, I cant stream or even play a game online without it lagging out. I have a friend that just bought his wife and son thier own PS3's so we could all play online together, but we're not sure if his connection can handle that many gaming sessions. He already has problems when we try to game and his wife wants to watch Netflix. Hell, when I upload pics to Dropbox for my wife back home it causes the video stream to stutter/buffer.
Sure, 10/1 might be adequate for your average single user scenarios, but many of us have multiple users in the house that may all want to use high bandwidth applications at the same time. | |
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| | flbas1
join:2010-02-03
Fort Lauderdale, FL |
to sandman_1
OS service packs. they can be large, and you can multiply that by the number of pc's in the family + work laptops
better telecommuting speeds. | |
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to sandman_1
Not just several GB's. Several terabytes. In a few years 10 TB HDDs will be common place. | |
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| |  dvd536as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium Member
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ |
to sandman_1
said by sandman_1:Lets see, how about online backup? With 1Gbps, you wouldn't have to wait hours on end to do a backup of your files which could be several GB's of data. Problem there is the backup companies e.g. carbonite, throttle your uploading so its a moot point! | |
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| rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO |
to fifty nine
What about IP-based disk? Granted, this isn't the sort of thing that anyone will want to do over a WAN but the assertion is pretty broad. | |
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to fifty nine
said by fifty nine:But it will probably be a major use for it.
Bit Torrent currently makes up a large share of internet traffic, and even full quality HD streaming doesn't take more than a few Mbps.
As for 10GBps, among the people I've talked to, I've only heard of one place so far having a real need for 10 Gig Ethernet in their environment. That's not to say that in the future we wouldn't need it but right now I think that maybe we need to make broadband more reliable and getting better speeds for all instead of getting faster speed tiers for a select few.
P2P has been steadily decreasing as a % of overall internet traffic for several years. | |
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|  tubbynetreminds me of the danse russe
MVM
join:2008-01-16
Gilbert, AZ |
to fifty nine
said by fifty nine:As for 10GBps, among the people I've talked to, I've only heard of one place so far having a real need for 10 Gig Ethernet in their environment. are you referring to lan or wan technology? not to start a war here, just that the two are drastically different (as i'm sure you're aware of, given your posts in regards to network technology). this is just an explanation of the differentiation of the two. however, there are quite a few areas that require 10gbe as a lan interconnect medium, especially when looking at server oversubscription in a datacenter environment. additionally, there are latency advantages to running 10gbe hardware for mission critical and 'near real time' applications. q. | |
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88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness |
88615298 (banned)
Member
2011-Jun-20 9:52 am
SENIOR level exec"I just don’t see any other application for that other than piracy,"
The guys grandad probably said "I don't see any use for these horseless carriages other than criminality" | |
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herpdaderp
Anon
2011-Jun-20 10:00 am
If you put it that way...the 5GB cap a month on internet is fine because we only need to check our email. I mean that's all the internet has to offer, isn't it? They(ISPs) have been trying to teach us for years we've been using the internet wrong, maybe they were right all this time. we shouldn't be using it for connecting devices from computers to refrigerators. I mean if we stopped watching videos on Netflix ISPs wouldn't have to worry about their crippling network infrastructure and actually have to upgrade to keep up with demand. If we just used the internet for what we were supposed to use it for(email) we wouldn't have any worries. No caps, no peak-traffic times, no overage charges. What a world it would be. | |
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We need 1 Gbps NOW1 Gbps would be excellent for business applications. One of my clients has a single T1 feeding 100 employees internet access. The most they can upgrade to is 22/3 Charter. Much faster than what they have, but still pathetic split among 100 people. The biggest issue they are having now is it's 5-6x faster to make the 45 minute drive with the files that need to go to the print company than it is to upload them. A 1GB line at both locations for a few hundred a month would be a godsend. | |
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Total failure.If a Cable Exec cant think of any uses for a 1Gbps line then that explains a whole lot about Cable Exec's.
Way to think outside the box there Mr. Exec but I fear we already knew the limits of your imagination taking in to account the 250Gb cap. | |
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owensdj
Member
2011-Jun-20 10:21 am
Dial UpI'm sure the dial-up Internet Service Providers said the same thing about broadband in the 90's. Obviously there aren't any applications yet for 1Gbps because almost nobody has that or anything close to it. We didn't have YouTube during the dial-up modem days either.
If everyone had 1Gbps or faster Internet I could see whole new industries springing up around it. | |
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jdofaz
Anon
2011-Jun-20 2:29 pm
Re: Dial UpI don't think anyone ever thought dialup was fast. It just got more tolerable as faster modems came out | |
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What about gaming?I just downloaded 40GBs of files for a legal game I bought off Steam. Would have been nice to play it the same night instead of downloading at a sustained 1Mbs and waiting until I got off work the next day to play it. Would have been nice to stream Netflicks at the same time..... | |
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28619103 (banned)
Member
2011-Jun-20 10:56 am
So much for off-the-record "(I’m not identifying him because the conversation was not a formal interview, and he wasn’t expecting to be quoted.)"
Not the greatest reporting ethics... | |
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| 88615298 (banned)
join:2004-07-28
West Tenness |
88615298 (banned)
Member
2011-Jun-20 11:00 am
Re: So much for off-the-recordsaid by 28619103: "(I’m not identifying him because the conversation was not a formal interview, and he wasn’t expecting to be quoted.)"
Not the greatest reporting ethics...
Did he give the name? Nope. | |
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ZeddicusToo
Anon
2011-Jun-20 10:57 am
Those who can,do; those who can't... accuse their customers of piracy. | |
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sparc
Member
2011-Jun-20 11:08 am
the guy isn't wrong....There's no content that really takes advantage of this kind of speed except for piracy. The present uses for this kind of speed at the regular consumer level is very limited. It's not like cable executive was in an interview commenting on the future of the internet. It was an informal non-interview comment.
Verizon may be adding tiers, but speed is more marketing than real world utility. I doubt consumers are signing up in droves for these high speed services. It's just become cheaper for Verizon to offer these speeds and create marketing that says they are the best. | |
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skit
Anon
2011-Jun-20 11:10 am
1 Gbps line is piracy?And a sports car is for speeding only? | |
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anon6
Anon
2011-Jun-20 11:48 am
uploadWhat is the upload speed? | |
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me1212
join:2008-11-20
Lees Summit, MO  ·Google Fiber
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me1212
Member
2011-Jun-20 11:51 am
There will be more uses dude.We didnt have youtube when we had dial up. and we didnt have HD or 3D youtube for a while after broadband was introduced ether. 7,680×4,320 video will take up more bandwidth than 1080p, especially in 3D, and maybe even hologram(CNN used holograms in on 2008 when Obama won the Presidency) and you know in time Games will catch up and use the same tech and more processes which will require more bandwidth. HD video phones/chat will be used more. Uber speed may not be needed now but it will be sooner than we think. | |
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Wilsdom
Member
2011-Jun-20 12:18 pm
MonopolistNo doubt the exec also makes money producing TV shows and movies. A real ISP executive would be excited about a better internet product for its own sake. | |
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 DaveDudeNo Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey |
its the netflixThe possibility of downloading a entire movie in less a minutes, scares the cable overloads. Hence the need to totally break up the bells into wiring centers. | |
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| rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO |
Re: its the netflixI don't think it's the less than a minute that scares them. I think they are already plenty scared. I have a 12Mbps connection with Charter and I rent a few HD movies per month on my Apple TV device. It only takes about 60 seconds to buffer enough movie before it starts playing. So far, it plays without hiccups all the way to the end. Sure, it's still downloading while I'm watching it but it always stays ahead of my current viewing position. With this kind of experience, who cares whether it comes down in less than a minute or 30 minutes. I've never tried it but I probably cannot randomly access content until it's finished downloading. So far random access isn't something I typically want when I rent a movie that I have not seen. I usually watch it from beginning to end and then I'm done. | |
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Re: its the netflixsaid by rradina:I don't think it's the less than a minute that scares them. I think they are already plenty scared. I have a 12Mbps connection with Charter and I rent a few HD movies per month on my Apple TV device. It only takes about 60 seconds to buffer enough movie before it starts playing. So far, it plays without hiccups all the way to the end. Sure, it's still downloading while I'm watching it but it always stays ahead of my current viewing position. With this kind of experience, who cares whether it comes down in less than a minute or 30 minutes. I've never tried it but I probably cannot randomly access content until it's finished downloading. So far random access isn't something I typically want when I rent a movie that I have not seen. I usually watch it from beginning to end and then I'm done.
This is unrelated but compression on those HD movies suck, just like with Netflix and Google. Those guys could easily double the bandwidth allocated to their streams, since bandwidth is so cheap for them (Netflix has repeatedly stated bandwidth is the cheapest cost of their business), but they can't upset the incumbent duopoly ISPs who have an iron grip on our politicians. | |
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 IowaCowboyLost in the Supermarket
Premium Member
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA |
No need for anything over 50 mbpsThe only legitimate use for 1gbps is for a medium to large business connection. My Comcast 12/3 connection is more than sufficient for normal residential use. 1 gbps is like having 20 phone lines or a pbx phone system for a family of four. | |
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|  danclan
join:2005-11-01
Midlothian, VA |
Re: No need for anything over 50 mbpssaid by IowaCowboy:The only legitimate use for 1gbps is for a medium to large business connection. My Comcast 12/3 connection is more than sufficient for normal residential use. 1 gbps is like having 20 phone lines or a pbx phone system for a family of four.
really....check your math...a 1gbps can support 20+K phone conversations...at once.. HD video streams consume with mpg4 ~4-6mps per stream, for mpeg2 it takes ~15mbps per stream, so you and your family would get 90% of 1 mpeg2 stream and no other use out of your connection till they stopped watching the movie.... with my 1gbps connection I and everyone in my house can each watch any type of HD feed we want and continue to surf and send/receive emails with no issues. I can self host the families web sit. I can do in essence whatever I want with no fear that I will impinge on anothers use. This "1gbps is only for illegitimate use" is a straw man argument and FUD and no basis in reality given the decrease in BT use and significant increase in legitimate streaming from the likes of Netflix and others. | |
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 michieru
Premium Member
join:2009-07-25
Denver, CO |
michieru
Premium Member
2011-Jun-20 2:34 pm
.The majority of people on here say "online backup" or "streaming video". Both very high demanding bandwidth applications, but what about the rest of the world that doesn't watch tv online, or have online backups and instead actual storage drives?
The only real reasons I can see for such connections is really multiple users on the same connection at once, that's the only other reason why a faster connection should be needed.
You want to stream and buy blue ray movies online? Then pay for the connection for it, nobody around here is going to give away a free lunch and neither is the cable and telco providers.
A for profit company will always increase the price of a service, as long as customers are willing to pay for that service, it's the same with gas, with the cost of fuel increasing has anyone really drove less? I sure haven't as much as I want to gripe about it.
If you simply cannot afford a faster connection at the price the company is offering then go pound sand, I want many things in life that I cannot afford at the moment or probably would never be able to afford. Blue ray is just HD, big freaking deal. Just like 3DTV is just another joke, but if you really want it, the provider sells it you for a price.
A standard 1.5mbps connection is good enough for a single user who does 99% of things online including netflix, download music off amazon or itunes, and watching youtube. | |
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The FCC didnt help us, it helped them...IF only the FCC would not have set those low standards for defining broadband ( 4mbps down and 1 mbps up) quotes like this may have never been said. I wish someone smart enough at the FCC would have said.... "hey, whats the average speed of a computers NIC built on-board or via a card 10/100 or 10/100/1000. So lets set 10mbps bidirectionally as the base definition of broadband." That would have been a smart idea! | |
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Get the numbersDoes anyone have or know the return on investment numbers for the present infrastructure? I sure hope I live long enough to see what happens to the present infrastructure after the 1 G bps infrastructure becomes common place. I also hope that our generations leave open the 1 G bps option for future generations. I do thank the previous generations for freeing us from the agony of dial up. | |
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