Powell, Wyoming: Population 5,500, Gets FiberSmall town FTTH project finally goes live... ( old news - 09:09AM Wednesday Jan 21 2009) tags: Fiber · competition · business · alternatives · cable · municipal · Bresnan OnlineWe've previously mentioned how the small town of Powell, Wyoming hopes to see an economic resurgence through the building of a $4.9 million fiber network through a public-private partnership with little to no taxpayer risk. The project broke ground back in May, and local Broadband Reports user koolkid1563  has been tracking the progress of the project. Last week, splicing and testing were completed on 11 of the 13 Powellink zones set to receive the service. It looks like they're starting rather slowly, offering customers a 10Mbps/5Mbps tier, which according to their pricing sheet is available for $42.45 standalone, $39.95 when bundled with voice or TV, or $35.95 when bundled with both VoIP and TV service. koolkid1563 snapped a few pictures of his ONT, says the installation was painless, and notes that the service doesn't require a long-term contract. The user notes that the local cable competitor is Bresnan Communications. Like other cable operators facing FTTH competition who haven't upgraded to DOCSIS 3.0, Bresnan is highlighting in advertisements how they've been using fiber since 2003, in the hopes that users can't differentiate between core and last mile network fiber.
Related:- Clarksville Fiber Rolls On
- Seattle Still Considering FTTH Network
- Utopia Hits 100Mbps
- Pittsburgh City Council Approves FiOS Franchise
- Powell Completes FTTH Build
- What Network Neutrality Is REALLY About
- Who Knew? Home-Rolled Fiber Lowers Cable Rates
- TDS Telecom Launches 50 Mbps Fiber
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Matt
Gone playing Dragon Age Origins
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC | 3, 2, 1 ..... And here come the Anti-Muni trolls!
Regardless, good luck with this project and I sincerely hope for its success! | |
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JasonOD
@comcast.net | Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business? | |
| | | ISurfTooMuch
join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL | Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... Then should a town not launch a public transit system because it might take business from taxicabs? | |
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ayn3090
@rr.com
 from:
fiberguy
jazzy_
| Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... government shouldn't be involved in transportation, nor education. | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Absolutely, especially when they're nothing but sue happy roadblocks to progress. | |
| | | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH
| What I think these need to be doing is facilitating competition without bringing physical competition. The governmenet/private funded fiber should be build but no access provided directly by any government agency. Instead they should allow any company who wishes to pay a fee/per X customers for maintenance & bandwidth but allow any company who wants to do so. That will provide the customers a choice of any X provider they wish to go with and without one or two large companies dominating a region with their own infrastructure and preventing other companies from competing in a given region.
Why cant they do that?
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- "Techie" Jim | |
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Matt
Gone playing Dragon Age Origins
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
 ·North State Commun..
| Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... said by jimbo2150 :What I think these need to be doing is facilitating competition without bringing physical competition. The governmenet/private funded fiber should be build but no access provided directly by any government agency. Instead they should allow any company who wishes to pay a fee/per X customers for maintenance & bandwidth but allow any company who wants to do so. That will provide the customers a choice of any X provider they wish to go with and without one or two large companies dominating a region with their own infrastructure and preventing other companies from competing in a given region. Why cant they do that? You just described UTOPIA.
The problem with this model, is the Comcasts, AT&Ts, and Time Warners of the world don't have exclusive access to your eyes, ears, and wallet, so they don't like this idea. | |
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wifi4milez
Big Russ, 1918 to 2008. Rest in Peace
join:2004-08-07
New York, NY
 ·Verizon FIOS
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
 ·RoadRunner Cable
 ·BroadVoice
| Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... said by Matt :said by jimbo2150 :What I think these need to be doing is facilitating competition without bringing physical competition. The governmenet/private funded fiber should be build but no access provided directly by any government agency. Instead they should allow any company who wishes to pay a fee/per X customers for maintenance & bandwidth but allow any company who wants to do so. That will provide the customers a choice of any X provider they wish to go with and without one or two large companies dominating a region with their own infrastructure and preventing other companies from competing in a given region. Why cant they do that? You just described UTOPIA. The problem with this model, is the Comcasts, AT&Ts, and Time Warners of the world don't have exclusive access to your eyes, ears, and wallet, so they don't like this idea. The other problem is that Utopia was a money pit, and thats why it failed. Since it was basically managed by a municipality that had no idea what they were doing, they blew through the allocated money with no real planning. A private company on the other hand, is typically more inclined to watch their bottom line since (without these outrageous bailouts!) going out of business is the end of the line.
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Комитет государственной безопасности
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| | | | | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH
| said by Matt :You just described UTOPIA. I know, I have been following the project. It was done incorrectly (I agree with wifi4milez ), but I think it can be done correctly and with government and business involved. But I think that we need to kick the businesses in the pants because:
said by Matt :The problem with this model, is the Comcasts, AT&Ts, and Time Warners of the world don't have exclusive access to your eyes, ears, and wallet, so they don't like this idea. Oh boo-hoo :P
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- "Techie" Jim | |
| | | | ISurfTooMuch
join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL
| One way to do this would be to build a network and connect every residence and business at no charge. That connection would get you access to local government Web sites (offering extensive e-services), video access to local public access channels, and telephone access to 911 and local government offices. That's it. For a small fee, you could get access to anything on the local fiber network, and, if you wanted TV, Internet, and phone service, you could contract with any provider who has connected to the network. | |
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Matt
Gone playing Dragon Age Origins
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
1 edit | said by JasonOD :
Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business?
If the local company isn't providing an adequate service and refuses to, absolutely. | |
| | | whosmatt
join:2005-02-28
Raleigh, NC | Why would this put a local company out of business? | |
| | | nasadude
join:2001-10-05
Rockville, MD
·Comcast
| said by JasonOD :
Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business?
comcast, ATT and time-warner are local companies? Just poor, struggling, small footprint local companies? | |
| | | 
NetAdmin
CCNA
join:2008-05-22
| said by JasonOD :
Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business? Okay, I'll bite. First, from the article:
The user notes that the local cable competitor is Bresnan Communications. Doing a bit of digging on Bresnan's site yields:
Today, Bresnan Communications operates in Colorado, Montana, Wyoming and Utah. and
Corporate Headquarters
Bresnan Communications
One Manhattanville Road
Purchase, NY 10577-2596
914.641.3300
Bresnan isn't a local company, they are headquartered in New York,. The community is better off running its own network to keep the money local.
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"This is a bus. You know how big a bus is?" | |
| | | JazzJRabbit
join:2003-09-27
Wheaton, IL
·WOW Internet and C..
| said by JasonOD :
Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business?
If municipality can provide better service for lesser price without using any taxpayer money it means that it's more efficient than local companies. So hell yes it should. | |
| | | 
Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
·Qwest.net
| said by JasonOD :
Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business?
Local Company!? Bresnan Communications is a owned lock stock and barrel by Comcast. So it is rather the reverse
it is the local David taking on Goliath.
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I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's.
- Mark Twain in Eruption | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
| said by JasonOD :
Ok Matt, I'll bite. Is it really a good ting to have municipalities put local companies out of business? Do many municipalities of 5500 have local broadband providers that would be put out of business? Yeah, I didn't think so either. | |
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dcurrey
Premium
join:2004-06-29
·ViaTalk
| One thing I know for sure is about 10 years ago our city tried to run its own cable company. More or less FTTN type deal don't know why they just didn't do FTTH. But no matter cost the city Millions to build and maintain. Had to sell it at a major loss to Cinci Bell. It about bankrupted the city.
Only good that came from it was it lowered Time Warners rates to match the cities. Since it was sold off to Cincinnati Bell they have been forced to be competitive.
The prices they are charging are roughly what we pay. Internet speeds are a hell off a lot faster with them however.
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Any unauthorized use of your own judgment is strictly prohibited. | |
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dcplaya
@ge.com | Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... Where do you live in Cincinnati? I have never heard anything like that being tried around the Cincinnati area? Also, if they sold a TV infrastructure to CB then why does CB offer DirectTV? | |
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dcurrey
Premium
join:2004-06-29
·ViaTalk
2 edits | Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... Lebanon Ohio. Just north of you. Reason they don't do it in Cinci is the lines are laid in Lebanon and I think parts of Turtlecreek township.
See »www.cincinnatibell.com/consumer/tv/cable/
Should also note that Cinci bell always handled the phone side of the service for the city. TW phone service price was much better at the time. Looks like they have pretty much matched it now.
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Any unauthorized use of your own judgment is strictly prohibited. | |
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Pizz
Hi
join:2000-10-27
Astoria, NY | Congrats to them  I hope this booms into more muni's state-wide. | |
| | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| said by Matt :And here come the Anti-Muni trolls! Regardless, good luck with this project and I sincerely hope for its success! I dunno, correct me if I'm wrong, but I do believe your post, itself, is TROLLING... you are bating people to jump in and bite your head off, which by definition, is a troll.
There is nothing wrong with any muni project so long as it's not going to cost tax-payers money to operate. It's a bad thing for the tax payer. Some tax payers will continue to do business with the private incumbents while being taxed to subsidize the muni user. All I'm saying is keep it tax payer-funded-free.
On my second point, I have no problem with muni so long as it plays by ALL the same rules as the private run operations. Anything less would be government abuse of power which would be completely illegal and most certainly challenged in court in favor of the plaintiffs. | |
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Matt
Gone playing Dragon Age Origins
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: 3, 2, 1 ..... said by fiberguy :said by Matt :And here come the Anti-Muni trolls! Regardless, good luck with this project and I sincerely hope for its success! I dunno, correct me if I'm wrong, but I do believe your post, itself, is TROLLING... you are bating people to jump in and bite your head off, which by definition, is a troll. There is nothing wrong with any muni project so long as it's not going to cost tax-payers money to operate. It's a bad thing for the tax payer. Some tax payers will continue to do business with the private incumbents while being taxed to subsidize the muni user. All I'm saying is keep it tax payer-funded-free. On my second point, I have no problem with muni so long as it plays by ALL the same rules as the private run operations. Anything less would be government abuse of power which would be completely illegal and most certainly challenged in court in favor of the plaintiffs. For the record, you had 3 points. But whatever.
My post was out of exasperation. Posting this actually exasperates me, so I'm not going to explain why I am exasperated. | |
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baineschile
2600
Premium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Didnt cable companies... Have some sort of an agreement when they spent $$ wiring a town that the town municipal wouldnt run its own service?
I am all for last-mile fiber, but government controlled is not the answer. | |
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NetAdmin
CCNA
join:2008-05-22
| Re: Didnt cable companies... said by baineschile :Have some sort of an agreement when they spent $$ wiring a town that the town municipal wouldnt run its own service? It depends on the franchise agreement.
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"This is a bus. You know how big a bus is?" | |
| | fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
| Correct.. it does matter on the agreement. MOST of them had no-compete agreements (ala exclusive) with the franchise IN EXCHANGE for putting up the risk. (money/investment - something that people here don't care about)
On another note, fiber to the home IS NOT the holy grain people think it is. I have fiber in my home in two places.. in my own network and then in my entertainment system. ANYONE that has a brain in their head knows that fiber is only as good as the equipment running it AND (most importantly) HOW the PEOPLE in control utilize it. ie: video services, internet speeds and capabilities, and phone services/features.
With out the above, the fiber is nothing more than just a pipe line with potential.
.. in the end, I don't think I've yet seen any minu do it right.. most of them, over time, have ALWAYS done the bare minimum to make a service work.. crappy guides, improperly inserted ads, where they exist, (making TV less enjoyable) horrible audio levels, near non-existent customer service, stiff rules (that make current providers look like saints).. all of which we already have now.
My point.. fiber is only as good as those running it. | |
| | | | | | act eth guy
join:2009-01-21
Downs, KS | Re: Showing only a PART of an ONT... BAD CHOICE WITH CALIX - STILL USING ATM TECHNIQUES - SHOULD HAVE GONE WITH OCCAM ACTIVE ETHERNET - PUT FTTH WITH ATM IN AN
IP/ETHERNET WORLD - WRONG CHOICE IN MY BOOK. | |
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Hazy Arc
join:2006-04-10
Greenwood, SC | Re: Rush off to Powell ??? Who needs to go outside when you have FTTH?  | |
| | decifal
join:2007-03-10
Bon Aqua, TN
| Yeah.. But what harm is there to go ahead and upgrade the networks now instead of waiting till everyone is basically feeling like they are on dialup before upgrading? I say this seriously because well, i'm having to do this atm myself... No reliable options landline wise for broadband. And i'm seriously missing out on things... Sat is a joke.. Wireless is improving, but still unreliable for low ping applications..
So.. I say go for it! Make use of the money.. Its better than what 25+million TN tax dollars are going for right now.. And thats to build a bunker for our governors mansion... Such a waste | |
| | ISurfTooMuch
join:2007-04-23
Tuscaloosa, AL | But how does cost of living compare to the national average? You can't judge income in an area until you know how much it costs to live there. | |
| MyDogHsFleas
Premium
join:2007-08-15
Austin, TX
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T Southwest
| So how does the math work on this? $5 million, about 5K residents, figure 2.5 residents per household (being conservative, makes 2K households.
$2500 per household startup costs? Wow.
And how many of these will actually pay even $50/month for broadband service? Let's be wildly optimistic and say 1/2 of them. That's 1000 households so gross revenue is $50K/month. Let's say profit is insanely high, 10%. That's $5K profit/month.
At this rate it'll take 1000 months or 80 years to make the original investment of $5 million.
Better to put your money in a 3% CD. | |
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See 9 replies to this post | |
act eth guy
join:2009-01-21
Downs, KS | ONT PIC LOOKS LIKE ON OCCAM ACTIVE ETHERNET ONT - 1GB ACTIVE ETHERNET | |
| | koolkid1563
Premium,MVM
join:2005-11-06
Powell, WY
clubs:
·Bresnan Online
1 edit | Re: ONT PIC It is actually a GPON ONT running on a 2.4/1.2 GPON network with a GigE subscriber side interface, or in our case a GigE and a 10/100 interface since that is how the 714G is configured.
The ONT model itself is the 714G (not to be confused with the 714GX which can use active Ethernet) which is part of the 700G series: »www.calix.com/products/p-series/···700.html. | |
| | | vinnie97
join:2003-12-05
Mesquite, TX | Re: ONT PIC What do you do in Powell, Koolkid, if you don't mind my asking. I'm a little envious being that you're so close to Yellowstone and the majestic Tetons (I love to hike and that area is beautiful). | |
| Quento21
join:2007-09-28
Laurel, MT | Lightnex a fiber company out of Bozeman, Lightnex, is planning on laying down fiber in my town, they already have an agreement with the city. Just hope they lay it down where i live. I live 80 miles north of powell. Lightnex offers 15/2 speeds. | |
| andrew82
join:2003-12-12
Fall Branch, TN
·Charter Pipeline
| BTES/BVU In Bristol, TN and Bristol, VA both have their own electric and internet structure... God knows its much more cheaper and a heck of a lot better than Charter and TVA-- for electric which serves that area. I moved 30 minutes away and am now stuck with Charter for both cable and internet... and am at least thankful Vonage is an option for phone. | |
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Rush off to Powell ???
