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Samsung Claims Advancement That Makes Wi-Fi Five Times Faster
Samsung claims they've found a way to boost the speed of Wi-Fi networks up to 4.6 Gbps, or about five times faster than the current maximum potential throughput. According to a Samsung announcement, the company says their 802.11ad 70 GHz technology uses millimeter-wave circuit design and a wide-coverage beam-forming antenna to achieve these significantly faster speeds. "Unlike the existing 2.4-GHz and 5-GHz Wi-Fi technologies, Samsung’s 802.11ad standard 60-GHz Wi-Fi technology maintains maximum speed by eliminating co-channel interference, regardless of the number of devices using the same network," claims the company in a statement. The company did not say when they expected commercial availability of this new technology.
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fg8578
join:2009-04-26
San Antonio, TX

fg8578

Member

Good

Anything to keep traffic off the wireless ISP networks.
bigballer
join:2014-09-25

bigballer

Member

Re: Good

How about the FCC freeing up some more unlicensed spectrum..... not useless 5 ghz.

SimbaSeven
I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT

SimbaSeven

Member

Re: Good

I'm surprised 2.4GHz is the lowest a consumer AP can go. Why not 900MHz (902-928MHz) with newer modulation techniques?

Also, why not 24GHz?

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

1 recommendation

DataRiker

Premium Member

Re: Good

900 Mhz is a bit self destructive in a residential environment. It simply travels too far, thus you will receive all of your neighbors signals and your neighbor neighbor's signals and so on, leaving no spectrum for you. ( if you are out in the country side and need a nice long signal to penetrate trees and such its great )

2.4 suffers a bit from the same fate, albeit to a lesser extent.

5 Ghz seems to reach a happy medium in the vast majority of cases.

koolman2
Premium Member
join:2002-10-01
Anchorage, AK

koolman2

Premium Member

Re: Good

Also, the 900 MHz ISM band is only 26 MHz wide. Not quite enough.
wkm001
join:2009-12-14

wkm001

Member

Re: Good

Verizon is doing quite a bit with their 10 MHz of spectrum in their LTE band...

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

1 edit

DataRiker

Premium Member

Re: Good

Verizon has bought the rights to use this spectrum exclusively eg = no noise (relatively) or pesky competing signals

Apples and Oranges bro...

koolman2
Premium Member
join:2002-10-01
Anchorage, AK

koolman2 to wkm001

Premium Member

to wkm001
LTE gives only 75 Mbps on category 4 and 10 MHz...
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
Central CT
·Frontier FiberOp..
Asus RT-AC68

BiggA to DataRiker

Premium Member

to DataRiker
900 might work well for large houses (I know of several cases where people the first-world problem of "my house is so big, my Wifi doesn't work), but for more suburban or urban environments with more normal sized houses or even worse apartments, 900mhz would indeed be a disaster.

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

1 edit

DataRiker

Premium Member

Re: Good

said by BiggA:

900 might work well for large houses (I know of several cases where people the first-world problem of "my house is so big, my Wifi doesn't work), but for more suburban or urban environments with more normal sized houses or even worse apartments, 900mhz would indeed be a disaster.

900Mhz is pretty pointless in general. I believe 802.11ah will be something like around 2.6 mbit/s if it ever happens.

Current back haul 900mhz gear is about the same.

Useful for rural non line of sight applications that need long distance.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
Central CT

BiggA

Premium Member

Re: Good

Yikes. That's awful. I guess they didn't bother designing for actual data traffic, only IoT connectivity, which is already covered by 2.4ghz anyways...
Samsonian
join:2007-06-15

Samsonian

Member

Re: Good

Yes, there is very little spectrum, and there's a less advanced modulation scheme, which results in lower bandwidth.

I'd hardly call 802.11ah in 900 MHz pointless though. It provides long range (up to 1 km) with lower power requirements, and built in relay capabilities.

It has certain use cases. It provides another option for rural areas and can provide IoE/IoT connectivity, and could do it better than existing solutions in unlicensed 900 and 2400 MHz.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
Central CT

BiggA

Premium Member

Re: Good

I guess we'll have to see what it ends up working for. 802.11n can already do 15 miles...

io chico
Premium Member
join:2003-12-30
Marble Falls, TX

io chico to DataRiker

Premium Member

to DataRiker
Agreed. I've had all three over the years. 5GHz is the fastest, most consistently connected of all.

F100
join:2013-01-15
Durham, NC
Alcatel-Lucent G-010G-A
(Software) pfSense
Pace 5268AC

F100 to SimbaSeven

Member

to SimbaSeven
And the City where I am has put in water meters that spew out 900mhz pulses all day long waiting for the once a month when the meter reading truck rolls by. It just fill the noise floor on 900mhz with every house pulsing beacons 24/365.

As 900mhz cordless phones phased out, it's this kind of low bandwidth, appliance connected devices that 900 mhz seems to be destined for in future use. Think refrigerator, oven, water heater, ect.

SimbaSeven
I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT
·StarLink

SimbaSeven

Member

Re: Good

Depends on the modulation. You can shove 54mbps through 900MHz with an Ubiquiti card. Some of the newest Ubiquiti 900MHz gear can go 150+mbps.

Then the other problem about devices spewing RF. Of course, there are several devices that spew out RF. A microwave, for example. The 5GHz area seems safe for now.

..and there is the 26MHz of spectrum issue that DataRiker See Profile and koolman2 See Profile brought up. If you thought 2.4GHz was a mess, this would be multitudes worse. This would only be good in rural environments, not urban.
BiggA
Premium Member
join:2005-11-23
Central CT

BiggA

Premium Member

Re: Good

It might work for exurban houses that are very large with good separation. But in general, yes it would be a mess.
wkm001
join:2009-12-14

wkm001 to SimbaSeven

Member

to SimbaSeven
900MHz gear is typically more expensive.
Chubbysumo
join:2009-12-01
Duluth, MN

Chubbysumo to SimbaSeven

Member

to SimbaSeven
you can buy 900mhz gear, but its expensive and meant more for long distance and point to point.
jades
join:2013-04-01
New York, NY

jades

Member

70 ghz???

Not enough 5 ghz range is crap, how do you make use of 70 ghz when the range will be 14x weaker than 5 ghz?? Put an AP in every room or every 50 ft in an open area?

SimbaSeven
I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT

SimbaSeven

Member

Re: 70 ghz???

I think Karl meant 60GHz. Also, it depends on the power output and the location of the access point.
Chubbysumo
join:2009-12-01
Duluth, MN

Chubbysumo

Member

Re: 70 ghz???

since non-commercial and non-license holder can only use up to 1w of broadcast power legally, and most consumer 2.4/5 stuff now is hitting that limit to get what it gets, 60ghz has no distance, even in open spaces.

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

1 edit

DataRiker to jades

Premium Member

to jades
said by jades:

Not enough 5 ghz range is crap

I would disagree. People tend to equate less range than 2.4 with terrible, but its greatly exaggerated unless you are dealing with brick or masonry.

The relatively low noise and available channels allows my 5 Ghz to travel just as well as my 2.4 due to the noise in the environment. (2.4 is insanely crowded)

I used to install AP's for a living and 5 Ghz outperformed 2.4 in large homes about 80+ % of the time simply due to the crowded noisy 2.4 and the larger spectrum available.

If we opened more unlicensed space in the 2 Ghz area we will simply get an instantly noisy non efficient space
bigballer
join:2014-09-25

bigballer

Member

Re: 70 ghz???

I don't live in an apartment, i live in a residential neighborhood where most houses are on 1/3 to 1/2 acre lots. 5 ghz only works in my den where my router is located. 5 ghz simply does not even extend to the other side of the wall. This makes 5 ghz almost next to useless.

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

DataRiker

Premium Member

Re: 70 ghz???

Absent a problem with your router or computer I find this hard to believe. I have installed hundreds of AP's in large homes. You have a serious issue if you can't extend through one wall.

5 Ghz can easily penetrate most residential material minus brick and masonry (which by the way 2.4 does not penetrate very well either)
Chubbysumo
join:2009-12-01
Duluth, MN
Ubee E31U2V1
(Software) pfSense
Netgear WNR3500L

Chubbysumo

Member

Re: 70 ghz???

if you have thicker insulation, or anything more than drywall in the house, even 2.4ghz has a hard time penetrating, let alone 5ghz. My dual band router has a hard time reaching downstairs, and its only through 2 walls and a straight line of less than 40 feet for 2.4ghz. The 5ghz does not even show up downstairs at all.

Alphonse68
@190.65.137.x

Alphonse68

Anon

Re: 70 ghz???

I don't if you have tried this, but I have found that some router antennae transmit perpendicularly to the antenna; in certain situations I have had to install routes with dual antennae, one set vertically and the other horizontally or at an angle, to solve that problem.
Cheers

AnonDude
@97.95.152.x

2 recommendations

AnonDude to bigballer

Anon

to bigballer
said by bigballer:

I don't live in an apartment, i live in a residential neighborhood where most houses are on 1/3 to 1/2 acre lots. 5 ghz only works in my den where my router is located. 5 ghz simply does not even extend to the other side of the wall. This makes 5 ghz almost next to useless.

That's YOU. Most people don't live like that. And for people like YOU then 2.4 GHz shouldn't be an issue to use. By the way I've gotten 5 GHz to work over 30 feet away through a couple of walls no problem

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

DataRiker

Premium Member

Re: 70 ghz???

said by AnonDude :

That's YOU. Most people don't live like that. And for people like YOU then 2.4 GHz shouldn't be an issue to use. By the way I've gotten 5 GHz to work over 30 feet away through a couple of walls no problem

Assuming he is telling the truth, he has a serious hardware issue. It has nothing to do with 5 Ghz

I have 5 Ghz routinely test at higher speeds on opposite ends of large homes vs 2.4
bigballer
join:2014-09-25

bigballer to AnonDude

Member

to AnonDude
Generally no, I have zero problems with 2.4 ghz.

Hardware wise, I'm rocking an asus ac66u router so I don't believe I have any hardware issues. 5 ghz just doesn't work very well, maybe it's because I have 5/8" drywall or something, but I can't complain when 2.4 ghz works very well in my case since many of the houses in my neighborhood are spread apart decently.

But yes, you guys are right. 5 ghz is best suited in urban apartments when everyone is running their 2.4 ghz routers neck to neck. That is when 5 ghz gets congested as well.....

DataRiker
Premium Member
join:2002-05-19
00000

DataRiker

Premium Member

Re: 70 ghz???

said by bigballer:

I don't believe I have any hardware issues.

Why? Something is very very wrong, and its not your 5/8 inch drywall. Take that thing back because the 5 Ghz radio is broken.

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thedragonmas
Premium Member
join:2007-12-28
Albany, GA
Netgear R6300 v2
ARRIS SB6180

thedragonmas to bigballer

Premium Member

to bigballer
really? thats something, since i live in a duplex, steel frame, real brick, and one inch thick plaster. i get full power through out my home. hell, i can even pick it up down at the bus stop a good 300 feet away all be it at about 1 bar..

so either you have your router on the floor, you have the antennas horizontle, you have it next to a modem or other high frequency device (CFL's any one?) or you got some major cabling in that wall.

you sure you didnt paint it with iron oxide infused paint?

MovieLover76
join:2009-09-11
Cherry Hill, NJ
(Software) pfSense
Asus RT-AC68
Asus RT-AC66

MovieLover76 to bigballer

Member

to bigballer
I too find this hard to swallow, unless your AP is malfunctioning or just garbage.
5Ghz is really a nice middle ground for residential use, occasionally you will need a second AP in a large house, but that's a small price to pay for the speed available on 5Ghz now.

I do live in an apartment, so I've moved almost entirely to 5Ghz as the 2.4 Ghz band is absolutly flooded in any apartment setting.
I have my 802.11ac wireless router on one end of my apartment and my media center is on the other side of the apartment. where I have a wireless media bridge and my ac transfer speeds are around 360mbps, try to do that on 2.4Ghz

even before I re positioned the router, and had to go through a wall, walk in closet, bathroom and kitchen I was getting 140 mbps. I can even go outside my apartment and still hold onto my AC signal.

PamelaTS
Digital Chick
join:2004-04-20
Dallas, TX
Asus RT-AC66
HTC 5G Hub

PamelaTS to jades

Member

to jades
I have to disagree with you. We're it not for 5Ghz I wouldn't be able to wirelessly stream HD from one DVR to Another. I was a whole home beta tester for DirecTV (before deca) and I did it with 5Ghz N.

No longer with DirecTV I use 5Ghz N with two TiVo Premieres with the very crowded 2.4Ghz band I wouldn't be streaming HD content were it not for the 5Ghz band. I've upgraded to AC and get better range, nearly as good as 2.4Ghz.

Yes, construction matters anyone living in concrete and rebar bunker, underground won't have the range. I was surprised that mine is as good as it is since the apartment is constructed wall board over cinder block. Guessing now that metal studs, rebar act like a modest faraday cage absent the metal at my apartment I get excellent coverage for floors down and 100 yards away at the pool.

All the years I've used 5Ghz I've only seen two other SSID's near me (each at different times) 2.4Ghz there are 30 SSID's including mine.

As to the AD standard we've already seen some articles on this proposed standard about a year ago. Range is going to be an issue, it is intended for much shorter range slightly better than PAN (personal area network i.e. bluetooth). In practice it may be the improved personal area network.
shmerl
join:2013-10-21

shmerl

Member

Decent WiFi cards for Linux?

Are there WiFi cards for Linux that can work even through 802.11n properly with kernel drivers? I specifically need a USB card and had hard time finding something decent.

•••••••
tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080

Member

20ghz?

weren't similar claims made @ 20ghz --
the higher the frequency the more amplification you need to get through physical objects and some of these will never allow pass through at higher frequencies. this has already been established as fact.

users are still waiting for the broadband innovations that make multi-gigabit routers worth buying.. much of the streaming media boxes are only 802.11n-- not AC, dual frequency or any of that..
patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY

patcat88

Member

fat uncle cuts off your wifi

At 60 GHZ is LOS. If your fat uncle walks in between the 2 devices your internet will disconnect.

w0g
o.O
join:2001-08-30
Springfield, OR

w0g

Member

I don't know if you guys know

But directed energy as Samsung is talking about using here effectively has lifted some of the omnidirectional limitations that previously made higher frequencies less useable. Higher frequencies have just as much use as lower frequencies without jacking up output power. The problem traditionally has been that only the military actually possessed or deployed it.

What they can do is direct signals right to each device which is what eliminates cross talk and interference. The focused energy also travels much farther than unfocused omnidirectional signals. You have more reach, more signal, less power, aiming the signal where it needs to go. Kind of like a laser that aims through matter.