 rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | If the Future is Wireless? Will these cabinets will be unsightly rust-buckets in 20 years? | |
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 |  RobIn Deo speramus.Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
kudos:3 | Re: If the Future is Wireless? said by rradina:Will these cabinets will be unsightly rust-buckets in 20 years?
Nope. They'll be unsightly graffiti ridden rust-buckets in 5 years.
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CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us | |
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|  alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA | said by rradina:Will these cabinets will be unsightly rust-buckets in 20 years?
Who said The Future was Wireless? Granted for certain applications Wireless is better, but The Future is FTTH. Only with Fiber can you expect Solid, Consistent HD Streaming, and all the other Voice and Data Demands! | |
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| | | | Re: If the Future is Wireless? said by alchav:said by rradina:Will these cabinets will be unsightly rust-buckets in 20 years?
Who said The Future was Wireless? Granted for certain applications Wireless is better, but The Future is FTTH. Only with Fiber can you expect Solid, Consistent HD Streaming, and all the other Voice and Data Demands! Very true.. Wireless is horrible... and over priced for what it is.. FTTH is the best and will always be Copper cant compete against it!! | |
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| | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | I'm basing that on the fact that the two largest providers of network connectivity seem to have abandonded FTTH , FTTC. AT&T believes in FTTN.
Based on their behavior, the future is wireless. | |
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| | | zed260Premium
join:2011-11-11
Cleveland, TN Reviews:
 ·Charter
| Re: If the Future is Wireless? said by rradina:I'm basing that on the fact that the two largest providers of network connectivity seem to have abandonded FTTH , FTTC. AT&T believes in FTTN.
Based on their behavior, the future is wireless.
most likely by 20 years time someone will buy out at&t landline divsion and convert these boxes into ftth conduits or at&t will change plans and convert to ftth | |
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| | alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
1 edit |  Re: If the Future is Wireless?
said by nunya:Wireless is where it's all going. The last mile will be soon to follow.
When I say "wireless", I don't mean cellular wireless either. I mean fixed wireless.
OSP in the traditional sense will be old relics or rural landscape fodder.
Wireless will never have the Bandwidth, Security, Consistency, or Reliability of Wired Fiber. I retired from AT&T, and worked with some of the top Silicon Companies, Engineers, and Minds in The Business. When it came to connecting their Networks, Wireless was never in their plans for Professional Connectivity. Like I said, Wireless has it's applications, but it will never match Wired Fiber.
Having said that, I feel AT&T made a mistake going with Copper for their Last Mile U-Verse. Verizon has been the leader here, but has held back due to low demand from it's Users. The demand will pick up when Streaming HD Video, Data, and Voice becomes second nature and Verizon will be at the forfront. | |
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| | |  nunyaWho is John Galt?Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:8
·Charter
 ·surpasshosting
 ·voip.ms
| Re: If the Future is Wireless? I retired from AT&T too for all that it really matters. Wireline is dead. Wireless already has the bandwidth. Sorry. That's just the way it is.
Wireless will never be "as good" as a wired connection. Younger generations are willing to accept this. The telcos do not want to deal with maintaining an OSP.
Joe Consumer doesn't really give a rats ass about bandwidth numbers. As long as he can look at porn, facebook, youtube, netflix, and use his vonage at the same time, he doesn't care whether his connection is 100 Mbps or 1 Gbps.
Fiber will have it's place, FTTT (fiber to the tower), and FTTP for customers who demand secure and high capacity connections (commercial).
For the Jone's house on Sycamore Rd or the Dairy Queen on Main St., there will be a fixed wireless box screwed to the side of the house. It will deliver one product - bandwidth.
The drops will be cut down. The F2 will go away. It will be cut down and not replaced. It will become a liability, not an asset. In fact, based on the actions of ILECs, it's quite clear that they already consider wireline a thorn in their side. Get rid of most of the plant, and you can get rid of most of the people who maintain it. That means bigger profits. The shareholders are already on board.
The telco's had their chance to upgrade the OSP. Verizon 1/2 assed it with Fios. AT&T screwed the pooch with U-Verse.
While Ma Bell was busy worrying about "long distance" in 1994-2002, cable companies were deploying deep HFC systems and pushing hard on DOCSIS development.
That's why today my local ILEC can offer me 10/768 DSL for 60/mo. The cable company gives me 100/5 for the same price.
The next ten years will belong to the cable companies. Eventually, their outside plant will be a liability as well.
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...because I care. | |
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| | | | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | Re: If the Future is Wireless? Wishful thinking.. don't care who you worked for. Besides, AT&T? .. that's the company you're putting your reputation behind? They do one thing very well, mass producing crap. AT&T has been calling for the wireless box screwed to the home for over 12 years now. Well?? *crickets*
If the drops get cut down, and the F2 as well, and it goes all wireless, AT&T will simply reduce service, raise prices, claim there is a crunch and the people will CONTINUE to not buy into the crap. In a perfect world you'd be correct, but dude.. if what you're saying is correct, then why are we moving away from unlimited data plans for our little smart phones and being charged up the ass for the data?
Yea.. dream on.. seriously. WORST comment I've ever seen here. | |
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| | | | | | alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA | Re: If the Future is Wireless?said by nunya:No I'm not "putting my reputation" behind AT&T. Apparently you skim read my post. I said "for all that it really matters", which was in reply to another poster acting as if tenure at AT&T gave magical powers.
No, quite the opposite. I think AT&T has done it all wrong, if you would take the time to actually read and comprehend.
You have to stop thinking of "wireless" as cellular. Wireless ≠ cellular or even any current wireless company.
I really didn't retire from AT&T, but from Pacific Bell a totally different Company. I was with them for 31 years, working my way up from a Frame Person to a Second Level Service Manager. Mostly in Operations, so I have an understanding in Telco's. I really enjoyed my work, especially after Divestiture in '84 when Ma Bell was split up. Then PacBell went into the Golden Years, and we ran heavy with The Big Boys in The Silicon Valley. So to me Wireless is Wireless, no matter how you cut it and it will never have the Bandwidth of Fiber. You did make some valid points, The Average Person doesn't know any better. So if it works most of the time and not expensive, why not Wireless! | |
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| | | | | | | nunyaWho is John Galt?Premium,MVM
join:2000-12-23
O Fallon, MO
kudos:8 Reviews:
·Charter
·surpasshosting
·voip.ms
| Re: If the Future is Wireless? Don't get me wrong, I do not want to see AT&T go away. Obviously I have a vested interest in them remaining a profitable and viable company.
But, with the advancements in technology and, and the changing customer demographic, I'm not sure how long they will last unless they change their evil ways quickly.
You know as well as I do that the Bell System used to be very proactive in almost every aspect (contrary to what most people think). R&D, safety, routine maintenance, continuing education, etc... That all went away and TA96 was the nail in the coffin. Everything became "reactive" as the whole industry started to spiral into a "race to the bottom", as I like to call it.
About 10 years after divestiture, all the RBOCs could think about was long distance. They cast everything else aside and focused on long distance as their "panacea". They should have been thinking about OSP upgrades and how to rule the bandwidth market.
Today the ILEC's all have long distance, which is a totally irrelevant product. The cable companies have DOCSIS 3.
U-Verse was the last project I worked on. I never actually got to see it come to fruition (I left before it went live). The whole time, I couldn't help but think what a horrible "stop-gap" solution U-Verse was to just doing it right and replacing all the plant with fiber. All the wasted man-hours conditioning U-Verse areas was sickening. Trying to milk 50 year old plant to provide enough bandwidth for HD streams.
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...because I care. | |
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| | | | | | | rradina
join:2000-08-08
Chesterfield, MO | Wireless is wireless? I disagree. IMO, one of the most interesting things that could be done RIGHT NOW with CURRENT technology is make the last mile wireless with incredibly small, fixed-wireless, highly directional RF devices. When I say last mile, I mean, 5,280 feet. OTS tech could easily deliver symmetrical 100Mbps at which point it jumps on FTTN. In rural areas you could probably go much more than a mile by using wider spectrum since there's less congestion. Since the telcos are working to fiber-connect the cell towers, you might even be able to use a portion of the spectrum for wireless back haul to the closest tower.
IMO the kind of copper we have buried in the ground for POTS isn't worth what it takes to maintain it. Either invest in FTTH or go wireless for the last mile. I predict that a lot of spectrum will become available in the coming years when we realize that a fast network is everywhere and there's little or no need for broadcast-style spectrum. We should use all of it to create "the network" and make sure there's lots of competition or federalize it and fund it with taxes and then allow competitors to deliver services on top of it. I probably prefer the latter since it's already half-ass funded with tax payer dollars in the form of corporate USF welfare and whatever other tax-breaks and incentives we provide firms to deliver what some even go so far as to misrepresent as a constitutional "right" right up there with free speech. Of course that's B.S. but that never stops the misinformed from screaming about how unfair their existence is. | |
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RobIn Deo speramus.Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
kudos:3 | Simple Solution to SA Residents.. Simple solution is to not subscribe to any of AT&T's services that are delivered from the VRAD cabinets. | |
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|  cdruGo ColtsPremium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7 | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by Rob:Simple solution is to not subscribe to any of AT&T's services that are delivered from the VRAD cabinets.
So then you'll have a large, ugly refrigerator-sized cabinet in your yard that is going completely unused. It's not quite cutting off your nose to spite the face, but it's not too far off. | |
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| | RobIn Deo speramus.Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
kudos:3 | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by cdru:said by Rob:Simple solution is to not subscribe to any of AT&T's services that are delivered from the VRAD cabinets.
So then you'll have a large, ugly refrigerator-sized cabinet in your yard that is going completely unused. It's not quite cutting off your nose to spite the face, but it's not too far off. How long would AT&T keep a VRAD activated if the cost of maintaining it exceeded any revenue?
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CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us | |
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| | |  mobOn the next level..Premium
join:2000-10-07
 ·SureWest Internet
| Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by Rob:said by cdru:said by Rob:Simple solution is to not subscribe to any of AT&T's services that are delivered from the VRAD cabinets.
So then you'll have a large, ugly refrigerator-sized cabinet in your yard that is going completely unused. It's not quite cutting off your nose to spite the face, but it's not too far off. How long would AT&T keep a VRAD activated if the cost of maintaining it exceeded any revenue? Until the sun explodes.
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Ich habe kein Mitleid - Me
You're a daisy if you do. - Doc Holliday
And as always, have nice day. | |
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| | | | RobIn Deo speramus.Premium
join:2001-08-25
Kendall, FL
kudos:3 | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by mob:Until the sun explodes.
We're talking about AT&T here. If they can't purchase the sun, they'll destroy it themselves before it explodes.
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CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us | |
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| | | | |  Camelot OnePremium,MVM
join:2001-11-21
Greenwood, IN
kudos:1 | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by Rob:We're talking about AT&T here. If they can't purchase the sun, they'll destroy it themselves before it explodes.
Nah, they will decide that purchasing the sun isn't worth doing, and fund a "grass-roots" movement to promote legislation preventing anyone else from purchasing or using it. | |
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| | | | | | Reviews:
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. They'll probably fight tooth and nail - fund a grass-roots movement, and after they decide that its not profitable, go and sell it to a mom/pop landline carrier (Frontier) for a tidy profit, and claim it as a tax loss, and compete with it using wireless. | |
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| | | | | | | | | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. No, that's Verizon. | |
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| | | | | | said by mob:Until the sun explodes.
..or the VRAD does. | |
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| | | | | Reviews:
·Comcast
| Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by Jim Kirk:said by mob:Until the sun explodes.
..or the VRAD does. Hey now, only a few VRADs have exploded so far.  | |
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| | | cdruGo ColtsPremium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7 | said by Rob:How long would AT&T keep a VRAD activated if the cost of maintaining it exceeded any revenue? If the VRAD is replacing the legacy copper POTS, essentially forever until something else comes along.
I don't see them removing the VRAD if subscription rates did not make them effectively viable to run. I do see them stripping them of most/all equipment and just leaving a large metal shell sitting there if/when such a time comes. | |
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| | |  maartenaElmoPremium
join:2002-05-10
Orange, CA
kudos:1 | said by Rob:said by cdru:said by Rob:Simple solution is to not subscribe to any of AT&T's services that are delivered from the VRAD cabinets.
So then you'll have a large, ugly refrigerator-sized cabinet in your yard that is going completely unused. It's not quite cutting off your nose to spite the face, but it's not too far off. How long would AT&T keep a VRAD activated if the cost of maintaining it exceeded any revenue? They MAY shut it down at some point if it proves to be a financial failure. (Looking at other U-verse markets though, not likely going to be the case). But they still won't be removing it, as removing it costs MORE money. They will just grab the equipment out, and leave the metal shell, bolted and all into the concrete, sitting where it is sitting.
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"I reject your reality and substitute my own!" | |
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| | | | | | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by maartena:They MAY shut it down at some point if it proves to be a financial failure. (Looking at other U-verse markets though, not likely going to be the case). But they still won't be removing it, as removing it costs MORE money. They will just grab the equipment out, and leave the metal shell, bolted and all into the concrete, sitting where it is sitting.
look at the old pay phones.. although not many are around, in some areas they are shut off disconnected but left their and not doin anythin | |
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| | | | sk1939Premium
join:2010-10-23
Washington, DC
kudos:9 | Make a nice shelter for some homeless person. | |
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| | | | | Decades. I was in an AT&T tandem a few months ago and they had rows of gear in the CLEC colo area that was powered up doing nothing. According to one of the AT&T techs I know that gear has not been used since the mid 90s. I asked why it was still running and he said that no one has ever issued a ticket to remove or power down the gear so it wasn't anything he was going to worry about.
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I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company. | |
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| | | | | | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by battleop:Decades. I was in an AT&T tandem a few months ago and they had rows of gear in the CLEC colo area that was powered up doing nothing. According to one of the AT&T techs I know that gear has not been used since the mid 90s. I asked why it was still running and he said that no one has ever issued a ticket to remove or power down the gear so it wasn't anything he was going to worry about.
...what a waist of money AT&T prob has many like that they dont even care about the old equipment they just wright it off some where down the line and let it sit in buildings.. runing and not doing anythin a bit of good | |
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| | | | | | | Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. You can thank the CWA for the "That's not my job" mentality. That's how it's looked at. If no one creates a ticket then they are not ging to bother with it. In all likelyhood the group responsible for that equipment probably does not exist anymore so there is no one to issue a ticket to remove it and the CO techs and managers are not going to bring it up because that is just extra work for them. The power to run it is not money out of their pocket so they don't care.
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I do not, have not, and will not work for AT&T/Comcast/Verizon/Charter or similar sized company. | |
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| | | | | | Reviews:
·Mediacom
| Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. No, this has nothing to do with the Union. That equipment is a liability suit waiting to happen if someone removes it without it being fully researched and properly decommissioned. This isn't your home office; you can't just walk in and turn the power off.
If AT&T wanted that tech gone, it would be gone. Trust me. Our CO is almost empty now, compared to what it was before. Why? Because obsolete and unused tech was removed. Some still sits on racks in the back, long-since powered down (and with the decommission stickers to prove it), but they don't remove it because, quite simply, the space is not needed. The digital equipment takes up so much less space than the old stuff that it's not even funny. | |
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| | | | | |  CWA
@wayport.net | said by battleop:You can thank the CWA for the "That's not my job" mentality.
???
This would be a management problem. Nothing at all to do with the CWA. | |
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| | | fiberguyMy views are my own.Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3 | It will never happen. No corporation such as AT&T would ever have to worry about that because they easily manipulate the consumer and the price they pay. They won't let things slip.. so it's not really an issue.
You can tend to lose a few customers, raise prices very slightly to the rest and actually make more money. It's simple accounting. | |
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|  AZ_OGM
join:2007-01-12
Phoenix, AZ | I thought a read a while back that the death star stopped deploying u-verse (same with VZ for Fios) and those that were eligible could get it; the rest were too bad, so sad. | |
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| | zed260Premium
join:2011-11-11
Cleveland, TN Reviews:
·Charter
| Re: Simple Solution to SA Residents.. said by AZ_OGM:I thought a read a while back that the death star stopped deploying u-verse (same with VZ for Fios) and those that were eligible could get it; the rest were too bad, so sad.
they are still deploying it just not as fast or on same scale as before | |
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 LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 |  AT&T won when city cut deal; NIMBY groups always lose
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»www.mittromney.com/s/repeal-and-···bamacare
»www.mittromney.com/issues/health-care | |
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Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·Cox HSI
 ·AT&T U-Verse
| WOW! Is AT&T still using cabinets like those in the picture?
Those style cabinets got replaced in my old town with one about half that size and more square. They actually are small enough to where you don't really notice them or care about them....
Also in the case where they are on peoples tree lawns. Didn't they have some kinda box there before these and also would the city carry some blame for allowing that to happen? | |
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See 7 replies to this post |
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mobOn the next level..Premium
join:2000-10-07 | Why not do this instead? »www.wimp.com/invisiblemercedes/
If they can do it on a moving car, I'm pretty sure they could do it on a stationary box. | |
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| sam64
join:2006-07-31
Newtown, PA | Re: Why not do this instead? Pretty neat!
They should be able to do something with the stationary cabinets but then you would have to deal with all the lawsuits stemming from the idiots who run into them because they were so "invisible".
There is no easy solution. I have seen it countless number of times when people complain about poor cell signals but will fight tooth and nail to the new tower that is being put up in their community. There has to be some give and take. | |
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| AZ_OGM
join:2007-01-12
Phoenix, AZ | I agree, if they can use "suburban camouflage" to hide cell phone towers, why not VRADS? | |
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| | | | Re: Why not do this instead? said by AZ_OGM:I agree, if they can use "suburban camouflage" to hide cell phone towers, why not VRADS? For starters, that "suburban camouflage" is either mandated by the government (local or state law) or agreed to as a condition to put up the tower; the companies don't do it because they want to.
Besides, it's free advertising when people start asking why those big honkin' boxes are getting planted all over the place.
/M | |
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Rekrul
join:2007-04-21
Milford, CT | I thought... I thought that the U-Verse expansion was over and that AT&T wasn't going to offer it in any new markets. So why would they need to install any new VRADs? | |
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| |  Why not....
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| | | Re: Why not.... said by Chute em :pull a gun on them when they come to install like the woman did when the electric company tried to install a smart meter on her house?
haha heck yah get off my property!! | |
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| | i have uverser Its always stable and fast, it rarely slows down. Don't have TV so can't comment on IP TV, but the internet product is decent. | |
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| | Meh This is potentially good news for Sonic, who submitted a permit to run FTTH through most of SF. I wish AT&T luck trying to pit U-Verse against Sonic's 100M/100M and 1G/1G offerings. | |
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| | | Re: Meh They will have plenty of luck because people are stupid and easily susceptible to AT&T's more aggressive marketing.
The Cult of Apple is proof that marketing will win over substance every time. | |
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|  DaneJasperSonic.NetPremium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
kudos:9 | said by Arty50:This is potentially good news for Sonic, who submitted a permit to run FTTH through most of SF. I wish AT&T luck trying to pit U-Verse against Sonic's 100M/100M and 1G/1G offerings.
Article from Sonic.net on the topic today: »corp.sonic.net/ceo/2012/07/20/sa···abinets/ | |
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| | | | Re: Meh That's good news. Thanks, Dane! | |
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 IowaCowboyWant to go back to IowaPremium
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA
·Comcast
 ·Verizon Broadban..
| They can put one on my lawn AT&T should buy out the landlines in Western Massachusetts since Verizon does not want to expand FiOS here. AT&T has U-Verse in Enfield Connecticut (which is 15 minutes away from my house) but the MA/CT state line seems to be the demarc between AT&T U-Verse and Verizon DSL. | |
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 levThis site served its purposePremium,Ex-mod 2002-08
join:2001-05-30
Chicago, IL
kudos:2
·Comcast Business..
| Tallest cabinets were, I believe, 63 inches I remember scalding the Comcast rep over this at a public meeting in Deerfield, Illinois a few years ago when one of your contacts called you later and asked why I was representing DSL Reports (I wasn't, just said I was a moderator) and inquired as to why you couldn't keep me in line.
63 inches is NOT 6 feet. It's 3 inches over 5 feet, so not even 5 1/2.
Stop parroting incorrect information!!!! | |
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|  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY | Oh Please A city bitching about metal cabinets and it's ok for fat hogs to walk around the city naked, which is a worse eye sore. | |
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| | Lose? Win! San Fran Residents Lose Battle Over AT&T U-Verse Cabinets No, San Francisco residents win. The crazy control-freak activists lose.
AT&T is not my favorite company at all, but man do we need some broadband competition here. Even this helps. | |
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Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
| This is rediculous. Customers want service but want to whine I find it funny that people in California and Connecticut want to whine about Uverse VRADs heck Uverse and Fios being deployed in my market made TWC launch 50/5 and 30/5 tiers because of increased competition. I did not see people in my area complain about uverse coming to town here in Texas.
I also find it funny that TWC might get sued in California over chalk markings for an advertisement for a wifi network that is not permitted without city approval due to a dumb provision in state law that does not allow for service providers to provide wifi to the public without city permission. You would think that they would welcome technological advancements but they are too snobby and worry that an advertisement is graffiti. 
»www.easyreadernews.com/54360/tim···ication/ | |
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| | one in every town This creates jobs and service..... ohhhh the travisity | |
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BiggA
join:2005-11-23
EARTH | I'd be more opposed to not getting FTTH I don't mind the VRADs themselves, but rather I hate them as a symbol of a lack of initiative and investment on AT&T's part. | |
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Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
| We all know how well at&t maintains their equip... Who remembers when those uverse boxes started exploding in neighborhoods.. that might be an area of concern i can agree with.. also at&t's track history or any telcos keeping up good maintenance on their equipment.
anyone ever see this article.
»www.dispatch.com/content/stories···ced.html | |
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