  baineschile 2600 Premium join:2008-05-10 Sterling Heights, MI | The lesser of two evils Ads will get to consumers; there is no avoiding that with TV and the internet in this day and age. That being said, I would rather have ads tailored to me (fun electronic gadgets) rather that the generic ads that I see (tampons, snuggies, etc). | |
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 |  jc100
join:2002-04-10 | Re: The lesser of two evils I'd rather NOT have any, how about them apples. I PAY for my internet. If the ISP wants to give me it for free, and generate ad revenue in order to supplement the cost, then by all means. Until such time, piss off. | |
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 |  |   damonlab Premium join:2001-05-02 Detroit, MI clubs: 
| Re: The lesser of two evils said by jc100 :I'd rather NOT have any, how about them apples. I PAY for my internet. If the ISP wants to give me it for free, and generate ad revenue in order to supplement the cost, then by all means. Until such time, piss off. Here is a twist... I PAY for my cable TV. If the cable TV provider wants to give me it for free, and generate ad revenue in order to supplement the cost, then by all means. Until such time, piss off. | |
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 |  |  |  jc100
join:2002-04-10
| Re: The lesser of two evils Well, that argument is true and FAILS in the same sentence.
True: Yes, so long as YOU PAY for your service, you should NOT be forcibly subjected to Revenue Generating Ads during your viewing experience.
Fails: Ads on TV are NOT behaviorally tracking your activity, collecting data on you, and selling it off. The ONLY way TV stations can tell viewing habits is if people agree to install Nielson boxes or fill out surveys.
Hence, one beast is FAR DIFFERENT than the other. | |
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 |  |  |  |   Laughing Man Stand Alone Complex Premium join:2008-03-17 Louisville, KY clubs:
·AT&T DSL Service
1 edit | Re: The lesser of two evils said by jc100 :Fails: Ads on TV are NOT behaviorally tracking your activity, collecting data on you, and selling it off. The ONLY way TV stations can tell viewing habits is if people agree to install Nielson boxes or fill out surveys. Not if cable gets their way.
Back in March of 2008, Comcast's Gerard Kunkel proclaimed that Comcast was experimenting with embedding cameras in your DVR or cable box, allowing the company to know exactly who is watching what, at what time. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |   michaelp95 Premium join:2001-08-23 Tucson, AZ
·Comcast
| Re: The lesser of two evils said by Laughing Man :said by jc100 :Fails: Ads on TV are NOT behaviorally tracking your activity, collecting data on you, and selling it off. The ONLY way TV stations can tell viewing habits is if people agree to install Nielson boxes or fill out surveys. Not if cable gets their way. Back in March of 2008, Comcast's Gerard Kunkel proclaimed that Comcast was experimenting with embedding cameras in your DVR or cable box, allowing the company to know exactly who is watching what, at what time. Voice from the Comcast box watching "Excuse me sir, I notice your underwear has a few holes in it, would you like me to tune in QVC so you can order some new boxers?"
That's targeting....bullseye. | |
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 |  |  |  |   birdfeedr Premium,MVM join:2001-08-11 Warwick, RI
·Verizon FIOS
| said by jc100 :The ONLY way TV stations can tell viewing habits is if people agree to install Nielson boxes or fill out surveys. How do you know Verizon's internet-connected STB does not upload channel history? There's a lot of obscured traffic traffic going out if you happen to sniff the WAN connection.
From Karl's article quote: Consumers -- at least the informed ones -- apparently think otherwise.
The informed internet consumer *knows* there is no real privacy. Anything they say about privacy is only a half-truth. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |   bender Bite my shiny metal ass Premium join:2005-03-19 Evanston, IL clubs: | Re: The lesser of two evils i'm just glad that this kind of stuff doesn't happen with digital OTA converters....... or does it? | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |   TKJunkMail Enjoy the sun Premium join:2002-03-03 Avalon, NJ
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| Re: The lesser of two evils said by bender :i'm just glad that this kind of stuff doesn't happen with digital OTA converters....... or does it? Right now, to the best of my knowledge, OTA digital is 1-way only. There is no mechanism to collect viewing information. Not to say that couldn't change down the line years from now. | |
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 |   KrK Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy Premium join:2000-01-17 Tulsa, OK | Choosing the lesser of two evils is still choosing evil.
(You can thank Jerry Garcia for that quote.) | |
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 |  jjeffeory
join:2002-12-04 USA
| I agree that there is a market for this, but I do not want to pay for the ads to be sent to me. I also do not like the idea of tailored ads. We have several people with varied tastes who use the IP address here. I don't want to be spammed my crap AND their crap too. | |
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 |  Kearnstd Elf Wizard Premium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ
| my honest dislike is ads on the ISP portal sites, i think they should all go away when you login. i mean seriously i know why the ISPs promote using their portal vs POP3, it isnt just support(POP3 can burn in hell when its allowed to be used by someone who needs help finding the tools menu) but also to funnel people across the portal and generate views for the ads. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 ShellMMG
join:2009-04-16 Grass Lake, MI
·Alltel Axess
| Remember this movie? One of the scariest scenes on film is from the "Minority Report." Tom Cruise is hustling through a shopping mall and is assaulted by a barrage of holographic ads, mentioning him by name and trying to get his attention! I dislike shopping malls as it is, and that scared me off for a good long time.
What part of obnoxious, offensive, intrusive and annoying don't advertisers get?? | |
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 |   jefe Premium join:2001-05-19 Northport, NY
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Remember this movie? I too think of that scene in "Minority Report" every time the subject of targeted advertising comes up.
It seems to me that advertising has become a game similar to spamming or malware. One set of players is always thinking of new ways to target you. On the other side, most of us are thinking of ways to avoid being targeted.
I see advertising in the same light. I rarely watch live TV, preferring to record any programing I want to watch so I can skip through the commercials.
Ad Muncher is one of my favorite all time PC applications. It pretty much shields me from browsing ads.
And the, of course, there's Spamassasin at my email server level. It pretty much shields me from the tons of crapola spam that I'd otherwise get bombarded with every day.
I can only speak for myself, of course, but the one type of advertising I still don't mind is print ads. I read the local newspaper, or a magazine, or get a flyer in the mail, and I don't mind the ads. If they interest me, I read them. If not I just skip right on by.
But TV, radio, or web ads....no thanks. Not for me. In my case, at least, spending money and effort on targeting me is a waste of that time and money. I won't be paying attention to your ads.  | |
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 |  |  stufried Premium join:2003-10-13
·Verizon BroadbandA..
| Re: Remember this movie? I am willing to share a basic profile with a central repository regarding the advertising that will least offend me, but I don't like the combing of my personal data. For example, I would tell them not to bother with hunting and fishing, but that I do like travel and food.
While I would prefer no advertising, I'm not willing to pay for a completely pay internet. Some advertising on web pages, etc. is therefore a cost of doing business.
I'm also not sure that profiling the websites I watch will always tell you my position. I am a student of the Middle East. I read both pro-Israeli and pro-Palestinian websites. I also read Al Jazeera, but also read Hareetz. A truly smart algorithm would tell you that this person doesn't favor either side and try to sell me a subscription to Foreign Affairs, the Foreign Policy, etc. The way things work right now, I'm likely to get adds to support both sides under the current structure and wind up on a State Department watch list. | |
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  FastiBook
join:2003-01-08 Newtown, PA
·Verizon FIOS
| I don't know about you... But i like seeing a variety of ads, not ones based on my ****ing searches on google, or ones based on what sites i go to, i'm a bit more varied as a person than searches and a few specific websites.
Why do companies think bombarding you with specified ads are better than keeping costs low and doing it how it's always been done.
- A -- LETS GO METS! | |
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 axiomatic
join:2006-08-23 Tomball, TX | Lets make a deal ISP's Hey ISP's, I will continue to allow you to make money off my search data, and also let you continue to serve me up customized advertisements, if you guys drop the CAPS and the METERS.
Deal? | |
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 |  |   Laughing Man Stand Alone Complex Premium join:2008-03-17 Louisville, KY clubs: | Re: Lets make a deal ISP's That reminds me of a good quote, "Resistance is futile. We wish to improve ourselves. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service ours." | |
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 |  |  |   michaelp95 Premium join:2001-08-23 Tucson, AZ
·Comcast
| Re: Lets make a deal ISP's said by Laughing Man :That reminds me of a good quote, "Resistance is futile. We wish to improve ourselves. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service ours." We don't want to be assimilated. | |
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 |  SuperWISP
join:2007-04-17 Laramie, WY | ISPs have no interest in invading your privacy.
Google does. | |
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 |  |  jjeffeory
join:2002-12-04 USA
| Re: Lets make a deal ISP's said by SuperWISP :ISPs have no interest in invading your privacy. Google does. You're not Qwest, at&t, Verizon, or Comcast. You may not be interested, but THEY are, and frankly you're too small to worry about. THEY are not. | |
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 |  |  axiomatic
join:2006-08-23 Tomball, TX 2 edits | That is a bunch of whargarbl SuperWISP.
You can tell that to my ISP Comcast.
Wait... nevermind... I obviously have forgotten who I'm talking too. | |
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 |  Kearnstd Elf Wizard Premium join:2002-01-22 Mullica Hill, NJ | difference is google isnt hiding the fact they want to suck in all the information in the world. -- [65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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 cpsycho
join:2008-06-03 Orangeville, ON | DAMN GROUPS! [sarcasm] These groups are satanic, socialist, baby killers, trying to inform people and break the free market. [/sarcasm] | |
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  Wizeguy
join:2008-08-23 Safety Harbor, FL | You are being watched! "There was of course no way of knowing whether you were being watched at any given moment. How often, or on what system, the Thought Police plugged in on any individual wire was guesswork" (G.Orwell 1984) | |
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 beaups
join:2003-08-11 Hilliard, OH | Put your money where your mouth is And pull the "internet-centric" ads off BBR's homepage. Why when I come to this site do I see ads for broadband products? Sounds like tailored ads to me. Wait.... | |
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 |   bender Bite my shiny metal ass Premium join:2005-03-19 Evanston, IL clubs: | Re: Put your money where your mouth is i see no ads. but then again, i'm premium. maybe that makes a difference. | |
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 |  |   Laughing Man Stand Alone Complex Premium join:2008-03-17 Louisville, KY clubs: | Re: Put your money where your mouth is Nope, I'm not premium and I don't have any ads. | |
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 |  |  |   A456732
@rr.com | Re: Put your money where your mouth is I'm with you. I'm not even loged in and I don't see any adds anywhere, not even the home page. Maybe it is because I don't have Javascript enabled. | |
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  bhan261
join:2001-02-12 New York, NY
| TANSTAAFL I work for a fairly large, well-known news site. Our worldwide news gathering operation costs us about $11 million/year in salaries, benefits etc. That doesn't count the additional costs of other overhead and hosting/CDN. Without ad revenue, how exactly are we supposed to recoup these costs? And if those ads are more relevant and interesting to each individual, how is that wrong? | |
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 |   asellus Premium join:2004-09-24 Malaysia
| Re: TANSTAAFL said by bhan261 :I work for a fairly large, well-known news site. Our worldwide news gathering operation costs us about $11 million/year in salaries, benefits etc. That doesn't count the additional costs of other overhead and hosting/CDN. Without ad revenue, how exactly are we supposed to recoup these costs? And if those ads are more relevant and interesting to each individual, how is that wrong? Do it WSJ way and charge for a subscription! -- 1098139570 | |
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 |  |   bhan261
join:2001-02-12 New York, NY | Re: TANSTAAFL Sorry...even the WSJ can't make enough on selling subs to cover their costs of producing the site. They HAVE to sell ads, too. | |
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 |  bt
join:2009-02-26 canada
·Rogers Hi-Speed
| said by bhan261 :And if those ads are more relevant and interesting to each individual, how is that wrong? It's wrong when it's at an unacceptable cost to the individual. While the monetary cost to the individual may be nothing, there are many people out there who would consider the privacy costs associated with individually tailored ads to be completely unacceptable.
Many sites that do this would probably find their readership drop quickly if every one of their visitors was actively aware that they were doing so. | |
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 |  |   bhan261
join:2001-02-12 New York, NY
| Re: TANSTAAFL See joebarnhart's post below.
Do you use a credit card? You're tracked. Do you use frequent shopper cards? You're tracked. Do you subscribe to magazines? You're tracked. Do you use a cellphone? You're tracked. Do you have EZ-Pass? You're tracked. etc...etc...etc...
And each of them are selling "your" data to other marketers. | |
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  w0g o.O
join:2001-08-30 Portland, OR clubs:
·Clearwire Wireless
| It's pretty invasive I browse over to Dell.com and all of a sudden Yahoo! and many other websites know about it and start giving me Dell advertisements. They track it down to the exact items I was looking at even. I click around google and amazon and the items I searched for or browsed are also used for the same thing - it's like everywhere these websites are sharing information amongst one another, tracking by IP address, cookies, whatever, and they even have my location name and address because I've done business with these companies before. I was a little surprised how intrigent it was , I'm not a fan of having so much information kept about me and my interests and habits. | |
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  dvd536 as Mr. Pink as they come Premium join:2001-04-27 Phoenix, AZ | Guess what? 1. I don't block ads. 2. I would never buy anything based on an ad i saw online or T.V.! -- When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
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