 
astokes
join:2000-08-11
Bangor, ME | ADSL2+ distance limitations It all looks nice on paper but when it comes to the real world only a very small percentage of their customers will get anywhere close to a 30 meg connection. Though the better uploads with Annex M looks nice. | |
|
Duramax08
Oh rly?
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX | Copper is everywhere Might as well milk it. Well atleast in rural areas. | |
|
 | |
| |
Duramax08
Oh rly?
join:2008-08-03
San Antonio, TX | Re: Copper is everywhere True. Hopefully this broadband stimulus will help out. | |
|
unoriginal
join:2000-07-12
San Diego, CA | Who handles the copper line repairs? Sonic may be using their own backend network but still need AT&T copper for the service. Who handles repairs for the lines since Sonic is offering essentially dry line dsl over the phone lines? | |
|
| iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO | Re: Who handles the copper line repairs? I suppose Sonic pays AT&T enough for those dry lines that AT&T will repair them when something goes wrong. | |
|
| | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Who handles the copper line repairs? until ATT decides to pull out the copper and do FTTH or toss in their VARDs to reduce the loops. Then Sonic is screwed. | |
|
| | | |
| | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
 ·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Re: Who handles the copper line repairs? ATT isn't reselling SHIT on their new network. They got what they wanted with getting rid of the copper and all the resellers. That's why you can't get Dryline DSL with many small town ISPs ATT took it from them as well. The same as the new network.
T1s have tripled in areas that have gone to the FTTH systems when it was SBC in trials.
Also what happens when ATT starts doing FTTN? and all the coper starts to go? Sonic is gonna be SOL but we'll hear how ATT is the evil on getting rid of the copper because Sonic should be allowed still to lease it.
Instead of spending the money to become a CLEC they should be worried about building out their full network. Maybe FTTH in HOAs and such. | |
|
| | | | | |
| | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Re: Who handles the copper line repairs? So just because their a CLEC doesn't matter.
VZ is pulling their copper out and guess what happens. The CLEC gets the shaft and is killed by one more customer upgrading.
You're also not affected so your comment applies to you.
Also ATT being regulated? LMAO!
the FCC bought and paid for by ATT and VZ. Also you must have not have read the memo, NEW Built out networks do NOT have to be shared with anyone else. Which MEANS: if the ILEC pulls the copper lines TOUGH SHIT for the CLECs, Look at the FTTH networks in Monroe MI where ATT built these out when it was SBC. They do not have any choices except ATT for services.
Guess what? Tough shit for the customers the FCC says. | |
|
| | | | | | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO | Re: Who handles the copper line repairs? That was the former FCC. Let's hope the brave new wo...erm...administration can fix things. Also, DSL around here is served by a DLEC. Too bad most of the lines are too crappy, or Verizon would have their own DSL here. | |
|
| | | | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Who handles the copper line repairs? If the FCC changed what the previous agreed to as far as the new networks i'm sure the FCC will find themselves in court faster than what we can blink. With that FiOS and U-Verse would be shut down that millisecond. | |
|
xan_user
join:2004-11-18
Windsor, CA
1 edit | "greater loop lengths" quote:
line-bonding is one way to grab additional bandwidth at greater loop lengths out of both ADSL2+ and VDSL.
What does this mean, if anything, regarding those currently just out of reach of sonic's DSL service. Do we now have choices other than IDSN and or 56Kx2(bonded)?
Or does this just mean more bandwidth for those already under the broadband over copper ATT/Sonic line length restriction? | |
|
| 
Rhaas
Premium
join:2005-12-19
Bernie, MO
| Re: "greater loop lengths" It wont extend the reach... much... depending on the service level. You should be able to push a 1.5M service an additional 3kft+, distance depends on the condition of the copper plant. Really it means more bandwidth available for the same given distance.
This is from our testing in '07: »Bonded DSL Testing the 'black-box' mentioned in that thread are Charles Ind. Adrenalines (they were beta then and I couldn't discuss them at the time). | |
|
| |
patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| supression of innovation A decade too late.
I can do VPN bonding with linux since day one. Why has it taken 10 years and counting for an ISP to figure out how to do it?
Innovation warehousing, hoarding of IP capital, patent suppression, and collusion in suppression of innovation and progression by the incumbents to avoid a profit loosing disruptive technology from affecting them or forcing them to innovate is the problem with the world now.
There is so much technology and surpression of innovation in this world. Just pick up a copy of Popular Mechanics from the last 5 decades and 99% of their "future" crap has never happened. | |
|
| 
copper FTW
@qwest.net
| Re: supression of innovation What is VPN bonding that you speak ? I think you may be referring to bridging two physical interfaces in linux (e.g eth0 and eth1 would become br0 ) xDSL technology is a lot different then that type of setup and pair bonding is not easy or fast to deploy. | |
|
| | |
DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
clubs:
| Answers to a few questions To address a couple of the questions:
We do not anticipate offering longer distance products using bonding, but bonding does allow delivery of faster service at a given distance. So, at a location where a customer might get 1.5Mbps/384kbps, with bonding they typically can obtain 3.0Mbps/768kbps.
Regarding bonding availability, CPE for ADSL2+ pair bonding have just become available in the last year or so, and the ADSL2+ bond DSLAM code is actually still in beta. We expect general release shortly. This is all quite new stuff.
-Dane | |
|
| 
DataRiker
Premium
join:2002-05-19
Metairie, LA
clubs:
| Re: Answers to a few questions said by DaneJasper  :To address a couple of the questions: We do not anticipate offering longer distance products using bonding, but bonding does allow delivery of faster service at a given distance. So, at a location where a customer might get 1.5Mbps/384kbps, with bonding they typically can obtain 3.0Mbps/768kbps. Regarding bonding availability, CPE for ADSL2+ pair bonding have just become available in the last year or so, and the ADSL2+ bond DSLAM code is actually still in beta. We expect general release shortly. This is all quite new stuff. -Dane What I don't understand is why not use line bonding to serve longer lengths, even if the speed is very low. Many of these people are desperate for anything besides ISDN or 56K.
Sadly, to this day many still only have ISDN as a high speed option - which really isn't an option | |
|
| |
DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
clubs:
| Re: Answers to a few questions In California, the maximum length you can legally drive high frequency data on is 17,500ft.
If and when reach extended ADSL2+ is ratified as a standard, that would likely become an option. But for now, as I understand it the standard is not complete, so it would not be legal.
Meanwhile, bonding could let you offer some services in areas that today no one reaches, and at 2x the speed.
-Dane | |
|
| Thislilfishy
join:2008-10-28
Orangeville, ON
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
| said by DaneJasper :To address a couple of the questions: We do not anticipate offering longer distance products using bonding, but bonding does allow delivery of faster service at a given distance. So, at a location where a customer might get 1.5Mbps/384kbps, with bonding they typically can obtain 3.0Mbps/768kbps. Regarding bonding availability, CPE for ADSL2+ pair bonding have just become available in the last year or so, and the ADSL2+ bond DSLAM code is actually still in beta. We expect general release shortly. This is all quite new stuff. -Dane You should talk to the boys at Teksavvy, they've been bonding for quite some time. I've been on mlppp for about a year now using their services. It's been a bumpy ride but they seem to have it all sorted now.
Ian | |
|
| |
DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
clubs:
| Re: Answers to a few questions said by Thislilfishy :said by DaneJasper :To address a couple of the questions: We do not anticipate offering longer distance products using bonding, but bonding does allow delivery of faster service at a given distance. So, at a location where a customer might get 1.5Mbps/384kbps, with bonding they typically can obtain 3.0Mbps/768kbps. Regarding bonding availability, CPE for ADSL2+ pair bonding have just become available in the last year or so, and the ADSL2+ bond DSLAM code is actually still in beta. We expect general release shortly. This is all quite new stuff. -Dane You should talk to the boys at Teksavvy, they've been bonding for quite some time. I've been on mlppp for about a year now using their services. It's been a bumpy ride but they seem to have it all sorted now. Ian We do have bonding working in the current platform, I think the issue was concurrent POTS voice and bonding on the same card. That required a card update, plus new firmware which is still beta.
They might also be using a different DSLAM/MSA platform than us for bonding.
-Dane | |
|
| |
frnkblk
@mtcnet.net | MLPPP is bonding at a different layer than ADSL2+ line bonding. They should not be confused.
Frank | |
|
hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | DSL? WTFE Why not just spend the money on something else and skip using copper? I mean we can build WiMax systems, MMDS, wireless with Mot Canopy. But yet ISPs are still using Copper. and ADSL2+ at that. Hell even ATT and Qwest are using VDSL!
WTF! | |
|
qworster
join:2001-11-25
Los Angeles, CA
2 edits | Then the law needs to be changed, Dane If current California law limits distances to 17.500 feet and is obsolete and/or does not reflect what can be done with current technology then it should either be changed, or overriden by the FCC. | |
|
| hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Then the law needs to be changed, Dane California is it's own country you should know that by now. And Sonic doesn't have the money to take on that law and the State.
ATT will eat them alive. if the current law is on the side of ATT. | |
|
| |
DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
clubs:
| Re: Then the law needs to be changed, Dane Until reach extended (RE-ADSL2) is ratified as an official standard, I don't think the 17,500ft distance is the real issue.
At that distance, ADSL1 and ADSL2+ are a bit slow and unreliable.
Once RE-ADSL2 is official, clearly longer loops would be useful.
-Dane | |
|
BigBlockChev
join:2004-09-18
| How is the real-world bonded performance? What kind of real world speeds are you seeing with bonded ADSL? I don't live in Sonic.net area but one of my local ISPs is starting to advertise bonded ADSL, but none of the techs have seen it in use yet. In my own situation, I have 10mbps down, 1mbps up ADSL. My modem syncs up at about 12mbps down and 940kbps up. My speed tests show about 9.5mbps down, 850 kbps up. If I had a bonded pair would I see double that? Or are there crosstalk issues that keep bonded from being truly double? What kind of increase can a person hope to see by doubling their current DSL service with a bonded offering? I seem to be hampered with 850kbps upload due to the SNR of my single line. | |
|
teekblang
join:2009-04-06
Glendale, CA
| RATES I am thinking of disconnecting my service with AT&T because of their stupid price change. Where can I compare the price list on DSL provider in Glendale (los Angeles Area).
If the price is attractive for a single static IP I will get one otherwise dynamic is fine | |
|
|
|
|
Sonic.Net Cooking Up Line Bonded ADSL2+
·
·
