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Sonic.Net Unveils Free Wi-Fi Plan
CEO chats up organic, Meraki approach to local Wi-Fi
(old news - 04:43PM Monday Sep 03 2007)
tags: dsl · business · wireless · alternatives · SONIC.NET

Independent California-based DSL ISP Sonic.net has launched the San Francisco WiFi Project, an effort to deliver free Wi-Fi to San Francisco residents. The company is offering inexpensive Meraki gear (previously discussed here) to customers at a subsidized rate. Customers can buy a $40 Wi-Fi starter kit that includes a Meraki Mini (see right), ethernet cables and a startup guide.

The truly plug and play device can then act as a repeater with other routers in the neighborhood, offering 500kbps free service locally. In the e-mail sent out to customers, the company hints at the possibility that Google ad revenue from free users could be applied as discounts to DSL customer bills:
"Free users will see a small Google ad bar at the top of their browser. At this time, we're not able to generate revenue from the ad bar, but in the future we will split revenue that the network makes with you as a credit against your bill. It could be a rather small credit, so don't get your hopes too high at this stage; this is still experimental and we are still working out many of the details."
Click for full size
CEO Dane Jasper tells us it's different from similar concepts such as FON because "we're not trying to WiFi the world - just portions of California." Jasper notes that in Santa Rosa, CA, where FON has a handful of hotspots, Sonic has 6,000 DSL users. Also unlike Fon, they're putting some Meraki gear on city street lights.

"Where Fon charges for day use, and in most cases keeps all of the money, we're offering free access, with ad support, and will share those revenues," he says. Ultimately, Jasper says his company wants to allow Sonic.net customers faster access to the network than the free users. Customers who host access points will eventually see even faster speeds, with no ads.

Click for full size
"However, the key features required to deliver this are not in the Meraki product today," Jasper tells us. "We're hopeful that they'll choose to implement authenticated WPA with RADIUS for Sonic.net customers, and provide the ability to set speed and ad display toggle via the RADIUS options flags."

Click for full size
Once the Meraki gear is capable, Jasper says they'd like to offer Sonic customers 1Mbps free access. Customers who host a Meraki gateway would get 2Mbps. "If/when the network is adequately deployed and reliable for true commercial service, we'd also consider offering a paid tier - perhaps 1Mbps for $10 to $20," he adds.

We asked Dane his thoughts on the current troubles facing citywide Wi-Fi at the moment. "The costs are large, the product is not as reliable or fast as wired products, so it's difficult to justify massive scale investment," he says. "This is the reason that we've selected a more organic approach, working with our customers as gateways for the network. We don't see WiFi ever replacing DSL or cable."

"Creating a network with the availability, speed and reliability of today's wired products is an impossible goal. However, it's a wonderful add on, and users do make use of WiFi where it's deployed."

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Forums » Sonic.Net Unveils Free Wi-Fi Plan
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Post a:

justmesqui
Just-
Premium
join:2004-05-14
BH9 2RJ

Free internet organization around the world

All i say is

www.meraki.com if you are in the USA

www.fon.com if you are in Europe also good in America

free the internet, unwire the whole world

guhuna
R.I.P Mike
Premium
join:2001-03-31
Birds Landing, CA

Hope for the best.

Hopefully everything works out.

LiamJunket
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Ocean City, NJ
·Comcast


3 edits

Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

One big problem with this. Those users who are actually hosting Gateways and are not sonic.net DSL users are almost all(AT&T or Verizon ?) breaking their provider's TOS. You are not allowed to open your internet connection to those outside of your home. If this starts to actually grow in usage, look for the ISPs to start dropping the customers providing internet access.

Or have they made sure that only sonic.net dsl users can be gateways?

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DaneJasper
Sonic.Net
Premium,VIP
join:2001-08-20
Santa Rosa, CA
clubs:

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

said by LiamJunket See Profile :

One big problem with this. Those users who are actually hosting Gateways and are not sonic.net DSL users are almost all(AT&T or Verizon ?) breaking their provider's TOS. You are not allowed to open your internet connection to those outside of your home. If this starts to actually grow in usage, look for the ISPs to start dropping the customers providing internet access.

Or have they made sure that only sonic.net dsl users can be gateways?

This is one of the big advantages of working with the ISP on the WiFi. We know the unit is out there, and on what IP, so if/when we see any bad behavior, we know if it's our customer or a WiFi user. This can be a HUGE deal when the US Secret Service or FBI show up.

-Dane

KA3SGM
- -... ...- -
Premium
join:2006-01-17
West Chester, PA
clubs:
·Cricket Broadband
·Verizon FIOS

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

said by DaneJasper See Profile :

said by LiamJunket See Profile :

One big problem with this. Those users who are actually hosting Gateways and are not sonic.net DSL users are almost all(AT&T or Verizon ?) breaking their provider's TOS. You are not allowed to open your internet connection to those outside of your home. If this starts to actually grow in usage, look for the ISPs to start dropping the customers providing internet access.

Or have they made sure that only sonic.net dsl users can be gateways?

This is one of the big advantages of working with the ISP on the WiFi. We know the unit is out there, and on what IP, so if/when we see any bad behavior, we know if it's our customer or a WiFi user. This can be a HUGE deal when the US Secret Service or FBI show up.

-Dane
Good Lord, what about my Dual gateway 8 Node Meraki network I am running???

It covers a good 1/4 to 1/2 mile around my neighborhood.

...but wait, it's set up with WPA Encryption, and only my Laptop and my kids Sony PSP have the WPA key.

My own PERSONAL mini-muni WiFi project.

I don't see how that violates any ISP's TOS as long as I don't resell their service or offer it up for free.
--
We're Gonna Need A Bigger Boat !!

LiamJunket
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Ocean City, NJ
·Comcast

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

said by KA3SGM See Profile :

]Good Lord, what about my Dual gateway 8 Node Meraki network I am running???

It covers a good 1/4 to 1/2 mile around my neighborhood.

...but wait, it's set up with WPA Encryption, and only my Laptop and my kids Sony PSP have the WPA key.

My own PERSONAL mini-muni WiFi project.

I don't see how that violates any ISP's TOS as long as I don't resell their service or offer it up for free.

And it doesn't violate any TOS. Your links, that you pay for, and only your family using it. Then no contract terms are violated.
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Internet News
My BLOG
My Web Page

KA3SGM
- -... ...- -
Premium
join:2006-01-17
West Chester, PA
clubs:
·Cricket Broadband
·Verizon FIOS

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

said by LiamJunket See Profile :

said by KA3SGM See Profile :

]Good Lord, what about my Dual gateway 8 Node Meraki network I am running???

It covers a good 1/4 to 1/2 mile around my neighborhood.

...but wait, it's set up with WPA Encryption, and only my Laptop and my kids Sony PSP have the WPA key.

My own PERSONAL mini-muni WiFi project.

I don't see how that violates any ISP's TOS as long as I don't resell their service or offer it up for free.

And it doesn't violate any TOS. Your links, that you pay for, and only your family using it. Then no contract terms are violated.
The Meraki firmware seems pretty capable of doing some really neat things.

I don't know if it can go this far, but I see a wireless mesh topology world, where your nodes can route your neighbors traffic, and your neighbors nodes route yours, all operating seamlessly, with no loss of security.

Everyone has their own private gateway, and access to it via a much larger muni WiFi platform.

WOW, If John Lennon was alive today, he would probably write a song about it.

Imagine there was no 2.4GHz co-channel interference.....
--
We're Gonna Need A Bigger Boat !!

rec9140
Provoice just DO it

join:2003-07-29
Mulberry, FL

said by KA3SGM See Profile :
what about my Dual gateway 8 Node Meraki network I am running???

It covers a good 1/4 to 1/2 mile around my neighborhood.

OOooooo...good some one who has some of these and has technical knowledge to post about their operation.

How about some pix's of your sites.

Some posts about your experiences in setup, operation, etc. would be great. Especially from some one who has a RF background.

I've been thinking of putting these up in an area as my own little project, so some input from some one using them would be great.
--
Lorem ipsum ei pro stet equidem labores, at enim animal expetenda nec. Ea vix argumentum dissentiunt, usu esse ridens ex.

KA3SGM
- -... ...- -
Premium
join:2006-01-17
West Chester, PA
clubs:
·Cricket Broadband
·Verizon FIOS

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

Sorry no current pix are available.

Directional antennas between nodes.

Pick the least used channels in your neighborhood.

Low loss Times Microwave Systems LMR-400 or LMR-600 coax for feedlines.

Do more research on RF propagation at 2.4GHz.

You still need to do battle with your own Microwave Oven.
--
We're Gonna Need A Bigger Boat !!

NJxxxJon
something good. or your mom.
Premium
join:2005-10-22
00000

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

Screw this crap on Street Lights....we need CAMERAS to catch crime on street lights. Did FON ever work? I still have the damn router thing. I should sell or mod the hell out of it.
--
\\"I don't have a girlfriend, I just know a girl that would get mad if I said that." \\Mitch Hedberg
unoriginal

join:2000-07-12
San Diego, CA

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

You can install DD-WRT on it. I used my Fon as a repeater for my main WRT54G also running DD-WRT.

JoeG4

join:2001-12-16
945941
·Vonage

Re: Users hosting Gateway AP's breaking ISP TOS???

Seems a little lame to me, IMHO. So basically, they offer everyone in SF free internet, and pass the costs on to their paying customers. *rolls eyes*

Hey that's what I'm seeing!

veloslave
Geek For God
Premium
join:2003-07-11
Pleasant Hill, CA
·SONIC.NET


1 edit

Sonic Rules!

Been with it for a while now... got in early.

Sonic is NOT your average uptight "TOS you till you are blue in the face" ISP... they are a company that is light on its feet and always thinking.

Good product, GREAT service and even some out of the box thinking that is pretty darn rare from an ISP these days.

If ATT were offering a 10Mb connection for the same price as Sonic's 6Mb connection that I currently have, for the same price... there would be NO DEBATE. I would stick with Sonic... companies that really do care are such a rare find in ANY industry.
--
Mom was right.... I NEED fiber!
Ih8comcrap

join:2004-12-11
Castro Valley, CA

Re: Sonic Rules!

Could not agree more with the kudos to Sonic. One very happy long time customer here. Let's roll this out in Castro Valley Dane

elvey
Spamassassin

join:2001-02-17
San Francisco, CA
·Pacific Bell - SBC
·Comcast
·SONIC.NET

Sales?

I'll be interested to hear how popular this is. There's only a 'feel-good' benefit to the user; they pay $40 and their 'net connection gets a bit slower.

I'm a big Sonic fan, but I'd be surprised if even 1% of Sonic customers go for it.

I signed up for and run a FON node, but with extremely rare exceptions: no one ever uses it, and I don't use others. I had a friend use it at my place the other day only because their old computer couldn't do the WPA encryption of my normal WiFi router.

I can't figure out what the numbers on the network map (»sonic.net/wifi/netinfo/map/) mean. Seems to be the beginning of a mesh network only at Sonic HQ in Santa Rosa.
What do the "9" and "10+" in SF mean??? I click on 'em and nothing happens.
--
SBC is the world's second-largest SpamHaus and leads an Organized Crime Syndicate. Also see TURN.org or UCAN.

Glasshouse

@santarosa.edu

Re: Sales?

I was looking for an answer for that and couldn't find one. My gut believes they are the number of users on that node, but I am still not convinced. So, side with me or my gut it is your choice.

elvey
Spamassassin

join:2001-02-17
San Francisco, CA

Re: Sales?

You're right, I think, assuming sf.meraki.com/overview has the same meaning.

Interesting - they're free if you get 'em direct from meraki...
Forums » Sonic.Net Unveils Free Wi-Fi Plan


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