 
ztmike
Mark for moderation
Premium
join:2001-08-02
Michigan City, IN | DSL dsl upload speeds slow? Never.. 
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www.youtube.com/watch?v=mdYueIC1pjM | |
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maartena
Nice'n Round.
Premium
join:2002-05-10
Orange, CA
 ·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: DSL DSL, ADSL, ADSL2+, and most DSL technologies have one enourmous drawback. To get more upload then about 1 Mbps, you pretty much need to live right next to the CO.
VDSL can give you up to about 5 Mbps upstream provided you are actually within 800ft of the CO or something like that. U-Verse from AT&T has 1.5 Mbps upload, BUT you have to be close to a DSLAM for that.
Telco's need to switch to fiberoptics to get the powerusers. My cable company offers 15/2 connections (for businesses, I have 10/1 but i think they will upgrade everyone). NO telco is going to give me that (I am 11000 ft from the CO) unless they run fiber into my home.
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"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -
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adisor19
join:2004-10-11
 ·TekSavvy Solutions..
·Radioactif
·Videotron
·Look Communications
| Re: DSL said by maartena  :DSL, ADSL, ADSL2+, and most DSL technologies have one enourmous drawback. To get more upload then about 1 Mbps, you pretty much need to live right next to the CO. VDSL can give you up to about 5 Mbps upstream provided you are actually within 800ft of the CO or something like that. U-Verse from AT&T has 1.5 Mbps upload, BUT you have to be close to a DSLAM for that. Telco's need to switch to fiberoptics to get the powerusers. My cable company offers 15/2 connections (for businesses, I have 10/1 but i think they will upgrade everyone). NO telco is going to give me that (I am 11000 ft from the CO) unless they run fiber into my home. Umm, did someone forget about Annex M by any chance ? Annex M gives ADSL2+ up to 3Mbps upload speed yet these guys aren't even offering it.. makes you wonder..
Adi | |
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| | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| said by maartena :DSL, ADSL, ADSL2+, and most DSL technologies have one enourmous drawback. To get more upload then about 1 Mbps, you pretty much need to live right next to the CO. VDSL can give you up to about 5 Mbps upstream provided you are actually within 800ft of the CO or something like that. U-Verse from AT&T has 1.5 Mbps upload, BUT you have to be close to a DSLAM for that. Telco's need to switch to fiberoptics to get the powerusers. My cable company offers 15/2 connections (for businesses, I have 10/1 but i think they will upgrade everyone). NO telco is going to give me that (I am 11000 ft from the CO) unless they run fiber into my home. What happened to putting a SDSL card into the RT? | |
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| | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Toledo, OH
·buckeye cable
| How do you figure DSL has enourmous set backs? North Point DSL and others back in the DSL Boom oftered faster DSL than what we have now! Where in the hell did all of that equipment that ATT and MCI (now VZ Business) buy when everyone went bankrupt. Someone surely knows what happened to it.
The fact is Telcos REFUSE to spend any damn money on their customers. If they can get away without doing it and staying in business they will. Telco's suck! and the CEO only cares about their bank account when they retire so they milk every damn thing they can. | |
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espaeth
Digital Plumber
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN | If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... Maybe if we got enough people to sign a petition we can get crosstalk considerations removed from the ADSL2+ protocol spec! | |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... Yeah, if only there were a technology that offered faster upstream speeds! Gosh, we're just sunk. | |
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pokesph
It Is Almost Fast
Premium
join:2001-06-25
Sacramento, CA
clubs: | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... Maybe, just maybe, we can just bond 2 lines together. | |
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mikepd
Discovery
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-26
New Port Richey, FL
clubs: | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... Not going to happen since true line bonding requires support at the ISP end as well as the subscriber end.
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Always Reach Beyond Your Grasp | |
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Matt
Quitting Caffeine - Argh
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... said by espaeth :said by mikepd :Not going to happen since true line bonding requires support at the ISP end as well as the subscriber end. No ISP support necessary. You just need to have a box somewhere with sufficient bandwidth (ie, a server at a local data center) and establish a multilink PPP session to that. Screw fiber to the home or DOCSIS 3.0, let's all order 2 DSL lines, co-locate a server in a data center, pay for our bandwidth there, just so we can get 1.8Mbps upstream!
Whooo! | |
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PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
Riverside, WA | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... No kidding. A much cheaper alternative would be to order two lines and connect them to a dual-WAN router. Although I'm not sure if you can max out both lines with only one connection (say, uploading a large file to a server). | |
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| | | | | | | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... said by PolarBear :No kidding. A much cheaper alternative would be to order two lines and connect them to a dual-WAN router. Although I'm not sure if you can max out both lines with only one connection (say, uploading a large file to a server). A dual WAN router just doesn't cut it. I'm not sure what algorithms it uses, but I assume most websites are smart enough to not allow loading of password protected resources from 2 different IPs with the exact same cookie, or sign out the 1st IP immediately if a 2nd IP trys to access a resource. Also a dual WAN router, AFAIK, can't cut up an image into a 2 Partial transfers, buffer the image in its RAM, then once the entire image is in RAM, pretend to be an HTTP server (hijacking the existing connection) to the PC and deliver the image under 1 HTTP connection. Just tunnel it to a datacenter and ressemble the tunnels into 1 tunnel. | |
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PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
Riverside, WA | BLASPHEMY! Shut your mouth, such evils should not be spoken of! | |
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| | | attsbcisgay
join:2003-03-18
Beverly Hills, CA
| said by pokesph :Maybe, just maybe, we can just bond 2 lines together. only a pair is used... there are 2 pair or 4 wire in a phone line.
if you could utilize that yes, you can basically go from 8/1 to 80/10 and that would be practical. | |
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| | | vortex91
join:2000-08-18
Glendale, CA | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... oh gee FTTH? | |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | Juice boosted carrier pigeon? | |
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maartena
Nice'n Round.
Premium
join:2002-05-10
Orange, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by espaeth :said by Karl Bode :Yeah, if only there were a technology that offered faster upstream speeds! Name a technology that Qwest could deploy at the same or lower costs than their FTTN ADSL2+ offering that would allow those faster upstream speeds. None. That's why I stick with Cable, because they can.  | |
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| | | EPS
join:2008-02-13
Hingham, MA
| said by espaeth :said by Karl Bode :Yeah, if only there were a technology that offered faster upstream speeds! Name a technology that Qwest could deploy at the same or lower costs than their FTTN ADSL2+ offering that would allow those faster upstream speeds. Yes, Qwest shouldn't have to spend MORE money! God, how dare some suggest that they may be better off with a more expensive choice- haven't those unlucky enough to hold shares in Q suffered enough?
Qwest dug themselves into this pit with all their debt, but now I don't really see how they can do anything else- they simply don't have the capability to make huge expensive deployments like telecom mega-conglomerates VZ and T. | |
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| | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| said by espaeth :said by Karl Bode :Yeah, if only there were a technology that offered faster upstream speeds! Name a technology that Qwest could deploy at the same or lower costs than their FTTN ADSL2+ offering that would allow those faster upstream speeds. LMDS wireless to the home from the RT? | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Gosh, if only the whiners would get together and put up $20 billion, they could build the "perfect" network instead of bitching about what everyone else isn't doing for them. | |
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SLD
join:2002-04-17
Los Angeles, CA | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... Maybe we can commendeer some of the money from the Iraq "war" for this. | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... Or better, give it back to the taxpayers. | |
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| | | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| said by Dogfather :Gosh, if only the whiners would get together and put up $20 billion, they could build the "perfect" network instead of bitching about what everyone else isn't doing for them. Start making physical plant being owned by non-profits that don't report to Wall Street and therefore don't have $3000 a month T1s (in a Datacenter BTW). | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | I do remote desktop over 3Mbps/512kbps - and it works just fine. As far as uploading large files...get off Windows platform, and use Solaris/Linux/HP-UX and Java/Weblogic
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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quetwo
That VoIP Guy
Premium
join:2004-09-04
East Lansing, MI | Re: If only user desire trumped engineering obstacles... What exactally does Windows have to do with the size of a download? Last I checked, Linux ISOs/DVDs are pretty large too... | |
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DaMaGeINC
The Lan Man
Premium
join:2002-06-08
Greenville, SC
clubs: | Ya, what does uploading large files have to do with the Windows Platform? | |
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hurfy
Premium
join:2002-08-06
Spokane, WA
| umm So he is wants T1 speeds uploading and some multiple of T1 downloading at a tenth the price of a T1 correct?
Having a hard time mustering up too much sympathy 
At least most ISPs got away from 128/256 upstream and the biggest number they can muster for downstream and gave us something to work with.
I don't need more bandwidth, i need shorter routing 
Be nice if my internet didn't go 2-3000 miles to get across the street (ok, it's really 2 whole blocks!) :/ | |
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| patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| said by hurfy :So he is wants T1 speeds uploading and some multiple of T1 downloading at a tenth the price of a T1 correct? T1 is a technological synonym for DSL. Only difference is you get a refund of that month's insanely high price if the line breaks down for more than a few hours. Business managers are fools and don't know the difference. | |
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| veldy
join:1999-08-04
Minneapolis, MN
·Comcast
 ·callwithus
·ViaTalk
·VoicePulse
·Callcentric
·Vonage
| said by hurfy :So he is wants T1 speeds uploading and some multiple of T1 downloading at a tenth the price of a T1 correct? Having a hard time mustering up too much sympathy The difference is LOS and the fact that bandwidth is not shared. Consumers are not paying for this and THAT is why the pricing model for consumer internet service is cheaper. Overselling is built into the pricing model.
said by hurfy :At least most ISPs got away from 128/256 upstream and the biggest number they can muster for downstream and gave us something to work with. I don't need more bandwidth, i need shorter routing Be nice if my internet didn't go 2-3000 miles to get across the street (ok, it's really 2 whole blocks!) :/ At the speed of light, information can pass around the equator of the planet seven times in a second [thus it is possible that the furthest point on the planet, if connected via fiber, would only add an additional 7ms latency in one direction]. Routing across the country can affect latency a bit, perhaps 10ms in some cases, but if it does this to avoid congestion at another point, then you are getting a net latency gain over choosing a geographically closer but over utilized route. In other words, you read way to much into the physical locations of your route. | |
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dadkins
Can you do Blu?
Premium,MVM
join:2003-09-26
Hercules, CA
·Comcast
2 edits | Only pirates... ... need any sort of faster upload!!!1
Remember, if you are uploading anything, you are doing something illegal! 
Just incase someone misses it, ^^^ That is severe sarcasm!
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Think outside the Fox... Opera | |
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yuutomo
The Wonder Kitter
Premium
join:2001-08-27
Missoula, MT |  well..
want good broadband, move to a country that will respect your rights as a person and also take care of the environment. | |
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Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
1 edit | Re: well.. ...and don't let the door hit ya in the ass. | |
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yuutomo
The Wonder Kitter
Premium
join:2001-08-27
Missoula, MT | Re: well.. the door will be taken if and when I leave the country, I gave my blood and sweat in service to my country. I can say anything I damn well please, you don;t like it, go jump on a landmine. | |
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yuutomo
The Wonder Kitter
Premium
join:2001-08-27
Missoula, MT | Re: well.. ah, I see you like to add and reinterpret anything said to you. you must be a loyal big oil bj toadie as well and a shill for Verizon. I will leave you to your sandbox little boy, since you can't stand to hear your bosses badmouthed. | |
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robertfl
Premium
join:2005-10-10
Mary Esther, FL | Greed this is about greed at the top
ISP's can easily support faster speeds at lower prices.
but that's not happening
-Rob | |
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| dynodb
Premium,VIP
join:2004-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
| Re: Greed said by robertfl :this is about greed at the top ISP's can easily support faster speeds at lower prices. but that's not happening -Rob Please share with us your extensive research and expertise that brought you to this conclusion.
Or shall we just assume the obvious- that you've no idea what you're talking about and falling back on the standard "Big Evil Corporations are the source of all evil" kneejerk response that's the norm around here? | |
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rmdir
join:2003-03-13
Chicago, IL | call a data plumber They just need to put in bigger tubes. | |
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The Beer
I Love It When A Plan Comes Together
Premium
join:2001-07-24
Omaha, NE
clubs: | In all fairness I like to bash Qwest as much as the next guy however even 896 up is 2 to 4 even 6 times faster than ALL of Cox's tiers before you hit the Premium tier. Even then you only get 1MB. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| Re: In all fairness said by The Beer :I like to bash Qwest as much as the next guy however even 896 up is 2 to 4 even 6 times faster than ALL of Cox's tiers before you hit the Premium tier. Even then you only get 1MB. Actually cox's standard tier gives you 768kbps upload and premium is 1536kbps upload with powerboost taking it to around 3 to 5mbps.
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When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
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dynodb
Premium,VIP
join:2004-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
| Yawn And exactly how many providers make a big stink about upstream speeds in terms of marketing?
Up until very recently, a lot providers were only offering in the neighborhood of 386k to 768k upstream- some still do. Given the choice, most would have the higher downstream than a higher upstream at the expense of downstream speed.
If a work from home "power user" needs faster upstream speeds, switch to a provider or service that offers it. Problem solved. | |
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elios
join:2005-11-15
Springfield, MO
·Mediacom
| Re: Yawn said by dynodb :And exactly how many providers make a big stink about upstream speeds in terms of marketing? Up until very recently, a lot providers were only offering in the neighborhood of 386k to 768k upstream- some still do. Given the choice, most would have the higher downstream than a higher upstream at the expense of downstream speed. If a work from home "power user" needs faster upstream speeds, switch to a provider or service that offers it. Problem solved. and if there ISNT a faster one? then what | |
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Hes Dead Jim
@verizon.net
| said by dynodb :And exactly how many providers make a big stink about upstream speeds in terms of marketing? Up until very recently, a lot providers were only offering in the neighborhood of 386k to 768k upstream- some still do. Given the choice, most would have the higher downstream than a higher upstream at the expense of downstream speed. If a work from home "power user" needs faster upstream speeds, switch to a provider or service that offers it. Problem solved. Really?! Just like that? and that is just going to get rid of the zoned areas and duopoly system providers setup in regions?...laff | |
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Asmodeus
join:2004-05-26
Spring Valley, CA
| upload speeds are a joke ISP's wide Seriously, outside of Fios, why can't these isps dole out the upload speeds to at least t1 speeds. Yeah, they can give huge download, but then you get hamstrung by upload speeds. I do a lot of work from home and I am constantly uploading large files back to my office. It's so agonizingly slow. | |
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tschmidt
Premium,MVM
join:2000-11-12
Milford, NH
·Verizon Online DSL
·Fairpoint Communic..
| Re: upload speeds are a joke ISP's wide Cable DOCSIS and Telco DSL were designed based on a passive consumption model. There were engineering and business reasons for the trade-off.
As Internet matures part of its promise is a more egalitarian communication model where there are many, rather then a privileged few, content providers. That is why I prefer term First-Mile rather then Last-Mile to describe customer access network. That change is putting severe strain on broadband business model used by most ISPs.
FTTP, like Verizon's FIOS, is the only real long term solution to deliver massive bandwidth to support both video libraries and large scale content creation and telecommuting.
/tom | |
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| | TheMG
join:2007-09-04
Edmonton, AB | Re: upload speeds are a joke ISP's wide Sooner or later ISPs and technology is going to have to get with the times.
One thing is for sure: uploading 1GB of photos at 640kbps to have them printed = not fun. | |
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Spazonator
join:2007-09-16
·FrontierNet Intern..
| Local ISP This is why I'm now with a local ISP now. I get 4 megs down and 2 up for $40 (not much compared with FIOS but for the middle of NE its amazing). I'm very satisfied with my connection and get around 30ms on Battlefield. Enough with the advertisement but to put it simple sometimes the smaller guys are the best and your supporting your local economy because most of the money goes back into your town! | |
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Cyber2lz
join:2001-11-15
Odessa, FL
 ·Verizon FIOS
·RoadRunner Cable
| 20/20 here With FiOS in the hinterlands of West Central Florida.
DL Ubuntu distro last night just because. Limited by MIT's FTP server.
New 1TB Raid 5 box and needed to test it.
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The Light Pipe is the Right Pipe !!! | |
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PolarBear
The bear formerly known as aaron8301
Premium
join:2005-01-03
Riverside, WA
·CableOne
| Some cable isn't any better
CableOne Tiers for Lewiston, Idaho |
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There comes a point in your life when you get tired of fixing everything and wiping everyone's ass. But it’s not giving up. It’s realizing that you don’t need certain people and the bullshit and drama they bring to your life. | |
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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Floral Park, NY | crappy qwest.. qwest should at least commit to what former BellSouth was going to do before the AT&T merger in terms of speed & coverage! what they're doing now is crap... | |
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| hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Toledo, OH | Re: crappy qwest.. BS had a lot of fiber out already in the field doing Fiber In The Loop. Many ISPs did not like this but if BS would not have sold to ATT they would be farther ahead in terms of what speeds ATT is putting out. | |
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Sorry Qwest, 'Next Generation' Broadband Isn't 896kbps Upstream
