 
MysticGogeta
The Robot Devil
Premium
join:2005-03-14
League City, TX
clubs: | Still impressive I think thats great this could be an alternative to cable/dsl. | |
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qqqq
@QWEST.NET
| Re: Still impressive I would definately dump my qworst dsl if it ever becomes available but I am a bit cynical about the availability/price. Like it happens with all innovations greed will takeover engineering feats  | |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
 ·Comcast
| Re: Still impressive It wouldn't be a bad engineering feat, but the pricing sucks. In Chicago you can get either 1.5mb dsl for $20 or 6mb Comcrap or WOW for roughly $50. If you want to roam freely, theres enough coffee houses where in alot of neighborhoods you don't have to pay a dime (not to mention the 50,000 unsecured "Linksys" SSIDs)!
Whats the incentive to switch besides hatred of ATT or Comcrap?
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Burn a tire, but make sure you buy that carbon offset! | |
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| | | jester121
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL | Re: Still impressive A deep burning desire for secured data transmission?
Or maybe the knowledge that you can hook up even if you can't find a parking spot at Panera? | |
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| | | | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
2 edits | Re: Still impressive I have 40 SSIDs that I can see from my condo building. I can only solidly connect to one or two if I'm lucky and half the time the connection dies. I need solid connection for work and am willing to pay $60/month for EVDO for significantly more reliability than WiFi and more flexibility/mobility than cable/dsl.
There are millions already paying $60/month for EVDO/HSDPA laptop cards. WiMAX will start at $50/month with no contracts and go down with mass adoption. As I said in another thread, many will be willing to pay for mobility just like we pay more for cellphones that have less reliability/quality than landline phones.
I've dumped cable modem for EVDO just as I've dumped landline phone for cellphone only. Many more will do the same with WiMAX as it's better than EVDO and will be more reliably available than WiFi.
Eventually you'll be buying laptops and consumer devices that have WiMAX and you won't even know it. I'd bet that you would at least try it, especially since there is no annual contract involved.
In 2-3 years time, you probably will not be able to buy a laptop w/out WiMAX/WiFi combo in the same way as you can't find a laptop today w/out WiFi. | |
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xenophon
join:2007-09-17
1 edit | Performance Here's the image from their test..
Speedtest.net doesn't show proper latency. It's probably much lower than 70ms. | |
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| expert007
join:2006-01-10
Buffalo, NY | Re: Performance Xenophone, just a WAG that you were on the boat. Are they saying that the actual speeds might be somewhere in the neighborhood of what you experienced, with say +/- 300Kbps or so??
Thanks | |
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| | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
3 edits | Re: Performance It can be compared to EVDO. Sprint supplies about 1.4-3Mbps, maybe more to EVDO sites. Many are able to get 2Mbps at times but the average is 700k-1Mbps.
WiMAX sites will likely be supplied 10Mbps minimum, so the average will likely be 2-4Mbps, with peaks near 10Mbps with low usage and near a site.
btw, the image above isn't mine, it's from the article. | |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
·Comcast
| Re: Performance If it can be compared to EDVO, then I can assume like EDVO, there will be plenty of deadspots. On the Southside of Chicago, EDVO is notorius for being inconsistent. I can't see how this made frontpage of BBR. They took 12 people with laptops and a few with cell phones, put them in a virtually a straight line with minimal intrusions and got connectivity....great. Now lets see 1000 people with boundries from Lake to Van Buren and Michigan to Canal. The results will be totally different.
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Burn a tire, but make sure you buy that carbon offset! | |
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| | | | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | Re: Performance said by S_engineer  :If it can be compared to EDVO, then I can assume like EDVO, there will be plenty of deadspots. On the Southside of Chicago, EDVO is notorius for being inconsistent. I can't see how this made frontpage of BBR. They took 12 people with laptops and a few with cell phones, put them in a virtually a straight line with minimal intrusions and got connectivity....great. Now lets see 1000 people with boundries from Lake to Van Buren and Michigan to Canal. The results will be totally different. Yeah, wireless broadband performance will ALWAYS vary widely. It's the nature of the beast. If you want to be stuck to wired broadband go for it. But I've dumped my cable modem for EVDO and never looked back, don't miss wired at all.
WiMAX will be even better and in more variety of devices. For WiMAX devices that use MIMO antennas, there will be less variance. But tower/site load will always be tough to manage as well for the carriers. | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | I've never used EVDO. UMTS/HSDPA works well for me though (~100 ms latency tethered to cell phone)
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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ztmike
Mark for moderation
Premium
join:2001-08-02
Michigan City, IN | just cells? This is just for cell phones and not your home desktop...correct? | |
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BodyBumper
join:2004-06-21
Beverly Hills, CA | Re: just cells? No, Xohm/WiMAX is not exclusively for cellphones. | |
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| | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: just cells? WiMAX will be built into laptops, phones, cars, GPS devices, cameras/camcorders, internet radios, pretty much any device that could benefit from being on the Net.
You won't see that with 3G, LTE or cell-based systems. It's just too limiting. WiMAX is more open like WiFi.
To start with, laptops will be the primary use of WiMAX with a few phones maybe. | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA
·RoadRunner Cable
 ·DSL EXTREME
| Re: just cells? Yeah - CDMA/GSM are currently limited because they've been based on providing voice service as their base, Internet as a secondary service.
WiFi/WiMAX are data based services only.
Lets hope WiMAX does the right thing and start using SIM cards.
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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join:2004-09-07
Cadillac, MI
| As usual, it'll be brought online in cities, where customers have 1, 2, or 3 other options for broadband.
Then there are people like me who are 2 miles out of cable range and 4 out of dsl range. Neither network will be upgraded to include me in anything less than 10 years. I pay $54/mo for ISDN and have tried (more than once) to justify a $200/mo. T1. I'd pay $75+ per month for the kind of service they're talking about.
But again, it'll never happen. They want the population base of cities. Same old story, same old game. I know I pay a price for living where I can pee off my back porch without anyone knowing, but dang is it frustrating.
Don't even get me started about people whining because they have 6M cable and want 8M cable. Crikey, I wish..... | |
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StuckWithSat
@tmodns.net | Re: just cells? I totally agree - I will be *amazed* if this Xohm service is made available anywhere where there isn't already cable and DSL and T1 etc etc. Rural areas will continue to be totally ignored. | |
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| | | | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: just cells? said by StuckWithSat :
Rural areas will continue to be totally ignored.
Clearwire will be rolling out to many rural areas, which will be marketed under Sprint's XOHM brand. But it will take forever to get to the whole country where there isn't any kind of density. States will probably have to subsidize Sprint/Clearwire for significant state-wide coverage as they would lose money to supply a connection to a few users.. | |
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| | | | aeblank
join:2004-09-07
Cadillac, MI
| Re: just cells? said by sirwoogie :I think Cadillac and the western part of the state will start to get better, most especially if the 700Mhz auction goes to who we hope it goes to.  Actually we have EVDO in Caddy now. I want to do some speed tests closer to town (with more signal). But the "EV" icon is lit on my brother's phone. This just happened within the last month or so. My family plan is full, but I'm contemplating a very custom router that can load balance and only connect at certain times (non-peak). Someday........ | |
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r81984
Thread is
Premium
join:2001-11-14
St John'S, NL | Sprint Broadband Direct v2.0 I hope try number 2 works.
Remember Sprint Broadband Direct.
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»www.ryanoneill.us | |
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majortom1029
join:2006-10-19
Lindenhurst, NY | work I hope it gets better speeds. 3g goes up to 3.6 down. SO for their sake I hope they can get it faster. Heck here in suffolk and nasau county they are working on wifi for both counties.
So what makes wimax better then 3g or wifi ? | |
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| xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
4 edits | Re: work 3G theoretical MAX is at 3.6Mbps but the average is only 700Kbps to 1Mpbs with peaks to maybe 2Mbps or so. The first revision of WiMAX will probably MAX around 10Mbps and average 2-4Mbps - much higher than current 3G. And WiMAX latency is much better than 3Gtoo.
The WiMAX devices themselves coming out are capable of up to 30Mbps in labs, but the infrastructure won't support that yet.
It all depends on how much backhaul is fed to the site as well. Sounds like Sprint will be feeding >10MBps to most sites. They'll also be using WiMAX as a backhaul to other WiMAX sites. So they may feed over 1Gb to one site and have it feed other WiMAX sites that have no landline backhaul or possibly repeaters sitting on city lightpoles. | |
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en102
Canadian, eh?
join:2001-01-26
Valencia, CA | Re: work I think the 'big' benefit (at least for Xohm) is that they have ~100MHz of spectrum to deploy in, and don't have any 'baggage' of providing cell based calls through PSTN.
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Canada = Hollywood North | |
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| | | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: work I agree. Sprint and Clearwire already own 100mhz spectrum per market for WiMAX (as well as Sprint's 3G spectrum). The other carriers will have a helluva time finding even 20mhz to do 4G, at least to get it nationwide in the US. And they'll have to spend many billions to get a smaller amount. | |
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| | | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | Re: work True enough, but of the EVDO/HSDPA devices currently rolled out, it's at 3.6Mbps MAX but the average is 1/3 that. There are 7.2Mbps 3G devices starting to rollout but ATT isn't supporting it yet.
WiMAX 802.16m theoretical max is 1Gbps and will likely be coming before the carriers get LTE out the door in a few years. But I'd expect WiMAX carriers to only use 802.16m for backhaul at first.
»www.dailywireless.org/2007/02/20···00-mbps/ | |
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LiamJunket
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Ocean City, NJ
·Comcast
|  Related WiMAX news
Intel Corp said on Wednesday it would cooperate with Nokia and Nokia Siemens Networks on Wimax technology, and Nokia would use Intel's semiconductors from 2008.
Nokia is to use Intel's Wimax-semiconductor named Baxter Peak in Nseries Internet table devices in 2008, Intel said in a statement. While WiMAX has been slow to roll out, it does look like momentum is building quickly for a big push in 2008.
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Internet News
My BLOG
My Web Page | |
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ncbill
Premium
join:2007-01-23
Winston Salem, NC | Price is still an issue No real technical advantage over EVDO at this point.
And EVDO can be gotten cheaper (even with a voice plan), if you know what I mean, wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say no more. | |
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| xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
1 edit | Re: Price is still an issue said by ncbill :No real technical advantage over EVDO at this point. And EVDO can be gotten cheaper (even with a voice plan), if you know what I mean, wink, wink, nudge, nudge, say no more. EVDO RevC is more technically like WiMAX, all based on OFDM and MIMO, but probably won't happen now. EVDO Rev0/A has more technical limitations.
Yeah, you can illegally hack EVDO phones and get it connected on a laptop at price of basic service. And you can download movies/music for 'free' too wink wink.
EVDO devices have a high royalty fee to Qualcomm - consumer electronics makers don't want to deal with it. WiMAX currently has none if ever does, will likely be very small.
But WiMAX will eventually be on pretty much any device that can benefit from being connected to the Net. EVDO/HSDPA/LTE will always be mostly limited to cellphones and laptop cards with the closed model of cell-based industry where the carriers want control of what's connected. WiMAX will be more open, like WiFi. | |
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| | ncbill
Premium
join:2007-01-23
Winston Salem, NC
·AT&T Southeast
| Re: Price is still an issue Aren't we still talking about _licensed_ frequencies with WiMax?
If that's the case, I wouldn't expect WiMax to be any more "open" than Clearwire or EVDO.
Though the monthly price may come down sooner than I initially thought (see next thread - Intel's pressing for a $30/month WiMax price plan)
>WiMAX will be more open, like WiFi. | |
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| | xenophon
join:2007-09-17
·Sprint Mobile Broa..
| Re: Price is still an issue I've tested HSDPA and found it to be decent but not on par with EVDO yet. Will be more of a player when it hits 7.2Mbps (if ATT feeds enough backhaul to sites) and has better coverage.
ATT HSDPA is targeted to hit 170m population by end of year. Sprint/Verizon already cover over 210m pops and Sprint will hit 230m by end of the year. Sprint also roams on Alltel EVDO, which has huge coverage in some states. For phones, Sprint data costs quite a bit less.
Here is performance comparisons.. (ignore tests over 3Mbps as it's an AOL proxy problem, come on BBR, fix that)
Sprint »/archive/spcsd···cid=&p=1
VErizon
»/archive/myvzw···cid=&p=1
ATT
»/archive/mycin···cid=&p=1
For phones...
»/mspeed?domains=1
Sprint seems to be winning when it comes to data on price, coverage and performance. Too bad the customer support sucks. | |
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Sprint Xohm Chicago Demo: 3Mbps
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