  LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 |  Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do
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 |  pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Thank you for reminding people of this. It is shameful that so many people are not taught this basic truth, and those who do learn it choose to ignore it.
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"Net Neutrality" zealots - the people you can thank for your capped Internet service. | |
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| | LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Sure, when some companies pay corporate taxes and other can avoid it, there are distortions in the marketplace that makes things less economically efficient. That is the fault of government.
There should be no corporate taxes. But public officials love to tax the sheeple indirectly - it makes them believe they aren't being taxed. If all taxes were levied against individuals directly, as it should be, they would finally realize how much money the government was taking from their pockets.
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»www.politico.com/rss/2012-election.xml
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| | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by Linklist:If all taxes were levied against individuals directly, as it should be, they would finally realize how much money the government was taking from their pockets. So, businesses should get away with basically using fire and police services for free? They should get the benefits of the military without paying something into the cost? They should benefit from the education system without paying something into that system? Get real.
Businesses use and benefit from government services and should pay for them along with individual taxpayers who benefit. If business don't pay for the services that they use, then the tax payer is subsidizing them and frankly, the individual taxpayer has subsidized profitable private industries far too much. | |
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| | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do After all, corporations are people, too! | |
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| | | | |  dib22
join:2002-01-27
Kansas City, MO | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by viperlmw:After all, corporations are people, too!
Then shouldn't they be subject to laws and regulations like the people? | |
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| | | | | | said by GetReal :said by Linklist:If all taxes were levied against individuals directly, as it should be, they would finally realize how much money the government was taking from their pockets. So, businesses should get away with basically using fire and police services for free? They should get the benefits of the military without paying something into the cost? They should benefit from the education system without paying something into that system? Get real. Wow, that was a really impressive job of COMPLETELY ignoring the argument that you were responding to.
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Dresden - I work in Accounts Payable.
Random Bad Guy - In what capacity?
Dresden - I make sure everyone gets what's coming to them. | |
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| | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by footballdude:Wow, that was a really impressive job of COMPLETELY ignoring the argument that you were responding to.
Not quite. The argument was made that taxes should not be levied against businesses, only against natural persons or, in the post replied to, "individuals". There are reasons why businesses should pay taxes, most specifically that they receive benefits from government services. The response was pointing that out that there are reasons businesses should pay taxes too. | |
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| | | | | |  amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do They pay property taxes on their buildings. Just like you pay them on your house. | |
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| | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do A good percentage of corporations have gotten their government flunkies to reduce or eliminate their property taxes. Try doing that with your house | |
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| | | | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do If I employed hundreds of people in my town at my house, I'd probably be able to negotiate something like that. | |
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| | | | | | | | | said by amarryat:They pay property taxes on their buildings. Just like you pay them on your house. Yes that is true, however, the original poster made a statement that taxes should only levied on individuals. If you hash that idea completely out, that preclude property taxes on business properties if they were owned by corporations. | |
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| | | | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Corporations are merely groups of people. Tax that entity and you are really taxing the investors, eg. 401K plans invested in stocks etc. | |
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by amarryat:Corporations are merely groups of people. Tax that entity and you are really taxing the investors, eg. 401K plans invested in stocks etc. Yes they are, which is why the corporate income tax should be zero if we continue to tax capital gains and dividends the way we are doing it now. If the corporation has already paid taxes on its profits, the shareholders shouldn't have to pay taxes again on that same money and vice versa.
However, no person or group of people should benefit from government services without paying for them and corporations receive a benefit from the government in the form of services like fire and police protections. Advocating for no taxes on corporations means that individuals are forced to pay higher rates and are essentially subsidizing the services that businesses receive from the government. | |
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| | | | | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by GetReal :If the corporation has already paid taxes on its profits, the shareholders shouldn't have to pay taxes again on that same money and vice versa.
I dream of that day. By extension, then all money should be taxed once and only once. However it is taxed again and again in the current system. When I get paid, I also pay taxes. When I pay someone to mow the lawn, they pay taxes on the money that I paid them, which was already taxed. And on and on..... | |
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by amarryat:I dream of that day. By extension, then all money should be taxed once and only once. However it is taxed again and again in the current system. When I get paid, I also pay taxes. When I pay someone to mow the lawn, they pay taxes on the money that I paid them, which was already taxed. And on and on..... I don't know how that would work though... You would eventually end up at a point where nothing would be taxed because the money has flowed through the economy a couple of times.
There is no simple solution to an issue like taxation. | |
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| | | | | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by GetReal :said by amarryat:I dream of that day. By extension, then all money should be taxed once and only once. However it is taxed again and again in the current system. When I get paid, I also pay taxes. When I pay someone to mow the lawn, they pay taxes on the money that I paid them, which was already taxed. And on and on..... I don't know how that would work though... You would eventually end up at a point where nothing would be taxed because the money has flowed through the economy a couple of times. There is no simple solution to an issue like taxation. Maybe a consumption tax, but to prevent re-taxation, only on the end product. | |
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| | | | | | | | | dplantz
join:2000-08-02
Roslindale, MA | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do The FairTax does just that taxes once and is a consumption tax. »www.fairtax.org. Gaining more support and more co sponsors each year. I like it. | |
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| | | | | | | | | CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do I was not able to find a single negative consequence on that website!! Is this a perfect tax plan? Any real look at an alternative system should put forth its negatives in addition to its positives.
Please explain how this FairTax derives income from bartering.
How does this system generate revenue from money spent overseas?
Does this system encourage big business to spend more or to spend less? | |
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| | | | | | | | |  93388818It's cool, I'm takin it backPremium
join:2000-03-14
Dallas, TX | Tell that to the 47% of individuals who pay NO federal income taxes whatsoever. | |
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by 93388818:Tell that to the 47% of individuals who pay NO federal income taxes whatsoever.
I love how everyone cherry picks the 47% number. The 47% number comes from the number of tax payers who didn't pay taxes at the worst part of the recession (2009) when millions of people had no jobs, ergo had no taxable income. If you figure in 9 percent unemployment, then it would be close to 38%. If you count total unemployment, including "discouraged workers", which is conservatively around 16%, it drops to 31%. If you count those who work, but are underemployed, that number drops into the upper end of the 20% range.
The number is also inflated due to, get this, the tax cuts that were passed during the Bush administration in 2001 which lowered tax liabilities to zero on many, those same tax cuts that were extended by Obama and then stimulus packages passed by both the Bush and Obama administrations which granted tax credits that pushed even more people to a zero or negative liability.
In other words, the 47% number comes from the fact that the recession has wiped out the earning power of a lot of taxpayers, who before the recession, were paying taxes.
People who use this number clearly have no clue where it comes from and really need to understand where it comes from. The reality is likely much lower than that number when the economic times are less dire. | |
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| | | | | | | | said by GetReal :The argument was made that taxes should not be levied against businesses, only against natural persons or, in the post replied to, "individuals". Nope. His point was that taxes levied against businesses are simply passed on to individuals. | |
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| | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by footballdude:Nope. His point was that taxes levied against businesses are simply passed on to individuals. In the original post, yes. In the post I responded to, no. The point of the post I responded to was that taxes levied on business should be eliminated because they are simply passed on. My point is that creates a problem whereby business benefits from services it doesn't pay for if you do that. There is no reason to debate that those taxes are passed on to customers since we all know that is the case, however it is fair to debate the idea that business should pay no tax because they pass those costs on. | |
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| | | | | | | |  Huh
@verizon.net | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Huh? So you understand business passes the cost of taxation onto customers, hence individuals are already paying for the government services from which the business benefits. Business ALREADY benefits from services it doesn't pay for. Seems you're contradicting your own point... | |
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| | | | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Uh, what? If you continue along your line of reasoning, my employer is paying my property taxes because my money comes from them. And if you keep going, it means that anyone that purchased a service from our company is paying for my property taxes. But because I might have paid for something from our customers' employers, I'm paying them to give me my money back to pay my own taxes. Rinse - wash - repeat.
Seriously, that argument can get a bit ridiculous. | |
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@frontiernet.net | So because I am a small biz owner of a corp this does not mean that me our my staff drives on anymore public roadways, uses more school resources, goes to the library anymore, etc. I pay my taxes as a citizen just like everyone else and then some! Because I am taxed on revenue that I dont get to take home because I like the idea of keeping cash in the bank to pay bills and payroll, I end up with a tax rate about 40%.
We all pay our taxes and use the same amount of "public services" in infrastructure, defense, etc. Stop thinking that all corporations need taxed. Most of the corps out there are small biz like me and more taxes will crush them in this rat hole economy. Just clean up the tax code and put everyone on the same field and get rid of the loop holes that large firms can lobby DC to put in for them. | |
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| | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Well, if businesses don't want to pay their share of taxes, fine. Then you shouldn't expect the police or the fire department to show up at your business when you need them. | |
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| | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do I don't know how it is where you are, but my police and fire department are funded by my property taxes. | |
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| | | | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by amarryat:I don't know how it is where you are, but my police and fire department are funded by my property taxes.
The same here, but you've missed the point... If people are going to claim that businesses should pay no taxes, which would also mean not paying property taxes, then businesses should receive no benefits from the fire and police department. | |
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| | | | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do I don't think that any one is saying that a corporation, who has a physical presence, should not have to pay any property taxes on that building. Just like if I were to buy a second home, I'd be paying property taxes on that as well. I think you took it too literally. | |
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| | |  rawgerzThe hell was that?Premium
join:2004-10-03
Grove City, PA | That just means that you, and everyone else is left to make up the difference.
This is a company that has Indian tech support for dsl and refuses to deploy faster speeds in areas that are not fios, then they wonder why dsl sales dry up.
Seems to me the average person should have benefited from this by now. Why is my bill not cut in half to represent Uncle Sam's share being cut out? Why are areas they won't deploy any service beyond POTS in not being built because they have a 2-4 year ROI? Why has FIOS builds stopped?
I would think investors would love to have some of those questions answered.
Besides, haven't you been watching Fox news lately? We're in massive debt, but corporate giants not paying taxes is good?
If you're really for lower taxes, demand your elected official cut military spending by 90%. Your taxes will be half what they are now!
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You can't make all the people happy all of the time. But it should be common sense to shoot for the majority. | |
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| | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| said by pnh102:Thank you for reminding people of this. It is shameful that so many people are not taught this basic truth, and those who do learn it choose to ignore it.
Not to mention the fact that all of the employees are having taxes withheld from their paychecks. | |
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| | | pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by amarryat:Not to mention the fact that all of the employees are having taxes withheld from their paychecks. As much as I hate any form of income tax, I'd actually love to see withholding abolished. Force everyone to cut tax checks to the various taxing authorities to which they must every quarter. Force them to save the money that they earned and force them to watch it sit there and not be spendable.
People really need to see how much they actually pay in tax every time they are paid.
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"Net Neutrality" zealots - the people you can thank for your capped Internet service. | |
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| | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do When you're an S-Corp like me, you already do some of that. It sucks. | |
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| | | | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do said by amarryat:When you're an S-Corp like me, you already do some of that. It sucks.
Another corporate tax dodger in the making... | |
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| | | | | | openbox9Premium
join:2004-01-26
japan
kudos:2 | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do You mean business?
Do you pay your statutory personal income tax rate? | |
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| | | | | | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA | Just because I don't like paying them doesn't mean I don't. Though this sounds like something Tim Geithner, Charles Rangel, John Kerry, etc. would enjoy reading. | |
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|  N3OGHYo Soy Col. "Bat" GuanoPremium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
kudos:1 | said by Linklist: It is worth repeating that it is the customers of these companies who pay the taxes thru higher prices. Anyone cheering for corporations paying higher taxes are really just cheering to pay more taxes themselves - unless you are one of those very few people who never buy any product or service.
See, now that's specious reasoning IMHO. Especially if the corporation is turning a decent profit.
Consumers pay what the MARKET will bear, regardless of the structure of the corporate tax code. If a corporation can't provide a service at a competitive price, the consumer goes elsewhere.
The real benefit of the current tax structure is to the SHAREHOLDER, and not to the CONSUMER. Corporations aren't going to charge me less just because their taxes are lower. They're going to charge the maximum amount they think they can for their product. The ultimate driving force here is not to charge less, or even pay less taxes, but to maximize profit. The obvious (and some would say proper) primary goal of the corporation.
I seriously doubt Verizon, GE, and Boeing are spending billions on lobbyists in the interests of end consumers like you and me.
These corporations enjoy the protections of the rule of law (both patent law & contract law via the courts). They have a duty to contribute SOMETHING to society.
I'm not saying tax the rich to feed the poor until their "int no rich no more", but pay SOMETHING.
Of course, I could pay nothing in taxes if I had a herd of corporate lawyers & lobbyists too. But since I'm just one person with one vote I have no real voice in this country anymore.
Money talks, bullshit (and the individual) walks.
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Petty people are disproportionally corrupted by petty power | |
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| | | Um, actually you are 100% wrong, and you should know better. Unless the products are completely price inelastic to the consumer, some of the tax incidence falls on the company as well as the consumer. Verizon's basket of goods are not inelastic.
Bottom line, any tax levied on Verizon, some portion fall on the customer, but the rest fall on the company. You know, the one that paid it's CEO nearly $20M a year in compensation.
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tax_incidence | |
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|  vpokoPremium
join:2003-07-03
Boston, MA | That's swell, but Verizon is a C corporation, which has a tax liability independent of its owners. They're expected to pay taxes, and yes, pass them on if they're able to do it without losing customers. Remember that the shareholders themselves are taxed at the capital gains rate, which is less than half of the ordinary income tax rate. That's done because they're an expectation that the corporation already paid tax on that money. Time to raise the capital gains rate to match the ordinary income rate. | |
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|  stevek1949We're not in Kansas anymore
join:2002-11-13
Virginia Beach, VA | So why isn't the headline, "WELLS FARGO and AT&T LEAD THE LIST OF NON TAXPAYERS. VERIZON THIRD".
It seems that when you get a chance to bash Verizon, you go out of your way to do it. Right or wrong, it is very obvious. | |
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| | vpokoPremium
join:2003-07-03
Boston, MA | said by stevek1949:So why isn't the headline, "WELLS FARGO and AT&T LEAD THE LIST OF NON TAXPAYERS. VERIZON THIRD". I'm not Karl, but I'd guess it's because this is a site for discussing the telecommunications industry and not the banking industry? | |
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| | | | | Re: Worth repeating - corporations don't pay taxes-customers do Considering AT&T comes before Verizion in the list, that's can't really all it is. It is the reason Wells Fargo wasn't selected as the target. | |
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1 edit | taxes are on profits! i.e what is leftover after sales - expenses = gross profit - taxes = net profit.
How on earth does that raise prices? Here is a great article on what has been done to the tax code.
»www.rollingstone.com/politics/ne···20111109
"When they [corporations] do not pay their taxes, someone else does – you and me." Ronald Reagan | |
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|  BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | said by Linklist:Always this big brouhaha over corporations paying or not paying taxes. It is worth repeating that it is the customers of these companies who pay the taxes thru higher prices. Anyone cheering for corporations paying higher taxes are really just cheering to pay more taxes themselves - unless you are one of those very few people who never buy any product or service.
So business should have to pay ZERO taxes? Do you think that will actually to to lower prices or higher pay? Nope. You repubs all think alike. Business and millionaires and billionaires shouldn't pay a dime and everyone else should support their lifestyles. Funny thing is you aint rich. And guess what supporting the rich won't make them let you into their little club. You aint part of the club you will NEVER be a part of the club. FUCK THEM. | |
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|  Jack_in_VAPremium
join:2007-11-26
Mathews, VA
kudos:1 | Or they are included in the 47 percent who pay no individual federal taxes themselves. That's the ones usually squealing for higher and more taxes since they don't have a stake in it. | |
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| CXM_SplicerLooking at the bigger picturePremium
join:2011-08-11
NYC
kudos:1 Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| said by Linklist:It is worth repeating that it is the customers of these companies who pay the taxes thru higher prices. Anyone cheering for corporations paying higher taxes are really just cheering to pay more taxes themselves Of course this is complete rubbish and easily refuted by both history and common sense.
First, immediately following WWII the corporate tax rate was its highest ever (by far) in history. These increased taxes were NOT passed on to the consumer but were instead absorbed by the corporations as they would be today. The years that followed were arguably some of the country's most prosperous.
Second, Corporate taxes have been DECREASING ever since and there has been no resulting reduction passed on to the consumer. Please raise your hand if your Verizon phone bill suddenly dropped when they stopped paying taxes. Anyone... anyone?
The financial solution is very simple: very high taxes on the top 1%, even higher corporate taxes, and a cut in military spending to 20% of its current value. | |
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|  ThalerPremium
join:2004-02-02
Los Angeles, CA
kudos:3 | Only thing I hate about this shindig is that in both ways, the customer not getting screwed is the best-case result.
• Raise taxes on corporations: the tax gets pushed onto their customers in an increase to service prices.
• Lower taxes on corporations: they pocket the difference and report windfall earnings to their stockholders. Their customers see no corresponding reduction in price.
Companies like Verizon could probably even find a way to charge customers extra for a reduction in tax burdens. Call it a "we have to handle more income" fee, or whatever. | |
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pnh102Reptiles Are Cuddly And PrettyPremium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD | Credibility Let's see, who should we believe, a study that attempts to make big corporations look like tax dodgers, or Verizon itself? Yea I'll go with the latter.
Though I will to correct one part of Verizon's response:
quote:
Verizon's customers paid out $1.79 billion in taxes over 2008-2010 ...
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"Net Neutrality" zealots - the people you can thank for your capped Internet service. | |
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 ARPremium,ExMod 2001-04
join:2000-09-21
Toronto, ON | Occupy the Spectrum now? Well, not paying corp. taxes is testament to the power of the lobbying influence of their taxation department. This is corporate welfare, pure and simple.
Now.....that bit about offloading debt to smaller carriers and tarring VZW that much more is completely unnecessary. Who forced them to sign off on that deal? That's squarely the carriers' fault for not looking at the long term implications of taking on VZW's liabilities. | |
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 IowaCowboyWant to go back to IowaPremium
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA | Solution Have them audited by the IRS. If the rest of us cheat on our taxes, the IRS comes knocking at the door. | |
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| | | Re: Solution said by IowaCowboy:Have them audited by the IRS. If the rest of us cheat on our taxes, the IRS comes knocking at the door.
Public corporations are audited regularly by independent and internal auditors and the results certified to the SEC. Very few of 'the rest of us' could withstand that kind of scrutiny. I've spoken with many people that work in tax departments of large coporations and they are in regular contact with the IRS.
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Dresden - I work in Accounts Payable.
Random Bad Guy - In what capacity?
Dresden - I make sure everyone gets what's coming to them. | |
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 SlavaPremium,MVM
join:2001-02-04
Fair Lawn, NJ | Getting killed everywhere we turn: "Fannie Mae seeks $7.8 billion in taxpayer aid as losses widen
By Derek Kravitz
The Associated Press
Posted: 11/09/2011 01:00:00 AM MST
WASHINGTON — Mortgage giant Fannie Mae is asking the federal government for $7.8 billion in aid to cover its losses in the July-September quarter.
The government-controlled company said Tuesday that it lost $7.6 billion in the third quarter. Low mortgage rates reduced profits, and declining home prices caused more defaults on loans it had guaranteed.
The government rescued Fannie Mae and sibling company Freddie Mac in September 2008 to cover their losses on soured mortgage loans. Since then, a federal regulator has controlled their financial decisions.
Taxpayers have spent about $169 billion to rescue Fannie and Freddie, the most-expensive bailout of the 2008 financial crisis. The government estimates that the figure could reach up to $220 billion to support the companies through 2014 after subtracting dividend payments.
Fannie has received $112.6 billion so far from the Treasury Department, the most-expensive bailout of a single company.
Fannie's losses are increasing for two reasons: Some home owners are paying less interest after refinancing at historically low mortgage rates; others are defaulting on their mortgages.
Read more: Fannie Mae seeks $7.8 billion in taxpayer aid as losses widen - The Denver Post »www.denverpost.com/business/ci_1···dJnSV9Ur
Read The Denver Post's Terms of Use of its content: »www.denverpost.com/termsofuse " | |
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amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Property tax clarification "For example, the company hasn't paid property tax in Massachusetts since a 1915 law was passed to help speed up phone service deployment. The state recently tried to remove the law, only to have Verizon hold back infrastructure upgrades (Boston doesn't get FiOS)."
Yes this is true. The Massachusetts legislature wanted to tax the circular property area occupied by each telephone pole.
Gives a whole new meaning to the pole tax.
Maybe they should also charge the water company, gas company, etc. for the areas occupied by their pipes. | |
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| IowaCowboyWant to go back to IowaPremium
join:2010-10-16
Springfield, MA Reviews:
 ·Comcast
 ·Verizon Broadban..
| Re: Property tax clarification said by amarryat:Maybe they should also charge the water company, gas company, etc. for the areas occupied by their pipes.
Not to mention the government owns many utilities like the Springfield Water & Sewer Commission, Chicopee Electric Light Department, Westfield Gas & Electric, and Holyoke Gas & Electric.
I am starting to wonder if our tax dollars are subsidizing these utilities. And you have fewer rights with municipal utilities than you do with investor owned utilities such as billing and shut-off rights. | |
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| PaxioPremium
join:2011-02-23
Santa Clara, CA
kudos:1 | Actually, we do pay tax on every single fiber we pay to put in the ground or on a pole, every year. It seems pretty counter-productive to me, and not a great incentive to spend the money needed to bring fiber to more people. Because taxes vary so much from place to place we recently had to add property taxes as a separate item on our bill -- our first and only "below the line" item on our bill.
Taxes are a hidden drain on the economy that saps its productive juices. Tax policy is used as a tool for politicians to reward their cronies and give advantages to some companies (e.g. Solyndra, G.E., and AT&T) over others. | |
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| | amarryatVerizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Property tax clarification Instead of taxing corporations, the govt. ought to tax us directly. Either way, we're going to pay. Charging Verizon a property tax on poles will be reflected by a rate increase.
The bottom line is that those in govt. want more money, and are constantly dreaming up ways to fool all of us into paying more. A tax on a corporation is a tax on all of us. | |
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| | | LinklistPremium
join:2002-03-03
Longport, NJ
kudos:5 | Re: Property tax clarification said by amarryat:Instead of taxing corporations, the govt. ought to tax us directly. Either way, we're going to pay. Charging Verizon a property tax on poles will be reflected by a rate increase.
The bottom line is that those in govt. want more money, and are constantly dreaming up ways to fool all of us into paying more. A tax on a corporation is a tax on all of us.
Exactly. The whole tax structure is set up to fool as many people as possible, so that they don't realize the extent that the government is dominating the economy thru taxes that are often hidden from the citizens.
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»www.politico.com/rss/2012-election.xml
»www.politico.com/rss/2012-election-blog.xml
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|  morboComplete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000
·Charter
| Re: I'm Confused... said by swintec: It is not the companies that are the problem, it is the tax code.
Except that the companies write the tax code via lobbyists. Do you see the problem now? | |
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| | | morboComplete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000 | Re: I'm Confused... Yes, our elected officials are a piece of this problem, but you can't simply assign all blame to them and ignore the corporation writing the tax code to their financial advantage. | |
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| | The ONLY hope for America is Ron Paul! So far, the only politician that has the BALLS to end this crap is Ron Paul. Look into it yourself, do not take my word for it. the mainstream media does not want Ron Paul elected so they ignore him. He has vowed to ABOLISH the IRS and stop these criminal organizations from exploiting us making us pay for their benefits. Corporate scum companies like Verizon, GE pay no taxes because they donate to politicians heavily and funnel money through lobbyists.
Some people tell me "Are you crazy? How else would the bloated govt run without our personal income tax?" - ANSWER: Only 1/3rd of the govt income comes from our income tax! So if we reduced the bloated size of the govt (Techs - compare to bloated Windows OS install) to a more lean an efficient model (techs - compare to Linux  ) , we can realistically have ZERO tax! OMG, would that be great or what? | |
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See 7 replies to this post |
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| | sick of corps get pay offs and no pay crap fire all the damn congress getting payoffs from this crap and make the company pay off the tax the owe us. | |
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pawpaw
join:2004-05-05
Greenville, SC Reviews:
·Charter
| Je Accuse This cannot be correct. When I check my bill online I get this tooltip for the heading of Taxes, Governmental Surcharges & Fees:
"Verizon Wireless Surcharges - Includes charges to recover or help defray costs of taxes and of governmental charges and fees imposed on us by the government. Other Charges and Credits - includes charges for products and services, and credits owing."
So obviously they are paying taxes, and in turn taking the money from me. Anyone who says Verizon is not paying federal tax is accusing them of lying, and we all know that Verizon would never lie. | |
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| | | Re: Je Accuse Maybe Verizon is its own government and can levy taxes. | |
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| | learn something everyday i was sure it was exxon mobil and the evil ass oil corporations that are polluting the planet. 
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ummh union bad, ummh union bad, please tell me what else to regurgitate | |
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 rrw1313Premium
join:2001-03-05
Taylor, PA | Whats a negative tax rate? Just curious what a Negative tax like Verizon's -951 million is? | |
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| openbox9Premium
join:2004-01-26
japan
kudos:2 | Re: Whats a negative tax rate? The tax benefit is greater than the liability...i.e., tax refund is more than what was paid in. | |
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| | make them choose I'm not a fan of corp taxes, we all know that the consumer pays. How about making corps choose, you don't want to pay income tax on the corp earnings, then you get zero deductions or insentives from tax dollars. You choose to pay corp income tax then you get the full benifit of the tax code. Now, if you are not happy with the current tax code, then you clearly have phone calls to make and letters to send, don't you? | |
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 mikepdDiscoveryPremium,MVM
join:2000-10-26
New Port Richey, FL
·Verizon FiOS
| Ridiculous study So people get up-in-arms when they hear corporations use every legal tactic to lower or eliminate their tax burden.
Exactly how is this different from ordinary people trying to take every deduction they can? If everyone had enough money to make the investments, hire tax lawyers, and go through their tax liability with a fine-tooth comb in order to structure their finances so as to take advantage of every tax avoidance measure possible then ordinary people could do the same thing. The damage that would do to the federal budget is a completely different topic.
Knowledge is power and people need to educate themselves on how to maximize their tax avoidance strategy. Tax avoidance is perfectly legal, whereas tax evasion is not. There is a legal difference between the two.
If you are unhappy with the current tax code (and who isn't in some fashion) then change the politicians who write the code but don't blame companies or people who can take advantage of every legal break they can.
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Always Reach Beyond Your Grasp | |
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| | | Re: Ridiculous study 100% agreed. Amid all the shouting and crying, it is forgotten that the lawmakers didn't magically get to where they were without the help of the people who put them there. Hence, corporations are governed only by law, and not morality. | |
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| | Math FAil!!! "Verizon paid out $1.79 billion in taxes over 2008-2010, and reported earnings of $5.25 billion over this same period. In addition, Verizon has annually invested $16.5 billion in technology infrastructure."
How can a company SUSTAIN itself when its income ($5.25 Billion over 2 years) doles out taxes ($1.79Billion over two years) but spends $16.5 billion over two years on upgrades?
Are they pulling the money out of their arse? No! They charge numerous phallic fees/taxes to the consumer for the government, but then turn around to the government and (shrugs shoulders) we collected but have a loss so... sorry!
Best. Ripoff. of government. Ever!
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Splat | |
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| openbox9Premium
join:2004-01-26
japan
kudos:2 | Re: Math FAil!!! Or expenditures are accounted for before reporting the bottom line  | |
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| | | | Re: Math FAil!!! Waste of breath around here. Nobody here has any knowldege of this subject.
The depreication rates on Verizions technology investments are depreicated, in most cases, at a rate which is HIGER than the actual depreciation of the item.
Again, the tax payer is the loser.
I'll say it one more time. TAXES ARE ONLY DUE ON PROFITS!
I mean how can you be so dumb as to not understand that Mega corps get mega benefits from society, from the global military industrial complex to education subsidies (students who's education is pubilcly funded is a savings to a corporation which hires him/her in the form of reduced training costs.
Try to see how the average stiff making 25k at Mcdonalds benefits from any of this? | |
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Reviews:
 ·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
| very profitable, for a price.. Verizon's been very profitable over the past several years even with all the labor angst going on over affording those very costly benefits. While wirleline alone would put Verizon at a disadvantage, the profits from wireless could (in theory) pay off Vodafone as a funding partner and have cash left over (by 2015). No coincidence that this is the same year Verizon's expected to have NYC's fios build complete or near 100% overlay of the Time Warner & Cablevision footprints. There will of course not be 100% customer for customer overlay... there will be gaps for sure in NY Metro.
That financial success comes at a price... namely higher cost wireless service. On average the RPS (revenue per subscriber) is 5% higher than even greedy AT&T. Consumers actually pay the higher price because they like to pay the highest price in the industry, but because they have the BEST overall network coverage. This has been the case for the longest time and would still be the case even if the ATT/Tmobile merger went through for several more years (which it's not). | |
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| | poor verizon 432,000 dollars income per employee. They can't afford to pay taxes too!!!!!!!!!!! | |
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slckusrPremium
join:2003-03-17
Maumee, OH
kudos:1 Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
| hmm verizons reply scares me "Verizon paid out $1.79 billion in taxes over 2008-2010, and reported earnings of $5.25 billion over this same period. In addition, Verizon has annually invested $16.5 billion in technology infrastructure. This investment has created and sustained jobs,"
I.e. We shouldnt pay taxes because we
1. maintain our network ?!?!
2. We give people jobs.
Do they fail to realize the symbiosis between the customer, the employee, and the corporation. when one fails they all go. | |
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| | | Re: hmm said by slckusr:I.e. We shouldnt pay taxes because we
Spent more money to maintain our network than we made in profits for that period.
Every company that can do that does.
They still had to pay sales, property, emplyee, and 911 taxes related to the industry... The fed stuff is small potatoes. | |
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