Telecom Lobbyists: U.S. Actually Broadband Leader Assuming you completely ignore all data suggesting otherwise... What do you do when you're a telecom industry trade group that wants the FCC to ignore the fact that U.S. consumers pay more money, for slower bandwidth, in fewer locations than more than a dozen other countries? You pick out a largely meaningless metric we actually are good at and blow it out of proportion. If you're a lobbying organization like the USTelecom Association, for example, you can send a letter to the FCC (pdf) highlighting how all those critics of expensive U.S. broadband who say we lack competition are ignoring the fact that we're a world leader in -- consuming broadband: To date, international broadband comparisons seem to have largely ignored actual usage in favor of more theoretical measurements based on capacity. We believe that the amount that Internet consumers are actually making use of their broadband connections to pull value from the Internet -- whether education, government services, or entertainment -- provides a more real-world, practical measure of how successfully a country's broadband networks and regulatory environment are providing consumers with what they want. By this more consumer-focused measure U.S. Internet users and our broadband networks are among the world leaders. In other words, USTelecom would prefer the FCC avoid looking at data that shows we are mediocre in most every metric -- and instead operate from the belief that we're doing great -- because Americans like bandwidth. That certainly sounds almost like science, and it does put us at the top of something. Even after using the lobbying firm's data (which is just culled from Cisco's latest study) we're still only in fourth place -- American's consuming about 14.24 gigabytes per month. As long as you ignore price, speed, competition, predatory practices, connection quality and every other meaningful metric -- we're world beaters.
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 | | A Loser Mentality The adoption of this type of mentality is exactly why the US is currently loosing its economic world dominance! | |
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| Re: A Loser Mentality said by macman4hire:The adoption of this type of mentality is exactly why the US is currently loosing its economic world dominance! it's not a mentality - it's PR spin. U.S. incumbents could give a crap about where the U.S. stands with respect to the rest of the world. All they care about is the amount of profit they make and how big their bonuses will be. That's why the U.S. is on a downward spiral in many, many areas. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: A Loser Mentality Totally agree. Does not take much deductive thinking on this topic, WAKE UP AMERICA! Look around. Housing crash, banking and other bailouts,WOrldom, Madoff..need i go on? ALL from use of fuzzy math and coporate greed to line their pockets without the care of how it affects this country or taxpayers. I have no confidence in our governmnet or bodies that oversee companies. No they dont care cuz lobbyist puts a big chunk of money in pocket so they will look the other way. COME on! | |
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 |  | | makes sense to me.we were number one but not any longer.
thank you big USA business and corrupt goverment for that fact. | |
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 Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste ....
... and that is what has made the U.S. GDP at or near the top for the last 70 years.
The telecomm group makes some good points: »news.yahoo.com/s/pcworld/2009122···dbanduse
"We'd love to have fiber to the home here, but in some countries there's more government subsidy," Banks said. "Some of the telecom companies can really build out a network without worrying about whether they can finance it or whether it is going to get used. What this says is we're tailoring our networks to what consumers really do with it, and people here really use it a lot, so our networks are good enough to support more usage."
The FCC and other policymakers can look to the study to see if U.S. broadband providers are giving consumers what they need, Banks said. "It's nice if you can build a network for 20 years out, and somehow, the government will finance it, but here we're trying to build for the next few years and make sure we have something that matches up with what people want," he added. And the chart showing bandwidth consumed:

The point is that some countries, misusing their people's tax dollars, have overbuilt systems well beyond the ability or desire of people to use the capacity. That is a gross mismanagement of limited resources and a waste of capital dollars that could have been used more efficiently and productively elsewhere.
Just like companies have become more efficient by using Just In Time inventory systems, the U.S. ISPs are using a bandwidth capacity sized to near term requirements. -- My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page
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| Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste. You are so incredibly full of it, almost constantly, occasionally to stunning effect. But Merry Christmas all the same, Tom. | |
|  |  |  Mr FelFlynn LivesPremium join:2008-03-17 Louisville, KY | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... Hey Karl that chart shows the US is 0.02GB/Month behind France, so we're third by even these metrics. | |
|  |  |  |  | | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... Actually, it also shows North America being higher than the USA, which means Canada and/or Mexico is also ahead of us. We may even be 4th or 5th! | |
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 |  |  Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | said by Karl Bode:U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste. You are so incredibly full of it, almost constantly, occasionally to stunning effect.  But Merry Christmas all the same, Tom. So you think US industry is inefficient - more so than countries like France, Japan, etc. I disagree. | |
|  |  |  |  dnoyeBFerrous Phallus join:2000-10-09 Southfield, MI | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... The US got large by dominating the world market. Today, the focus is largely on dominating the US market. Many of these laws favor one industry over another. Such as how Health Insurance and Energy industries are costing other industries billions.
Broadband is the same. They will starve the citizens and the corporations alike. This hurts the US on and individual and a business level. -- dnoyeB "Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard. " Ecclesiastes 9:16
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|  |  |  |  | | What's mindblowing is that you'd use a statistic like the GDP to argue that the U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste. | |
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 |  knightmbEverybody Lies join:2003-12-01 Franklin, TN | said by Romney2012:Just like companies have become more efficient by using Just In Time inventory systems, the U.S. ISPs are using a bandwidth capacity sized to near term requirements. I won't argue with your other points, but I will counter this one. I run two ISP here in this country and you can't buy bandwidth capacity on the same scale of a "Just in Time" inventory systems. What you buy is blocks of bandwidth that only certain companies will sell to you.
So if I have one site with 100 customers and on average they never use more than 8 Mbps/sec of bandwidth, I can't buy 8 or 10 megabits of bandwidth from the local big companies (AT&T for example). Instead, I have to buy large blocks and set up peering agreements to run AT&T traffic as well. So for example, I have a site just like the one in question sitting on a 1000 M/bps Fiber peer.
Sure, it's great to have that much bandwidth available to them, but they never ever use it. It's 100 grandmoms checking e-mail and dads playing fantasy football. It also cost a lot of money! I certainly wish that I could tell them, I only need this much bandwidth now, bill me for less and during peak times, I need more bandwidth, so bill me for more.
So is this the same as per your example, this is overbuilt with a gigabit of bandwidth when it will never be used but instead of the government forcing this, a private company is? -- Fight Insight Ready (Was NebuAD) and the like: Click Here to pollute their data | |
|  |  |  | | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... said by knightmb:So is this the same as per your example, this is overbuilt with a gigabit of bandwidth when it will never be used but instead of the government forcing this, a private company is? Sounds almost the same as the whole cable a-la-carta problems. In the end, when companies recombine and form much larger companies that control large portions of the needed resources they can then charge whatever they want and people have to pay it in order to use it. That's a major problem today: more and more industries are loosing smaller companies, combining into larger ones, and competition is drying up (they then claim competition is thriving when it's not). --
- "Techie" Jim | |
|  |  |  |  dnoyeBFerrous Phallus join:2000-10-09 Southfield, MI | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... I agree. This ties into my previous point about global market dominance vs. local dominance. Consolidations are good for global strength, but bad for local competition. Today's companies are trying to dominate the US market, and working hard to isolate this market from the rest of the world. Today's company desires isolated product competition but global resources.
I don't think that is good for us. -- dnoyeB "Then said I, Wisdom [is] better than strength: nevertheless the poor man's wisdom [is] despised, and his words are not heard. " Ecclesiastes 9:16
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 |  1 edit | I don't think we always use our resources efficiently but you do bring up some good points.
It would be interested to see the "real" cost per megabyte that people in each country pays including what the government contributes to broadband deployment. As we know this money essentially comes from the people in the form of taxes. We pay the majority of our internet bill directly to an internet provider. People in other countries pay some of it directly to an internet provider and another part in taxes that the government redistributes back to the same internet provider. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... The "they fund it with taxpayers money" meme is greatly overstating the actual level of direct taxpayer funding of network infrastructure in these other countries. Go read the Berkman Center study for the full details.
Also, this meme ignores the fact that both taxpayers and ratepayers here in the U.S. have spent quite a bit on our major ISPs. They've been given billions in tax benefits in the form of accelerated depreciation; the ILECs have special preferential treatment on pole attachments; they get utility right-of-way preferential treatment, yet as ISPs are not regulated like utilities; and in some states, folks regulated phone bills were allowed to be increased above the normal price cap price in exchange for promises of ftth deployment. | |
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 |  | | said by Romney2012:The point is that some countries, misusing their people's tax dollars, have overbuilt systems well beyond the ability or desire of people to use the capacity. I'm sure other country's ISPs are complaining that their customers are the problem, not their networks.
You know what that chart says to me?
That bandwidth demand is growing, but company's are lacking in investment. North America and US are nearly the same. So it appears compressed, like the demand is greater but no one is stepping up to continue the available bandwidth growth.
Hence the companies now try to "control" customer use instead of continuing investment to expand and improve their own networks. --
- "Techie" Jim | |
|  |  Zoder join:2002-04-16 Miami, FL 1 edit | As quoted from article TKjunkmail linked to
"We'd love to have fiber to the home here, but in some countries there's more government subsidy," Banks said. "Some of the telecom companies can really build out a network without worrying about whether they can finance it or whether it is going to get used. What this says is we're tailoring our networks to what consumers really do with it, and people here really use it a lot, so our networks are good enough to support more usage."
So I guess we don't need to move to metered billing then. | |
|  |  |  Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... said by Zoder:What this says is we're tailoring our networks to what consumers really do with it, and people here really use it a lot, so our networks are good enough to support more usage."
So I guess we don't need to move to metered billing then. Nice try at putting words in my mouth. But I didn't say that and you know it. It was a quote from a news article in a post I made yesterday: »Wednesday Evening Links -- My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page
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|  |  |  |  Zoder join:2002-04-16 Miami, FL | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... That's why i didn't quote your name. I was trying to quote the article you referenced. I'll fix it. | |
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 |  | | I notice that "North America" is higher than the US. Considering there are 10 times more Americans than Canadians, Canadians must be downloading a lot! Considering downloading copyrighted content for personal or academic reasons is completed legal according to Canadians laws, it's no surprise! | |
|  |  |  |  | | LOL, Karl nailed you on this one so I wont expand beyond saying....
oh the poor poor monopolistic/duopoly companies want the government to help build their networks AGAIN!!!!!
As a stock jockey I see your point. Why have your earnings go towards the company expenses when you can have the tax dollars of millions go towards it? You earn more and pay less.
WE the people have paid for these networks over and over and over. WE the people continue to pay for these network over and over and over. THEY need to take their billions in profit (again our money) and build the damn networks out for the long term. And if that means putting people like you out on the street to do it, then so be it. The improvement of the underlying infrastructure of this nation far outweighs the few stock jockeys that will pitch a fit.
I just had UVerse installed last week. It was quite entertaining after the lady had been here for over 2 hours for her to turn to me and say "you can only get 1 HD channel because you are too far out". It was even more entertaining to hear her say "I didn't say this, but Verizon is doing it right." | |
|  |  |  Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... said by Skippy25:LOL, Karl nailed you on this one so I wont expand beyond saying.... Karl nailed NOTHING. All he did was call me a name. | |
|  |  |  |  | | Re: U.S. uses resources efficiently with low waste .... Out of my entire post that all you got out of it?
LOL! | |
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 | | Karl, it seems to be your mission to trash-talk ISPs.... Perhaps that's why you are disappointed when anyone presents them in a positive light. Well, I have news for you: I and my colleagues work damned hard to provide good service, and I think we do so. | |
|  |  | | Re: Karl, it seems to be your mission to trash-talk ISPs.... Lariet.net does not equal USTelecom (AT&T, Verizon, Qwest). You don't charge your customers more so you can fund an overpaid lobby to turn out propaganda. In fact, you are quite good at propagandizing in blog forums all by your lonesome self. | |
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 | | This Stat Highlights Our Epic Failure The fact we American's make really great use of the crappy expensive broadband connections we have, highlights how much loss our crappy expensive broadband infrastructure is causing.
If we are #2 in making good use of broadband, imagine the GDP/productivity/producer-consumer surplus we could generate if we had a world-class broadband infrastructure. If our major dense cities had the same level of broadband infrastructure at the same cost as some places in Western Europe or East Asian, or if our adoption rates were as high as some of those places, we'd be in a much better off economic place right now.
Bottom line: If you build it (or sell it at a reasonable cost) American's will come. The cable-telco duopoly is costing the American billions in lost economic activity. | |
|  |  andre2 join:2005-08-24 Brookline, MA | Re: This Stat Highlights Our Epic Failure said by Bill Dollar:The fact we American's make really great use of the crappy expensive broadband connections we have, highlights how much loss our crappy expensive broadband infrastructure is causing. Exactly - in measuring how well the infrastructure is meeting people's needs, heavy usage should be regarded as a minus, not a plus. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: This Stat Highlights Our Epic Failure Agreed completely. At any quality corporation when you start hitting 70% utilization, its time to spend money and upgrade the network.
For US ISP's hitting 70% utilization means you haven't oversold the network near enough.
Its kind of sad actually. | |
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 | | Average Use and Caps Of course, the interesting thing to me was that 14GB/month usage figure. Time Warner Cable was trialing caps of 5GB, 10GB, 20GB and 40GB. 5GB would, of course, be the default. If people consume, on average, 14GB per month, the average user would have either needed to have upgraded their plan (to 20GB at least) or would have paid lots of extra in overage fees. Either way, Time Warner would have profited greatly. Still might, since they seem determined to find a way to push out the caps while minimizing the inevitable bad PR. -- -Jason Levine Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar and/or a photo book. Shooting For A Cause | |
|  | | 5 billion megabit DMCA soon ACTA all your funny laws caps and user based billing at 1 GB and 500 $ per GB after means what again? DAMN yea FAST fast to not get used and hosed
and trust me Canada is doing it better then you WERE NUMBER ONE at screwing the people.
new WIND mobile 5GB cap...55$ boy i can even with proposed user based billing for same price get 60GB
and trust thats billions a pages a text the big RIP OFF text messaging LOL your all suckers that use and do it ( no flame war intended this message was meant in the sense of they are screwing you and will keep doing it until EVERY user phones them once a day and complains ... this cost to them will drive the changes ) | |
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| not the exact reason, but close allowing telcos into the lucrative video/content business was actually a mistake, although not the one you THINK it's about...
getting telcos to think that they could create a video business by copying the cable-tv (coax) industry was a huge mistake. all that did is get an already greedy set of corporations under the impression that they could go back to their old monopolist ways, with a new revenue source and not do the necessary things to ensure competition, fairness to the consumer and evolution of the business model without having to make excuses (for gouging the consumer) why one part of the business is sucking the life out of the other parts. bad also begets bad.. in the ways that the big cablecos reacted.. instead of lowering rates, they raised them and implemented capped bandwidth, increased throttling (even on so-called non-bandwidth hog subscribers) and increased cherry picking of geographies for system upgrades/maintenance. for these and other reasons, we have a horrible set of circumstances that let fewer large corporations control more media content, allowed at&t to swallow up a company to own 2/3 the USA geographic last mile, allowed verizon to SELL off so-called bad ROI geographies to companies that either have or will file for bankruptcy due to massive debt-- for which they PAID $$ MILLIONS $$ for the priviledge to own. in addition, targeted lobbying and "behind the scenes" dirt sabotaged many efforts to create & build either municipal or 3rd party (independent carrier) last mile networks across the country from California, to New York, to Texas and up the Mid-Atlantic states (not owned by at&t).
don't expect much to happen except your rates for ALL THREE SERVICES WILL GO UP NEXT YEAR, if they haven't already-- even the holdouts in the most competitive areas! meanwhile, the cost of providing internet access itself declined (the backbone service, not the last mile infrastructure part). | |
|  linicxCaveat EmptorPremium join:2002-12-03 United State Reviews:
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| U.S. Broadband Leader? Not even close.
The problem with trying to compare the US to other countries is that those "other countries" with the great broadband 'this and that' is not 3000 miles wide, does not deal with two great mountain ranges, great rivers, does not deal with a huge area of homes that are 5 miles apart. nor does it kowtow to fork-tongued telephone company suits that talk out of both sides of their mouth at the same time. They own it. .
Welcome to rural America where dial-up is sometimes faster than DSL, competition is more likely between cable vs telephone, quoted speeds are flat, services is non-existent, and the puffery is knee deep. I have a better chance of catching bass with my teeth than I do of seeing a consistent 1.5 down even though I am paying for 6. Facts do not lie.
I danced the rural waltz for 15 years. I started with 28.8 modem. The best phone I've had in years is the VOIP provided by the best cable company I've had in years. It's local, it's small and it serves people. I can write a book about how bad three of the four largest phone companies are in America and how they rape and trade rural America. .
For a very short time I was hooked up with a local WISP. The 3rd party turnkey outfit was so dumb it went live with no anti-virus protection on a new XP optimized system. They sent me the same virus 7 times in one day. When I complained they denied it. So did the company where their severs were located. I sent them both a copy of the virus with a warning in the subject line. The server location verified and thanked me. The local IT genius who knew all about Linux opened it, WISP was down for a week. I was back on-line 2 hours later with a new Mac and AT&T.  -- Mac: No windows, No Gates, Apple inside | |
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