 
Matt
Quitting Caffeine - Argh
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC |  3 Strikes and You're Out
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Chibooey
Just My Two Cents Worth
join:2000-07-05
Chicago, IL | Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out The problem is MPAA would just send out warnings without proof. Historically their tactics have been very shady. | |
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Matt
Quitting Caffeine - Argh
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
 ·North State Commun..
| Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out said by Chibooey  :The problem is MPAA would just send out warnings without proof. Historically their tactics have been very shady. I agree, which is why there has to be an independent organization and an appeals process. I absolutely would not support a 3 strikes system if the MPAA/RIAA/BSA dictated directly to the ISPs who "they" felt were offenders via DMCA letters or whatever form they chose.
There would also have to be strict guidelines around what is considered infringement and what isn't. | |
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Karl Bode
News Guy
join:2000-03-02 | Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out Oh what, a system that can be manipulated to frame a printer isn't good enough for you, huh? | |
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| | | robl27
Premium
join:2008-07-16
Mary Esther, FL
 ·Cox HSI
| i do not support the MafIAA.. they are wrong, wrong, wrong.
i do not believe downloading music/movies/etc is considered to be pirating.
because downloading pirated songs actually would encourage people to buy the CD's if the MafIAA didn't fuck up.
we need to explore beyond what's at the top 40 play lists and allow other artists to be heard.
remember, i bought more cd's as a result of me downloading the song from napster before it got ruined.
»phoenixlabs.org/pg2/ is also good protection.
-Rob
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Our 96K BroadBandStream
Our Dial Up Stream
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follow me on Twitter | |
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Matt
Quitting Caffeine - Argh
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out said by robl27 :i do not support the MafIAA.. they are wrong, wrong, wrong. i do not believe downloading music/movies/etc is considered to be pirating. because downloading pirated songs actually would encourage people to buy the CD's if the MafIAA didn't fuck up. we need to explore beyond what's at the top 40 play lists and allow other artists to be heard. remember, i bought more cd's as a result of me downloading the song from napster before it got ruined. » phoenixlabs.org/pg2/ is also good protection. -Rob  | |
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Premium
join:2008-07-16
Mary Esther, FL | Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out this has mixed reviews but it's better then nothing! | |
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insomniac84
join:2002-01-03
Schererville, IN
| There is no such thing an independent organization. And who is going to pay for it? The U.S. government(us) so the independent organization can become corrupted by any interest group or the MPAA so the independent organization always sides with them? | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out said by insomniac84 :There is no such thing an independent organization. And who is going to pay for it? The U.S. government(us) so the independent organization can become corrupted by any interest group or the MPAA so the independent organization always sides with them? Exactly. So the three strikes thing should be struck down.
OR should have a clause that says the MAFIAA has to pay any wrongly accused/mistaken notification victim say $100,000.
That may cool their jets.
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"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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C0deZer0
Oc'D To Rhythm And Police
Premium
join:2001-10-03
Davenport, FL
 ·Verizon FIOS
| Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out said by KrK :OR should have a clause that says the MAFIAA has to pay any wrongly accused/mistaken notification victim say $100,000,000. That may cool their jets. You need to add a few more zeros to that figure before they will be more cautious, bub.  | |
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| | raythompsontn
join:2001-01-11
Oliver Springs, TN
| said by Chibooey :The problem is MPAA would just send out warnings without proof. Historically their tactics have been very shady. So why not just send three DMCA takedown notices to the MPAA's ISP? The ISP would have to shut them down as they could not make exceptions "just because". | |
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| zduice
join:2001-03-03
San Dimas, CA
| Here is the piece that bothers me….
Currently, the **AA organizations are blanketing ISP with DMCA request . These request are processed with practically no evidence. The only proof being presented is that sometime in the past, something was shared and that something has a filename that loosely resembles the title of an item they hold a copyright to. At present, the burden of proof is on me, the accused to utilize my financial resources and prove that this file, for the sake of argument is my kid’s musical recital or perhaps an independent film of my own creation. Why should I have to prove this? Shouldn’t they have to prove my guilt through the preponderance of evidence, which is none except a simple filename.
Should an appeal process exist, it would without a doubt become so backlogged and in turn seemly ineffective. Then we have the question, who would pay for this arbitrating process? …the taxpayers, the ISP’s, the **AA, me? …none are suitable answers. | |
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KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest
| Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out Remember, we're dealing with people who think that buying a used CD is "stealing" from them or that failing to watch every advertisement = theft of service.
'Tards.
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"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX | Re: 3 Strikes and You're Out Sounds to me the three strikes policy should apply to the **ia organizations instead what with all the false lawsuits that are being uncovered lately. | |
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| Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| they should have to have absolute evidence that the person was committing the crime.
also since the economy is tougher, the ISP should charge the MPAA/RIAA with a $5,000 filing and research fee when a DMCA request is submitted that does not have a court order from a court local to the person they have in question.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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richdelb
Go Hawks Go
Premium
join:2003-01-22
Algonquin, IL | In my book, any "3 Strikes" policy MUST include SEVERE punishment if the **AA's do not have PROOF. (How about up to $150,000 per incident, per day.) | |
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zalternate
join:2007-02-22
BC
·TELUS
| O' Canaduh We Canadian people are sheep. Please step all over us in a fascist manner. We will barely protest. And if we protest, the Government will ignore us or pepper spray us. And then the government will just keep doing things in secret, as always.
Remember that 3% of Canadians create and submit and finalize our bogus laws to control the people.
No, this post is not from the Twilight zone. It's just representative of what you don't read in Canadian media. | |
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hopeflicker
Capitalism breeds greed
Premium
join:2003-04-03
Long Beach, CA
| Re: O' Canaduh said by zalternate :We Canadian people are sheep. Please step all over us in a fascist manner. We will barely protest. And if we protest, the Government will ignore us or pepper spray us. And then the government will just keep doing things in secret, as always. Remember that 3% of Canadians create and submit and finalize our bogus laws to control the people. No, this post is not from the Twilight zone. It's just representative of what you don't read in Canadian media. Hey! we're sheeple too, ya know 
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There is no love untouched by hate
No unity without discord
There is no courage without fear
There is no peace without a war
There is no wisdom without regret
No admiration without scorn
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
·Comcast
| They'll never learn... Interesting to see the premise of the MPAA losing money is due to piracy. It has nothing to do with the content that they're promoting. Hopefully this will blow up in their face. I think the President elect better get up to snuff on the invalidity of their argument as well as the "metered billing is the only way to avoid a bandwidth crunch" fallacy!
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"For duty and humanity!"
- Moe Larry and Curly (MEN IN BLACK, 1934)...These are the guys we have in Congress | |
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LiamJunket
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Ocean City, NJ
·Comcast
| Re: They'll never learn... said by S_engineer :Interesting to see the premise of the MPAA losing money is due to piracy. It has nothing to do with the content that they're promoting. It is both. | |
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| | Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| said by LiamJunket :said by S_engineer :Interesting to see the premise of the MPAA losing money is due to piracy. It has nothing to do with the content that they're promoting. It is both. P2P piracy probably doesnt even cost them 50 million, however the big time piracy rings that usually are linked to the asian or russian crime rings cost them billions.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX | It's DVDs and video games that give tons more for your dollar than a $15 audio CD with just an hour's worth of music. | |
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dvd536
as Mr. Pink as they come
Premium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
| said by S_engineer :Interesting to see the premise of the MPAA losing money is due to piracy. I think its more due to their lack of finding talent. theres no music today worth pirating!
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When I gez aju zavateh na nalechoo more new yonooz tonigh molinigh - Ken Lee | |
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inferno
join:2008-07-06 | lol who cares? Obama is the messiah... he can do as he wants... he can raise the waters if he wants... Obama is awesomeness!!!! | |
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hopeflicker
Capitalism breeds greed
Premium
join:2003-04-03
Long Beach, CA
| Re: lol who cares? said by inferno :Obama is the messiah... he can do as he wants... he can raise the waters if he wants... Obama is awesomeness!!!! smoking crack again,eh? | |
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mrchris
We don't miss you Bush
Premium
join:2002-10-01
North Babylon, NY | Um, he's not even IN OFFICE yet.. | |
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| | inferno
join:2008-07-06
| Re: lol who cares? said by mrchris :Um, he's not even IN OFFICE yet.. He doesn't have to be. All of the media that worship him are saying that Bush should resign and he should take over tomorrow... (Yea ton of crazy idiotic liberals out there)
But anyway... Obama is the messiah... he will do as he wants...  | |
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BabyBear
Keep wise ...with Night-Owl
join:2007-01-11
| Re: lol who cares? said by mrchris : he will do as he wants... Worked for the last guy! | |
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Matt
Quitting Caffeine - Argh
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
·North State Commun..
| said by inferno :said by mrchris :Um, he's not even IN OFFICE yet.. He doesn't have to be. All of the media that worship him are saying that Bush should resign and he should take over tomorrow... He should and it's not just the media who feels that way. | |
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HotRodFoto
Premium
join:2003-04-19
Denver, CO
| said by inferno :said by mrchris :Um, he's not even IN OFFICE yet.. He doesn't have to be. All of the media that worship him are saying that Bush should resign and he should take over tomorrow... (Yea ton of crazy idiotic liberals out there) But anyway... Obama is the messiah... he will do as he wants... Bush outta resign, period.
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Capturing the images of Colorado
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See 6 replies to this post |
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Singular
join:2008-08-13
Shelbyville, KY
| Stuff What is this world coming too, I mean when the big entertainment companies don't have the hundred dollar bills they use to wipe their ass what are we going to do? This is sheer terror! I mean really though, I don't support stealing. Its just how the industry is, for the longest time they would charge whatever they wanted to for a CD, then when their money flow changes because they were charging to much for a CD and people found a better cheaper way to get the music they want they freak out because the money pot is short. I just think that rather then scaring the people back into their old ways of charging 20 dollars for a CD, they need to join the digital revolution. The only way they are going to survive is to sell what the people want to buy, not force them to buy what they want to sell. | |
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Assault
join:2001-12-14
Garland, TX | bailouts I'm surprised they're not asking for billion dollar bailouts due to piracy | |
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| k1ll3rdr4g0n
join:2005-03-19
Homer Glen, IL
| Re: bailouts said by Assault :I'm surprised they're not asking for billion dollar bailouts due to piracy I believe that is in step 3, but we really don't know!
Step 1. Sue everyone in sight
Step 2. Ask President to strip the rights of US citizens
Step 3. ?????
Step 4. Profit | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
·Comcast
| said by Assault :I'm surprised they're not asking for billion dollar bailouts due to piracy Give it time.
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Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty | |
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karlmarx
join:2006-09-18
Nashua, NH
·Fairpoint Communic..
| They want their cake and to eat it to. Did you READ the document?
The MPAA want's the VALUE of the MOVIE to be based on the cost of the production of the MEDIA. Which is about $.10 cents.
They ALSO want to be able to send their media over the internet.
Yet, they want ISP's to filter said media.
So, which one is it going to be. Do they want to be able to use the internet to distribute, or do they want the ISP's to block it all?
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The happiest countries are the most secular. The struggle AGAINST corporations is the struggle FOR humanity! | |
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Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
| the music industry should thank piracy without piracy the MP3 likely would never have taken off, so things like ipods wouldnt have a reason to exist and as such their automatic profit machines(aka digital download stores like iTunes and others) would never exist. digital downloads are nearly pure profit when you think about the cost of bulk bandwidth and server maintance vs disc fab and trucking.
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[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports | |
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asdfdfdfdfdfdf
@Level3.net
| This is why those people condemning collective licensing... need to rethink. This is why I am so frustrated by the attitudes of people in the other thread. We are all shooting ourselves in the foot out of spite toward the industry.
»Debating an ISP Piracy Tax
It is in all our interests to find a solution that can balance consumer and industry interests.
If the situation continues indefinitely in this stalemate the government will become more and more willing to turn to solutions like forcing isp services to crack down on infringement, filter and monitor all of our activities. We are seeing this happening in other countries. This would be an appalling result and would further the move toward legitimizing things like deep packet inspection, which would facilitate all kinds of nasty intentions that the incumbent communication companies have to subvert competition. The consequences would also be far reaching for our privacy and liberty.
We will all end up paying a very heavy price for the refusal of some people to compromise. Purists often impose a lot of unpleasant side effects on others. | |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: This is why those people condemning collective licensing... I don't agree that taxing is the solution. The RIAA is greedy. Period. They still haven't shown accountability for actually distributing the monies they have received in their lawsuits to the copyright holders. And you want to give them MORE money? No. Copyright law is pretty specific in its intent, which is to protect the copyright holder from exploitation (i.e. people making money/taking credit off/from their work). Anything else and it's steering away from the point of proliferating the arts. | |
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asdfdfdfdfdfdf
@Level3.net
| Re: This is why those people condemning collective licensing... You have to work with what is, not with what you wish was there.
I'm in general agreement with what you say, but this is the purist attitude I'm talking about.
You seem to be saying that you have no intention of cooperating or compromising until the present industry voluntarily commits suicide. They aren't going to do that. The copyright industries may indeed be profoundly corrupt and exploitative, but it is a system that has stood for far longer than any of us have been alive and, though its profit is diminished, it doesn't appear as if it is going to disappear. People still pay a lot of money every year to be entertained by product from this industry and massive numbers of musicians still choose to participate in such a system. The public at large has continued to buy and keep this industry alive through all of its stupid behavior over the last half dozen years. They aren't going to stop buying even if the ugly things I suggested above come to pass.
To Desdinova I would say that I would love to see their business model change and I would love to see the american public develop a spine. I would ask you to consider this though: The US public sat passively by during the worst economic crisis since the depression and the massive socialization of the costs and risks that the wealthy took on to privately profit at public expense, sat passively by during the iraq fiasco, the patriot act, torture at abu ghraib, Mark Kleins whistleblowing about nsa blanket snooping of american internet traffic at AT&T. If we are waiting for the US public to act to defend its interests and uphold just and fair norms we may be waiting until hell freezes over. Whose scenario do you think is more likely to come true yours(however much I wish your scenario would come true) or mine?
Unfortunately we don't get to deal with our idealized vision of how the world should be. We have to deal with the world as it is. We try to change it for the better, when we can, but we shouldn't ignore the things we can do to keep it from becoming worse than it is now.
So I again come back to what I said before. If we refuse to find a solution then worse things are likely to result. If we have an opportunity for a solution that may not be ideal, but is better than what we have now and is better than what we are likely to get if we do nothing, then why would we subvert our own interests by doing nothing? | |
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SRFireside
join:2001-01-19
Houston, TX
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: This is why those people condemning collective licensing... said by asdfdfdfdfdfdf :
The copyright industries may indeed be profoundly corrupt and exploitative, but it is a system that has stood for far longer than any of us have been alive and, though its profit is diminished, it doesn't appear as if it is going to disappear. Then again you can say the same thing about the auto industry, the oil industry and the banking (i.e. home lending) industry. All three had some very corrupt elements in them that abused their positions to further their own greed. Now look at them. Nobody can escape karma. Mark my words the music industry will HAVE to change their tune or there will be a similar shakeup in their industry.
said by asdfdfdfdfdfdf :
I would ask you to consider this though: The US public sat passively by during the worst economic crisis since the depression and the massive socialization of the costs and risks that the wealthy took on to privately profit at public expense, sat passively by during the iraq fiasco, the patriot act, torture at abu ghraib, Mark Kleins whistleblowing about nsa blanket snooping of american internet traffic at AT&T.
The U.S. public had MANY who decried all of those things and many more. The problem is the government either denied there was a problem or flat out ignored the complaints. Again... we see the fruits of that labor. Time will tell if hindsight is 20/20, but right here and right now more and more people are coming out against all that. Likely because they no longer fear the retribution that may have been threatening them from the old regime.
said by asdfdfdfdfdfdf :
We try to change it for the better, when we can, but we shouldn't ignore the things we can do to keep it from becoming worse than it is now. It's not about what change is more likely to pass. It's about refusing the IP tax. People shouldn't have to pay into something they may or may not do. Ideologically I gave you my reasons against it. The alternative is for the RIAA and MPAA to continue with business as usual. That is fine for me. Now the courts are more and more ruling against them and it is getting harder and harder for them to sustain their legal action. Why appease them now when in the end they are fighting a losing battle? | |
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| Desdinova
join:2003-01-26
Gaithersburg, MD
| "If the situation continues indefinitely in this stalemate the government will become more and more willing to turn to solutions like forcing isp services to crack down on infringement, filter and monitor all of our activities."
Maybe. Or the U.S. public may suddenly realize that the government works for THEM and not for a handful of poorly informed attorneys who are doing as much damage as they can to the greatest number of people in an effort to prop up an antiquated and failed business model. | |
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wtansill
Ncc1701
join:2000-10-10
Falls Church, VA
1 edit | Here's a wishlist for ya... I have two ideas on this, the first of which is original to me, the second of of which I read somewhere (might even have been here - I can't recall).
•The US Congress has repeatedly extended copyright terms at the request of the entertainment industry. Well and good -- that is their contitutional function. However, every such extension is, by definition, a diminution of the public domain. As such, it is a "taking", and the public should be compensated as provided by the 5th Amendment. And who better to provide such compensation than the very industry who has so far benefitted from such takings?
•The various entertainment industries consider their IP to be real property -- hence the terms "piracy" or "theft" for what is in fact various acts of copyright infringment. Fine. Let's extend the metaphor to its logical conclusion. Real property is subject to various taxes. Let the entertainment industry have any copyright extensions it calls for. And lets tax every last piece of "intellectual property" they own. I'm guessing that a very large chunk of previously closely-held IP would very quickly fall into the public domain were we to demand such a tax.
As Porky Pig famously said "Ththththata's all folks!"
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"In every generation, there are those who want to rule well - but they mean to rule. They promise to be good masters - but they mean to be master."
--Daniel Webster
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| Pv8man
join:2008-07-24
Hammond, IN | Re: Here's a wishlist for ya... heh, hey that Porky Pig statement is copyrighted. YOU ARE STEALING!!! YOU LITTLE THIEF !!! LOL | |
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GlobalMind
Domino Dude, POWER Systems Guy
Premium
join:2001-10-29
Hollywood, FL | Yea three "warnings" is crap Sorry but disconnect for warnings is BS to the Nth degree.
Now, if it's actually PROVEN that you've infringed 3 times then ok well maybe that might work.
But warnings? LOL!! Yea we know how accurate those have been. | |
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Ayal B
@optonline.net
| Get a grip! I haven't posted here in years, I still pop by and troll from time to time, this is obnoxious! Not that I voted for or support President Elect Obama, but I feel bad for the job he is about to undertake. He is walking in to the biggest mess we as a nation or civilization have ever seen. The ship is taking on water so fast I can't imagine any possible way to fix things. The Riaa Mpaa should go to he!! the last thing the incoming president needs to be concerned with is this nonsense! These morons should open their eyes and see that we've got much bigger problems then whether or not someone downloads a copy written song or movie. I think the transition team even giving them the time of day just shows how not ready they are to govern in this crisis. And the MPAA continues to show that they are a dinosaur that needs to be extinct. | |
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no one
@rr.com
| they just dont get it. At last count wasn't something like half of all internet traffic in the USA all P2P traffic. The MAfiaa's need to understand that times have changed. People want to get there music/movies in different ways and use it the way they want to use it. Sometimes you don't want the movie with 2 million hours of extra crap footage, or the latest wonderteen make your ears bleed crap song.
I can see it know, half of the US gets banned from the net for warning letters. | |
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no one
@rr.com
| At last count wasn't something like half of all internet traffic in the USA all P2P traffic. The MAfiaa's need to understand that times have changed. People want to get there music/movies in different ways and use it the way they want to use it. Sometimes you don't want the movie with 2 million hours of extra crap footage, or the latest wonderteen make your ears bleed crap song.
I can see it now, half of the US gets banned from the net for warning letters. | |
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The MPAA's Wishlist For The Obama Presidency
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