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story category The NSA Doesn't Take Kindly To Fiber Cuts
Washington rail extension plays peek a boo with government fiber...
09:49AM Monday Jun 01 2009 by Karl Bode
tags: business · hardware · install · trouble
The cutting of an unmarked fiber optic cable or a sewer line are par for the course during construction or fiber installations, though the Washington Post explores what happens when that fiber you cut just happens to belong to a secretive government agency. A $5.2 billion project to extend the DC Metrorail means moving more than 75 miles of conduit. When a normal fiber line gets cut (and they've spent $150 million to move the lines of 21 private utilities) it takes some time to find out the owner, but construction crews say when they cut a government intelligence line, they get a personal visit from very annoyed government employees in black SUVs within minutes.


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Forums » The NSA Doesn't Take Kindly To Fiber Cuts
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aSic
application specific
Premium
join:2001-05-17
Wakulla, FL
clubs:

Wow..

"...a personal visit from very annoyed government employees in black SUVs within minutes."

Thats one hell of an SLA.
--
Teamwork is a lot of people doing what I say.

Maynard G Krebs

@teksavvy.com

Re: Wow..

said by aSic See Profile :

Thats one hell of an SLA.

There's No Such Agreement.
DarkLogix

join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX
I don't think is as much of a SLA as a you cut my cable I'm coming after you agreement

GlenQuagmire
Giggidy Giggidy Giggidy Goo
Premium
join:2004-02-16
Grand Rapids, MI

Opps

Opps No more youtube for the NSA.

cowspotter

join:2000-09-11
Ashburn, VA

Billion

Just a small correction. The metrorail extension is $5.2 billion, not million.
nanoflower

join:2002-07-14
30876

Re: Billion

I figured that was probably the case. Otherwise that's a mighty expensive extension. Spend $5 million on the extension, but spend $150 million moving utilities before the actual extension can be done. Ouch....
Mr Matt

join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL
·Comcast
·Embarq

That was the snoop line!

The construction crew was wrong, no one in our government is intelligent. That was the line carrying everyone's communications in the world. The NSA could no longer listen on Aunt Bee's conversation with Barney. That is why they were upset.
BarneyBadAss
Badasses Fight For Freedom
Premium
join:2004-05-07
00001
·Verizon FIOS

Re: That was the snoop line!

said by Mr Matt See Profile :

The construction crew was wrong, no one in our government is intelligent. That was the line carrying everyone's communications in the world. The NSA could no longer listen on Aunt Bee's conversation with Barney. That is why they were upset.
I never talk w/aunt Bee on the phone. I only talk to her using a couple o'tin cans n' some string!
--
---Barney
dlewis23

join:2005-04-18
Boca Raton, FL

Nice

Id love to be on the job site the day that happens, just to see how the foreman handles this one... LOL

Nightshade
sic semper tyrannis
Premium
join:2002-05-26
Salem, OR

Re: Nice

Hell it be enough for me to see the foreman's "Oh Sh*t" look on his face.
Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
great would be the foreman telling the government guy, Tough shit we called 811 and you guys where too dumb to have yours on the plans.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports
social

join:2000-07-19
Saint Louis, MO

1 edit

Hmmm

"it takes some time to fine out the owner" Do you think that they get fined or does it take time to FIND the owner. Hmmm I wonder if it the Men in Black that come to see you.
DarkLogix

join:2008-10-23
Baytown, TX

Re: Hmmm

I'd tell you but then I'd have to neuralize you

cwy1980
Premium
join:2004-08-10
Monmouth Junction, NJ
clubs:

Re: Hmmm

I think the currently acceptable term is "marginalize"

tomkb
Premium
join:2000-11-15
Avon, OH
clubs:

ya, but here is the kicker

Who's service is better to the general public? Government or Utility?
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY

black wire

quote:
Georgelas, the developer whose company was overseeing the work in 2000 when the Chevrolet Suburbans drove up to the Greensboro Corporate Center, said he figured that the government was involved when an AT&T crew arrived the same day to fix the line, rather than waiting days. His opinion didn't change when AT&T tried to bill his company for the work but immediately backed down when his company balked.

"These lines are not cheap to move," Georgelas said. "They said, 'You owe us $300,000.' We said, 'Are you nuts?' "

The charges just disappeared.

Non-existent wire means a non-existent repair bill

morbo
Complete Your Transaction

join:2002-01-22
00000
clubs:

Re: black wire

I'm certain AT&T tried to bill the company as well as the government for the same work.

KrK
Heavy Artillery For The Little Guy
Premium
join:2000-01-17
Tulsa, OK
·AT&T Yahoo
·AT&T DSL Service
·Cox HSI
·AT&T Southwest

Re: black wire

said by morbo See Profile :

I'm certain AT&T tried to bill the company as well as the government for the same work.
They probably billed them both more thern once.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini

rcdailey
Dragoonfly
Premium
join:2005-03-29
Rialto, CA

What happens when they have to give up those Suburbans and drive around in eco-friendly little cars? They won't be nearly so scary. Of course, they could just remove $300,000 from the bank account of the developer without asking. That would shake him up, probably even more than a formation of black SUV's.
--
In reality, there is no such thing as a clean human being.
averagedude

join:2002-01-30
Mesa, AZ
·Cox HSI

Re: black wire


car
The NSA showing up in a black smart car instead of a SUV....not so intimidating.

hayabusa3303
Over 200 mph
Premium
join:2005-06-29
clubs:
·QuantumVoice
·AT&T Southeast
·RoadRunner Cable

Re: black wire

How about this one? Makes more since to me..

Mr Neutron
Hopped up on what you mopped up
Premium
join:2005-05-30
Gorham, ME

said by averagedude See Profile :

The NSA showing up in a black smart car instead of a SUV....not so intimidating.
What about a clown car? You know, something about half the size of a smartcar that pulls up and suddenly a dozen guys start leaping out of it?

(Well, it would scare the hell out of me, anyway.)
--
We could use the £5,000 to buy a spoon. And then fill up with ice cream.
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY

said by rcdailey See Profile :

Of course, they could just remove $300,000 from the bank account of the developer without asking. That would shake him up, probably even more than a formation of black SUV's.
Then the bank will swallow the loss after the account holder says fraud, then the bank will withdraw the $ from TARP.

OSUGoose

join:2007-12-27
Columbus, OH
clubs:
·AT&T Midwest
·Cingular Wireless
·Verizon BroadbandA..
·RoadRunner Cable

I'd say the Gov't will be footing the bill to repair their own lines. They failed to mark it, claiming it was "secret". Ya well thats all good and nice but you could of had it setup under a dummy owner name. Failure to mark your facilities normaly means the damager is free from libility. Esp if they called 811/One call number to have them marked BEFORE they dug.
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY

Re: black wire

said by OSUGoose See Profile :

Failure to mark your facilities normaly means the damager is free from libility. Esp if they called 811/One call number to have them marked BEFORE they dug.
Yep, if One Call didn't mark it, you have no liability in repairing it.
Kearnstd
Elf Wizard
Premium
join:2002-01-22
Mullica Hill, NJ
im sorry since your wire "Doesnt Exist" we "Didn't Cut it".....
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports

Neyland

join:2003-02-04
USA

Fine out the owner?

I suppose they might try a fine....

"When a normal fiber line gets cut (and they've spent $150 million to move the lines of 21 private utilities) it takes some time to fine out the owner..."

Steve
I'm a PC, so shut up
Consultant
join:2001-03-10
Yorba Linda, CA

Re: Fine out the owner?

When you find what's obviously a typo, why not send Karl a private message instead of post a public message?

Neyland

join:2003-02-04
USA


1 edit

Re: Fine out the owner?

Because I was only 95% sure it was a typo, could have been a joke considering the gov does like to hand out fines.

Besides, if I send him a private message then I don't get the credit for being a wise ass spelling freak.

*Edit for spelling*

birdfeedr
Premium,MVM
join:2001-08-11
Warwick, RI
Could be worse. It could be a visit by the GrammarNazi™.

»Re: So did hitler
MichaelWacey
OwlSaver
Premium
join:2005-01-30
Berwyn, PA
·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast

This sounds like a potential security problem

My understanding is that in the past, any sensitive copper links would be run through hardened conduit with leakage detection. That would make taping or signal inject nearly impossible without detection.

It sounds like they have decided that Fibre plus encryption is secure enough that it does not require special conduit. I am not so sure. But, then again, they did detect the break location, so there must be some sort of detection mechanism.

See 7 replies to this post
andyross

join:2003-05-04
Schaumburg, IL

Why not just label them "Top Secret"?

Seems like a stupid way to identify the lines! Now everybody knows which are the government ones! Just cut one, and wait for the SUV's.
cooperaaaron

join:2004-04-10
Joliet, IL

Why are they called "secret" lines ?

We all know what info goes thru them......

See 9 replies to this post

SLD
Premium
join:2002-04-17

Why SUVs?

Can't they drive something a little more eco-friendly and less wasteful of tax-dollars?

See 6 replies to this post
cpsycho

join:2008-06-03
Orangeville, ON

Wow 15 minutes...

Man I atleast give my company 20 minutes before I phone them. I know online gaming is all the rage at the NSA but 15 minutes, these guys must be so addicted to WoW and FPS games.

Transmaster
Don't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus

join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
·Qwest.net

Re: Wow 15 minutes...

a Friend of mine who works for Qwest, and also has the necessary security clearances to work on the fiber used by the Space Command in Colorado Springs. He told me he was working on the fiber lines at the resident of the General in command of The Air Force Space Command. He and his co worker had cleared this with the Generals staff and the Security staff, or so they though. They where working on the system they where challenged and when they looked up from where they where working right into the muzzles of several M4's carbines and M9 pistols. Mark dryly remarked it was apparent not everyone in security had been informed they where there. It turned out the section they where working on had recently had the security requirements increased and part of that was a Air Force Security Officer had to be present at all times too watch the technician do their work.
--
I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's.
- Mark Twain in Eruption

cableties
Premium
join:2005-01-27

Who ya gonna call?

Fiber-Busters!

I believe it.

FunnyBones
Premium
join:2004-01-22
usa
·Vonage

Re: Who ya gonna call?

said by cableties See Profile :

Fiber-Busters!

I believe it.
lol I busted my gut reading this..
--
Fb:2009 Take the quintessence and all will be reveled.

tmh

@qwest.net

What fiber?

The NSA will neither confirm nor deny the existence of any fiber, so if the line gets cut, TS.
MichaelWacey
OwlSaver
Premium
join:2005-01-30
Berwyn, PA
·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast

Re: What fiber?

So, the work crew accidentally cuts a piece of unidentified fiber. They report it to the appropriate authorities. They go home for the night. When they get back in the morning, either the fibre is mysteriously fixed or it is gone. That sounds more like the NSA.
halfelite

join:2007-09-11

did they know?

All i want to know is. Did the SUV folk know there was construction going on. Or did the come with m16's and rocket launchers stashed in their car to take someone out.

SUV: "Finally some action"
SUV: "Ye i hope i can test out my new gun"
SUV: "ahhhhh hell its only construction"

NSA_CIA

@charter.com

Re: did they know?

said by halfelite See Profile :

All i want to know is. Did the SUV folk know there was construction going on. Or did the come with m16's and rocket launchers stashed in their car to take someone out.

SUV: "Finally some action"
SUV: "Ye i hope i can test out my new gun"
SUV: "ahhhhh hell its only construction"
Nah, we pull up in this:

»www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAZ2qvhJGgU

hayabusa3303
Over 200 mph
Premium
join:2005-06-29
clubs:

Re: did they know?

alittle to much fire power. How about a RPG looks better.

spg
Grrrr

join:2001-10-31
NOT Texas!

Re: did they know?

Can I have the brass?

RR User

@rr.com

Ok how about a Hummer.... with a machine gun... quad Stinger missle launcher.... and a laser cannon:

»www.hummerpedia.org/hummer-avenger-laser

quote:
“Laser Avenger, unlike a conventional weapon, can fire its laser beam without creating missile exhaust or gun flashes that would reveal its position. As a result, Laser Avenger can neutralize these UAV threats while keeping our troops safe.”

The tests follow a 2007 demonstration in which an earlier version of Laser Avenger neutralized improvised explosive devices (IEDs) and unexploded ordnance (UXO) on the ground.
I'm sure getting it painted "secret agency" black is not a problem...
dougau
Premium
join:2007-08-09
Dickson, TN

government SUV's

Why is it that “The Government” gets to drive SUV gas hogs but wants to put the rest of us in “gas efficient” little mini-me cars?

Hpower
Roflmao

join:2000-06-08
Glendale, CA

Re: government SUV's

lol yup that's what I think of too.
mc5w

join:2002-06-14
Independence, OH

Cut the Fiber

What we really need to do is to cut the fiber going to India. Then, companies would be forced to move the call centers over here.
Forums » The NSA Doesn't Take Kindly To Fiber Cuts


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