site Search:


 
   
The hardest question..
by justin Tuesday 29-Aug-2000 tags: coverage · telco
The hardest question is still Can You Get DSL. After years of software development effort and data cleaning by Telcos and their DCLEC competitors, there is still no reliable answer to this question, without actually ordering it, then plugging in the DSL modem in and waiting for a green light.

Perhaps these screenshots can explain why nobody knows availability for a new address for sure: Telco, CLEC, ISP, for many addresses, we're all in the dark.

The screen-shot to the left is a 500 mile chunk of California coastline, taken from the SBC DSL Availability tool. (Click on the picture to enlarge it). This program allows SBC and authorized CLECs to zoom into increasing levels of detail of SBCs wire center and DSL boundary database.
Each of those little blue stars is a Telco Wire Center, and the lines define the boundaries of the area they serve. (It is interesting to note lines of blue stars marching across the country, perhaps following a major communications link, and/or highway).

Zooming further into the San Francisco bay area, one can see that some wire centers serve huge, albeit sparsely populated geographical areas.. 30 miles or more! On the other hand, the populated areas are still a mass of COs. For even the largest CLECs offering DSL, such as Covad and NorthPoint, all they have to go on for DSL availablity in any state are the location of these COs, and the boundaries of their service areas. They then must make educated guesses using further mapping databases to filter customers that are likely to be too far, from those that are almost certainly near enough. How well can an automatic filter based on positions and maps really do? lets continue down to further levels of detail and see!

Now we down into a 100 mile square area, and most of the COs are switched on for DSL.. but of course that still leaves the problem of distance from the CO.. Please note, this mapping tool is unique to SBC, and not employed like this for the mass of DSL prequalifications done by the CLECs or their partner ISPs.. so you are looking at a more accurate picture here than even Covad and NorthPoint is utilizing in production!

At the level of 30 mile square areas, the application is able to start giving us critical information on DSL availablity.. Green for DSL Yes, Yellow for DSL Maybe, and Red for DSL No.
It is plain that despite the number of COs that are DSL equipped in such an important city, zones are still unreachable. In addition, one can start to see the irregular nature of DSL availablity. Little green DSL compass circles with radius 18000 freet are clearly not the case.

At the 10 mile level, the streets become clearer. There are obviously thousands of cases here where even direct neighbors will have radically different experiences when ordering the same service. It is also possible to tell that driving distance estimates on DSL availability such as typically offered on other web-sites, are of limited use.. availability as predicted by the SBC system here, does not obey crow-fly, or crow-drives, distance rules!


Here we can see street names. For those in the green area, DSL availability is a high probability, and only very unusual problems could get in the way of a connection. For those in the yellow area, DSL availability is impossible to tell from data alone.. the only way to find out is to try an order. For those in the red area, only a remote DSL terminal will help their situation.

So next time your ISP does a flip/flop on availability, or available speeds, remember that until your sync light goes green, there are no guarantees and no fast answers when it comes to the question, Can I get DSL?.


See also: DSL install explained from start to finish
DSL from the installer

view: topics flat text 
Post a:
Brain Dead

join:2000-07-14
Baltimore, MD

Too cool!

where can i get that mapping program?

kkb
Counsel thrift, courtesy and cynicism.

join:2000-06-11
ExPat SOB

Re: Mapping Program

I haven't played with it, but it looks interesting...

»www.baylor.edu/~grass/index2.html
Anon

Re: Too cool!

Biggest cock-a-mai-mie lie I've hear about DSL - you'll get it - I mean, mine's $40 (just dropped from $50 last month, and $150 for the prior year to that) - and I'm gunna cancel the DSL line and it's shared line from GTE since really, 56K provides all I need.

Maybe if there was some advantage in LATENCY I'd care about DSL over 56K - but screw em - especially when they delete web pages describing what the details were... I got a legit 56K service for $8/month, and it's never let me down yet in the past 2+ years. In fact the shit GTE ISP has been down so much this past month, I had to rely on this dial-up back-up.
manhole

join:2000-09-12
Modesto, CA
Where can I get a map of my city to see what area's have DSL. I live in Modesto, CA. Thanks.

JerryC23
Character Counts 40,41,43
Premium,ExMod 1999-03
join:1999-10-08
Humble, TX

Can we shift about 1500 miles East and ..

..just a little south and get a similar map of Houston -
or more precise 27.7 miles NE of Houston -to Humble, Tx

OH Rats**t - That's a Sprint area.

Never mind
==========
Will we ever get DSL in HUMBLE?

[text was edited by author 2000-08-29 20:53:26]

mrdialup8

join:2000-07-30
Fayetteville, AR

Re: Can we shift that to Arkansas?

Amen! Can we also shift that half way across the U.S. (to Arkansas), and see what it does?

I just switched ISP's today. I am with DicksonStreet.com (Dickson Street On-Line, a local ISP.) I get 200 hours for $19.95 a month. I shared my dad's last account (with the U of A, and got 80 hours for free, if you work for the U of A). They only offer dial-up, but have plans to offer Wireless Access with in the next month. God I hope they do offer wireless.

I want DSL!

justin
Australian
join:1999-05-28
New York, NY
kudos:7

Re: Can we shift that to Arkansas?

I'm going to deeply regret doing this.. but
here is your town.
RadioDoc
58ef2c0
Premium,ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-05-11

Re: Can we shift that to Arkansas?

Justin: What a cool article. Too bad its such a pain to generate maps with that SBC tool. The fact that they have developed it gives me some hope that they are at least trying to get a good handle on where their deployment problems are. And no, I don't want a map. I know where they are around here.
Anon

Re: Can we shift that to Arkansas?

I live just south of Little Rock (3 miles south of Baseline road on Arch Street) and even without seeing your map, I figure the closest it comes to me is 1500 feet.

Larry

Dest
Bolo
Premium
join:2000-03-21
Naperville, IL
Reviews:
·Sprint Broadband..
quote:
Justin: What a cool article. Too bad its such a pain to generate maps with that SBC tool. The fact that they have developed it gives me some hope that they are at least trying to get a good handle on where their deployment problems are. And no, I don't want a map. I know where they are around here.

Does that mean you have access? cause i just recently stumble and gain access to the Map tools lol =) and discover that my town is one giant gray blob =(

wesm
Premium
join:1999-07-29
Redmond, WA
You're gonna be flooded with requests for maps, you know that, don't you? So, if SWBell has this handy technology all available, is it still "plug and pray" like the article says, or are they actually getting more accurate at doing prequals?

On a related note, does anyone know how GTE/Verizon's site (»www.gte.com/dsl/) does that prequal?

(Oh, and can I have a map of 75006? *duck* Actually, I'd like one, but not if it causes problems, which it apparently does)

stray

join:2000-01-16
Warren, NJ

Re: Can we shift that to Arkansas?

I tried the Verizon prequal with both my home and office phone numbers. Got this message:

"The Number Entered May Not be in Verizon's Service Area"

Perhaps I should write that response on my next set of Verizon telephone bills. Been paying BA or Verizon for 15 years. Never noticed that I wasn't getting phone service!

wesm
Premium
join:1999-07-29
Redmond, WA

Re: Can we shift that to Arkansas?

Well, if you went to the address I listed, remember that GTE and Bell Atlantic just merged ... the GTE site still probably only covers the original GTE DSL service areas, even though it now says Verizon all over it. Just a thought.

(Ever noticed that DSL in the post preview is highlighted as being spelt wrong?)

mrdialup8

join:2000-07-30
Fayetteville, AR
Regret what? Thanks for the pic. I had a good feeling I knew what the pic would look like. I did not think there would be so much green, I thought there would be a little speck of green with the rest of pic made of yellow and red. Once again, thanks.
Anon How do I get to see my area? 44070? Is this GIS tool from Ameritech something that everyone can use or is it only for SBC people? I wonder if there is anywhere to see where new development is going.. and future projected dsl availablilty for SBC.. as you can tell by the Nick I have Ameritech. I have got alot of people in my area with DSL and there is this funny box that is huge on my pole out in the front yard that is new and there was trucks laying what I think was fiber about a month ago on the pole as well.. THey were all over the place.

klambert
Seti Rocks
ExMod 2000-03
join:2000-07-20
Dallas, TX
WHere did y'all find that SBC mapping tool? Is it proprietary, or can anyone use it? How do I get it???
JWilly

join:2000-06-02
48519-1440

Re: The hardest question..

This description of why it's hard to determine DSL availability is somewhat misleading. Phone networks are hardware; all that SBC has done for their DSL availability tool is copy their network map from Engineering, then analyze and modify the data according to known DSL limitations, i.e. concentrators, fiber, cable trouble histories, previous cable bandwidth problems, etc. Of course a driving-distance or circular-radius estimate is inaccurate; we all know that it's cable distance and hardware layers that matter. But, the cable networks have been extremely well mapped for many years, for engineering, maintenance and facilities planning of POTS telephone service.

There is no reason why any other telco can't do the same thing as SBC; all telcos have similar maps of their POTS networks. The telcos' DSL operations don't have to bear the full cost of map development because their maps are based on data that is mostly paid for on the POTS-service side.

In theory, the major non-telco providers could do the same thing in two ways. One, they could spend a ton of money to independantly re-map the telcos' networks. That's not practical. Two, they could build maps based on the telcos' existing engineering databases, if they could get access to them. Perhaps the rules that force the telcos to provide access to their copper networks didn't foresee the need to also provide access to that engineering information.
Anon

Even DSLREPORTS can't tell you

Most of the dsl-prequal tools do not take into account that many SLC/DLCs are equipped for DSL. As a result, the distance calculation is way off. When the user is behind a DSL equipped SLC/DLC, the distance should be calculated to the SLC/DLC and not to the CO. In my case the DSLREPORTS tool reports that I am 17500+ feet from the CO when it should really be 4500 ft, and ADSL is not listed as an option. Many providers look at the distance calculation and simply say the DSL is not available or you can only have IDSL. I have BellSouth ADSL and it works great.

wesm
Premium
join:1999-07-29
Redmond, WA

Re: Even DSLREPORTS can't tell you

As near as I know, the telcos don't/aren't required to publish the locations of SLC and DLC units. Ergo, since DSLreports, nor the CLECs, know where these things are, they can't calculate distance from them. The number you get from DSLreports is a guess, nothing more. As the article says, you won't know for certain that you can get DSL until you plug in the modem and get a green light.
---
Do not meddle in the affairs of sysadmins, for they are easy to annoy and have the root password.
Anon

Re: The hardest question..

This is a fabulous article. It really paints a clear picture of what to expect for DSL. However, this is the LEC view and may not be specific to the other CLECs. (Maybe it is...!)
Anon

Just a few more shifts

Wow - This is some really great stuff. Is there any way I can get a look at the East Bay - I would love to be able to get a close up of Oakland as well as the Peninsula - my folks are moving to Burlingame and they are having a hard time getting DSL. Also - I have been told that my CO is full. How many people can be served by each office. Thanks again for this insight into an area that I have been wresting with for a long time....

Monday, 04-Jun 06:37:17 Terms of Use & Privacy | feedback | contact | Hosting by nac.net - DSL,Hosting & Co-lo
over 12.5 years online © 1999-2012 dslreports.com.