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Time Warner Cable Increases Workforce in Kansas City
As Operator is Forced to Compete With Google Fiber

Time Warner Cable is one of many U.S. ISPs that has, for too long, beneffitted from little to no real competition in many of its markets. The result is an ISP that tries just hard enough to keep up appearances, but which has been sluggish on system upgrades while usually refusing to seriously compete on price. Now that Google Fiber has entered one of their markets in Kansas City, Time Warner Cable has already been promising locals working on Google Fiber $50 gift cards if they dish information on the build, and now user xenophon See Profile directs our attention to the fact they're significantly ramping up hiring in Kansas City, bumping it's local workforce by about 9%.

One thing that may have to change is their top speeds of 50 Mbps down, 5 Mbps up -- which even among DOCSIS 3.0 operators is starting to look a little stale in the face of symmetrical 1 Gbps connections for $70. While you'd like to think these new employees will spend their time working on upgrading Time Warner Cable's network, they'll more likely spend their time rushing around and trying to get locals locked into two-year contracts before Google Fiber comes to town.
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tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080

Member

where it counts?

You'd think they'd do more hiring for PLANT upgrades and revise offerings maybe split some nodes and outside construction too? How about some FTTP? There's no reason you HAVE to stick with coax in the last mile? Afterall, google fiber is going coax inside the home too.. wouldn't it be nice to have an analogous product that can compete bit for bit? Don't expect docsis 4.0 to come flying out of R&D anytime soon to save you!

Time Warner better start offering at LEAST a 300mbit tier in the next 6 months or they won't have customers in overlapping geography.. playing the we're the town employer bit isnt' gonna do much.. Time Warner isn't walmart or a coal mining company.. and certainly not General (Sam) Motors.

Docsis 3 is no competition for gigabit fiber.. The only thing they can do is compete on price.. I'm looking for 300mbit for ~$50.. this somewhat approaches sanity in an apples to apples comparison. Afterall there is no mid-grade/half-way tier btw 5mbit and 1000mbit (for half the price.. $35-$50).. it's all 1000 or the free 5mbit service. That can pave the way for additional competition in the northeast, if it happens. Not holding breath.. TWC is a company that would have usage caps & overages if they could get away with it..

JasonOD
@comcast.net

JasonOD

Anon

Re: where it counts?

300mbit for $50? By their own metrics they'd be losing money and would not be the best PR as their other markets are going to notice the major price disparity. TW's best bet might be to consider KC to be a 'lost' market, ignore google, and let the chips fall. Fibre's great, but google fibre is no threat to their overall business.

Gbcue
Premium Member
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA

Gbcue

Premium Member

Re: where it counts?

said by JasonOD :

their other markets are going to notice the major price disparity.

That's the point.

skuv
@rr.com

skuv

Anon

Re: where it counts?

said by Gbcue:

said by JasonOD :

their other markets are going to notice the major price disparity.

That's the point.

The point is that they should try to compete on price with an obvious "loss leader" that is subsidized by other business within Google, and enrage their other markets that would want to be at that price point?

Why is everyone assuming that Google is making profit on the prices they are charging? They don't have to, it's not their only business or product.
tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080 to JasonOD

Member

to JasonOD
Maybe, but that doesn't justify hiring more people..
People may poo-poo hydrogen, natural gas, and electric cars as being on the fringe.. and a "LOSS LEADER" but when $5 - $10 gas arrives, they won't be poo-pooing it anymore..

Google has indicated they may expand if successful. Not that they'd necessarily target a TWC geography, but why not, if the response is going to be to hire a few token employees to stay loyal to the company.. that's like a mining town that keeps hiring miners after the mines close or have very little offer.
25139889 (banned)
join:2011-10-25
Toledo, OH

25139889 (banned)

Member

Re: where it counts?

and i've been waiting on that $5+ gas that AAA has been claiming for the last 5+ years. Still hasn't hit.

SeanA
@rr.com

SeanA to JasonOD

Anon

to JasonOD
The Model T was no threat to the livery business either....

LightS
Premium Member
join:2005-12-17
Greenville, TX

LightS to tmc8080

Premium Member

to tmc8080
If they could do a 300/100 plan for around that price, and I didn't have google fiber available, I'd likely get it. However, with their current pricing model for that area, they will have to ramp up their infrastructure

I had Time Warner for the last 26 months and I was very fond of them. That being said, i'd take gfiber over TWC any day of the week if I had the choice..

skuv
@rr.com

skuv

Anon

Re: where it counts?

said by LightS:

If they could do a 300/100 plan for around that price, and I didn't have google fiber available, I'd likely get it. However, with their current pricing model for that area, they will have to ramp up their infrastructure

I had Time Warner for the last 26 months and I was very fond of them. That being said, i'd take gfiber over TWC any day of the week if I had the choice..

Besides price, what exactly do you know about Google's Internet service, TV service, and customer service that would make you switch any day of the week?

LightS
Premium Member
join:2005-12-17
Greenville, TX

LightS

Premium Member

Re: where it counts?

Nothing. The price is enough for me to give it a shot.
tgp1994
join:2010-10-06

tgp1994 to tmc8080

Member

to tmc8080
said by tmc8080:

Afterall, google fiber is going coax inside the home too..

Wait, do you mean for standard televisions, or does all of the data on the fiber at some point come in over coaxial?
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Re: where it counts?

Google Fiber can use WiFi, coax or Ethernet to connect its set top boxes to its "Storage Box" (DVR).
UnnDunn
Premium Member
join:2005-12-21
Brooklyn, NY

UnnDunn to tgp1994

Premium Member

to tgp1994
Coax is more than adequate to deliver any sort of data around the home. And chances are you already have a perfectly serviceable in-home Coax network. No sense deploying an in-home Fiber or Ethernet network (at least, not for Google Fiber purposes) when you've got Coax right there.
tgp1994
join:2010-10-06

tgp1994

Member

Re: where it counts?

said by UnnDunn:

Coax is more than adequate to deliver any sort of data around the home. And chances are you already have a perfectly serviceable in-home Coax network. No sense deploying an in-home Fiber or Ethernet network (at least, not for Google Fiber purposes) when you've got Coax right there.

So the idea is that for each machine, you get (or buy, I'm not sure which) a converter?
elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA

elray to tmc8080

Member

to tmc8080
What counts is the video package, not the ridiculous Gbit speeds.

Unless Google offers its TV lineup with their $300 "free" 5M tier, they will find themselves losing and ... leaving.
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Re: where it counts?

Why the heck would they need to do that? You're shortchanging the fact that many folks don't want linear TV anymore. You can also continue to get TV from somewhere else.
elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA

1 recommendation

elray

Member

Re: where it counts?

said by iansltx:

Why the heck would they need to do that? You're shortchanging the fact that many folks don't want linear TV anymore. You can also continue to get TV from somewhere else.

Why?

Because given a choice, Mom is going to go with $70 for Cable TV+Broadband, not $120 for faster broadband and less video. Dad only wants his ESPN. Mom wants to keep Dad at home on the couch, not at the Sports Bar.

While it may seem dated and unsophisticated to you, the majority of households choose "Linear TV" as you call it.

Google didn't broker a new iTunes deal with the content industry, the networks or broadcasters to change the way in which their product is priced, bundled, and sold. They just made a faster pipe available in a beta town, which most people don't want or need except for bragging rights. The faster pipe will not induce [IPTV/OTT] video competition.
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Re: where it counts?

Do you have linear TV? I notice that you've got a review there for Sonic.net...

I'd be curious to know the numbers on folks who derive enough value out of ESPN to pay the price for it. Because my bet is that the $70 TWC double play is going to cut corners somewhere...
elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA

elray

Member

Re: where it counts?

We don't have pay-tv, period. We "cut" that portion of our cable bill many years ago, when one channel was costing us $62+/month. But we're the exception - no one we know goes without.

As for Sonic, we're the steerage class. We get to pay full rack rate, but enjoy none of the benefits. While we're told Fusion is coming, it hasn't arrived yet, and when it does, we'll be part of the new child class, wherein we have no choice but to buy dialtone and pay the usurious taxes that accompany it, as well as the mandatory modem rental, and I expect performance will be, at best, around 1Mbit, while others enjoy "up to" 20mbits for the same price.

TWC can do double-play for $70/month, no problem. They won't do it forever, but they will for the 2-3 years it takes to knock the wind out of Google's sails.
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Re: where it counts?

Why do you think that Sonic.net will only hit 1 Mbps at your location? Too many wire feet out?
elray
join:2000-12-16
Santa Monica, CA

elray

Member

Re: where it counts?

Loop length is somewhere between 14K and 18K depending on who is measuring.

We're currently doing 500kbps and less, despite new copper, new inside wiring, and the industry-standard external splitter. Upgrading to ADSL2+ should show a doubling if the pair remains the same quality. Maybe we'll get lucky at hit 2Mbits - its a total crapshoot.

Sonic's CEO tells us that having the slowest connections pay the same rate as the fastest, forcing us to pay for dialtone we don't want, and forcing us to rent a modem is all good, because big companies do it.
25139889 (banned)
join:2011-10-25
Toledo, OH

25139889 (banned) to elray

Member

to elray
and 1Gig Internet has been in homes for YEARS. CWRU was the first ones to put it out. After that some munis put it out. And they don't even fully use it as most servers will NOT allow you to transfer out that fast. It's a moot point to even have. And if the public did want it- they could get it already from their local MSOs.

Katz
@swbell.net

Katz to elray

Anon

to elray
Just use rabitts ears antenna for local HD with google fiber!
And with user generated content who needs HBO, borring!
34764170 (banned)
join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

34764170 (banned) to tmc8080

Member

to tmc8080
said by tmc8080:

Afterall, google fiber is going coax inside the home too..

There's no point in using fiber within the home even up to 10Gb speeds.
tanzam75
join:2012-07-19

tanzam75

Member

Re: where it counts?

said by 34764170:

There's no point in using fiber within the home even up to 10Gb speeds.

With fiber, you could take structured wiring to its logical conclusion. You could bundle it with the 120V electric cables. No electrons flowing = no cross-talk.

This would cut the install costs for new construction, while providing ubiquitous access to wired networking at every outlet. Plus, all the advantages that fiber carries in terms of future expandability.
davidhoffman
Premium Member
join:2009-11-19
Warner Robins, GA

davidhoffman

Premium Member

Re: where it counts?

I like that idea, everything at one big connection box.
34764170 (banned)
join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

34764170 (banned)

Member

Re: where it counts?

said by davidhoffman:

I like that idea, everything at one big connection box.

Except you can do that already and you don't have to replace everything connected to your network with non-existent equipment that has fiber ports.

skuv
@rr.com

skuv to tmc8080

Anon

to tmc8080
There have been other local fiber services offering 100mbit to 1gbit before Google Fiber in areas where there are a phone company and a cable company (before DOCSIS3 was available), and still not all customers switched over. So they will still have customers in overlapping geography.

KC Joe
@sbcglobal.net

KC Joe to tmc8080

Anon

to tmc8080
said by tmc8080:

There's no reason you HAVE to stick with coax in the last mile? Afterall, google fiber is going coax inside the home too..

I was at the 'Fiber Space' last week and saw the product. It is fiber all the way into the home and to the 'network' box. Everything else in the home is either wireless or ethernet, no coax.

It was impressive to watch a 4K video on you tube without buffering.

Google Fiber is surely a game changer for EVERYONE in the US. It's going to force every provider here to catch up with the rest of the world Thanks Google!
axus
join:2001-06-18
Washington, DC

axus

Member

Forgot about the cable companies!

AT&T is probably thinking good riddance. Time Warner has a lot to lose. If Google can overcome the barriers to entry anywhere, then Time Warner could lose lots of subscribers everywhere.

Really the best thing they could do is sell TV and internet at cost, and hope that Google is discouraged from spreading. I think there would be antitrust restrictions on funding below-cost prices here from internet/TV in other parts of the country.
Joe12345678
join:2003-07-22
Des Plaines, IL

Joe12345678

Member

Re: Forgot about the cable companies!

Time Warner can make a big deal about saying we have.

MLB EI
NBA LP
NHL CI

ESPN

AMC (they make a big deal about Not being on DISH)

Time Warner channels

TNT

TBS

CNN

Disney

HBO and CINEMAX

FS / FSN / FOX channels.

•••••

KC Joe
@sbcglobal.net

KC Joe to axus

Anon

to axus
said by axus:

Really the best thing they could do is sell TV and internet at cost, and hope that Google is discouraged from spreading. I think there would be antitrust restrictions on funding below-cost prices here from internet/TV in other parts of the country.

You can google this, the city of North Kansas City used a ton of excess casino revenue to build out their own fiber service delivering internet and tv several years ago. TWC sued to prevent them from doing this, and LOST! Poetic justice right? I think the service is called Linkcity and can be found at linkcity.org.

TWC has been getting it from all sides here in KC over the past 10 years. Linkcity, EverestKC and Uverse. All competitors and in their markets. Plus Sprint's home is here.

As they say in the show 'Oklahoma': "everything's up to date in Kansas City"!

Nightmare
@corpmailsvcs.com

Nightmare

Anon

Competition

WAIT WAIT WAIT WAIT... Hold the phone. You mean, that JUST maybe.... that since google came into town, time Warner might be REQUIRED to compete on something???? but... but..... the market is already competitive.... you already have 1 other provider /Sarcasm

I suspect you will see Time Warner and (i think) ATT will start o offer prices just below googles price offering, abit slower speeds or offering to extend "promotional prices" if the customer tries to leave. Funny how that works, dont you think?

••••••

powerspec88
Premium Member
join:2007-03-11
Lees Summit, MO

powerspec88

Premium Member

Surewest

I wonder what Surewest is thinking. I'm sure that sooner or later Google Fiber will overlap with Surewest Fiber and Surewest is still stuck at 50/50 for $150 a month. I haven't heard them say anything in terms of speed increases or price drops anytime soon.

•••
iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Austin, TX

iansltx

Member

Double play...TWC can't compete on Internet

TWC's latest rental modems are 8x4 channel bonded. They top out at around 300/65 (aka Comcast's latest tier), realistically...and that's pushing it. TWC could get 24x8 modems to get closer to a gigabit down, but they'd have to upgrade their plant a ton to find 24 internet QAMs (and they'd probably want 32 to spread load).

In short, TWC can't compete on speed with GFiber. They can compete on price, but they're the cable company so they don't like doing that. Competing on price is DSL territory.

So what should TWC do? What it's better at than Google: TV (more channels) and phone (GFiber doesn't have it). Push TV service in the $50 range (maybe a bit more if there are some really good channels that Google doesn't have) and phone service in the $20 range (Sprint's home phone over CDMA service is $20) as part of a double play bundle, then send folks to Google for Internet since TWC can't compete there. Revenues will go down, but TWC doesn't have to upgrade their plant a ton to match (or even get close to) GFiber specs.
34764170 (banned)
join:2007-09-06
Etobicoke, ON

34764170 (banned)

Member

Re: Double play...TWC can't compete on Internet

I'd rather go to a VoIP carrier over going with MSO for phone service. What they provide is overpriced.

KC Joe
@sbcglobal.net

KC Joe to iansltx

Anon

to iansltx
said by iansltx:

TWC's latest rental modems are 8x4 channel bonded. They top out at around 300/65 (aka Comcast's latest tier), realistically...and that's pushing it. TWC could get 24x8 modems to get closer to a gigabit down, but they'd have to upgrade their plant a ton to find 24 internet QAMs (and they'd probably want 32 to spread load).

There is one little glimmer of hope for TWC, at least on the Kansas side of the state line. 20 years ago it was called Telecable, the cable company that was here when TWC bought it. Telecable had a A/B, dual cable system. When TWC took over the shut down the B side and that wire went dark. That cable is still up in many places if not all. I always wondered why they never lit that up for road runner. Now they have a reason.

TWCableSucks

Anon

You are forgetting one important thing!!

What you are all missing is that if you go with TWC's new tiered program they give you a $5.00 savings, who needs Google Fiber when you have metered data and a $5.00 discount?

Sarcastic of course

Eddy120876
join:2009-02-16
Bronx, NY

Eddy120876

Member

Time Warner give up in KC

You are competing with an incredible bandwidth that you will never achieve at the speed or price like Google. So Adios TW
hedyd4u
Premium Member
join:2003-12-16
Schenectady, NY

hedyd4u

Premium Member

Who cares about TV

The TV packages are useless only the internet matters. 7,000 homes pre order in first week seems very low though since the major cost is the initial install and the amount of time that install needs to be active and paying before the initial costs are made up is not stated anywhere. I do want to see this succeed and would like to see google fiber in Schenectady NY. Verizon stopped fios in Schenectady and I am about 200 feet from a street that has it.

•••
Cobra11M
join:2010-12-23
Mineral Wells, TX

Cobra11M

Member

haha

haha this is funny, their forced to hire weather or not they want to cause of competition.., one day all of them will see the same fate, it comes down to weather or not they are willing to change or just stay the same

everything changes givin time
Expand your moderator at work

Hank
Searching for a new Frontier
Premium Member
join:2002-05-21
Burlington, WV

Hank

Premium Member

Competition works?

Now if we could only get competition in rural areas.

••••