 | | 150GB? "While the company recently unveiled new pricing and caps as low as 150GB"
I think you meant 150MB, unless Verizon has had a major change of heart. :0)
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TKJunkMail aliases - MMH, ThrowDemsOut, Golf N Sun | |
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 | | | Re: 150GB? Whoops, yes thanks. | |
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|  Simba7I Void Warranties
join:2003-03-24
Billings, MT | said by digitalfreak:"While the company recently unveiled new pricing and caps as low as 150GB" I think you meant 150MB, unless Verizon has had a major change of heart. :0) Suuuure. Give our hopes up. :P | |
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| | | Re: Retrograde Retards! This may not be such a bad idea.
Cheap wireless minutes has enabled EVERYBODY to get a cellphone, and as such people are using them everywhere, to the annoyance of everyone, as well as endangering lives by doing things like talking or texting while driving.
Of course going back to expensive wireless service is not going to fly anymore as wireless has basically become a necessity since you can get a free phone and minutes if you are low income. | |
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| |  BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: Retrograde Retards! said by fifty nine:This may not be such a bad idea. Cheap wireless minutes has enabled EVERYBODY to get a cellphone, and as such people are using them everywhere, to the annoyance of everyone, as well as endangering lives by doing things like talking or texting while driving. Of course going back to expensive wireless service is not going to fly anymore as wireless has basically become a necessity since you can get a free phone and minutes if you are low income. Yes a phone that was considered old and cheap 4 years ago and 200 minutes. whoooo. People get phones they were going to discard anyways. | |
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| | | | | Re: Retrograde Retards! said by BF69:said by fifty nine:This may not be such a bad idea. Cheap wireless minutes has enabled EVERYBODY to get a cellphone, and as such people are using them everywhere, to the annoyance of everyone, as well as endangering lives by doing things like talking or texting while driving. Of course going back to expensive wireless service is not going to fly anymore as wireless has basically become a necessity since you can get a free phone and minutes if you are low income. Yes a phone that was considered old and cheap 4 years ago and 200 minutes. whoooo. People get phones they were going to discard anyways. It's still 200 free minutes each month. I know quite a few people with it and they aren't exactly welfare recipients.
Not everyone wants a new iPhone 4 or a Droid X. Some people are happy with a basic cellphone. | |
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| | Reviews:
 ·Hargray Cable
| said by fifty nine:This may not be such a bad idea. Cheap wireless minutes has enabled EVERYBODY to get a cellphone, and as such people are using them everywhere, to the annoyance of everyone, as well as endangering lives by doing things like talking or texting while driving. Of course going back to expensive wireless service is not going to fly anymore as wireless has basically become a necessity since you can get a free phone and minutes if you are low income. I don't own a cell phone and would not mind others losing theirs. The girls who walk into stores with a cell phone always on their ear kind of bug me. I don't think they are actually talking to anyone. | |
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| | | | | Re: Retrograde Retards! Now everyone losing cell phone is not right. Some of us are using the landline for DSL and are cell only. I like cell only as I don't have to hear the calls for anyone else, take messages, or bother with the answering machine. We use our phones like we did the landline. Friends at our convenience, and business calls. I will answer a call I know is from family by ringtone, but everyone else can just wait.
CS | |
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| | | | Reviews:
·Hargray Cable
| Re: Retrograde Retards! said by carpetshark3:Now everyone losing cell phone is not right. Some of us are using the land line for DSL and are cell only. I like cell only as I don't have to hear the calls for anyone else, take messages, or bother with the answering machine. We use our phones like we did the land line. Friends at our convenience, and business calls. I will answer a call I know is from family by ringtone, but everyone else can just wait.
CS
My difference is a live on the coast of SC and a hurricane is a real thing to consider. Land line much more robust than cell phone infrastructure. | |
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| Reviews:
 ·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
| said by Mr Matt:Ivan Sidenberg wants to go back to the good old days of AMPS. At that time the wireless weasels gave the customer an allotment of 30 Minutes for about $60.00 per month and charged $0.60 per minute when the allotment was exhausted. Once the PCS frequency band was opened, the cost for wireless voice service dropped because there was competition. You call them "weasels" but you ignore the reality that AMPS didn't scale very well at all. If they had tried to offer modern day rate plans on the AMPS network it would have collapsed under the load. It wasn't just the roll out of PCS that put an end to this problem -- digital technology increased the number of calls you could squeeze into each RF channel.
It's the same with the current data technology. EVDO provides a maximum of about 3mbit/s per data channel. That data pool is shared with every other user on the same channel. Just think about that for a second. 3mbit/s. A single user could easily peg that connection with streaming video and slow things down for everybody else.
The long term solution to this problem lies with new technology and increased spectrum allotments for wireless providers. Until then it would be nice if people could recognize the technological limitations that the wireless companies operate under and not automatically assume that they are out to screw us by not providing wireline like unlimited data services. | |
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| | | | Re: Retrograde Retards! said by Crookshanks:The long term solution to this problem lies with new technology and increased spectrum allotments for wireless providers. Until then it would be nice if people could recognize the technological limitations that the wireless companies operate under and not automatically assume that they are out to screw us by not providing wireline like unlimited data services. When you run out of spectrum, then what?
Increased spectrum allocation is not the answer. They have enough spectrum, much of which they haven't begun to use efficiently yet.
One thing which could be done is making the cells even smaller than they are now. I could see where they'd become wifi sized for high traffic areas like malls and commuter hubs. Public transport vehicles like trains should also have their own microcells. | |
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| | | Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Retrograde Retards! said by fifty nine:One thing which could be done is making the cells even smaller than they are now. I could see where they'd become wifi sized for high traffic areas like malls and commuter hubs. Public transport vehicles like trains should also have their own microcells. That's all well and good for those areas and I believe they are already doing this. That does not solve the problem outside of those areas though. Making the cells smaller across the whole network would cost billions of dollars and pick thousands of fights with local zoning agencies, disgruntled "RF causes cancer!" types and the NIMBY/BANANA crowd.
The only long term solution is better technology combined with more spectrum. Take note that I didn't say spectrum alone will solve this problem.....
At least you are cognizant of the technological reality that they operate under. That's more than I can say for a lot of the userbase on BBR and other tech sites. People seem to have this idea that it's easy to roll out a nationwide wireless network that can deliver limitless amounts of data at ever increasing speeds. They gripe about the current offerings but ignore all of the progress that has been made on wireless service in the last decade. | |
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| | | | | | Re: Retrograde Retards! More spectrum isn't the answer. There is only so much to go around, and Verizon and AT&T can't have all of it.
Making cells smaller WOULD cost money, but so would adding additional antennas, radios and other equipment for different frequencies. | |
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| | | | | Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Retrograde Retards! Keep pretending that's all I said if it makes it easier to write two line replies.
said by fifty nine:Making cells smaller WOULD cost money And goodwill when you have to pick fights with the NIMBY crowd to get permission to install more towers to support those cells. There are parts of the cellular network that exist outside of dense urban environments where convenient mounting points for base stations already exist....
said by fifty nine:but so would adding additional antennas, radios and other equipment That's going to happen anyway as they upgrade technology. | |
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| | | | | | | | Re: Retrograde Retards! The reply is simple because it is simple.
More spectrum is not the answer because it is a finite resource that we can't hand over all of it to the wireless companies and trust that they will have the public interest first and foremost.
Fighting the NIMBY crowd will always happen, no matter what. But smaller cells may actually be better for them since you're using lower power and less unsightly antennas.
Adding antennas for more frequencies is only necessary if you use more frequencies. If you keep the same frequencies you will have to upgrade and replace existing antennas, not add additional ones for different frequencies.
On various cell sites I have been to, they started out with one array at the top. Today there may be as many as four, five or six on each tower. It's getting ridiculous. Apart from being ugly it also is an inefficient waste of resources.
To make the cells smaller in populated areas, we could put antennas lower and on existing structures. This was how PCS was supposed to work anyway. The existing cellular infrastructure on 850MHz back in the AMPS days was designed primarily for car phones.
You still haven't answered my question, so I'll ask again - when we run out of spectrum, then what? | |
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| | | | | | | Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Retrograde Retards! Your question doesn't deserve an answer, since I never suggested giving them limitless amounts of spectrum as some sort of solution to the current problem.
All I said is that it will be a PART of the solution. Since such nuances are apparently over your head I see no further reason to try and explain my position to you. | |
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| | | | | | | | | | Re: Retrograde Retards! The incumbents have more than enough spectrum. At this point new spectrum should only be allocated to the non big 3 or 4. And even Seidenberg has said spectrum isn't an issue.
These wireless corps are insanely, ridiculously profitable. They can afford whatever is required to expand coverage and enhance speeds. Once true 4G comes out they'll have 1 gbps shared between the users on each tower. | |
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| | | Told them to shove it two years ago. | |
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| | | said by Mr Matt:  Ivan Sidenberg wants to go back to the good old days of AMPS. At that time the wireless weasels gave the customer an allotment of 30 Minutes for about $60.00 per month and charged $0.60 per minute when the allotment was exhausted. Once the PCS frequency band was opened, the cost for wireless voice service dropped because there was competition. By allowing incumbent wireless carriers to buy up all the wireless bandwidth our government severely impacted the ability for more competition to develop in the wireless market. Sidenberg said: "I don't think the world's that simple," he said. "We need to get into it, figure out what the customer thinks is fair, and go from there." Actually Sidenberg wants to figure out how much he can gouge the customer before they will tell Verizon to shove it. "Actually Sidenberg wants to figure out how much he can gouge the customer before they will tell Verizon to shove it."
ALL companies are that way but Verizon is King of it all!
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The Firefox alternative.
»www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/ | |
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| | Healthy? quote:
"I think it would be healthy if there's more consolidation."
Yea, healthy for his pocket....not ours! | |
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| | | Re: Healthy? hey, well, it's a business. not a charity.
if you ran a business, you too would try to get the best bang for your buck
have you ever sold an item before? a house perhaps? did you "give the buyer a break" because you felt like being a "good guy" or did you try to get as much value out of that investment as you could? | |
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| |  n2jtx
join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY
·Optimum Online
| Re: Healthy? said by smartguy3 :
hey, well, it's a business. not a charity I don't think that is the point. Free and open markets with competition are healthy for a society. A single wireless phone company is not, just like the days when there was only Ma Bell for landlines. It wasn't until the split up that suddenly we saw major innovation, some price competition and the growth of alternative services. I am sure Ivan Sidenberg would love VZW to be "THE" wireless company in the United States and free to charge what they want and limit the choice of devices and services. That is not good for society or the capitalist system in general.
We are already getting close to a duopoly with Sprint and T-Mobile (I am a TMO subscriber) minor players in relation to VZW and AT&T. Sprint and TMO do keep the big two in check but they are more of an irritation to the big guys than a serious threat.
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I support the right to keep and arm bears. | |
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| | | Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Healthy? said by n2jtx:We are already getting close to a duopoly with Sprint and T-Mobile (I am a TMO subscriber) minor players in relation to VZW and AT&T. Sprint and TMO do keep the big two in check but they are more of an irritation to the big guys than a serious threat. And why is that? One word: coverage
If T-Mobile had Verizon's footprint I would switch to them in a New York minute.
The question is, can you build a nationwide network without charging the rates that AT&T and Verizon do? I would love to see T-Mobile pull it off but they've already gone on record as saying that they seem themselves as an urban provider. People around here get ticked when Verizon cherry picks markets (as they are doing with their landline division and FIOS rollouts), why doesn't T-Mobile get called to task for doing the exact same thing? | |
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| | | | | | Re: Healthy? Uh yes, you can? Their profit margins are ridiculous. They already built most of the towers they'll ever need. For them now it's just a matter of running fiber or wireless backhaul to each tower. | |
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| |  hopefully verizon won't false advertise
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|  bigunkGort, Klattu Birada Nikto
join:2001-02-10
USA | Re: hopefully verizon won't false advertise Too much wireless competition. Hey Ivan, here's an idea for you to reduce competition. Shut VZW down and walk away. VZW sucks anyway. Fairly good network, but customer service that ranks at the bottom of my septic tank. Wanna know why I'm not a client anymore? Read my last sentence. | |
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| | | bigunkGort, Klattu Birada Nikto
join:2001-02-10
USA | Re: hopefully verizon won't false advertise Funny, I've read T-Mobile got top honors. And I can also speak from experience. VZW slowly degraded to the point my wife and I both left for TMO. Happy ever since, even the their network isn't quite as mature. | |
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|  BHNtechXpertBHN StaffPremium,VIP
join:2006-02-16
Saint Petersburg, FL
kudos:32
 ·Clearwire Wireless
| said by vlad1000:assuming they're honest about their coverage, speeds and overage fees, i will gladly sign up with them. Are you wishful thinking or under the misguided impression that Verizon has turned over a new leaf? Verizon isn't capable of being honest about much of anything... | |
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| | NEVER enough money for some people.... I said it before and I will say it again, what is the point of having fast internet on LTE if there is no unlimited plan ??? Verizon sucks !!!
Half of the point of the smartphones is speed the other is applications. What is then the point if the speed/bandwidth is crippled ? I hate the business practices of Verizon and their lobbying plus the laws that allows this kind of behaviour. | |
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See 24 replies to this post |
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 Boomer86never say roadkillPremium
join:2002-10-18
Walden, NY | wireless data pricing 101 Competition is the ONLY factor keeping VZW from reaching for the sky with their price points. The end customer who wisely compares offerings from the major carriers (factoring in signal coverage, throughput and contract terms) can only help to keep data pricing in check.
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I run, therefore I am | |
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See 15 replies to this post |
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BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | LTE Pricing Verizon CEO Ivan Seidenberg again indicates new pricing will come when Verizon launches LTE services later this year
43 days until Dec 31. You'd think they'd get their asses in gear. | |
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| openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
kudos:2 | Re: LTE Pricing You don't think everything is ready to go? I bet it is  | |
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| |  TransmasterDon't Blame Me I Voted For Bill and Opus
join:2001-06-20
Cheyenne, WY
1 edit | Dreaming of the Good Old Days
What Ivan Seidenberg's erotic dreams are about. |
We though they'd never end
We had it all and controlled every phone
charged just what we pleased
The board of public utilities was a breeze
customers we could squeeze
Those where the days
Oh Yes those where the days.
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I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's.
- Mark Twain in Eruption | |
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| | | | | Re: Dreaming of the Good Old Days Lol. Pretty good. | |
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| | BF69Premium
join:2004-07-28
Camden, TN | Re: LTE Pricing said by openbox9:You don't think everything is ready to go? I bet it is Well I'm just saying that people are planning their Christmas expenditures and if Verizon wants people to get their service they announce the price so people can plan accordingly. | |
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| | | openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
kudos:2 | Re: LTE Pricing With only mobile data plans for immediate LTE usage, VZW will primarily be targeting business customers out of the gate. Most business customers probably aren't relying on Santa fulfilling their Christmas lists. Everything will get more interesting around the middle of 2011 when LTE capable smartphones start popping up. | |
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Reviews:
 ·Verizon FiOS
| Verizon would love.. to get rid of the competition so they could charge at least twice what they charge now. When you're the only player you can charge as much as you can get people to cough up. They would love it if they could get every cell phone user to pay them $300 per month at a minimum. | |
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| | Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
·DSL EXTREME
1 edit | Re: Verizon would love.. FiOS is a wonderful service and just because Verizon stopped deploying it doesn't make it any less so. Being broke and wanting more uptake are completely different reasons for halting deployment. They certainly aren't broke.
FTTN and VDSL in other countries are done right, not half-assed like AT&T. Take Japan, for example. They reserve the line for internet service and phone ONLY, not shoving a bunch of over-compressed TV that was never intended to be pushed down a phone line.
They also deploy it over very short distances, within office or apartment buildings, not 5 blocks down the street to a single family home. The lines are in good condition and the infrastructure is all very new, mostly due to wars that flattened everything. AT&T, on the other hand, uses rotting 50-year old copper strung all over the place, and there are bridge taps hidden all over the lines.
The mess that AT&T has right now, aka U-verse, is unlikely to be upgraded any further because of the way the infrastructure is.
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This signature has consumed several bytes of your bandwidth. | |
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| | | | | John, well said. I've been watching this from an insider's point of view for 10 yrs. and you're 100% right. To add to your comment, I'm part of a family run ISP that provisions DSL and FTAS (Verizon's wholesale fiber optics product that independent ISPs could provision over the FiOS infrastructure just like DSL is provisioned over existing phone lines), until Verizon broke their contract with all independent ISPs, claiming "lack of consumer interest"!!!! I've got a data base of over 6000 consumers interested in fiber optics most of whom can't be provisioned because they 1) live in a multi-unit building, 2) no fiber strung on the utility pole or 3) the fiber was strung but never "lit" in the C/O. | |
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| | How about we American's, buy American,? Here's a concept, that may help the economy as well, Buy American? Did you know T-Mobile, is owned by Duetsche Telekom? How about good ol Verizon Wireless, formerly Bell Atlantic Mobile, right? No, when mergered and bought, Verizon Wireless's majority owener is Vodafone, British Wireless Company.
When you filling your tank up, BP stations with "Amoco Fuels," is British Peroleum, or how about Shell, good wholesome american company right? No, they are German owned after the numerous oil company mergers.
The in the recent years, quality maybe questionable at times, but I own 2 GM Cars and a Ford. Sure I could afford a import, or like saving some money on a Kia or a Hyundai or whatever, but you know, at what cost? American jobs??? Not me, with family a friends relying on their jobs, that to me is the most important factors, then costs and so on.... | |
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| cghh
join:2001-01-15
Milpitas, CA | Re: How about we American's, buy American,? said by Buy American :
How about good ol Verizon Wireless, formerly Bell Atlantic Mobile, right? No, when mergered and bought, Verizon Wireless's majority owner is Vodafone, British Wireless Company.
Verizon Communications (formed from several Bell companies and GTE) owns 55% of Verizon Wireless, Vodofone owns the other 45%. | |
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| |
WHT
join:2010-03-26
kudos:3 | As I've been predicting Karl...When I first read your article with 150 GB (GigaBytes) - I flinched, then gasped, then started to cry because there is no way on God's green earth my $29 per month 50 GB plan could compete with a 150 GB cellular data plan.
Then I saw your correction and did the feeding-time happy-doggie-dance (que up Snoopy dancing around his food bowl).
Over the past year in your BBR Wireless Service Providers forum and other forums, wireless internet providers were fearing the impact of ubiquitous cellular data, but I've been preaching there is not likely anything to fear as the price points would be out of this world.
Finally...we can see into the future and it is as I predicted. Cellular data offerings with anemic data caps will neuter their offerings.
Looking back over my last three months of my subscribers' data usage, very few use over 30 GB per month and *everyone* uses over 10 GB per month. So if Verizon ends up with a 5 GB plan for $50, I have no fear of cellular data.
My crystal ball isn't' very clear on the compelling reasons for high-priced low-data caps. But I'll take some guesses...
* Seidenberg, and likely Dan Hesse and Randall Stephenson are oblivious to WISPs delivering the last mile, in spite of Seidenberg saying there's too much competition (unless he's thinking of BoPL which will not stay in its coffin).
* People *need* internet access and will pay whatever it takes - recycling hand-me-downs clothes for their younger kids, one night a week of Top Ramen for dinner, etc. My greatest reason why my subscribers use the internet is for school work; it's that or driving their kids into the nearest town's public library.
* Each cell site can't support thousands of concurrent connections (I limit my CPEs to only 60). Scratch that...with network neutrality off the chopping block, they can do the Comcast Two-Step and dance the night away with deep packet inspections.
* The cellular companies' Board of Directors are all infected with the Ed Whitacresque mentality found only in Shirley MacLaine's alternative universe. | |
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Reviews:
·AT&T U-Verse
| Competition is a healthy deterrent to Gouging! VZW*and others) advertise in BIG BOLD FLASHY marketing fluff of plans that cost x.xx dollars a month (ex "unlimited") then turn around and say that tit costs an additional x.xx dollars for the privilege of accessing their services, x.xx Dollars to access their services using the latest technology. You end up with a service that cost much more than the the advertised price.
You go into a burger place and order a hamburger for 1.00 as the sign says, then you get charged for the use of the cash register to take your money. If you don't like this you can leave and not get your hamburger but this burger joint has arranged that no other burger joints are available to get a hamburger by paying off the local government to pass a law forbidding any other burger joint except this one. You don't have any choice if you want a burger- This is what Verizon and others want-complete autonomy to charge whatever they want to deliver whatever they feel like and be protected by laws forbidding any recourse. | |
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 mix
join:2002-03-19
Utica, MI | Since when... Since when has too much competition lead to increases in prices? This guy is a lying tard. | |
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 VanPremium
join:2009-07-08
New Orleans, LA | Ah, I see...so the way to attract more customers is to continue the ways of AT&T with laughably low caps all the while encouraging people to use the internet world more and more | |
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| | Anyone has iphone and noticed data counter on att billing system raises faster than the one on iphone when you include both sent and received? Did I inaccurately synchronized meters or something/somebody screws (Apple or ATT)? | |
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 elwoodbluesElwood BluesPremium
join:2006-08-30
HarperLand
·Cybersurf Intern..
| He should come to Canada The competition up here is practically non existent. Dominated by 3 large Telco/Cableco's and a smattering of recently licensed players(who currently provide no threat).
Canadians salivate when we look to the US and pray for the day we get the competition Americans have.
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Jake: "Four fried chickens, and a coke" Elwood: "And some dry white toast, please" | |
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| Reviews:
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: He should come to Canada said by elwoodblues:The competition up here is practically non existent. Dominated by 3 large Telco/Cableco's and a smattering of recently licensed players(who currently provide no threat).
Canadians salivate when we look to the US and pray for the day we get the competition Americans have.
Get rid of your conservative government up North & you might have a fighting chance for consumer protection laws/favorable regulations for a change. | |
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| |  corsterPremium
join:2002-02-23
Gatineau, QC
·TekSavvy Cable
·WIND Mobile
·TekSavvy DSL
·Bell Sympatico
2 edits | Re: He should come to Canada Ha! All the consolidation occurred under the Liberal government (Telus bought Clearnet and Rogers bought Fido), essentially wiping out the two competitive independent players, sending prices through the moon. Oh yeah, and these mergers were approved by government agencies. See what voting Liberal gets you?
The Conservative Government was the one that reserved parts of AWS spectrum exclusively for new entrants... now in addition to the Big 3, Globalive (Wind/Orascom), DAVE Wireless (Mobilicity), Videotron, Bragg, and Shaw can build their own wireless networks. See what not voting Liberal gets you? $40 a month unlimited north american calling, text, and data from Mobilicity. That's what.
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Ontario can lead again - Tim Hudak in 2011
Save Canadian Internet - StopUBB.ca | |
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 dvd536as Mr. Pink as they comePremium
join:2001-04-27
Phoenix, AZ
kudos:4 | 150MB? Why even bother VZW!
with the average webpage load coming in around 2MB i say again why bother. | |
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| Reviews:
·Frontier Communi..
·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: 150MB? According to Verizon there's a sizable percentage of their userbase that uses less than 150MB per month of data. For those users it sounds like a decent plan. They are still offering the unlimited plan for smartphones, so nobody is FORCING you to go with the 150 MB option.
I couldn't use it because I use around 400MB a month on my Droid without taking advantage of the streaming media (Pandora) apps that are available. Toss in those apps and my usage is closer to 2GB. I don't begrudge them for offering the 150MB plan for the folks that primarily use their phones for e-mail though. | |
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| corsterPremium
join:2002-02-23
Gatineau, QC | 150MB would be more than enough for the majority of BlackBerry users. | |
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| | laughable Too much competition? What a joke? Or did the CEO forget about free markets and the advantages it brings to the industry. Of course, he would easily spout off about the free market while "keeping away government". But then, when it comes to really running a business he complains about having to compete with others. Duplicitousness. This is why I don't trust big business anymore. They will use BIG government to their advantage for a quick handout or a free ride in the market. But if any kind of regulation is enacted they scream and whine like pigs at a slaughter house. Idiots. | |
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bah6
join:2001-04-22
Brooklyn, NY | heard this b4 Reminds me of sony a few years back complaining that many LCD makers were selling TVs too cheaply. Cry me a river | |
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NyNexit
join:2009-11-01
Huntington, NY | wow Why not just ask your customers which way they like it... in the ass or the mouth. Thanks. | |
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Retrograde Retards!
When AMPS was introduced in 1983 anything associated with a cell phone cost an arm and a leg. While that is unfortunate, at least the price of wireless voice service decreased over time.
