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Verizon Ending VoiceWing Service
Customers get letters citing March 31 termination date...
by Karl Bode 09:25AM Monday Jan 26 2009 Tipped by sir didymus See Profile
Verizon Voicewing users tell us that Verizon is sending them letters informing them that the company is officially ending the Voicewing service. "We regret to inform you that effective March 31, 2009, Verizon will no longer offer VoiceWing," starts the letter sent out to VoiceWing subcribers dated Jan 16, 2009. "At that time all VoiceWing service will be terminated." As we've been exploring, Verizon is working on a new VoIP product called FiOS Digital Voice, and we assume will launch their own BYOB service (for non-FiOS customers) as well.

Voicewing was simply a re-branded version of VoIP service offered by Delta Three. While users are still able to use the service, Verizon stopped marketing Voicewing some time ago.

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mike1965
Geek4rent

join:2002-09-23
Marion, IL
Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL

Copper? what Copper?

This further supports the reports that Verizon is neglecting copper because so many do not have FOIS nor EVER WILL.

on the flip side the pricing never was good anyhow
--
Free computer help »geek4rent.us
Big Dawg 23

join:2002-03-27
Northfield, MN

Re: Copper? what Copper?

Who cares if Copper is neglected? Copper is not the future. Numerous sites continue to state more and more folks are dumping the home phone for Cell phones or Voip.
gopnick

join:2005-01-07
Benton, AR

Re: Copper? what Copper?

No joke. Copper has no place in the future last miles of telephone and Internet networks.

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by gopnick:

No joke. Copper has no place in the future last miles of telephone and Internet networks.
The current copper network has three things that FiOS doesn't:

- Open access by competitive providers
- Widespread availability
- Long term availability during a power outage. 8 hours UPS won't work if power is out for 3+ days, as it is around here after a big ice storm or maybe down South where there are hurricanes.

Until FiOS has all of the above, the copper needs to be maintained. Telephone subscribers and taxpayers have paid for the copper network. It needs to be maintained until everyone has fiber.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by fifty nine:

said by gopnick:

No joke. Copper has no place in the future last miles of telephone and Internet networks.
The current copper network has three things that FiOS doesn't:

- Open access by competitive providers
- Widespread availability
- Long term availability during a power outage. 8 hours UPS won't work if power is out for 3+ days, as it is around here after a big ice storm or maybe down South where there are hurricanes.

Until FiOS has all of the above, the copper needs to be maintained. Telephone subscribers and taxpayers have paid for the copper network. It needs to be maintained until everyone has fiber.
I generally agree with your statement. However, I don't think Verizon should be responsible for maintaining it if FiOS has been accepted by the local PUC as an approved replacement for POTS and they are actively deploying it.

If a CLEC wants to come in and maintain it, that should be their right to do so, but maintenance of the copper plant shouldn't be a "Verizon only" burden any longer since they have a clear path to FiOS. I think Verizon should sell the copper plant to someone like a CLEC in areas where fiber is deployed.
wrad

join:2003-09-11
Fort Pierce, FL

Re: Copper? what Copper?

Had copper for forty-years, until learning The Fone Company batteries die after a day without power. Great moment in my life to tell TFP to take their wire and ...
Tobester

join:2000-11-14
San Francisco, CA
Reviews:
·SONIC.NET
said by Matt3:

If a CLEC wants to come in and maintain it, that should be their right to do so, but maintenance of the copper plant shouldn't be a "Verizon only" burden any longer since they have a clear path to FiOS. I think Verizon should sell the copper plant to someone like a CLEC in areas where fiber is deployed.
I'm fairly sure that Covad and other DSL providers are paying AT&T (and/or Verizon) a fee for their "Line Sharing" of the last mile copper wire to my house.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by Tobester:

I'm fairly sure that Covad and other DSL providers are paying AT&T (and/or Verizon) a fee for their "Line Sharing" of the last mile copper wire to my house.
I'm not sure what that has to do with my point, which is that if Verizon wants to dump their copper plant and move resources to FiOS, they should be allowed to do so. It's not Verizon's responsibility to keep a CLEC in business. (And before I'm mobbed by the masses here, I am glad the CLECs are around and wish there was more competition.)
fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3

Re: Copper? what Copper?

As the incumbent provider, they absolutely are required to maintain plant/services to the community they serve. They can't simply abandon their plant and pick and chose who/where they will service.
fiberguy
My views are my own.
Premium
join:2005-05-20
kudos:3
I don't believe the PUC has approved it as a replacement. That would require/allow regulation of the service, and I don't believe it is. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

However, last I checked, it was not a regulated utility which had been my argument.. if FiOS is to "replace" the copper service, then I believe it should also be subject to the same rules and regulations AND open access as their copper plant is.. I also think it's a dangerous move to allow an incumbent to abandon a regulated life line service with out either turning it over to another party, selling and divesting it 100% for their FiOS operation, an accepting FiOS be regulated.

Verizon owns the copper plant. By other providers leasing lines for their own service, they ARE paying for maintenance of the plant with those fees. Anything outside that money paid absolutely needs to remain the responsibility of Verizon to maintain. However, Verizon gets away with murder when it comes to not maintaining their copper plant. I can name, easily, addresses from coast to coast where Verizon has flat out refused to repair their service, rather, handing the home owner a cell phone as a replacement for land line services.

cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
kudos:7
said by fifty nine:

said by gopnick:

No joke. Copper has no place in the future last miles of telephone and Internet networks.
The current copper network has three things that FiOS doesn't:

- Open access by competitive providers
Which is only there because the government required it since it helped pay for that infrastructure. If MaBell didn't get a government handout way back when, CLECs likely wouldn't be around today.

- Widespread availability
That's being worked on...it won't be a overnight or 100% coverage in the immediate future, but I bet urban areas are covered quicker then you might imagine.

- Long term availability during a power outage. 8 hours UPS won't work if power is out for 3+ days, as it is around here after a big ice storm or maybe down South where there are hurricanes.
They can be made to work longer periods if needed by only plugging them from the battery backup, or having a secondary UPS that you can turn on and off. I know that my BBU for my fios has an emergency override that allows a few additional minutes of service in an emergency after the main reserve is depleted.

It's still an issue, but times are changing and with it changes the notion that phone is suppose to be always there.

Many homes are cell phone only. A multi-day power outage will push many phones to their battery limits if they are actively being used. So people being without phone service during a multi-day outage is already an issue but people seem to be able to manage it.

A multi day power outage during a winter storm probably would make many homes uncomfortably cold to live in anyways so you may not even be home.

A hurricane down south may knock out power, but it may also knock out phones in which case having or not having power isn't really an issue.

Plus, power outages in most places are relatively rare. In the past decade I can count exactly once in the past decade that I can remember being without power for more then a few hours. Including my immediate family, I can think of only once that there was an outage for more then a day or two, and that was my sister after a ice storm last December. That storm brought 3/4" of ice to the region knocking out power to I think 2/3 of our county for up to 4 or 5 days in some areas. Coincidentally, her POTS copper phone line was also out during that period.

Until FiOS has all of the above, the copper needs to be maintained. Telephone subscribers and taxpayers have paid for the copper network. It needs to be maintained until everyone has fiber.

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

1 edit

Re: Copper? what Copper?

I used to think power isn't a problem, but power has been out in this area for days at a time at least once per year since I moved here 2 years ago. The most recent ice storm knocked out power for a few days up in Highland Lakes (which is a somewhat upscale lake community). I would rather be safe than sorry. Phones were still working for quite a few people.

During a power outage, heat is not a problem. Due to the high cost of heating oil, a lot of people are using wood stoves to heat their homes so they are unaffected by power outages for heating. In an emergency you can also use kerosene heaters. Besides, running a generator non-stop gets expensive if you're using propane or gasoline. Most people run them for 4-5 hours a day during an extended outage to keep the fridge cold and their pipes freezing. I'd hate to have to fire up the genny just to call 911 because my kid had a severe allergic reaction to something. I know you can use cellphones, but they have limited backup power. Many times the CO still has power but just local powerlines may be down. I'd like to have at least some assurance of service.

The ideal solution to the power problem would be a pair of power lines along with the fiber going to the home. That way you can have lifeline POTS with your fiber ONT still working.

Widespread availability is being worked on, but I am hearing 10 years and more. I also haven't really heard anything from Embarq on fiber in our area. They just stick us with DSL and due to the distance from the CO to me it's 5MBps for me only (which is why I have cable). So it might be even more, probably 15-20 years for a full fiber buildout. People can't stay with unreliable copper POTS service that long. They need to have the phones they pay for working.

As for the CLECs, I like the fact that there's competition. The telcos are using public rights of way that we pay for. They need to give open access to competitors, and the most efficient way to do that is to allow CLECs.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by fifty nine:

As for the CLECs, I like the fact that there's competition. The telcos are using public rights of way that we pay for. They need to give open access to competitors, and the most efficient way to do that is to allow CLECs.
Just a quick note, the ILECs almost always pay to use the public right of way. It is almost always negotiated in the franchise agreement or with the PUC.

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by Matt3:

said by fifty nine:

As for the CLECs, I like the fact that there's competition. The telcos are using public rights of way that we pay for. They need to give open access to competitors, and the most efficient way to do that is to allow CLECs.
Just a quick note, the ILECs almost always pay to use the public right of way. It is almost always negotiated in the franchise agreement or with the PUC.
Regardless of whether they pay or not, it's land that landowners give them access to whether they wanted to or not. I have utility easements on my property and I can assure you that I had NO choice in the matter.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by fifty nine:

said by Matt3:

said by fifty nine:

As for the CLECs, I like the fact that there's competition. The telcos are using public rights of way that we pay for. They need to give open access to competitors, and the most efficient way to do that is to allow CLECs.
Just a quick note, the ILECs almost always pay to use the public right of way. It is almost always negotiated in the franchise agreement or with the PUC.
Regardless of whether they pay or not, it's land that landowners give them access to whether they wanted to or not. I have utility easements on my property and I can assure you that I had NO choice in the matter.
Take that up with your city. It's not just the telephone/cable companies who use it. It can be used for water, gas, sidewalk, basically whatever the easement allows.

fifty nine

join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
kudos:2

Re: Copper? what Copper?

said by Matt3:

Take that up with your city. It's not just the telephone/cable companies who use it. It can be used for water, gas, sidewalk, basically whatever the easement allows.
Sure. Like that's real effective. They wanted to run a big 500kv powerline through here and basically they told us if we didn't cooperate they'd go to the state PUC and they'd seize our land from us forcibly. The powerline essentially exports power to big cities like NYC and Newark. We don't see much benefit here, and property values would quickly go down if there's a big powerline in your back yard.

Ever heard the saying, "you can't fight city hall?"

All I want is some choice in providers in exchange for the moneymaking rights of way that monopoly telcos are given.

In addition they've been collecting USF and lots of other taxes and fees for years. All we want is a little return on our investment and not to be given a "take it or leave it" attitude by monopoly telcos.

Is that really a bad thing to ask for?

By the way the only utilities that swing by here are electric, phone and cable. Water is from wells and no gas lines, at least none that serve us anyway. They're all headed to the bigger towns and cities.

Slidetbone
Mazin Go
Premium
join:2002-11-10
Land O Lakes, FL
said by fifty nine:

The current copper network has three things that FiOS doesn't:

- Open access by competitive providers
- Widespread availability
- Long term availability during a power outage. 8 hours UPS won't work if power is out for 3+ days, as it is around here after a big ice storm or maybe down South where there are hurricanes.

Until FiOS has all of the above, the copper needs to be maintained. Telephone subscribers and taxpayers have paid for the copper network. It needs to be maintained until everyone has fiber.
- Open access by competitive providers: True
- Widespread availability : true
- Long term availability during a power outage. 8 hours UPS won't work if power is out for 3+ days, as it is around here after a big ice storm or maybe down South where there are hurricanes: Not necesarily true.

I was deployed to support Hurricanes Frances, Charlie and Ivan. These hurricanes took out power grids and all CO's and remotes lost power. Battery power was available at the main CO's, but most overlays did not have any power until generators were deployed at the RT's, and the ILEC's did not have enough of them to go around. POTS service was restored 6 days at the location I was deployed at for Charlie, 9 days for Ivan.

The battery back up unit is good for 8 hours talk time and I doubt people will be talking for that long during a storm. My Fios had available power for 5 days on battery and, of course, I have a back-up: a jumper cable from my car to a connector plug that fits the Fios BBU.

Just as many folks do not have phantom powered phones, those on fancy cordless phones were SOL unless they were running home generators, so it is about being prepared. With Fios, there is more control on power preparedness than having to wait for the LEC to deploy a generator in a major power outage.

Then, there are those on voip...the BBU will not activate the data on an outage. But there is always a dial-up option that will work flawlessly on Fios.

So there are pros and cons, but Fios is the future. the medium is cheaper and efficient. And power management is a cinch.

I do agree the copper infrastructure needs to be maintained until all Verizon areas are 100% fiber. It only makes sense since they have already paid for it and any service on copper will be a profit for the LEC.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12
said by gopnick:

No joke. Copper has no place in the future last miles of telephone and Internet networks.
I don't know, Coax still has a lot of life left in it. I'd say last-mile twisted pair has no life left in it. At some point it becomes more expensive to run and maintain multiple pairs than to just run fiber.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Migrate to Femtocell?

I don't think this would make much business sense since I think they are technically separate companies, but I wonder if they will push people to migrate to their Femtocell service?

Staplegun

join:2005-04-20
Flower Mound, TX

Re: Migrate to Femtocell?

Well not really, because the only benefit to Femtocell is the stronger cell signal/reception. You are still using VZW minutes while on Femtocell so for most of use there isn't much benefit and zero cost savings.

Matt3
All noise, no signal.
Premium
join:2003-07-20
Jamestown, NC
kudos:12

Re: Migrate to Femtocell?

said by Staplegun:

Well not really, because the only benefit to Femtocell is the stronger cell signal/reception. You are still using VZW minutes while on Femtocell so for most of use there isn't much benefit and zero cost savings.
I was referring to a benefit to Verizon directly. Verizon Wireless can charge the roaming carrier (or negotiate a more favorable rate) and Verizon (the POTS guys -- if they provide call termination) can now bill that charge back to Verizon Wireless.

That's a pretty wild assumption on my part though and they may not even operate that way internally.
B
Premium,MVM
join:2000-10-28

Some further DSLR Discussion...

at »Verizon Voicewing Terminating ALL Service Effective March 31

-- B
--
In a realm outside causality and function

djrobx
Premium
join:2000-05-31
Valencia, CA
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Time Warner Cable
·VOIPO

AT&T CallVantage

Eek! I hope AT&T doesn't see this a signal that they should do the same with their existing CallVantage customers. They've stopped taking new customers for several months but there hasn't been any indication that they would actually stop the service for the existing customers.
--
AT&T U-Hearse
Your funeral. Delivered.

jpyott

join:2003-11-28
Long Beach, CA

1 edit

I'm one that received the letter...

The news of the service being shut down isn't bad.. but the way the leave their customers hanging in thin air is flat out stupid of VERIZON.

They do not yet have their VERIZON DIGITAL VOICE service available to all.. wonder why they couldn't have waited.

They don't even suggest any options of what to do in the interim. Leaves everyone including myself looking at all other services but VERIZON.

Lastly, you would think that if VERIZON wanted to keep us, they would have at least said Their Digital Voice service will or will not be ready before the March 31st deadline.

BUT NO! Not a single bit of information hinting to the fact that they want to keep us as customers now or in the future.

How stupid can VERIZON MANAGEMENT GET? IF, it weren't for FIOS being such a great TV and INTERNET Service. I would be DUMPING my stock and there service simply for their STUPIDITY!

WTG VERIZON!
hxmiller

join:2001-11-19

port your voicewing to verizon wireless

Why not port your voicewing number to verizon wireless. For $10 more a month I added a line to my family share. No extention to my contract since I brought my own phone.

jpyott

join:2003-11-28
Long Beach, CA

Re: port your voicewing to verizon wireless

Well I would except I'm already maxed out on Verizon Wireless with 5 phones.. Me, Wife and her parents and my mother. But that was an interesting IDEA! The main problem is I like the Cell number I have so giving it up isn't what I want either. I'll have to check if they can assign my main number as a virtual cell number.

I've ordered Magicjack as a trail.. although they don't port numbers right now they are working on it and hope to have that working soon.

My only hope is that Verizon get's their act together with this Digital Voice in time for me to transfer over.
Expand your moderator at work
witr
Bigbadbob
Premium
join:2004-03-13
Swampscott, MA

I'm sure they'll unlock the PAP2s now. NOT

But I suppose it is worth a try. Otherwise it is trash and I remember I had to pay for it.