Verizon: LTE Launch On Track CTO Lynch: 'We will meet our 2010 deadline...' Speaking in Barcelona for this year's Mobile World Congress, Verizon CTO Dick Lynch says that Verizon's LTE plans are on track, and that the company should launch the faster service in between 25 and 30 markets later this year. According to Lynch, Verizon is in the final "phase 4" of testing the technology in Seattle and Boston. That testing should be done in approximately two months, after which Verizon will announce some commercial launch markets. Hopefully they'll also announce pricing plans for the technology, so far only hinting that they may be utilizing some kind of metered billing when the product finally launches. Speeds will initially be between 5 and 12 Mbps. LTE is an integral part of a new Verizon strategy to ditch aging copper, and as such the company hopes to have the entire network upgraded by the end of 2014.
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 | | The introduction... of LTE will coincide with the implementation of metered billing....great. I thought this FCC was supposed to purge the practices of old, yeah right!
ON another note, I'm pretty impressed with the Droid, I just don't want to spend the $120 a month for it...I have better priorities -- BF69~~~Please stop suffocating gerbils! | |
|  |  en102Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA | Re: The introduction... Not really.. FCC only 'discouraged' things like throttling specific applications/protocols (aka Sandvine traffic shaping).
Since wireless spectrum is a limited resource in general, unless more efficiencies are brought into play, tiered/metered billing is inevitable. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: The introduction... What kind of tiers and meters will they have? In 5 years the average bandwidth consumed will go up 20 fold or more. A couple bucks a GB would be fair, but I'm expecting something more along the lines of $5 or more per GB. :| | |
|  |  |  | | said by en102:Not really.. FCC only 'discouraged' things like throttling specific applications/protocols (aka Sandvine traffic shaping). Since wireless spectrum is a limited resource in general, unless more efficiencies are brought into play, tiered/metered billing is inevitable. 4G IS the extra efficiency. They've been using 3G all over Japan for almost a decade now without any problems either. It's only carriers in places like the US, Canada, and Australia who claim to have problems. | |
|  |  |  |  en102Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA | Re: The introduction... 1. Japan has just started to use LTE. 2. 'Some' countries such as Japan have only a few carriers and more spectrum capacity available total (»gsmworld.com/roaming/gsminfo/cou_jp.shtml vs. »gsmworld.com/roaming/gsminfo/cou_us.shtml). Carriers in the US typically have ~30-70MHz of spectrum (cell+PCS or PCS+AWS). In Japan, there's the 800MHz + 2100MHz blocks 3. Covering Japan is similar to covering NYC + Southern California, and disregarding the rest of the country. Dense population means they can probably put a cell site on every block or 2. 4. Government regulation. In the US, spectrum has been 'spent' across different technologies. iDEN, CDMA, GSM, UMTS/HSPA/WiMAX The US/Canada and Austrialia are a few countries that allowed for multiple incompatible techologies to compete on spectrum, essentially 'wasting' a limited resource. | |
|  |  |  |  |  | | Re: The introduction... 1. I wasn't talking about LTE. 2. We only have 2 real carriers offering nation-wide 3G. 3. Japan has extremely limited space. Putting down a cell site anywhere presents a huge logistics issue. AT&T has utterly failed at providing decent 3G service in its most densely populated areas. 4. This is true. A national, government built wireless infrastructure would be infinitely more efficient than the mess we have now. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  en102Canadian, eh? join:2001-01-26 Valencia, CA | Re: The introduction... 2. More like 3. Verizon Wireless (largest), Sprint (2nd largest) AT&T (3rd, but closing in on #2). T-Mobile has a long way to go. Carriers consume spectrum regardless of 3G or not.
3. Japan has had cellular service in densely populated service for a long time. 3G in Japan in on 'greenfield' spectrum (2100MHz). AT&T has had to recycle existing 2G spectrum.
4. While it doesn't have to be government built, 'some' regulation on to the use of spectrum, being limited as it is should be performed. Big business would fight this though, stating that government shouldn't interfere. The 'good': Competition (keeping prices low, creating lots of jobs). The bad: quality can suffer, due to waste of spectrum. -- Canada = Hollywood North | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
| Re: The introduction... said by en102:2. More like 3. Verizon Wireless (largest), Sprint (2nd largest) AT&T (3rd, but closing in on #2). T-Mobile has a long way to go. Carriers consume spectrum regardless of 3G or not. Stupid remarks like this help discredit your objective insight on the topic at hand.
ATT covers 230million with 3g. TMO covers 205million. If ATT counts, so does TMO. If TMO doesnt count, then ATT doesnt. -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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 |  |  |  patcat88 join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY kudos:1 | said by sonicmerlin:4G IS the extra efficiency. They've been using 3G all over Japan for almost a decade now without any problems either. It's only carriers in places like the US, Canada, and Australia who claim to have problems. In Japan I'm sure there is only tower siting company, with a government franchise/monopoly, and then all the cellphone providers colocate on the tower, or rent capacity on the base station equipment. Also eminent domain/street furniture is much less of a problem I bet in Japan. In Japan the network maintenance company will just put a tower on any building without any protest from property owner. In the USA communities fight tooth and nail against towers on private and public property, property owners want blood money for rent for towers, then the communities complain how there is no coverage in their town and their are being discriminated and need stimulus funds. Also Japan has some cellphone standards (PHS and PDC) whose tower ranges are in 100s of feet, with tower density of municipal wifi network (street lamps), which take some of the load off the CDMA and HSDPA (no GSM ) networks in urban areas. PHS and PDC are also priced cheaper than CDMA/HSDPA. | |
|  |  |  |  |  | | Re: The introduction... said by patcat88:said by sonicmerlin:4G IS the extra efficiency. They've been using 3G all over Japan for almost a decade now without any problems either. It's only carriers in places like the US, Canada, and Australia who claim to have problems. In Japan I'm sure there is only tower siting company, with a government franchise/monopoly, and then all the cellphone providers colocate on the tower, or rent capacity on the base station equipment. Also eminent domain/street furniture is much less of a problem I bet in Japan. In Japan the network maintenance company will just put a tower on any building without any protest from property owner. In the USA communities fight tooth and nail against towers on private and public property, property owners want blood money for rent for towers, then the communities complain how there is no coverage in their town and their are being discriminated and need stimulus funds. Also Japan has some cellphone standards (PHS and PDC) whose tower ranges are in 100s of feet, with tower density of municipal wifi network (street lamps), which take some of the load off the CDMA and HSDPA (no GSM  ) networks in urban areas. PHS and PDC are also priced cheaper than CDMA/HSDPA. But does that fully account for the Japanese people's massive usage of 3G? Many Japanese use their 3G as their primary internet connection, downloading, torrenting, and whatever else you can think of on their wireless connections. While there are "recommended" usage limits, in reality nothing is enforced. The "explosion" in 3G usage in America pales in comparison to what already occurred in Japan years ago. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  patcat88 join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY kudos:1 | Re: The introduction... said by sonicmerlin:But does that fully account for the Japanese people's massive usage of 3G? Many Japanese use their 3G as their primary internet connection, downloading, torrenting, and whatever else you can think of on their wireless connections. While there are "recommended" usage limits, in reality nothing is enforced. The "explosion" in 3G usage in America pales in comparison to what already occurred in Japan years ago. They don't torrent. I think they use wall garden services that were bandwidth reduced by the carrier to be appropriate to 3G networks, same as Verizon's Get It Now. See »en.wikipedia.org/wiki/I-mode
According to Wikipedia, Symbian is a crypto signed program only locked OS like iPhone OS out of the box. Symbian seems to be the majority in Japan from the statistics that I can find, »www.newlc.com/fr/symbian-reaches···ts-japan
What kills a 3G network is when people try to use unlimited desktop content on 3G. Using limited (by price or scarcity) mobile content on 3G is easy for the carriers. | |
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 | | its just a waiting game metropcs and at&t are also launching lte internet...so i am sure their packages will be unlimited....well and wimax should hurry up and expand their deployment...no new york till now? terrible | |
|  |  mobbo join:2005-04-13 Denton, TX | Re: its just a waiting game I've given up on WiMax. Clear's signal has a lot of problems going through walls, windows, etc. Unless you're going to use it outside at a coffee shop patio, park, or by the pool, its pretty useless based on my experiences so far. I'm interested to see if the spectrum LTE uses will be better at penetrating into buildings, energy-efficient windows, etc. | |
|  |  |  MattAll noise, no signal.Premium join:2003-07-20 Jamestown, NC kudos:12 | Re: its just a waiting game said by mobbo:I've given up on WiMax. Clear's signal has a lot of problems going through walls, windows, etc. Unless you're going to use it outside at a coffee shop patio, park, or by the pool, its pretty useless based on my experiences so far. I'm interested to see if the spectrum LTE uses will be better at penetrating into buildings, energy-efficient windows, etc. Most LTE will be deployed in the 700MHz spectrum, whereas WiMAX is in the 2.5GHz range I believe. LTE should have absolutely no trouble penetrating walls and buildings. It will be substantially better than your current cell phone actually. | |
|  |  |  |  mobbo join:2005-04-13 Denton, TX | Re: its just a waiting game That's good to hear. Its such a bummer to have a screaming fast 4G connection in my work truck then absolutely no service as soon as I step into my office... with a window (energy efficient). | |
|  |  |  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 | Verizon, ATT, and TMO will be launching quite a bit of LTE on the AWS band.
Chances are likely that if you're in a city (or anywhere that capacity may be an issue), you'll be getting your LTE on 1700. | |
|  |  |  |  |  MattAll noise, no signal.Premium join:2003-07-20 Jamestown, NC kudos:12 | Re: its just a waiting game said by tiger72:Verizon, ATT, and TMO will be launching quite a bit of LTE on the AWS band. Chances are likely that if you're in a city (or anywhere that capacity may be an issue), you'll be getting your LTE on 1700. Verizon is launching it in the 700MHz band. Good info to know though, as 1700MHz should still penetrate better than the current 1900MHz. Is AT&T not using any of their new 850MHz spectrum for LTE?
So if we want the ability to take an LTE phone from Verizon to AT&T, it will still need two radios? No wonder everyone is saying LTE is going to cause a mess of global roaming because of all the frequencies in use. | |
|  |  |  |  |  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
| Re: its just a waiting game said by Matt:said by tiger72:Verizon, ATT, and TMO will be launching quite a bit of LTE on the AWS band. Chances are likely that if you're in a city (or anywhere that capacity may be an issue), you'll be getting your LTE on 1700. Verizon is launching it in the 700MHz band. Good info to know though, as 1700MHz should still penetrate better than the current 1900MHz. Is AT&T not using any of their new 850MHz spectrum for LTE? So if we want the ability to take an LTE phone from Verizon to AT&T, it will still need two radios? No wonder everyone is saying LTE is going to cause a mess of global roaming because of all the frequencies in use. Yeah Verizon has AWS licenses of 20mhz for the eastern half of the United States. ATT has 10-20mhz for the Western Half. TMO has 20-30 nationwide (some of which is being used for 3g)
I don't know if ATT is using 850 for LTE. I would presume they are since their 700mhz pickups aren't nationwide, and are mostly in the eastern United States.
Either way, LTE will be spread across many different bands: USA: 700, 1700 (850 for ATT?, 2500 if Clear switches?) EU: 800, 1800, 2600
That's gonna be fun for radio chip makers... -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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 |  iansltx join:2007-02-19 Golden, CO kudos:2 | CricKet's data packages aren't unlimited FYI, though there aren't overages either. | |
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 OwlSaverOwlSaverPremium join:2005-01-30 Berwyn, PA | I hope it is better than 3G My company provides me with a 3g connection over Verizon. It works great outdoors near a tower. But anywhere that I need to use it - the service is terrible. If LTE is faster and can penetrate walls, it will be great. | |
|  |  dennismurphyPut me on hold? I'll put YOU on holdPremium join:2002-11-19 Parsippany, NJ Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
·Optimum Online
| Re: I hope it is better than 3G said by OwlSaver:My company provides me with a 3g connection over Verizon. It works great outdoors near a tower. But anywhere that I need to use it - the service is terrible. If LTE is faster and can penetrate walls, it will be great. The 700mhz spectrum being used to roll out LTE is better than -any- of the current CDMA or GSM frequencies (800mhz (CDMA-Verizon)/850 (GSM)/1900mhz (CDMA-Verizon/Sprint & GSM)) at building penetration. The lower the frequency, the longer the wave, and thus, the better it penetrates walls/concrete/etc.
Here's a GREAT article re: CDMA/GSM. It's dated (2002) pre-3G, so some of the info isn't applicable anymore, but a lot of it is, and explains the difference behind the two standards.
»denbeste.nu/cd_log_entries/2002/···3G.shtml | |
|  |  |  patcat88 join:2002-04-05 Jamaica, NY kudos:1 | Re: I hope it is better than 3G 800 CDMA and 850 GSM are the exact same band...... | |
|  |  |  |  dennismurphyPut me on hold? I'll put YOU on holdPremium join:2002-11-19 Parsippany, NJ Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
·Optimum Online
| Re: I hope it is better than 3G said by patcat88:800 CDMA and 850 GSM are the exact same band...... You're absolutely right - they are indeed the same band, although whether you're in the 800-849 or 859-899mhz range (or thereabouts) depends on whether you hold/held the a-side or b-side license for the particular MSA/RSA.
Or, at least, that's how it was in the AMPS days ... it's been sliced-n-diced so many times since!
One of the beautiful things about the 700mhz band is that we'll have real, honest-to-goodness nationwide frequencies. Hallelujah! | |
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 |  | | I pay for my own 3G with VZ, use it 8 hours a day, with few problems. I realize that it is location dependant. That said, the purpose of this post is to mention that moving from a USB modem to an new laptop with a built in modem (and antenna, the real difference I think) made a significant difference in my reception. Areas that were iffy before became rock solid, and I haven't found a dead spot in some time. | |
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 Romney2012Defeat Obama 2012-Chg we can believe inPremium join:2002-03-03 USA kudos:4 1 edit | LTE as replacement for copper DSL to the home??
LTE is an integral part of a new Verizon strategy to ditch aging copper, and as such the company hopes to have the entire network upgraded by the end of 2014. I keep reading that LTE may become an option to replace aging copper infrastructure and the slow DSL that rides on it. Well in my area, the best that Verizon can deliver using DSL is 3000 kbps down and 768 kbps up. LTE could do better on speeds, but cable(Comcast) will still deliver better speeds at lower cost than LTE will deliver. I don't see how LTE will compete with cable for broadband to the home. Only in those few areas where cable doesn't exist will LTE be competitive to the home.
On the mobile front, it is a different story and depending on pricing could garner many users who find 3G speeds too slow. | |
|  |  mobbo join:2005-04-13 Denton, TX | Re: LTE as replacement for copper DSL to the home?? Not only that, but how much latency will LTE have? If my ping times are greater than 50ms to a local gameserver, I would never consider LTE for a home internet replacement. | |
|  |  |  iansltx join:2007-02-19 Golden, CO kudos:2 Reviews:
·Verizon Online DSL
·Comcast
| Re: LTE as replacement for copper DSL to the home?? You *might* come in under 50ms, or you might not. From what I'm hearing LTE will have about the same latency as interleaved DSL...if you want low latency stick with cable. Unless of course you have a cable provider with a sucky backbone routing-wise. In that case you're screwed. | |
|  |  |  | | said by mobbo:Not only that, but how much latency will LTE have? If my ping times are greater than 50ms to a local gameserver, I would never consider LTE for a home internet replacement. Last I heard LTE reaches pings of 37 ms. Good stuff. | |
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 |  tubbynetreminds me of the danse russePremium,MVM join:2008-01-16 Chandler, AZ | said by Romney2012:Well in my area, the best that Verizon can deliver using DSL is 3000 kbps down and 768 kbps up. LTE could do better on speeds, but cable(Comcast) will still deliver better speeds at lower cost than LTE will deliver. I don't see how LTE will compete with cable for broadband to the home. Only in those few areas where cable doesn't exist will LTE be competitive to the home. while there are some (many?) who pledge their allegiance to whoever gives them the best deal, some people may have had (a) issues with a provider in the past (b) refuse to deal with a provider based on past business/ethics dealings (us west/qwest, anyone?) or (c) because of discounts that could be offered (double play with vzw voice and lte data). its not outside of the realm of possibility.
q. -- "...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..." | |
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 | | If LTE is going to have a 5 Gig Cap If LTE is going to have a 5 Gig CAP on it like Verizon's 3G service. Then as far as I am concerned there is no reason to even roll it out. | |
|  |  iansltx join:2007-02-19 Golden, CO kudos:2 | Re: If LTE is going to have a 5 Gig Cap Sure there is; I use less than 5GB per month when using my mobile broadband like mobile broadband (checking stuff on the go). That said, caps will probably be higher. | |
|  |  |  | | Re: If LTE is going to have a 5 Gig Cap said by iansltx:Sure there is; I use less than 5GB per month when using my mobile broadband like mobile broadband (checking stuff on the go). That said, caps will probably be higher. And what about what you do requires faster than 3G speeds? | |
|  |  |  |  iansltx join:2007-02-19 Golden, CO kudos:2 | Re: If LTE is going to have a 5 Gig Cap Nothing I do *requires* them, however when I need to upload files and such (which are still within my 5GB) it'd be nice to be able to do that task 10x faster. | |
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 Duramax08A Challenger AppearsPremium join:2008-08-03 San Antonio, TX | I will ditch clear if..... If there is a home modem and a low ping. | |
|  | | LTE The annoying thing is that in Sweden tested speeds are in the 40 mbps range. In the US providers are just lazy. | |
|  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 Reviews:
·T-Mobile US
| Re: LTE said by sonicmerlin:The annoying thing is that in Sweden tested speeds are in the 40 mbps range. In the US providers are just lazy. Not completely. Higher frequencies support higher capacity and speeds. Moreover, vast swaths of their country have no coverage because no one lives there. In the developed areas population density is high, which allows Sweden to deploy faster backhauls to fewer cell sites. On top of that, LTE deployment has official government backing and financial support. -- "What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning." -United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara | |
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 | | What's in a CEO name... Dick Lynch...
Gimme 4G LTE already...you hung dick! (dick hanger?) -- Splat | |
|  VanPremium join:2009-07-08 New Orleans, LA | Are phones able to get much faster speeds right now? I thought i remember reading here that most phones dont have the processing to run much faster speeds then what is given | |
|  |  | | Re: Are phones able to get much faster speeds right now? said by Van:I thought i remember reading here that most phones dont have the processing to run much faster speeds then what is given Well you heard wrong. | |
|  |  |  VanPremium join:2009-07-08 New Orleans, LA 1 edit | Re: Are phones able to get much faster speeds right now? said by sonicmerlin:said by Van:I thought i remember reading here that most phones dont have the processing to run much faster speeds then what is given Well you heard wrong. Ok, how exactly am I wrong?
What are the max speeds that most smartphones can reach? | |
|  |  |  |  | | Re: Are phones able to get much faster speeds right now? I can only seem to get 6Mbps max on my Droid over all WiFi connections I have tried. | |
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 |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 | Not sure about processor speeds, but they definitely don't have batteries that can last a day on LTE. | |
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