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Verizon Largely Laughs Off T-Mobile Competition

Verizon's latest earnings were released this morning, the company seeing a net income of $3.79 billion on revenue of $31.6 billion. While Verizon slightly missed Wall Street estimates, competition from T-Mobile didn't dent big red much: the company added 1.5 million wireless customers in the third quarter, 1.1 million of which were tablets. Verizon saw a net gain of 1.2 million LTE smartphones but only a net gain of 457,000 phones, suggesting a 743,000 user decline on the feature phone and 3G smartphone end.

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Verizon has so far refused to jump into any serious price competition with T-Mobile, only offering largely cosmetic promos aimed at the heaviest data users (see their recent double data allotment promo).

So far Verizon's "premium pricing strategy" is working, thanks largely to Verizon's high marks in most customer satisfaction and support surveys. Wall Street has been consistently nervous that one of these quarters, Verizon may actually have to compete on price.

On the wireline side, the company added 162,000 net new FiOS Internet connections and 114,000 net new FiOS Video customers, now laying claim to 6.5 million FiOS Internet and 5.5 million FiOS Video subscribers.. Company CFO Fran Shammo stated Verizon would very likely raise rates on FiOS TV customers again this fourth quarter, much as they did last year.

"We see continued, healthy customer demand for wireless and broadband services, and we are encouraged by the growth we are starting to see in the areas of video delivery and machine-to-machine," Verizon CEO Lowell McAdam said in a prepared statement.
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ramsaso
Premium Member
join:2014-01-04
Houston, TX

ramsaso

Premium Member

What is....

"Veruzib"?

Cjaiceman
MVM
join:2004-10-12
Castle Rock, WA
(Software) pfSense
Ubiquiti UniFi UAP-AC-PRO

1 recommendation

Cjaiceman

MVM

Re: What is....

Thought this would fit here :P

Zenit_IIfx
The system is the solution
Premium Member
join:2012-05-07
Purcellville, VA

2 recommendations

Zenit_IIfx

Premium Member

Re: What is....

I had my iPhone auto correct Verizon to Berezina - its long lost Russian twin, clearly!

Berezina Russian Telecom - now with snowy trash bags and more Vodka for dealing with support and service troubles.
:P
Bob61571
join:2008-08-08
Washington, IL

Bob61571 to ramsaso

Member

to ramsaso
Is that like a combination of Verizon and Beelzebub?

CaptainRR
Premium Member
join:2006-04-21
Blue Rock, OH
·AT&T Wireless Br..

CaptainRR

Premium Member

Competition I wish

If I had T-Mobile service I would dump Verizon in a heartbeat. Had VZW since the Bell Atlantic days and just fed up with all there B/S from there current lousy plans and all the bloatware the comes with the smartphone and I pay full retail for them! Someday T-Mobile coverage will improve but unfortunatly I may never see them in my rural location. As long as I can hold onto the unlimited smartphone plan, it helps.
mikeluscher159
join:2011-09-04

mikeluscher159

Member

Re: Competition I wish

Hopefully Band 12 will fix this. In time.........

CaptainRR
Premium Member
join:2006-04-21
Blue Rock, OH

CaptainRR

Premium Member

Re: Competition I wish

I hope so to. I even used to have Nextel service where I am but Sprint came along and left a bunch of empty rural towers out of it.
mikeluscher159
join:2011-09-04

1 recommendation

mikeluscher159

Member

Re: Competition I wish

Those were the days.... Of 800mhz iDen PTT coverage. Keep your eyes on Sensorly and Rootmetrics to see who's up and coming in your area. If you've got a smartphone, wouldn't hurt to help the crowdsourcing effort.

CaptainRR
Premium Member
join:2006-04-21
Blue Rock, OH

CaptainRR

Premium Member

Re: Competition I wish

I do run Sensorly & OpenSignal. Very noteworthy efforts. There are a lot of back roads around me showing service thanks to me!
silbaco
Premium Member
join:2009-08-03
USA

silbaco to mikeluscher159

Premium Member

to mikeluscher159
I don't think T-Mobile's 700 A covers many rural areas. The majority of 700 A is owned or leased by smaller carriers like US Cellular.

fonzbear2000
Premium Member
join:2005-08-09
Saint Paul, MN

fonzbear2000 to CaptainRR

Premium Member

to CaptainRR
said by CaptainRR:

If I had T-Mobile service I would dump Verizon in a heartbeat. Had VZW since the Bell Atlantic days and just fed up with all there B/S from there current lousy plans and all the bloatware the comes with the smartphone and I pay full retail for them! Someday T-Mobile coverage will improve but unfortunatly I may never see them in my rural location. As long as I can hold onto the unlimited smartphone plan, it helps.

My dad's Galaxy Note from T-mobile is loaded with bloatware as well. Samsung does that with all of their Android phones no matter who your cell provider is.

frisbyfold
@76.112.186.x

frisbyfold

Anon

Re: Competition I wish

Yeah but I think we can all agree that Verizon is by and away the worst

ILpt4U
Premium Member
join:2006-11-12
Saint Louis, MO
ARRIS TM822
Asus RT-N66

ILpt4U to fonzbear2000

Premium Member

to fonzbear2000
said by fonzbear2000:

Samsung does that with all of their Android phones no matter who your cell provider is.

The Google Play Edition S4 comes pretty free of Samsung or Carrier Bloatware -- just straight Android. Pretty nifty...

Supposedly the GPE S5 is coming, one of these days...

ctaranto
join:2011-12-14
MA

ctaranto to fonzbear2000

Member

to fonzbear2000
Yes, but (at least with the S5) the bootloader is unlocked on the T-Mobile variant. Meaning, root, custom ROMs, and bloat removal.

bluefox8
join:2014-08-20

bluefox8

Member

Let's do some numbers

Let's do some basic math, using the scenario of someone living in a metropolitan region like myself:

Assuming that you are purchasing the cell phones outright:
4 lines at T-Mo cost $100/mo (10 lines cost $160)
4 lines at Verizon cost $160/mo (10 lines cost $400)

More math:

a) 90% of the time you are at home or work or within a metropolitan region, where T-mobile coverage is comparable to Verizon/ATT.
b) 5% of the time you are on an interstate highway between two cities. T-mo has comparable coverage to Verizon/ATT.
c) 5% of the time you are in a rural countryside. T-Mo will continue to do 'poorly' here. But between spotty coverage, roaming agreement with ATT, and the ability to make an emergency call on any available network (yes, thanks to a federal law you can call 911 on any network your phone can talk to even if you don't have any plan) that can be worth the savings.

In other words, *assuming* your situation is like mine, savings of $60 every month (for 4 lines) is too good to pass up. If you have bigger or extended family, the savings can be bigger.
AmericanMan
Premium Member
join:2013-12-28
united state

AmericanMan

Premium Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

Or just do like a coworker does and go primary T-Mobile with 1 TracFone on Verizon for when they are traveling out of town. Sort of hedging your bets.

atuarre
Here come the drums
Premium Member
join:2004-02-14
EC/SETX SWLA

atuarre to bluefox8

Premium Member

to bluefox8
In most places T-Mobile coverage is not comparable to ATT/Verizon. They have 3G. T-Mobile has 2G except the metros. You need to get out and drive more of those highways and interstates.

bluefox8
join:2014-08-20

bluefox8

Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

Conroe TX has a population of 60,000 (»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Co ··· e,_Texas)

Come on guys, when I said metropolitan (in bold), I didn't think you guys in small town would start complaining.

graycorgi
Premium Member
join:2004-02-23

graycorgi

Premium Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

It really depends. You can live in a metro area but spend less than 80% of your time there so T-Mobile would probably not be a good idea. T-Mobile's data service is not very good on the Interstate between cities here. For example, I-40 between Knoxville and Nashville (definitely metro areas) T-Mobile only has 2g/3g. Sprint has LTE.

atuarre
Here come the drums
Premium Member
join:2004-02-14
EC/SETX SWLA

atuarre to bluefox8

Premium Member

to bluefox8
I'm actually in Louisiana. I do travel to Texas from time to time, one of the places being Conroe, but right now I'm in Louisiana.
atuarre

atuarre to bluefox8

Premium Member

to bluefox8
This city has 75,000 people and we have T-Mobile LTE but where I live, way outside of the city, Sprint, ATT and Verizon has LTE and T-Mobile has 2G. They never deployed 3G here but they lied and had 3G listed on the coverage maps until they realized that liability reasons that listing 3G in areas where there was none and then changed the coverage maps to what they are now.

cowboyro
Premium Member
join:2000-10-11
CT

cowboyro to bluefox8

Premium Member

to bluefox8
said by bluefox8:

a) 90% of the time you are at home or work or within a metropolitan region, where T-mobile coverage is comparable to Verizon/ATT.
b) 5% of the time you are on an interstate highway between two cities. T-mo has comparable coverage to Verizon/ATT.
c) 5% of the time you are in a rural countryside. T-Mo will continue to do 'poorly' here. But between spotty coverage, roaming agreement with ATT, and the ability to make an emergency call on any available network (yes, thanks to a federal law you can call 911 on any network your phone can talk to even if you don't have any plan) that can be worth the savings.

The coverage isn't comparable, except on their maps. I live in a fairly populated suburban area. Coverage is spotty at best. At work there is no T-mo inside the building (can't even make a call). And if you go away you'll only be only able to do 911 calls, as in reality there is no roaming agreement. Tested with a T-mo SIM in my phone, the same phone that works flawlessly on AT&T.
Both ATT and Verizon have solid coverage in the same area.
Now if you live in a large city and you don't care about being unable to use the phone, then T-mo is a good choice.

bluefox8
join:2014-08-20

bluefox8

Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

Shelton CT has a population of 40,000. (»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sh ··· necticut)

I guess it can be called metropolitan if you want to.

I compared Philly and NYC, with I-95 in between (using a trial T-Mo phone and ATT side by side) and got excellent results. YMMV.
tired_runner
Premium Member
join:2000-08-25
CT

tired_runner to cowboyro

Premium Member

to cowboyro
I live in New York City and use T-Mobile. I get LTE coverage almost everywhere. And it's always fast too.

Indoor coverage is comparable to other carriers. If T-Mo doesn't work, good chance neither do the others.

antdude
Matrix Ant
Premium Member
join:2001-03-25
US

antdude

Premium Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

said by tired_runner:

I live in New York City and use T-Mobile. I get LTE coverage almost everywhere. And it's always fast too.

Indoor coverage is comparable to other carriers. If T-Mo doesn't work, good chance neither do the others.

In my new rural area, T-Mobile and others don't work. However, Verizon does. :/
Expand your moderator at work

jdimeas
@64.53.222.x

1 recommendation

jdimeas to bluefox8

Anon

to bluefox8
Don't assume everyone is in the same boat as you. I am a lawyer so that one missed call on the interstate because my carrier doesn't have coverage could cost me thousands of dollars. One missed call could pay my cell phone bill for 20 years. So for someone like me, saving $60 a month on my phone bill and risk missing a phone call while I am driving from court from one county to another is not an option. For small business owners who depend on their cell phone to make a living, quality of service is the main option.

bluefox8
join:2014-08-20

2 edits

1 recommendation

bluefox8

Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

Agreed. It does not apply to everyone's scenario.

But if your cell phone connection is that mission critical, then it may serve you better to have both verizon and att (with a number that forwards to both lines). Even verizon (best coverage) does not have perfect coverage in cities and highways.

jdimeas
@64.53.222.x

jdimeas

Anon

Re: Let's do some numbers

I was with T-Mobile since 2002 when it was Voice Stream. I couple of years ago I noticed that I was missing calls so I switched to AT&T. I then noticed I was missing calls inside the city with AT&T so I switched to Verizon and I don't think I have ever missed a call since then. My cousin is an architect. He had been with Verizon for many years. A year ago he switched to T-Mobile due to their advertising campaign. Within 3 weeks he was back with Verizon because he could not get coverage at many of the job sites he would visit. My best friend is a medical doctor who had to leave T-Mobile because coverage issues caused problems with his office trying to call him when he was driving around from office to office. The point is that there's lots of people who require solid, reliable cell phone coverage in order to make a living. That's why Verizon and AT&T are still picking up customers in spite of T-Mobile and Sprint's efforts to cut prices. Unless these carriers match Verizon and AT&T with coverage and spectrum, they will never be able to truly compete.

bluefox8
join:2014-08-20

4 edits

1 recommendation

bluefox8

Member

Re: Let's do some numbers

That's great. I'm not interested in giving my personal info on the internet but I'll just say that some of my immediate family (perhaps myself included) are practicing MDs and JDs. We and many of our colleagues have switched over to t-mo and haven't regretted it yet.

I'm not trying to argue with you, your situation probably warrants verizon if you're on the road a lot. But it doesn't necessarily apply as broadly to all (or even majority) of MD/JD group as you may be implying. There are a lot of us who don't need as good a coverage as you do, because we have any combination of these: fixed work hours, fixed call hours, beeper, good signal at home and work, don't need to travel outside a city for work, etc etc that works for our situation just like your setup works for yours.

amarryat
Verizon FiOS
join:2005-05-02
Marshfield, MA

1 recommendation

amarryat to bluefox8

Member

to bluefox8
I think your math is reasonable, but as someone in that situation, I think the convenience factor is a bit more substantial. Unless you never leave the city, it does become a problem when you leave and the coverage goes away. When you can't use your phone indoors because the signal is too weak (T-Mobile at least says they cannot guarantee coverage indoors). Or when you drive into a parking garage and there is no service. This has happened multiple times where my wife's work Verizon phone has service and the T-Mobile one doesn't while underground in a parking garage.

So while your phone probably works 95% of the time when you're near home, that 5% can become very annoying.

And then there is the situation where your phone works great at home, but there is no service at work. For example, at a location where there are thousands of workers converging at the site and there is no T-Mobile service. Those thousands of workers, even though they have great service at their residence, are not going to buy T-Mobile service because they can't use their phone at work to call home.
tmc8080
join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY

tmc8080

Member

customers NOT counted but profited from

these numbers apparently don't count MVNO numbers which Verizon DOES profit from which are on the straigt talk and tracfone brands respectively..

Verizon has let many 3rd party cell towers wither on the vine as it were in terms of signal strength upgrades and proper maintenance. So customers probably who have 3g smartphone svc that it isn't all that great won't choose to pay a premium price. It also goes to show that non-deployment of FIOS in some places is resulting in customers breaking down and buying data plans for tablets.

Let's not forget this so-called micro price war with doubling data came from a spat between ATT and Tmobile which then spilled over to Sprint.. who then cut 1k jobs...to make up the difference
biochemistry
Premium Member
join:2003-05-09
92361

biochemistry

Premium Member

How many more?

How many more FiOS customers need to be added before they finally decide to expand their footprint?

••••••••••••
billydunwood
join:2008-04-23
united state

billydunwood

Member

TMobile sucks

Our work had Tmobile and we dumped them because althought there coverage wasn't too bad(still worse than verizon), they kept dropping calls and the call quality was terrible. We went back to Verizon and although a 30% increase in price, we have much better coverage and a lot better quality. And yes, when we had Tmobile we had upper management trying to help us with our issues to no avail.

••••••••

martd13
join:2004-01-08
Bayside, NY

martd13

Member

I jumped ship

I just left VZW after 12 years when T-Mobile offered their new prices. I was paying $132.00/month (including taxes and fees and 19% discount) for 4 dumb phones with 700 minutes, unlimited texting and no data with Verizon.
New bill with T-Mo is $113.00/month for unlimited talk, text and data (2.5 gb high speed) for 4 smart phones with 15% discount. Phones can be bought for $99 each or paid off over 2 years for $4/month. Since I travel only a few times a year, the service hasn't been a problem for me at all and the call quality is amazing. I am keeping fios, but am very happy saying goodbye to VZW and their high prices.

why60loss
Premium Member
join:2012-09-20

why60loss

Premium Member

Verizons foot print

Is the only thing that matters to 99% of there customers. The service works really well when it set up right. If not, customer service isn't very good at dealing with issues. Good luck getting your replacement phone out of them under warranty.

Verizon's network coverage is very good outside big city's and is head to head with AT&T. T-mobiles issue is that outside big city's you get 2G or you don't get anything. My dad has T-Mobile and likes it a lot more than when he had AT&T.

For me though Verizon has only two things, LTE all over and I still have my unlimited data plan. If I can no longer keep it and the data pricing is still a car payment then T-Mobile will be getting my business.
floydb1982
join:2004-08-25
Kent, WA

floydb1982

Member

My family switch over to T-Mobile

We switched over to to T-Mobile when Verizon milked my dad and stepmom over $600. When they called up Verizon They were told to pay up or it would go to collections. So they paid it and then switched us over to T-Mobile. They were finally able to get a full signal off the Verizon tower out were they live it at were they didn't need to use there Wi-Fi to use there cellular phones. They can get a full 2G T-Mobile signal in Eatonville, WA. My dad said as long as we can place a call and check voicemail over T-Mobile were fine with that. I live in Kent, WA and can get all 2G, 3G, 4G and so on with T-Mobile. T-Mobile is just as good as Verizon.

hamburglar
join:2002-04-29
united state

hamburglar

Member

Cricket

Left Verizon, paying $125 for 2 lines with metered data. Now 5 lines for $100 all in, and each line gets their own gig before throttle. No overages, ATT coverage and haven't looked back. Flashed my Verizon G2 with the AICP AOKP ROM and get 2 days out of the battery and no more bloatware. I'll never be on a contract or subsidized phone again if I can help it.

nowayvz
@96.247.88.x

nowayvz

Anon

right...

I love it when uninformed boots praise Verizon. Yes Verizon has superior coverage on 1xRTT. The rest is crap. LTE and 3G is sub par. Also the price you pay for them is just atrocious... Do not get me wrong, T-Mo has to work on its network, but just GSM coverage seems much better than ATT or Verizon.

cb14
join:2013-02-04
Miami Beach, FL

cb14

Member

Verizon sucks

The secret behind Verizon's success is the consumer- easy to influence and manipulate.
The majority of residents in large metro areas never goes rural, if they travel they either fly to other metro areas or drive a freeway with good coverage by TMO. And the majority of those who do go into remote rural areas do it only occasionally. What they need is a second Verizon PAYG prepaid with a 100$/year plus tax card. What remains, the residents of rural areas and the small number of people going daily there, may indeed have to stick to Verizon.
Yes, verizon's rural coverage is great. No thanks to Verizon, they did not build up most of it, they snatched it from others. Like from Alltel, which used to have prior to Verizon/ATT raid the largest geographical coverage and called itself 'the rural company".
Off course, that did not pay off, nobody becomes super rich by building rural coverage.
So now, Verizon and tea got it.
Everything on Verizon sucks. Astronomical prices ( imagine how they would be without TMO pressure!) , horrible conditions, miserable customer service, deceptive way to do business.
I tried Verizon in September 2007 and left after a week. 2 months of billing disputes after that.After the raid on Alltel, I became a Verizon customer again- this time for my PAYG Alltel phone which I used to have for rural coverage. Since then , only hassle. I could write half a page about what i went through with Verizon. Crooked and incompetent. Where this company gets it's positive ratings is a mystery to me. TMO is, with all it's flaws, pure gold in comparison.

•••••
Mr Matt
join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL

Mr Matt

Member

Verizon Largely Laughs Off T-Mobile Competition, why not!

Wireless customers seem to forget that Verizon and AT&T's networks are an aggregation of the baby bells legacy A and B block AMPS 800 MHz networks. The lower frequencies provides increased coverage with less towers. T-Mobile and Sprint PCS are just that PCS wireless carriers which are assigned the PCS frequencies which have a shorter range. As a result competing wireless carriers will have a struggle matching Verizon's and AT&T's coverage.

cb14
join:2013-02-04
Miami Beach, FL

cb14

Member

Re: Verizon Largely Laughs Off T-Mobile Competition, why not!

VOLTE on the low frequency LTE band could be an answer to that.
BTW, it was not just baby bells' 800Mhz AMPS, but also the 800 Mhz AMPS and D-AMPS from "non wireline' carriers like mcCaws cellular one, where i got my first cellluar service in 1993 and which also had the 800 Mhz AMPS and D-AMPS("TDMA") bands. that was taken over by the old ATT wireless and later by Cingular/SBC which assumed the name ATT.

odreian615
join:2006-01-18
Chicago, IL

odreian615

Member

T-Mobile ads are only aimed at At&t

You would think they would go after #1 or even both. You don't see Toyota truck ads going only after Dodge of GM.
Body Count
join:2010-09-11
Columbus, OH
Netgear CM1000
Ubiquiti EdgeRouter ER-4
Ubiquiti U6-Pro

Body Count

Member

Went with T-Mobile

Left Verizon at the end of last year. Was paying $179 with a 18% work discount for three phones. Two of them smart and one dumb.

With T-Mobile I'm paying $145 for three smart phones, all with 1 gig data (we use wireless mostly), and once the phones are paid off at 0% interest, my bill will drop to around $100.

With Verizon, after your two year contract is up, you still pay the same amount. That's the number one reason I switched. It would still be $179 a month if I was still with them and if I wanted a new phone, I would expect to pay $200-$300 up front for another 2 year contract.

Live in Columbus Ohio so coverage isn't an issue. I get 4G throughout the entire city. Yes traveling sucks. I get no data when making trips to Michigan unless when I'm passing Toledo or Ann Arbor. But I rarely travel. I didn't see paying $35 more a month was worth the data when I travel one to five times a year.

Wifi calling is great. Inside the office in an all steel building, coverage sucked for both Verizon and T-Mobile but at least I can still get calls thanks to wifi calling.

And since I use wifi mostly, the 1 gig a month is plenty for me especially now since they don't count streaming music sites anymore on your data plan. I'm a big iheartradio listener and it's all 4G free!