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Verizon Posts Loss Due To Workforce Buyouts
Landline, focus on LTE/FiOS takes temporary toll
by Karl Bode Friday 23-Jul-2010 tags: coverage · business · Verizon FiOS · Verizon Online DSL
Verizon has posted their second quarter earnings showing that big red lost $198 million in the second quarter -- mostly due to the company's continued and fairly significant layoffs. For scale, Verizon now has 24,500 fewer employees than one year ago -- and spent $2.3 billion in the second quarter dealing with these buyouts. The workforce reductions, buyouts and layoffs in recent years stem largely from landline losses, but also from Verizon's massive shift away from rural America.


On the wireless front, Verizon actually managed to add 665,000 contract wireless customers, more than the 496,000 for AT&T -- despite not having the iPhone. That said, Verizon's 5.2 percent growth in wireless service revenues is substantially slower than AT&T. That's something that should change shortly, as Verizon's expected to follow AT&T's lead and impose a low cap (200MB to 2GB) high overage data pricing model very soon.

Speaking on a conference call with analysts and the press, Verizon CFO John Killian wouldn't get specific about the wireless data price changes everyone knows is coming (in large part because Verizon keeps incessantly hinting that they're coming). All Killian would say is that Verizon is looking at AT&T's tiered pricing models), is "monitoring the situation," while insisting Verizon won't be making any sudden moves. That seems to run contrary to rumors that this new pricing is dropping next week.

On the terrestrial front, like AT&T, Verizon continues to bleed traditional landline customers, and residential broadband growth remains slower than Verizon would like. The company added 196,000 net FiOS Internet subscribers and 174,000 net FiOS TV customers, bringing their FiOS total to 3.8 million FiOS Internet customers and 3.2 million FiOS TV subscribers. Verizon says FiOS is now available for sale to 12.9 million premises. These slow adds are usually good news for companies like Comcast who has been adding more broadband subscribers per quarter than AT&T and Verizon combined.

Verizon says they now serve 9.3 million broadband connections, with continued DSL subsriber losses offset by FiOS gains (AT&T actually posted a net loss in total broadband subscribers yesterday). FiOS Internet penetration was 29.7 percent at quarter's end. Verizon's essentially halted FiOS deployment, with Verizon CEO Ivan Seidenberg previously saying he'd like that penetration number at around 40% before considering what to do next in terms of FiOS expansion. Assuming the FiOS footprint gets expanded at all.

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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

Easy Solution

Look for this to be used as justification for caps and overages.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
kudos:1

Re: Easy Solution

Look for what to be used as justification? Earnings of $0.58/shr before special charges? Increase in free cash flow? Wireless revenue growth?
ualdayan

join:2004-07-17
Antioch, TN
Call me nuts, but if they spent $2.3 billion on layoffs then the layoffs are the cause of their money problems. Their losses have nothing to do with data usage. They can try to use it as justification, but anybody with sense can see where their billions just went.
FLATLINE

join:2007-02-27
Buffalo, NY

Re: Easy Solution

Im not sure making sense is a priority for Verizon. Making more money is the priority.

NOCMan
MacChatter
Premium
join:2004-09-30
Colorado Springs, CO
We'll they had to pay severance, and pay out any funds owed to these people in employee savings etc.

24500 employees, 2.3 billion dollars, 94k per employee laid off. Now the unemployment tax burden for each considering 1200 a month for 99 months, is something like 118,000 per employee laid off on the Taxpayers, not including any other programs they end up using, any foreclosures they endure, nor lost property values from those foreclosures, lost sales to any businesses etc.

Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY

Re: Easy Solution

Most were voluntary separation NOT layoffs. Very few are eligible for unemployment.

SterlingJ85

join:2000-11-19
Millville, NJ

1 edit
99 Weeks you mean... but that does NOT apply to every State, contrary to poor news reporting of the issue. A State has to have 8.5% unemployment or above to qualify for Tier 4 benefits (the last tier added in the stimulus package). Many States, the maximum is MUCH less.. some areas do not qualify for more than 26 weeks of State benefits, period.

For this reason, you are starting to hear of the "99ers", those who have exhausted 99 weeks of unemployment, and are long-term unemployed. You are starting to see some political will to add a Tier 5 extension, which has been needed for nearly 6 months. What passed yesterday was merely an eligibility date extension of the EXISTING extensions we already had in place; it added nothing new.
--
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elbm

join:2000-08-03
Reisterstown, MD
Employees in positions that were declared surplus were offered $50,000 plus $2,200 for every year of service and 6 months of health insurance coverage. If an employee did not take the offer they risked a future layoff. So for example an employee with 10 years on the job was paid $72,000 to voluntarily cease employment. That is where the 2.3 billion went, not unemployment.
rody_44
Premium
join:2004-02-20
Quakertown, PA

1 edit

Re: Easy Solution

But most of the verizon employees that took the layoff were newer employees. At ten plus years the employee was pretty well safe. Verizon thought they would have more older employees taking the bate. In realitty it back fired on them. In the end it ended up costing them a ton of money with very little benefit to them. Basically where they went into it thinking they would unload long term employees that were not as productive as the newer employees. They ended up giving money where they didnt have to.
Ulmo

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Re: Easy Solution

So they boffed. As a 10 year employee, $76,800 seems like about 1 years' pay, maybe 2 years in weird areas. If job prospects are slim, like it would be for any aged employee, then 1 or 2 years of pay is not really a great deal for 1 or 2 following decades of unemployment, if the alternative is quite possibly 1, 2, or even more years of continued employment, possibly 1 or 2 decades more.

As a 2 year employee, being asked to take $59,200 to go look for work for a year, compared to being fired in 4 months and take $47,520 in unemployment for two years if you don't find work or less if you do, the $59,200 seems like a much better deal, by about 237% (assuming 1 year unemployment for $24,960).

In addition to that, in today's tight employment market (I mean hard to get work), it's much more lucrative for the best employees who have the best employment options to jump ship than the laggards, so if you give them money to do it, they'd go even faster.

Verizon should have made appropriate metrics for performance at the top and administered the tests in a supervisor-uninvolved way (i.e., go to the headquarters and take the test by the same oversight personnel company-wide). Then they would offer severance in accordance to details about the employee: find the minimum to make it desirable for the undesirable employees to leave, and don't offer anything to the undesirable employees, laying those off later.
Ulmo

join:2005-09-22
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I think those layoffs are a big investment that may be good for them. That is a high price tag, though. Depends how they did it, of course.

wrt the pricing models for wireless caps, Bode is wrong: it makes sense that VZ is saying they won't make sudden moves, despite saying they'll probably make moves (i.e., not sudden-type) within a week. Whether that's actually what they do is a different matter.

MemphisPCGuy
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Will I save money?

I have a Palm Centro and am paying $29.95 a month for 5GB Data package. I use maybe a couple of Megabytes per month, so will I get to save some money or will I be lumped in with all the really smartphones ?
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Re: Will I save money?

said by MemphisPCGuy:

I have a Palm Centro and am paying $29.95 a month for 5GB Data package. I use maybe a couple of Megabytes per month, so will I get to save some money or will I be lumped in with all the really smartphones ?
If they follow AT&Ts data plan tiers then yes you will. Possibly 10-15 bucks a month? But shhhh..the folks on this site like to pretend that this is not good for anybody.
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xenophon

join:2007-09-17
We won't know until pricing comes out. If VZW charges $5-10/GB then you would, but they'll likely be more comparable to ATT. They may still have a baseline charge with buckets of data rates after the baseline.

Sprint's EVO tax doesn't look so bad now... $10 for truly unlimited 3G/4G. Even if Sprint adds the 20GB cap mentioned, the others are far more restrictive at a higher price. Since Sprint has more 4x more 4G spectrum, they'll likely always have better caps.
Big Dawg 23

join:2002-03-27
Northfield, MN
You don't have 5GB cap on Verizon for a Phone it is unlimited. Now tethering and data cards do have a 5GB cap. Palm Centro is considered a smartphone so yes. Although they will be like AT&T and grandfather people.
beaups

join:2003-08-11
Hilliard, OH

Maybe

Maybe, just maybe, the analysts were correct in criticizing the FIOS investment. Not that anyone here would admit that.

Karl Bode
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Re: Maybe

Why?

A lot of the problems in subscriber adds have to do with pushing 3-7 Mbps DSL against faster cable speeds and the triple play, and the losses are due to layoffs. FiOS itself is doing relatively well, just slow growth given than more than half of Verizon's footprint remains last-generation DSL.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
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Re: Maybe

said by Karl Bode:

FiOS itself is doing relatively well, just slow growth given than more than half of Verizon's footprint remains last-generation DSL.
What does the FiOS uptake have to do with its deployment footprint? Or are you suggesting that VZ would have more FiOS subscribers if FiOS was deployed to more residences/businesses? Which, while most likely correct, what really determines FiOS' financial success is take rate and ARPU. At shy of 30% take rate, FiOS still has a ways to go IMO.
beaups

join:2003-08-11
Hilliard, OH

Re: Maybe

That's my point. Of course if more people that were passed actually bought the service, they would make money/more money. That's a no brainer.

Issue is that outside of us geeks nobody cares what technology serves them their content...as long as it works. For that reason, I still believe FIOS was launched too early. What is the added value for the average consumer? Nothing.
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO

Re: Maybe

said by beaups:

What is the added value for the average consumer?
Nothing is correct more or less. Not because it couldn't be, but in a pretty stagnant monopoly / duopoly market there doesn't need to be.

What was the big push with statewide franchise agreements? It was lower TV bills right if memory serves me correct. That would have been value added, but those promises never transpired.

FIOS has much greater capacity and can certainly run circles around DSL and Cable, yet they sell pretty much the same products for pretty much the same price. That could of been value added.

JeepMatt
C'mon the U
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You think a 25% penetration rate is bad?

Wow..
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openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
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Re: Maybe

It's ok, but what is nice is the revenue growth that FiOS is seeing. Now if VZ can increase the take rate, FiOS will be doing well IMO.

N3OGH
Certified GLG-20
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I always love talking penetration on BBR!

I agree, 25% is pretty good. Now that they've dropped the contract requirement, I think you'll see a lot more uptake.

As far as the layoffs and the caps, the caps won't effect me much. My billing cycle ends on Sunday and I've only used half a gig for the month. Mostly I just browse the web, and watch a video here and there.

I did stream XM for about 3 or 4 days before I got my window office back. Worked really well, and when I hooked it up to my computer speakers, it sounded as good as the live broadcast...
--
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caco
Premium
join:2005-03-10
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"Items that negatively impacted Verizon's second-quarter 2010 net income were 52 cents per share associated with the voluntary incentive program for union-represented employees, about two-thirds of whom left the payroll in late June or early July; 6 cents per share for both Alltel merger integration costs and taxes associated with the divestiture of the Alltel trust properties; 4 cents per share in Frontier spinoff-related charges; and 3 cents per share for a one-time, non-cash revenue adjustment of $268 million, which was recorded to properly defer previously recognized wireless data revenues that will be earned and recognized in future periods."

Fios was not the problem.
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JPL
Premium
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said by beaups:

Maybe, just maybe, the analysts were correct in criticizing the FIOS investment. Not that anyone here would admit that.
I'll ask the question that this post begs - if they didn't do fios where would they be? What would they have in competing against cable? DSL and POTS? Right... the two areas where they're bleeding customers is exactly the future for them! The did fios because they HAD to do something like that to survive.

aztecnology
O Rly?
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join:2003-02-12
Murrieta, CA
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

Re: Maybe

said by JPL:

said by beaups:

Maybe, just maybe, the analysts were correct in criticizing the FIOS investment. Not that anyone here would admit that.
I'll ask the question that this post begs - if they didn't do fios where would they be? What would they have in competing against cable? DSL and POTS? Right... the two areas where they're bleeding customers is exactly the future for them! The did fios because they HAD to do something like that to survive.
They'd be in the exact same place. Spending all their cash on LTE...
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JPL
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2 edits

Re: Maybe

said by aztecnology:

said by JPL:

said by beaups:

Maybe, just maybe, the analysts were correct in criticizing the FIOS investment. Not that anyone here would admit that.
I'll ask the question that this post begs - if they didn't do fios where would they be? What would they have in competing against cable? DSL and POTS? Right... the two areas where they're bleeding customers is exactly the future for them! The did fios because they HAD to do something like that to survive.
They'd be in the exact same place. Spending all their cash on LTE...
What? They would be in the exact same place? So... all those loss offsets that they were able achieve BECAUSE of fios would also have materialized without actually having fios?! Read those numbers again - FiOS internet additions helped to offset losses for DSL service. Those offsets would NEVER have materialized if they were DSL only.

In areas where Verizon actually has FiOS, they've been able to hold their own against the cable companies with regard to phone and internet service. Meaning, FiOS has made it possible for them to compete whereas their old architecture does not. Their revenue stream would be much lower than where it is now were it not for FiOS... meaning LESS money to devote to LTE.

Never mind the fact that they're smoking the wireless world (look at all those additions) even WITH fios. Please tell me where they've lost out on the wireless front because they're also investing in fiber. Because I ain't seeing it.

aztecnology
O Rly?
Premium
join:2003-02-12
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·Verizon FiOS

Re: Maybe

said by JPL:

What? They would be in the exact same place?
Yes. Regardless of FiOS, they (Verizon), at this point in time, would still be spending all thier money on LTE...
--
.:|:. Go Wheatley or Go Home!
JPL
Premium
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1 edit

Re: Maybe

said by aztecnology:

said by JPL:

What? They would be in the exact same place?
Yes. Regardless of FiOS, they (Verizon), at this point in time, would still be spending all thier money on LTE...
Right... with a much smaller customer base. I could tell you that if it were not for FiOS, right now I would not be a Verizon customer at all. How many others are like that? I'll bet there are alot. FiOS makes bundling of these services possible, meaning that they're able to compete against the Comcast's of the world.

Besides, if what you're saying is true - if they're investing ALL their money in wireless... then what's the problem? What's the issue with fios? If it's not a money drain then what the hell? They're not spending all their money on LTE. That's just silly. They're still spending money on fios.

aztecnology
O Rly?
Premium
join:2003-02-12
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·Verizon FiOS

Re: Maybe

said by JPL:

Besides, if what you're saying is true - if they're investing ALL their money in wireless... then what's the problem? What's the issue with fios? If it's not a money drain then what the hell? They're not spending all their money on LTE. That's just silly. They're still spending money on fios.
O rly...?

Show me where big red hasn't stopped FiOS deployment...?

»So, Is This Where Verizon's FiOS Deployment Ends?

»Verizon Downplays FiOS Deployment Freeze

»dark-fiber.tmcnet.com/topics/dar···vice.htm

»www.fiercetelecom.com/story/veri···10-03-29
--
.:|:. Go Wheatley or Go Home!
ITALIAN926

join:2003-08-16
kudos:1

Re: Maybe

Verizon is still deploying Fiber in areas where franchise agreements have been reached. They just ran underground conduit to about 80 homes in my development. They have to have my entire town wires within 2 more years.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
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Wireless is the future. FiOS just rounds out the package.
JPL
Premium
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Downingtown, PA
kudos:1

3 edits

Re: Maybe

said by openbox9:

Wireless is the future. FiOS just rounds out the package.
I'm sorry, but wireless will never fully replace good old fashioned linear TV and internet service. There just isn't enough wireless bandwidth to make that possible. Think about how many homes there are in the US (100 Million+). Add to that all the hotel rooms, bars, restaurants, etc. that also offer TV service. Now, multiply THAT by the average number of TVs per unit (let's round that down and call it 2). So now you're at what 250 Million TVs... I would LOVE to see someone realistically make the case that it would be possible to use wireless to replace all that. And I haven't even touched on internet usage yet.

Also you're missing my other point - FiOS is a revenue stream for Verizon. It offers them more money coming in. More money means more available for investment in things like... wireless. What a concept - make money to be able to invest in other areas! Were it not for FiOS, Verizon would need to start offsetting losses in their landline division by taking money from their wireless division.
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
kudos:1

1 edit

Re: Maybe

said by JPL:

I'm sorry, but wireless will never fully replace good old fashioned linear TV and internet service.
I'm not suggesting that wireless will replace traditional wireline infrastructure, just that for growth in the industry, wireless is where the bang for the buck is going to be for a while. FiOS will round out service offerings for some of VZ's markets and generate revenue, but I believe wireless revenue growth is the key for a while.
said by JPL:

So now you're at what 250 Million TVs... I would LOVE to see someone realistically make the case that it would be possible to use wireless to replace all that.
DBS already does that
said by JPL:

FiOS is a revenue stream for Verizon. It offers them more money coming in.
It also cost a big chunk of change that I don't believe has paid for itself yet.
said by JPL:

Were it not for FiOS, Verizon would need to start offsetting losses in their landline division by taking money from their wireless division.
Huh? If anything, I would've seen VZ shedding more of its wireline markets if they were revenue drains.

Don't get me wrong, I believe that FiOS will serve VZ well in the long run, I just see more focus being placed on wireless and revenue growth from it being key for the next several years. Maybe once VZ fully deploys LTE with sufficient capacity over the next five or six years, it can get back to the FTTH project.
rody_44
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Sure it will. Ten years everything could be wireless.

benc
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said by JPL:

I'm sorry, but wireless will never fully replace good old fashioned linear TV and internet service. There just isn't enough wireless bandwidth to make that possible. Think about how many homes there are in the US (100 Million+). Add to that all the hotel rooms, bars, restaurants, etc. that also offer TV service. Now, multiply THAT by the average number of TVs per unit (let's round that down and call it 2). So now you're at what 250 Million TVs... I would LOVE to see someone realistically make the case that it would be possible to use wireless to replace all that. And I haven't even touched on internet usage yet.
OTA?

     Though I don't see wireless, at least not in it's current state, being able to support all Internet access.  At least not at the speeds that people will want.
FLATLINE

join:2007-02-27
Buffalo, NY
I dont think it was meant as an all or nothing. Verizon clearly had to do something to compete with Cable. But maybe just maybe they didnt need to bring Fiber all the way to the home.

wdoa

join:2001-10-16
Spencer, MA
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said by beaups:

Maybe, just maybe, the analysts were correct in criticizing the FIOS investment. Not that anyone here would admit that.
Spoken like a true representative of "The United Corporations of America"
beaups

join:2003-08-11
Hilliard, OH

Re: Maybe

Wow that's an intelligent comment. If they were getting an ROI they would continue to expand it. They have no shortage of working capital, so the argument that they need the $$$ for LTE is BS.

I like FIOS, wish it would come here.

If you are so anti corporate how about you quit your job, sell of your 401K (if you have one) and stop using the internet that the "evil corporations" provide you.
sonicmerlin

join:2009-05-24
Cleveland, OH
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Re: Maybe

said by beaups:

Wow that's an intelligent comment. If they were getting an ROI they would continue to expand it. They have no shortage of working capital, so the argument that they need the $$$ for LTE is BS.

I like FIOS, wish it would come here.

If you are so anti corporate how about you quit your job, sell of your 401K (if you have one) and stop using the internet that the "evil corporations" provide you.
They *are* getting an ROI. But their investors felt it wasn't high enough. The problem is short-term investors are driving companies like Verizon and AT&T into the ground by forcing them to myopically focus on short-term profits. Long-term halting FIOS deployments is the stupidest decision possible to make. Verizon will continue to bleed DSL customers, and after a while will be stuck relying entirely on wireless.

alchav

join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
said by beaups:

Maybe, just maybe, the analysts were correct in criticizing the FIOS investment. Not that anyone here would admit that.
I think the FiOS decision was sound, but the public and the applications were not there. I've said this before, people want cheap fast service, and are not willing to pay for the higher end products. Then the applications that require a bigger pipe are not there. The Movie Industry is dragging their feet on streaming HD Video, so the public doesn't need the bigger Broadband Pipes. Verizon just hasn't seen a good Return on Investment, hence the loss.
beaups

join:2003-08-11
Hilliard, OH

Re: Maybe

That's a ridiculous comment. If the public doesn't want it, the investment is not sound, period! Cable/DSL (mostly) have no issues handling the bandwidth that 99% of the country needs. Now, could it matter in 5-10 years? Perhaps. But if that's the case verizon could've waited and saved even more money.

I can't believe you just posted that comment.

alchav

join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA

Re: Maybe

"I think the FiOS decision was sound, but the public and the applications were not there. I've said this before, people want cheap fast service, and are not willing to pay for the higher end products. Then the applications that require a bigger pipe are not there."

said by beaups:

That's a ridiculous comment. If the public doesn't want it, the investment is not sound, period! Cable/DSL (mostly) have no issues handling the bandwidth that 99% of the country needs. Now, could it matter in 5-10 years? Perhaps. But if that's the case verizon could've waited and saved even more money.

I can't believe you just posted that comment.
I never said the Public doesn't want it, for that matter the Public or the Average Person doesn't know what they want! The only thing the Average Person wants is cheap, reliable service. No loyalties, or even thinking about the future, just Now, what can you give me right Now? I worked in the Telco Industry for 31 years, so I know what I am talking about. If you don't think at least 10 years ahead, you are doomed for failure. You are saying that Verizon could have waited, and used what, their existing Copper. AT&T did this, and I say that was a mistake. The Public thinks it's okay for now, but the Bandwidth is just not there with Copper. Also, Copper gets old and has to be replaced....More Cost. So I don't think my comments are ridiculous, but only a short time will tell the difference.
Ulmo

join:2005-09-22
San Jose, CA
Reviews:
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A rough napkin calc:

$2000 per install (counts homes passed and fully installed as identical -- so an average of the two -- I know, it costs more to do a full install). $6,790 total install cost per current customer (counts unutilized installs, as it should). $80 revenue per month per customer. 7 years to break even.

Not bad for single mode fiber. How many years to go before the 7 years are up? About 5?

If the revenue is lower, then obviously it would take longer.

hamburglar_

join:2002-04-29
united state
Reviews:
·VOIPo

Who didn't see this coming?

What still amazes me is that the telcos refuse to lower landline pricing, and it's 2010. I would happily keep mine if they could offer the same features and price as my voip provider. They still rob rural customers $60+ a month for a phone. I don't see how Frontier can turn this around.
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1

Re: Who didn't see this coming?

$10.95 caller ID FTW
openbox9

join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA
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How much of a typical POTS line is regulation/tariff based? Honest question, as I've not done the research.

benc
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said by hamburglar_:

What still amazes me is that the telcos refuse to lower landline pricing, and it's 2010. I would happily keep mine if they could offer the same features and price as my voip provider. They still rob rural customers $60+ a month for a phone. I don't see how Frontier can turn this around.
     They're very slow to change.  Over the very long term, they have lowered pricing.  For instance, I have unlimited calling to anywhere in the U.S., with my landline.  No per minute rates ever, unless I call internationally.  At one point, that would have been unheard of, or prohibitively expensive for most.

     I do agree with you though, that prices could be better.  Some of those features really should be offered at no extra charge at all.  Caller ID costs what....maybe cents or fractions of a dollar per customer to operate?  Voicemail would be a bit more involved, but even that should be cheap to offer.
xenophon

join:2007-09-17

Layoffs expensive but so is LTE rollout

Layoffs have a pretty expensive up front cost (severance pay), but given the quick LTE rollout VZW appears to be doing, that is probably a big chunk of cash expenses to hit the books for the quarter. If the LTE rollout is actually happening at the rate they claim, it's more than twice the rate than VZW's EVDO rollout 5+ years ago. That has to be pretty expensive.

Pathfinder
Dazed Confused
Premium
join:2000-03-26
Mount Vernon, NY

Firings?

"The firings stem largely from landline losses"

What firings? The Incentive Program was a very generous package. Most eligible employees jumped at it.

wallawallabe

@comcast.net

Re: Firings?

"The firings stem largely from landline losses" NO THEY WERENT.....i know a fios installer they told them they only had enough work for a certain amount of peoplethats why they were laid off cause they are slowing deployment... and they other figure not TOLD in these NUMBERS are people LEAVING fios so "LOSS of SUBS" I KNOW hard to believe someone leaving lovely FIOS....LOL

jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA

Re: Firings?

I can read your vehement dislike toward Verizon, but I don't follow your logic. The total number of FiOS subscribers, as well as the percentage of penetration, increased for both Internet and TV services. They are clearly gaining subscribers, overall.

wallawallabe

@comcast.net

Re: Firings?

the numbers never reflect lost subscribers when they quote numbers or penetration

jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA

Re: Firings?

Still not following you. There will always be situations where customers leave with any ISP, but Verizon FiOS is gaining more customers each quarter, and the percentage of homes that can get FiOS is increasing as well. Why does it matter if 50,000 people leave if 150,000 sign up? Customer satisfaction with FiOS is higher than any other comparable service. Exactly how is the loss of subs a major factor compared to generous give-aways to thousands of employees that were dropped, especially when seeing net customer gains each year?
Mr Matt

join:2008-01-29
Eustis, FL
kudos:1
Reviews:
·CenturyLink
·Comcast
·Embarq Now Centu..
·Millenicom

Add BSA sufix to Verizon's name.

As a student of telephone industry I am aware of some facts that most persons are not. Verizon evolved out General Telephone and Electronics (GTE). I see Verizon developing a Bell System Attitude. What has gone before: During the development of the telephone industry infrastructure AT&T directed their efforts to operating in large cities while GTE acquired their properties by buying up independent telephone companies in rural America. Verizon management appears to want to shed the holdings acquired by GTE in rural America and have been doing so over the last several years.
viperlmw
Premium
join:2005-01-25

Re: Add BSA sufix to Verizon's name.

IIRC, Verizon was actually a merging of 3 different operating companies, GTE as an ILEC/Independent telco, and 2 BOCs, Bell Atlantic and (NYNEX?). And now that they have sold off most of the GTE properties, they are the 2nd biggest RBOC, so when it comes to "developing a Bell System Attitude", TO LATE!

Steve Mehs
Jobs is Dead
Premium
join:2005-07-16

Re: Add BSA sufix to Verizon's name.

It didn't happen all at once though. Bell Atlantic and NYNEX were two seperate RBOCs, in 1997 Bell Atlantic bought out NYNEX and kept the Bell Atlantic name. Three years later, Bell Atlantic merged with GTE and the Verizon name was born.

Niarlan
Excelsior
Premium
join:2002-11-09
Manville, NJ
Actually Bell Atlantic and Nynex merged a couple of years prior to Verizon. Damn stationary suppliers were estatic....first Bell Atlantic...then Bell Atlantic Nynex....Then back to Bell Atlantic...at least on the Mobile side.

Then you add in GTE and Primeco and Airtouch on the wireless side when you merge to Verizon Wireless.

Nia
PX Eliezer
Premium
join:2008-08-09
HuttRiver US
kudos:11
Reviews:
·callwithus
·voip.ms
·Vitelity VOIP
·Callcentric
·Optimum Voice
·Gizmo5
said by Mr Matt:

As a student of telephone industry I am aware of some facts that most persons are not.
That sounds rather egotistical....

said by Mr Matt:

Verizon evolved out General Telephone and Electronics (GTE).
....because you are not even correct on a basic fact.

Verizon's home territory in the northeast and mid-Atlantic states represents a merger of 2 of the 7 Regional Bell Operating Companies (RBOC's/BabyBells) that were created by the 1984 ATT/BellSystem breakup.

These two companies were BellAtlantic and NYNEX.

Yes, other companies came into the mix as well, including GTE and MCI.

But to repeat, Verizon's original home footprint, AND their management (!!) came from BellAtlantic and NYNEX---but ESPECIALLY BellAtlantic.

Aggie Dan
Stop... Reverse That.
Premium
join:2001-01-30
Frisco, TX
You should stop sleeping through your history of telecom classes.

I actually lived through the merger of Bell Atlantic and GTE. I can attest to the fact that even though it was described as a merger of equals, it was run as more of an acquisition of GTE by Bell Atlantic.

Do some research and look at who took the helm of the combined company. Was it the GTE CEO or the Bell Atlantic one?

Years later with the acquisition of MCI Business, it was more of the same. Everyone in that division was initially given a BAID (Bell Atlantic ID) just like the former GTE employees.

Verizon gained some good markets through the acquisition of GTE and gained a good portion of technical expertise. As an example, Verizon FiOS follows the provisioning processes developed by GTE.
--
Note : The statements made by myself are my own and not the opinions of my employer or of my coworkers. 15.81 GHz Crunching Power | My Random Thoughts... Yes, I have thoughts.

Dragasoni
We're All Mad Here
Premium
join:2001-12-14
Palm Bay, FL
Reviews:
·Earthlink Cable ..

The Bobs

Click for full size
Did Verizon hire these guys?

Just kidding, being laid off sucks and I miss working. It's been a LONG 16 months...

-Dragasoni-
--
»www.youtube.com/user/dragasoni

wallawallabe

@comcast.net

Re: The Bobs

LOL
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

what was that slogan again?

rule the air?

I think everyone needs to chillax (including the shareholders) and give them some rope to hang themselves on next quarter's earnings.. IMO these are a once-off thing and they'll return to profitability next quarter.. there is no indication that they would do otherwise.

It's also expensive ($$) to get rid of CONTRACTED UNIONIZED WORKERS.. but it's a one-time expense, over & done with. That double edged sword of severance money pushing you in the direction of looking for another job in this jobmarket can be a mixed blessing if you can't find work for 1+ years.

Verizon's doing alot of right things to fight tooth & nail for the NYC customers of Time Warner & Cablevision. Don't jinx it now, or you put at risk TWC & Cablevision actually competing by increasing broadband speeds.

Alcohol
Premium
join:2003-05-26
Climax, MI
kudos:3
Reviews:
·Comcast

Re: what was that slogan again?

quote:
On the wireless front, Verizon actually managed to add 665,000 contract wireless customers, more than the 496,000 for AT&T -- despite not having the iPhone.
Atleast they're doing well on the wireless side. Hopefully this means more high end android phones.
--
I found the key to success but somebody changed the lock.

JLarue

@spcsdns.net

Layoffs and FIOS

Laid off from Verizon. In some states if you volunteer, you are not eligible for unemployment. That's why you wait to be laid off. 35 weeks pay and benefits plus unemployment not too bad. BTW, Verizon still hasn't made a profit from FIOS>
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS

Re: Layoffs and FIOS

said by JLarue :

Laid off from Verizon. In some states if you volunteer, you are not eligible for unemployment. That's why you wait to be laid off. 35 weeks pay and benefits plus unemployment not too bad. BTW, Verizon still hasn't made a profit from FIOS>
When they just go with digital voice & get rid of that B/S Fcc line charge (seriously, $6+ to the fcc for a digital voice/voip line?!?!?), then it's apples to apples.. except the broadband is better.. then they just might squeak out a profit. Actually, the company overall is profitable. They just wanted ALL the bad news to hit the fan in one quarter.

BTW, I don't see Cablevision, Time Warner or Comcrap & AT&T delivering symmetric bandwidth ANYWHERE in their footprints.

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