 ozznyPremium join:2005-04-22 Bronx, NY | New Data Prices I wouldn't be surprised if Verizon uses this study as a basis to adapt AT&T style per GB billing. | |
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 | | OMG... "Only 2/10ths of 1 percent of both Verizon smartphones and iPhones use more than 5 GBs per month. "
And we are robbed with $39.99/Unlimited*** data plans...
Is there a cliff nearby because as a lemming I feel the urge to go over it... | |
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 |  Z80APremium join:2009-11-23 | Re: OMG... And AT&T is crying about usage. | |
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 |  |  tiger72SexaT duorPPremium join:2001-03-28 Saint Louis, MO kudos:1 | Re: OMG... As i've said all along - they know it's cheaper to cast blame on their customers than it is to actually build a good network. | |
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 Camelot OnePremium,MVM join:2001-11-21 Greenwood, IN kudos:1 | Misleading data..... I'm now up to more than 800Mb used on my Droid X since I picked it up on the 15th. And I've yet to use it outside of my home. Maybe if Verizon worked on their phone's wifi issues, they wouldn't see quite as much 3G traffic. -- Intel Q6600 @3400Mhz/GA-EP35-DS3P/4x 2048Mb G.Skill/WD Raptor 300Gb/3x WD20EADS 2TB/2x PNY GTX 260/Silverstone 850W/Custom water cooler | |
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 |  | | Re: Misleading data..... I was wondering how much Wi-Fi use skews this data. I know my iPhone is on Wi-Fi a lot. I don't know how many of the smartphones on Verizon's network have wi-Fi.
-- Mark | |
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 |  |  Camelot OnePremium,MVM join:2001-11-21 Greenwood, IN kudos:1 | Re: Misleading data..... As far as I know, all of the Android phones have wifi. I doubt wifi data is being included, its more the amount of 3G traffic people THINK is running over their wifi that interests me.
My phone should have 0-50Mb of 3G use at most, accounting for all of the auto-sync crap it does with google. But because it can't seem to hold a wifi connection, even in the same room with the AP, I'm at 862Mb in 13 days. -- Intel Q6600 @3400Mhz/GA-EP35-DS3P/4x 2048Mb G.Skill/WD Raptor 300Gb/3x WD20EADS 2TB/2x PNY GTX 260/Silverstone 850W/Custom water cooler | |
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 |  ptrowskiGot Helix?Premium join:2005-03-14 Putnam, CT kudos:4 Reviews:
·VOIPo
| For example on my iPhone I am on 3G from 7 AM to 5:30 PM, and at home I am on wifi. I listen to XM Radio on my 45 minute drive in to work. 21 days in this billing cycle and so far I have used 1.29 GB of data. If I was on 3G strictly I could see it being higher. | |
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 |  openbox9Premium join:2004-01-26 japan kudos:2 | As of yesterday, I've used 375 MB since I snagged my DX on the 15th. I concur wholeheartedly with Motorola fixing the WiFi problem on the DX. I shouldn't need to run an unencrypted, open WAP to be able to use my WiFi. | |
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 |  | | But how does that make the data misleading?
They say the data is specifically for 3G data usage.
They don't care why someone is using the 3G, whether it's because their WiFi doesn't work, or because they don't know they can use WiFi.
They only care about the 3G usage data. It doesn't matter how it got to the 3G network. They're not trying to make guesstimates or assumptions about someone's intentions. They are publishing the acutal average 3G data usage. | |
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 |  |  Camelot OnePremium,MVM join:2001-11-21 Greenwood, IN kudos:1 | Re: Misleading data..... said by skuv :
But how does that make the data misleading?
They say the data is specifically for 3G data usage.
They don't care why someone is using the 3G, whether it's because their WiFi doesn't work, or because they don't know they can use WiFi.
They only care about the 3G usage data. It doesn't matter how it got to the 3G network. They're not trying to make guesstimates or assumptions about someone's intentions. They are publishing the acutal average 3G data usage. It matters because studies like these will be used to justify higher data prices. And if Verizon customers are only using more 3G data because their phones are defective, that is certainly relevant. -- Intel Q6600 @3400Mhz/GA-EP35-DS3P/4x 2048Mb G.Skill/WD Raptor 300Gb/3x WD20EADS 2TB/2x PNY GTX 260/Silverstone 850W/Custom water cooler | |
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 rileyjam514There You Go Again... join:2005-06-26 Kearny, NJ | And yet.. ... Verizon's network isn't straining and choking under the weight of all that usage. | |
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 |  BF69Premium join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN | Re: And yet.. funny how that works | |
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 |  | | Oh please, i have yet to see more than a few android devices of any kind out in the real world. There are millions of 3G capable iPhones in the US alone, all on one network.
Also, you forget that the type of data is what causes choke points, thus far only where there are several thousand in use devices per sq mile is there any kind of issue. Vzw doesnt have that many customers.
Also you forget that you can't use voice & cll data on vz's network, on att you can, so imagine a % of those using data also being on a call.... The amount of info to/from those dual usage devices is likely 2.5x more than a vzw device.
- A -- LETS GO METS! | |
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 |  |  BF69Premium join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN | Re: And yet.. said by FastiBook:Oh please, i have yet to see more than a few android devices of any kind out in the real world. There are millions of 3G capable iPhones in the US alone, all on one network. Funny where I live I have yet to see anyone with an Iphone. of course not having 3G coverage in our area kind of kills sales. Meanwhile Droids flying off the shelves here because Veriozn actually provides 3G coverage. Verizon FTW. | |
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 |  |  openbox9Premium join:2004-01-26 japan kudos:2 | said by FastiBook:Oh please, i have yet to see more than a few android devices of any kind out in the real world. .... Vzw doesnt have that many customers. If that makes you feel better  »www.nytimes.com/2010/07/24/busin···zon.htmlsaid by FastiBook:The amount of info to/from those dual usage devices is likely 2.5x more than a vzw device. PDOOMA much? How did you determine 2.5x? How much bandwidth does on of AT&T's wireless voice channels consume? I seriously doubt it's 250% of surfing the net on a data channel. | |
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 |  |  |  BF69Premium join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN | Re: And yet.. From that article
Mr. Killian highlighted the companys additions to its mobile portfolio, including the HTC Droid Incredible and the Motorola Droid X, which helped woo new customers. More than 35 percent of the companys subscribers now have 3G smartphones, he said.
ALL of which require a data plan. And of course as people upgrade phones and contracts end, EVERYONE will be basically required to have a data plan.
Now I don't use phone data now. But I have an upgrade coming and if I'm required to pay $30 a month for data then I'm using all the data I can. If they insist on making me pay for something I dont want or need you can be damned well sure I'm getting my money's worth. | |
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 |  |  |  |  openbox9Premium join:2004-01-26 japan kudos:2 | Re: And yet.. I read the article, so I'm not sure why you're quoting it to me. Besides, my response was to disprove FastiBook 's claim that VZ doesn't have that many wireless customers. | |
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 |  |  |  |  tcopePremium join:2003-05-07 Sandy, UT kudos:2 | Been using my Cliq on Tmobile's network and never had a data plan. Despite what most TM reps will tell you, a data plan is _not_ required to use an Android phone on TM. While this certainly does limit the phones capability, there are many wifi connections in my area (home, work, bars, stores) that it's really not a huge deal for me.
Saving $30/month... priceless. | |
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 |  |  | | they are selling 15million a quarter,,,,
The figure, which indicates that around 15 million Android handsets are being sold every quarter, is up from Mays sales figure of 100,000 Android handsets being sold per day and, should you need further evidence with respect to the huge increase in market share being gained by Googles Android OS this daily sales figure was put at just 60,000 per day back in February.
»nexus404.com/Blog/2010/06/24/and···r-month/ | |
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 |  |  | | You can do both as long as you're in 3G. Try that on EDGE, which is the bulk of ATTs network, and let us know how that works out for you. | |
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 |  bdon78I didn't do it join:2009-05-18 Decatur, GA | Read the study.
It states that VZWs smartphone users consume more data NOT VZW has more smartphone users.
Let me simplify:
1 Droid X consuming 421MB
Versus
10 iPhones consuming 338MB
Here is it is right from the study:
AT&T continues to lead with 71.2% of users with data usage, up from 58.4%, with increase in mean usage per user from 111.9 MB to 149.6 MB
VERSUS
Verizon Wireless posts the largest percentage increase in mean data usage per user from 48.2MB to 147.2 MB; increase from 33.4% to 42.9% lines with data usage
So...AT&T 71.2% of users with data.. Verizon 42.9%... So nearly half as many users (even if the consume more data) Is that math simple enough? | |
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 |  |  BF69Premium join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN | Re: And yet.. said by bdon78:Read the study. It states that VZWs smartphone users consume more data NOT VZW has more smartphone users. Let me simplify: 1 Droid X consuming 421MB Versus 10 iPhones consuming 338MB Here is it is right from the study: AT&T continues to lead with 71.2% of users with data usage, up from 58.4%, with increase in mean usage per user from 111.9 MB to 149.6 MB VERSUS Verizon Wireless posts the largest percentage increase in mean data usage per user from 48.2MB to 147.2 MB; increase from 33.4% to 42.9% lines with data usage So...AT&T 71.2% of users with data.. Verizon 42.9%... So nearly half as many users (even if the consume more data) Is that math simple enough? And common sense says that numbers for both at&t and Verizon in terms of % that use data and the amount of data will increase and by A LOT in a very short period of time. | |
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 |  |  openbox9Premium join:2004-01-26 japan kudos:2 | And VZW has more customers than AT&T, so the numbers begin to converge. VZW is adding customers faster than AT&T. Yes, I believe AT&T still have more wireless data subscribers than Verizon, but using the percentages as you're doing doesn't tell the whole story. | |
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 |  |  |  | | Re: And yet.. I got a happy surprise in my voicemail this morning regarding VZW's expansion.
I've been having EVDO tower trouble for a few months and have been pestering the poor guys in tech support about it. I'm pretty rural but the tower I use covers a major interstate, so I'm guessing the problem went unreported by drivers; they just waited until the next tower and assumed it was a dead spot. Well, today they confirmed there IS a problem with the backhaul and will have it fixed soon.
But the REALLY good news -- we're getting a new cell tower! They're building it just two miles north of my house! The Tech wasn't able to give me a lot of details, but I wonder if this means LTE. What's surprising is this tower is further from the interstate, so there must be a big demand in my area. Not that we have a lot of choices...
Either way I couldn't be more thrilled! | |
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 |  | | Tell that to SETN. My 3G speeds have steadily gone south since November 2009. I can tell there are many more smartphone users in the area. It's bearable, but very annoying. | |
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 bdon78I didn't do it join:2009-05-18 Decatur, GA | Has anyone looked at the blog? Here is the link to the blog:
blog.myvalidas.com/
The interesting thing is that the final results aren't posted until September 1. How is that everyone (BGR, Engadget, DSLR) is picking up and reporting on a study that hasn't even been published?
Karl, have you even read the "myvalidas" blog? Aside from not seeming terribly professional, it does strike me odd that someone who is doing a study quotes some numbers on his blog and now the world is running with it not knowing all the facts (Let me add that I'm not saying Validas or the numbers are wrong, I just think its odd to state it as "fact" without having all the information from the study)
I also think that VZW will use this flurry of comments related to usage to move to the AT&T caps model (they will end up there one way or another) | |
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 |  BF69Premium join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN | Re: Has anyone looked at the blog? said by bdon78:Here is the link to the blog: blog.myvalidas.com/ The interesting thing is that the final results aren't posted until September 1. How is that everyone (BGR, Engadget, DSLR) is picking up and reporting on a study that hasn't even been published? Karl, have you even read the "myvalidas" blog? Aside from not seeming terribly professional, it does strike me odd that someone who is doing a study quotes some numbers on his blog and now the world is running with it not knowing all the facts (Let me add that I'm not saying Validas or the numbers are wrong, I just think its odd to state it as "fact" without having all the information from the study) By the time the full numbers come in it will be even higher. Especially for Verizon. When you add in all those people streaming NFL Network games and Sunday Night Football games it will be a lot more. At least 3 GB a month. Then of course there's Hulu. Just 1 hour of watching Hulu per day = 9 GB a month. 2 GB isn't going to seem like much. | |
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 |  |  bdon78I didn't do it join:2009-05-18 Decatur, GA | Re: Has anyone looked at the blog? You're missing the point...
AT&T 71.2% of users with data.. Verizon 42.9%.
So even with an increase in per user data consumption, AT&T has nearly twice as many users consuming data.. which equals more data traffic. Lets do some math
7 users @ 338MB = 2366 4 users @ 421MB = 1684
My point is that if you multiply that out by millions of users, the difference in backhaul consumption becomes significant.
But as you say, the introduction NFL streaming will be the real test...
Who cares either way, I want LTE! | |
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 |  |  |  amarryatVerizon FiOS join:2005-05-02 Marshfield, MA Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: Has anyone looked at the blog? said by bdon78:You're missing the point... So even with an increase in per user data consumption, AT&T has nearly twice as many users consuming data.. which equals more data traffic. Haven't you read other posts in here and other news stories that state that VZW carries more data traffic than AT&T? Sprint does too. So regardless of your math and iPhones, there is still more data with Verizon. And the difference should only become wider as Android phones are rapidly becoming more popular. AT&T has sold a boatload of iPhone 4's, but keep in mind that many (most?) of those were upgrades. | |
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 bn1221 join:2009-04-29 Cortland, NY | No duh.. VZ has a superior 3G in many areas (most of where I travel has ATT Edge or VZ REV A....)
So, makes sense to me.
Plus a lot of BB's on VZ lack wifi.....The iphone hits wifi where it can thereby lowering cell data usage | |
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 |  bdon78I didn't do it join:2009-05-18 Decatur, GA | Re: No duh.. said by bn1221:VZ has a superior 3G in many areas (most of where I travel has ATT Edge or VZ REV A....) I don't think anyone is questioning Verizon's 3G coverage (there is a map for that), just the amount of data consumed by smartphone users.. (which has nothing to do with maps) | |
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 |  |  bn1221 join:2009-04-29 Cortland, NY | Re: No duh.. I see your point..but you can use data a lot faster on 3G than you can on Edge.
Sorry for my unclarity  | |
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 Reviews:
·Comcast
| So it's smartphone users vs iPhone users? So does the VZW portion include all Android, Blackberry, and older Windows Mobile phones? And the AT&T portion *only* includes iPhones while excluding Blackberries, Android, and WM?
Seems that these numbers could change quite a bit. I would imagine Android users on VZW are using more data than BB users are. --
--psiu | |
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 |  Reviews:
·Verizon FiOS
| Re: So it's smartphone users vs iPhone users? said by psiu_nws:So does the VZW portion include all Android, Blackberry, and older Windows Mobile phones? And the AT&T portion *only* includes iPhones while excluding Blackberries, Android, and WM? Seems that these numbers could change quite a bit. I would imagine Android users on VZW are using more data than BB users are. Exactly. Why don't they include all of the smartphones on ATT? Blackberries, iPhones, android devices. Choosing just the iPhone skews the results. Also, ATT has more data users than Verizon Wireless so I'm not getting the point behind the blog's results. This just buttresses' ATT's argument that there network took a hit with the iPhone and the data demands of all smartphone users on their network. Considering that ATT's data use is more than 70% compared to Verizon's, ATT isn't looking too bad. | |
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 |  Matt3All noise, no signal.Premium join:2003-07-20 Jamestown, NC kudos:12 | said by psiu_nws:So does the VZW portion include all Android, Blackberry, and older Windows Mobile phones? And the AT&T portion *only* includes iPhones while excluding Blackberries, Android, and WM? Seems that these numbers could change quite a bit. I would imagine Android users on VZW are using more data than BB users are. No, the article states Blackberry devices are not included on either carrier. If they were, it would HEAVILY skew the numbers in VZW's favor, as they have a much larger percentage of business BB users than does AT&T. | |
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 bnceo join:2007-10-11 Bel Air, MD | VzW Smartphone users diff than iPhone Users I know grandparents who have iPhones. And you can bet they don't use any data at all. And I bet VzW smartphone users are mostly power users.
We need to know the % of power users of both Droid users and iPhone users. This is a misleading study. | |
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 Z80APremium join:2009-11-23 1 edit | Worthless info without the entire picture No BB on VZW, no other handsets on AT&T, no information about total smartphone populations on either network...so what conclusion are we supposed to draw from these tiny bits of info?
This is a pointless story without the rest of the information.
This is like having a story that says there are more accidents in city A than city B without giving any information about traffic, roads, how many cars there are in each, etc. Saying that city A has more red cars and city B has more pickup trucks tells you nothing.
Even the headline "Verizon Smartphone Users Consume The Most Data" is unsupported by the limited information provided because we don't have the total populations of either network. We don't know who consumes "the most data". If AT&T has twice the number of smart phone users, they would consume far more data despite a lower per user average.
-- "Our goal (was to make) a billion phones Flash-enabled by 2010...We're actually going to get 1 billion Flash-enabled phones by 2009." -Adobe Chief Technology Officer Kevin Lynch in Nov 2008. | |
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 |  bdon78I didn't do it join:2009-05-18 Decatur, GA | Re: Worthless info without the entire picture said by Z80A:No BB on VZW, no other handsets on AT&T, no information about total smartphone populations on either network...so what conclusion are we supposed to draw from these tiny bits of info? This is a pointless story without the rest of the information. This is like having a story that says there are more accidents in city A than city B without giving any information about traffic, roads, how many cars there are in each, etc. Saying that city A has more red cars and city B has more pickup trucks tells you nothing. Even the headline "Verizon Smartphone Users Consume The Most Data" is unsupported by the limited information provided because we don't have the total populations of either network. We don't know is consumes "the most data". Your post sums it up.. I can't figure out why this is being reported in the first place (well, because Karl hates AT&T). In fact, the study isn't even out until Sept... | |
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 |  1 edit | Well said!
This really shouldn't even be discussed unless MUCH more data is provided for the bigger picture.
I have the Storm 2 and consume data in nearly equal parts between 3G and Wifi. What about me and the thousands of other BB users? Where is our representation and the others between both networks?
Worthless data.  | |
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 HallPremium,MVM join:2000-04-28 Dayton, OH kudos:2 | ATT only has iPhones ? From this story, apparently ATT has no smartphones other than iPhones. I really doubt that ATT would publish the data usage numbers of their iPhone customers. ATT does have Android phones and Blackberries. | |
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 | | I know it will be small, but... I wonder how much of the data traffic is being used to purchase apps, music, etc from the stores.
I am thinking about getting an Android when my contract with Time Warner runs out (dump the home phone). Hopefully the phones preferring the 3G/4G network over your own WAP issue will be fixed by then. I can use the WiFi at home and work for the most part. | |
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 | | Passive aggressive BS What is up with all this passive aggressive BS coming from the wireless providers? It basically plays out like this: A. Receive a marketing assault from a wireless company that their smartphone is the best in the world and it practically poops golden bricks in the form of apps and functionality. B. Customer buys said phone at a subsidized price. (Basically a good deal on the HW if you sign a 2 year contract so you are now stuck using this device.) C. Then once you get used to the phone and start using all of these cool features then the passive aggressive side of your wireless provider comes out in the form of a nonsensical EULA and incessant bleating that you use the device they wanted you to buy so badly too much. Huh? D. Overage bills start to come in, data caps are making it hard for you to use the phone for business while also trying to have fun with it at night. E. Get so sick of the wireless provider that you try to cancel and go elsewhere yet now you have an ETF fee staring you in the face. Screw that, not handing the company thats pissing me off any more $$$ than they deserve. F. Admit defeat and stick with current provider while having to marginalize your use of the device because the wireless provider has so oversold the number of devices that their network can handle all the while still pestering you with overage emails and fee's yet the wireless company is secretly raking in the $$$ handing out executive bonuses like crazy while investing (compared to the bonuses) very little in the network they so want you to use.
How in the world is this a viable model? Do they want to sell you a smartphone? Yes. Do they really want you to use it? No.
This is the exact reason I don't lease cars. Who the hell wants to lease a car when leasing comes with a bunch of rules on how you are not supposed to use the car? Where's the fun in that?
I think its high time these wireless companies decide if they want to offer a service or not. If they do, then invest accordingly and don't limit your customers as it only causes negative press and emotions from your customer. And wireless companies need to stop with the BS of "If you overuse the network you are not being fair to your neighbor who also wants to use the network." When in truth this is the wireless company redirecting the blame of not building a robust enough network for their paying customers who should be able to do whatever they want with the device they bought and the money they paid.
I don't want to hear any BS about "that costs too much to do" because I'm willing to pay my way out of caps and limits, so price your crappy network to the point that I am not annoyed with your BS wireless companies.
I'm old enough to remember the internet without limits. Lets get back to that. | |
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 SeleniaI love DebianPremium join:2006-09-22 Lanesboro, MA kudos:2 | That made me laugh This is a much below-average month for my Pantech due to less traveling this month(normal use for me is around 1.5-2 gigs). I am posting this because that is hardly a smartphone, really making these stats look like a joke(one reason I love it though is notice the data cap I get for $15, which lends it nicely to streaming, etc). Must be a PR rep from Verizon for metered billing that produced this bullox, figuring it'd make AT&T look bad at the same time LOL. Another thing that makes me think this is only iphone stats are grabbed for AT&T, while the source thinks they know the average for all VZW smartphone customers. I don't think neither carrier will ever release truthful stats. -- The new Sony rootkit-Using the ability to remove features you paid for. What's next? Boycott Sony products »[Rant] ps3 update = no more Linux | |
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 | | Point of Information AT&T had more than 120M connections on their Wi-Fi network through June 30, 2010. There's prob no public info on how much data carried in those 120M connections. One could safely assume that no other wireless carrier in the US offloaded by way of managing "120M" Wi-Fi connections in the first 6 months of 2010. | |
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 | | Study on Data Cards` Are there any studies on data card usage as compared to smartphones? I'd like to see a study on this as I'm getting tired of discriminatory pricing on data card plans as opposed to smartphone plans. $40/mo data card for 250 Meg as opposed to $30/mo smartphone for unlimited is absolutely rediculous. $60/mo 5 gig datacard is better but still stinks. | |
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 |  FutureMonAch Du LieberPremium,ExMod 2002-05 join:2000-10-05 Seaside, CA Reviews:
·Suddenlink
| Re: Study on Data Cards` I keep hearing the term "discriminatory pricing" in regards to data cards.
How is it discriminatory? If I'm not mistaken, the data card allows a regular computer or laptop full internet access.
We're talking about data plans for cellular devices.
They are two different things, so why shouldn't the billing be different?
Would you be able to do everything on your smartphone that you can on your laptop? Right now the answer is probably no.
- FM | |
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 AVDRespice, Adspice, ProspicePremium join:2003-02-06 Onion, NJ kudos:1 | If your network works.... people will use it. And if the wifi is ineffective, people will use the 3G more. -- standard disclaimers apply. | |
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