 
rudnicke
Premium
join:2004-10-23
Rantoul, IL
clubs: | Trust At this point, I would trust the union over a Verizon spokesperson. | |
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dispatcher21
join:2004-01-22
Walla Walla, WA | Re: Trust Where is the proof? The union just spouts stuff off but there is nothing there to back it up. Photos? Statistics of service being down? CSR stats? Where is the proof? Anyone can say anything they want but without proof, its crap. | |
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VZ service tech
@bellatlantic.com
| Re: Trust said by dispatcher21  :Where is the proof? The union just spouts stuff off but there is nothing there to back it up. Photos? Statistics of service being down? CSR stats? Where is the proof? Anyone can say anything they want but without proof, its crap. OK, how about this. I worked in copper for about six months. In that time, we were constantly waiting for tools and equipment because so much money was being sent to the FIOS department. I was told by cable that no new copper plant would be placed even if we ran out of good pairs. They will just have to find a way to fix it. The FIOS guys got brand new laptops. We got their hand-me-downs. Even in a meeting we were told most of the money is going to fiber. However, in the time I was there I can't think of a time where things became so critical that customers were left hanging. | |
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Supafly
Premium
join:2000-07-15
Lancaster, CA
| Re: Trust said by VZ service tech :
OK, how about this. I worked in copper for about six months. In that time, we were constantly waiting for tools and equipment because so much money was being sent to the FIOS department. I was told by cable that no new copper plant would be placed even if we ran out of good pairs. They will just have to find a way to fix it. The FIOS guys got brand new laptops. We got their hand-me-downs. Even in a meeting we were told most of the money is going to fiber. Sounds like FiOS envy... 
Seriously though, they are doing what any smart company does. They are re-locating their efforts and resources to the solution that is being provided for the long term. Why on god's earth would they continue to throw money down the copper toilet when they can better spend those resources on get Fiber to the masses, faster?
You said it yourself:
said by VZ service tech :
However, in the time I was there I can't think of a time where things became so critical that customers were left hanging. | |
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| | | PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
| said by VZ service tech :
I was told by cable that no new copper plant would be placed even if we ran out of good pairs. They will just have to find a way to fix it. I'm no fan of unions and their protect-mediocrity, kill-ambition mentality, but this does align with what I've heard from VZ techs who try to fix problems around here.
quote:
We provide good quality service to our customers regardless of where they live.
What a crock. Believe me, no one in my neighborhood would call what we get from Verizon as "good quality service". And Verizon knows it.
When you call Verizon, you get a very nice person at the call center, who'll tell you yessir, that's not right, we'll get right on it.
Then the next day, you get a call from some obnoxious local person, telling you no, we're not gonna roll a truck to fix that, you'll just have to live with it, we know you have no choice (no cable in this neighborhood). | |
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cob_
1310nm Of Goodness
Premium
join:2003-07-08
Tulsa, OK
| For better or for worse, I would say that CWA could consider these actions on Verizon's part a way to show union members what they could have had had they not relied on union contracts and stifled their own advancement by locking themselves into copper technology. | |
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| | chemaupr
join:2005-06-06
Alexandria, VA | Re: Trust I agree with you. Union leaders are as bad as CEOs. They only care about their pockets | |
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S_engineer
join:2007-05-16
Chicago, IL
| Re: Trust wrong...they care about the repectable wages for their constituants rather than non-signitory contractors working for pennies. None of these non-signitory contractors have gone through an apprenticeship or had the level of training that is demanded. Futhermore, Verizon or Comcast (etc...etc..)do not pass on the savings to the consumer whether it's union or non-union.
So in ten years when all the good jobs are at Walmart, take a look in the mirror! | |
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TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ
 ·Sprint Broadband D..
| Re: Trust said by S_engineer :wrong...they care about the repectable wages for their constituants rather than non-signitory contractors working for pennies. None of these non-signitory contractors have gone through an apprenticeship or had the level of training that is demanded. Futhermore, Verizon or Comcast (etc...etc..)do not pass on the savings to the consumer whether it's union or non-union. So in ten years when all the good jobs are at Walmart, take a look in the mirror! You have SOOOOOOO wrong! The great god of the airwaves, Bill O'Loofah, says unions are corrupt, nasty, traitorous and they smell funny. Ergo, it must be so.
Billo knows. HE KNOWS! | |
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NyQuil Kid
8f The Nyquil Kid
join:2001-01-06
Brick, NJ
 ·Comcast
edit:
June 12th, @06:26PM
| said by rudnicke :At this point, I would trust the union over a Verizon spokesperson. [sarcasm]
Yeah, because everyone knows that unions don't have their own agenda and are just looking out for you...[/sarcasm]
If anyone honestly believes the above, you're a moron.
[8F] The NyQuil Kid
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[8F] The NyQuil Kid comes into town not looking for trouble...
n00bz gang up, but he ain't seein' double,...
pulls and draws, his deagles two...
n00bz litter the ground you know it's true. | |
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Mactron
el Camino Real
Premium
join:2001-12-16
CM94sv
| Coincidence ? "but if Verizon wants to keep state and federal regulators off its back, it can't become so infatuated with its new FiOS hotness that the copper network becomes old and busted."
Should read ?.. "Just enough to keep them off their backs"
Funny I only see about half as many VZ Repair trucks parked at night in their yard as I use to. Hmmmm Coincidence ?
So far so good here in Central Ca. Fingers crossed.
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If only the Verizon CSRs worked this well.  | |
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RIRWIN1983
join:2005-08-30
Columbus, OH | Re: Coincidence ? Perhaps bc they have finaly sold off the old trucks, i've seen alot of old vz trucks w/booms and old vz vans (GTE era) poping up around ohio with the logos removed. and bear in mind ohio is at&t land for 75% of it. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD |  That Sucks!
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ
·Sprint Broadband D..
| Re: That Sucks! You are so correct. Let those clowns who live in areas without FIOS resort to communicating with smoke signals and jungle drums! After all, they chose to live there!
Ghod forbid the gubmint steps in and makes them maintain their utilities or something. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
edit:
June 12th, @03:42PM
| Re: That Sucks! said by TScheisskopf :You are so correct. Let those clowns who live in areas without FIOS resort to communicating with smoke signals and jungle drums! After all, they chose to live there! We have cable. Should the quality of Verizon's service degrade to the point where it is unusable, people will simply drop it, as there is little point in paying money for a service that isn't usable anyway.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ | Re: That Sucks! Well, of course the answer to that is:
Move!
Also, you should remember that your betters have decided all this for you. Submit to their will, citizen. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| Re: That Sucks! said by JTRockville :It's hard to imagine the quality of any Verizon service sinking beneath that of cable, even in copper-only areas. I for one do not believe the union. Just about everyone I know who has Verizon landline service has no complaints about it at all. For them, it just works.
said by JTRockville :But a choice of two doesn't make a "market". In order for market forces to replace regulation, we need many competitors, not just two. Technically even a monopoly is a market. I am weary of even more regulation because that regulation resulted directly in companies like Verizon not expanding DSL deployments. Of course, I suppose one could say that pushed them to invest in FIOS, but now those people are complaining that Verizon won't share that either.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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Supervisor
Premium
join:2006-03-26
Lebanon, PA
| Re: That Sucks! Why assume that regulation is what drives companies like Verizon to not expand DSL deployment? How about lack of competition? And if Verizon operates as a monopoly there cannot be competition. The Telecom Act of 1996 attempted to fix this by keeping some of the regulation of the earlier 1934 Act PLUS adding in new requirements for competition. Of course this has all gone by the wayside with the recent FCC Triennial Review Order that tosses out most of the competitive requirements of the 1996 Act, including the requirement that telcos share their monopoly fiber. The one of the few things the TRO left in was a requirement for telcos to resell to competitors whatever is left of the old copper loops. No wonder Verizon is focusing on fiber and ignoring their old copper.
The problem all boils down to how should a competition-stifling monopoly like a telco be handled. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| Re: That Sucks! said by Supervisor :Why assume that regulation is what drives companies like Verizon to not expand DSL deployment? Because it is exactly what happened. When DSL became available in Verizon service areas, coverage was rarely expanded beyond buildings that had a direct copper line going to the central office. Verizon did not expand DSL service to remote areas because they did not want to have to share that infrastructure with the competition.
Of course, many cable companies swept in and started providing the services that Verizon would not. As Verizon lost more business to cable, they reacted by deploying FIOS.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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| | | TurtleFan
join:2003-05-03
Wyckoff, NJ
| This might explain why our phone line down the Jersey shore always gets super staticy for a few days and then just drops completely.
I understand why Verizon wants to do the most populated areas first.... but there's got to be a more even way to deploy it to all areas than what they are currently doing...Any chance of wireless FIOS speeds?
We're getting cable next time the phones go out and hope it's better , or will just cancel the phones altogether.. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| Re: That Sucks! said by TurtleFan :This might explain why our phone line down the Jersey shore always gets super staticy for a few days and then just drops completely. But why keep it then? Is that level of service acceptable? If it was me paying the bill for that line, I would have dropped it after Verizon's failure to fix the problem after the first service call. Even if there is no cell service in that area, I just don't see any point in paying for a service which I cannot use.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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n1zuk
Didn't lose this week
Premium
join:2001-10-24
South Burlington, VT | Uh-huh Folks here in Vermont believe that. Verizon can't get rid of us, and our copper, fast enough for them... | |
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Maxo
Your tax dollars at work.
Premium,VIP
join:2002-11-04
Tallahassee, FL
clubs: | Numbers Any numbers to back up anyones claims? Something about uptime or consumer complaints should provide a real graph of who's telling the truth and who's just trying to make themselves look good. | |
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pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD
| Re: Numbers said by Maxo :Any numbers to back up anyones claims? Exactly... if Verizon landlines stopped working due to neglect, it would literally front page news.
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Only SHATNER is Kirk. | |
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alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
|  Verizon is a Business!
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| TheGhost
Premium
join:2003-01-03
Lake Forest, IL
clubs:
| Re: Verizon is a Business! What you stated is correct, but Verizon may not be investing to keep the copper plant running much past when they plan on dumping it (sell off, whatever).
The issue some people, myself include, have with the ILECs is that the initial infrastructure was built under a cost+ model, they had no risk. They were they able to use this risk free infrastructure to bankroll all these new technologies. Now they are dumping and unwilling to share the new infrastructure, which again, was built off of a monopoly cost+ model. | |
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| | soothsayer15
join:2002-03-01
Irving, TX
 ·Verizon FIOS
 ·Verizon Online DSL
| Re: Verizon is a Business! What else would you expect the CWA to say? With FIOS, fewer technicians are needed to support the network. That threatens their jobs and their membership. A Telco can not simply just ignore their network. Their fines would cost more than the "savings" they get by neglecting copper. There are always two sides to every story and half truths being told by both sides. People just like to believe what coincides with their point of view.
People's opinion are being reported as "news". Welcome to journalism in America today. | |
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nc bell man
@ctc.net | Re: Verizon is a Business! they are hiring cwa techs by the 100's to deploy fios | |
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Ryno
The Wanderer
Premium
join:2001-04-07
Danielsville, PA
·Verizon Online DSL
·RCN CABLE
| said by TheGhost :What you stated is correct, but Verizon may not be investing to keep the copper plant running much past when they plan on dumping it (sell off, whatever). The issue some people, myself include, have with the ILECs is that the initial infrastructure was built under a cost+ model, they had no risk. They were they able to use this risk free infrastructure to bankroll all these new technologies. Now they are dumping and unwilling to share the new infrastructure, which again, was built off of a monopoly cost+ model. Yeh, they should have to share their infrastucture like the cable companies do...umm...well ok so they just rape the customer and don't share, nothing wrong with that is there.
I've got two cable companies and Verizon in my area. Verizon gives me a rock solid connection 24/7 for 2 1/2 years and the whole time cable still can't get me connected. Oh wait. I can get one way, but then again 99% of you have no clue how horrible that is. You get to pay a lot MORE money for a connection that is about 2% better than dial up.
As for the union vs Verizon. They are both lying. I'm sure the union does not speak for everyone, and I'm sure Verizon is concentrating on FIOS more, they'd be idiots if they didn't, it's the future. | |
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| | alchav
join:2002-05-17
Palm Desert, CA
| said by TheGhost :What you stated is correct, but Verizon may not be investing to keep the copper plant running much past when they plan on dumping it (sell off, whatever). The issue some people, myself include, have with the ILECs is that the initial infrastructure was built under a cost+ model, they had no risk. They were they able to use this risk free infrastructure to bankroll all these new technologies. Now they are dumping and unwilling to share the new infrastructure, which again, was built off of a monopoly cost+ model. I don't know where you get your information Ghost, but like the Fiber Infrastructure, Verizon laid and paid for the Copper Plant. This all goes back to the Central Offices, so where is all the sharing to take place? Also, every Infrastructure or Plant has their own risks. Verizon improved on the Copper Plant as much as it could before moving to Fiber, and it cost and there was always risk.
If Cities and Communities want their own Fiber, they simply pay for it, then they can do what they want. The truth is nobody wants to pay, so people keep waiting for that Free Lunch! | |
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joshuad156
join:2003-06-10
Englewood, OH
| Just more unfounded statements My telco is Verizon, and I live in a plat where copper was deployed 30 years ago. Capacity is maxed out in my neighborhood and if a line goes bad or you want a second line Verizon will split your line digitally as there are no available lines in the area. When we asked why not they basically told us that since our neighborhood was so old, they wouldn't update or upgrade our area at all. No new lines for older houses. What a crock.
Also, there are DSL boxes within reach of my house, but because of line quality and digital splitting, I was unable to get DSL at my actual location. Needless to say I have since dropped my landline all together and do not do business with Verizon anymore. | |
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POTSville
@myvzw.com
|  Re: Just more unfounded statements
No cable here either -- and fiber to my home? Ha -- like that's ever going to happen. All the money the Bush administration has forked over to Verizon to provide universal broadband in rural areas has migrated off to northern Virginia.
Thank goodness for alltel and mobile broadband. Now I'm looking forward to dumping Verizon, too. | |
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insomniac84
join:2002-01-03
Schererville, IN | It needs to be said. I guess I will be the first one to say this, screw the unions. | |
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See 8 replies to this post |
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N3OGH
It's Biden Vs. the Biscuit. Sarah's hot
Premium
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs
·Verizon Online DSL
| Here's the real story.... »www.wdbj7.com/Global/story.asp?S=6588688
CWA's gonna be headed into contract negotiations with Verizon soon. This is a good way to get the membership pumped up, and let the their employer know that they're "there".
I'm not saying Verizon ISN'T neglecting it's copper plant in VA, I'm not there, and I don't know anyone who is.
I do know that our union pulls the same stunts when we're coming up for contract negotiations. It gets people pumped up for negotiations, and gives the employer pause....
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O&A Replays back on XM Monday! Found promo code to get free activation and 3 free months. PM me if interested! | |
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Cabal
Premium
join:2007-01-21
Boston, MA
| Re: Here's the real story.... None of that seems to have much to do with the quality of work that the people do or how to fairly compensate them for it. Oh right, we're talking about unions...
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Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru? | |
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inteller
Sociopaths always win.
join:2003-12-08
Tulsa, OK | These are not the driods you are looking for. ....and the copper here is not deteriorating. | |
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snod_ix
join:2007-06-12
Gate City, VA | so thats why the sold a million lines to fairpoint:) so thats why they sold a million lines to fair point. | |
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dispatcher21
join:2004-01-22
Walla Walla, WA | Re: Wireless too I have verizon wireless and have no complaints. No billing issues and the coeverage around here rocks. | |
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ColorBASIC
8-bit Fun
Premium
join:2006-12-29
Corona, CA | They're all filthy liars I don't believe either of them. | |
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partysource
join:2000-11-25
Phoenix, AZ
edit:
June 12th, @05:16PM
| Get rid of all copper! Lets just deploy FIOS! Copper is way outdated and is the past! | |
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batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ
clubs:
·Verizon Online DSL
| Let those with eyes see. quote:
Mitchell acknowledged that Verizon does face challenges as it rolls out its FiOS network while continuing to maintain existing copper infrastructure in areas that will not be seeing fiber deployments anytime soon—if ever. "It's a challenge to balance the copper and fiber network investments," said Mitchell.
That means there is no money for copper. | |
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iamcool2
join:2006-05-12
Carmel, IN
·Insight Communicat..
| ... I would believe the union more than the Verizon spokesperson.
I live in a very populated area and still cant get DSL from verizon. Even though i can get a 20mbps cable connection. And At&t territory across the street has u-verse - Ya its messed up | |
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nixen
Rockin' the Boxen
Premium
join:2002-10-04
Alexandria, VA
·Cox HSI
| Much as it Pains Me To believe the union guys, I've seen how Verizon copper service has degraded, lately. Lines that formerly supported 6.0/768 barely manage to support half that, now. 
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Everyday, thousands of new cars are delivered to their new owners with poorly-selected radio station presets. | |
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madrhino
join:2004-07-03 | Pot and kettle- both "brown" from what they are full of Verizon is an irresponsible lying scum company.I know this for a fact.
CWA is a lying scum union.I know this for a fact.
Nothing either one says should be trusted.
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Get Verizon FIOS,The Anti-DIOS | |
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xdeadhead
220, 221, Whatever It Takes.
Premium
join:2000-11-08
Pangea | Re: Pot and kettle- both "brown" from what they are full of do we work at the same garage?
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I am not herbert. | |
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ltjordan
join:2001-12-02
Hyattsville, MD
| Re: Neglecting phone lines. Everybody knows that the phone company is a dinosaur and that they're losing customers every year to competition from cellphones (their own included) and voip so it's only natural that they're going to put more time, money and effort into the areas that are going to make them money in the long run, i.e. Fios, dsl and wireless. As long as you have a dialtone and you can make and receive calls, they're under no obligations to improve the network. | |
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Verizon: We're Not Neglecting Copper
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