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Verizon Won't Extend Contracts After Plan Changes
On heels of Sprint suit, Verizon suddenly sees the light...

For some time, both Sprint and Verizon Wireless have forced customers to extend their contract for another year or two if they make changes to their plan -- for instance, shift to a different minute package. Sprint was just sued for the practice by the Minnesota AG, who says Sprint tricked users and extended their contracts for such things as adding or subtracting minutes or replacing phones.

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Either because their attorneys smelled a threat or because the telco is just really nice like that, Verizon today announced that they'd no longer engage in similar practices, and won't extend customer contracts if they make plan changes.

There's no mention of the Sprint suit in the press release, of course, but the company does take a moment to pat itself on the back:
quote:
"Verizon Wireless once again demonstrates that our number one priority is delivering the most customer-friendly wireless experience in the U.S. marketplace. Our commitment to our customers is why we lead the industry in customer loyalty and why more customers use the Verizon Wireless brand than any other," said Jack Plating, executive vice president and chief operating officer of Verizon Wireless.
According to the company, the new policy takes effect on October 7.
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timcuth
Braves Fan
Premium Member
join:2000-09-18
Pelham, AL

timcuth

Premium Member

I wonder

... if at&t will follow suit?

Tim

Robert
Premium Member
join:2001-08-25
Miami, FL

Robert

Premium Member

Re: I wonder

said by timcuth:

... if at&t will follow suit?

Tim
And lose all those locked in iphone customers?! I think not.

pnh102
Reptiles Are Cuddly And Pretty
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mount Airy, MD

pnh102

Premium Member

Re: I wonder

said by Robert:

And lose all those locked in iphone customers?! I think not.
Some will just one meeeeeeeeeeelion dollars.

Coma
Thanks Steve
Premium Member
join:2001-12-30
NirvanaLand

Coma to timcuth

Premium Member

to timcuth

If they do, I want some money back !


oKubricko
join:2001-08-06
Miamisburg, OH

oKubricko

Member

Re: I wonder

agreed!
GeekBigboy
join:2007-07-21
Moreno Valley, CA

GeekBigboy to Coma

Member

to Coma
I wouldn't count on it its the new ATT unless they sell it soon.

Jim Gurd
Premium Member
join:2000-07-08
Livonia, MI

1 recommendation

Jim Gurd to timcuth

Premium Member

to timcuth
I don't believe at&t extends contracts for changing rate plans. They will if you get a new (subsidized) phone but that's to be expected.
speedy998
join:2002-09-25
Saratoga, CA

speedy998

Member

Re: I wonder

said by Jim Gurd:

I don't believe at&t extends contracts for changing rate plans. They will if you get a new (subsidized) phone but that's to be expected.
They do. I have a second mobile line right now that will cost me $200 to cancel - so I just pay the $9.95/month, someday I might need it again.

Jim Gurd
Premium Member
join:2000-07-08
Livonia, MI

Jim Gurd

Premium Member

Re: I wonder

Did you add a new line? If so that's why. I'm talking about simply increasing or decreasing your monthly minutes.

hhawkman
Premium Member
join:2001-02-08
Port Hueneme, CA

hhawkman

Premium Member

Re: I wonder

said by Jim Gurd:

Did you add a new line? If so that's why. I'm talking about simply increasing or decreasing your monthly minutes.
So why should adding a new line increase the contract on existing lines and phones? This happened to me when I was with AT&T. We got a new phone and line for our stepdaughter. Separate billing. Separate account. The current plan they were offering was a little better minute-wise than our existing plan (not by much, and same price), so we changed to the new plan (no mention of any contract extensions). A year later when our contract was supposed to end and we tried the cancel the 2 old lines, we were told we had another year on our contract, and would have to pay a "termination fee". We took it all the way to the FTC, and didn't have to pay. Then we kissed AT&T and their crappy 2 year old phones goodbye.

cyrus369
join:2002-09-16
usa

cyrus369

Member

Re: I wonder

said by hhawkman:

said by Jim Gurd:

Did you add a new line? If so that's why. I'm talking about simply increasing or decreasing your monthly minutes.
So why should adding a new line increase the contract on existing lines and phones? This happened to me when I was with AT&T. We got a new phone and line for our stepdaughter. Separate billing. Separate account. The current plan they were offering was a little better minute-wise than our existing plan (not by much, and same price), so we changed to the new plan (no mention of any contract extensions). A year later when our contract was supposed to end and we tried the cancel the 2 old lines, we were told we had another year on our contract, and would have to pay a "termination fee". We took it all the way to the FTC, and didn't have to pay. Then we kissed AT&T and their crappy 2 year old phones goodbye.
Sounds fishy to me, did you do this over the phone, in a at&t corporate store or through a mall store? Each line has its own separate contract, when you add a line or extend a contract on one line it does NOT change contracts on any other line. And when you change your plan it does not extend your contract, I do it all day long and have yet to see it change a contract date...

visio
join:2001-08-29
Austin, TX

visio

Member

Re: I wonder

said by cyrus369:

said by hhawkman:

said by Jim Gurd:

Did you add a new line? If so that's why. I'm talking about simply increasing or decreasing your monthly minutes.
So why should adding a new line increase the contract on existing lines and phones? This happened to me when I was with AT&T. We got a new phone and line for our stepdaughter. Separate billing. Separate account. The current plan they were offering was a little better minute-wise than our existing plan (not by much, and same price), so we changed to the new plan (no mention of any contract extensions). A year later when our contract was supposed to end and we tried the cancel the 2 old lines, we were told we had another year on our contract, and would have to pay a "termination fee". We took it all the way to the FTC, and didn't have to pay. Then we kissed AT&T and their crappy 2 year old phones goodbye.
Sounds fishy to me, did you do this over the phone, in a at&t corporate store or through a mall store? Each line has its own separate contract, when you add a line or extend a contract on one line it does NOT change contracts on any other line. And when you change your plan it does not extend your contract, I do it all day long and have yet to see it change a contract date...
He says it right there.
When I used to work in the wireless industry it was common practice to extend contracts to 2 years from the date of change. You may not do that now at your current place, but this problem he had was years ago.

atmw
@att.net

atmw to Jim Gurd

Anon

to Jim Gurd
You just get screwed out of any extra rollover minutes you have not used but paid for if you change a minute plan or opt for the unity plan as they consider that a plan change.

hoyter
join:2004-01-21
Franklin, TN

hoyter to timcuth

Member

to timcuth
At&t / Cingy has had this policy for several years. I cannot remember a time when I could not change a plan with no extension. Hell, their website will allow you to change plans (prorated for time used) and features on the fly...

I am glad to be an cingular customer for several years. It is also nice to have full access to the phone and features that Verizon is just now allowing. But I am a geek who wants to exploit any gadget/device to its potential. I am glad cingular/att has ALWAYS let me do that.

not
@comcast.net

not

Anon

One down, one to go.

Now they just have to stop crippling the phones and they really would be #1.... well, that and bring down the pices by about 10-20 bucks. That would be a really good move on their part. They think they would be loosing money, but I bet they wouldn't because of all the new line additions for people wanting to join. One can dream I guess.
BuzzDar
join:2006-01-28
West Frankfort, IL

BuzzDar

Member

I was ripped off

I know about 4 months ago or so i was made to extend my contract for another year just to change my plan i feel that i have now have been ripped off just like everyother verizon wireless customer that had to do the same thing.

krenim191
join:2001-01-23
Santee, CA

1 edit

krenim191

Member

Re: I was ripped off

yeah - me too. I tried like hell to avoid renewing my contract just because I was changing my calling plan. I was out of contract and they would NOT budge. I tried 5 or 6 times being as polite as I could. My argument was I'm not purchasing any new equipment... so they weren't subsidizing any new equipment, I've been a loyal customer for years... why did they feel they needed to lock me in once again. I was simply changing my plan. Also, as soon as my contract was over - I started getting calls asking if I wanted to renew it. No incentive... just a renewal. It was crazy! This just burns my ass. It's not like I'm planning on switching so the contract isn't so bad... but I really hate contracts of any kind. If i want to ditch one provider today and go with another tomorrow... I want that ability w/o paying a fee to cancel.

It is good to see them doing this though. I do feel they offer the best service.

h8verizonDSL
Had fiber today
join:2005-02-25
Middletown, DE

h8verizonDSL

Member

Free 100 Minutes

I was wondering why VZW was offering me an extra 100 Anytime Minutes per month for 12 months if I signed a new agreement. Then I read this news item. Pondering...
xenophon
join:2007-09-17

xenophon

Member

Good start

Glad to see a carrier step up and do this. All other carriers will have no choice but to follow suit.

FFH5
Premium Member
join:2002-03-03
Tavistock NJ

FFH5

Premium Member

Re: Good start

said by xenophon:

Glad to see a carrier step up and do this. All other carriers will have no choice but to follow suit.
Of course, this only applies to modifying plans. If you upgrade to get a new improved subsidized cellphone, you will get a new or extended contract.
mlundin
join:2001-03-27
Lawrence, KS

mlundin

Member

Re: Good start

said by FFH5:

If you upgrade to get a new improved subsidized cellphone, you will get a new or extended contract.
I suppose you're never going to get something for nothing, but why does it always feel like making a deal with the devil when signing with these companies?

N3OGH
Yo Soy Col. "Bat" Guano
Premium Member
join:2003-11-11
Philly burbs

N3OGH

Premium Member

The kindness of their heart?

"Verizon Wireless once again demonstrates that our number one priority is delivering the most customer-friendly wireless experience in the U.S. marketplace." Is avoiding lawsuits and bad press before it comes.

Large telcos don't make altruistic moves out of the kindness of their hearts. Everything is a business decision.

I'm a satisfied Verizon wireless and DSL customer, BTW.

But I'll still trash corporate suits any chance I get
Rick5
Premium Member
join:2001-02-06

Rick5

Premium Member

Not sure I agree

While I guess it's nice of Verizon to do this, I think i'm more on the side of Sprint on this issue.

If a person negotiates a contract the terms of it should be adhered to on both sides. And, in these types of contracts the number of minutes and price per minute is a key point of those agreements. Usually, the plans call for more favorable rates the more minutes you buy and less favorable rates the less minutes you buy.

I think that further demonstrates the importance of this within these contracts and points to the reasons people subscribe to a particular plan, and the reasons why the telco's offer those plans for a given price.

Along now comes the Minnesota AG and apparently some customers who want to turn contract law into a one sided thing for the benefit of only one party by saying now it's ok for a customer to come along and change what might be the most significant part of that agreement at any time and to suffer no consequences for it.
Verizon, sprint and others on the other hand, now would have to accept a lower price per minute possibly than they otherwise would, and keep that in effect until the end of the original agreement.

This to me would seem similar to a landlord who rents out space to a tenant for a 3 year lease, the tenant decides 6 mos. later his business isn't doing very well..decides he wants half the space instead..and the landlord is then forced to simply accept that for the remainder of the lease.

Simply put, that pretty much vacates the whole reason for ever having negotiated this in the first place..and offers the landlord no protection except that the person will be there in SOME form or the other.

Sprint..should have fought this on a contract law basis.
And Verizon was wrong to cave in without a fight.

Fair..after all..is fair. And there's more potential damage in setting these kinds of strange precedents.
Dissonance
join:2007-03-26
Floral Park, NY

Dissonance

Member

Re: Not sure I agree

The problem is they just do it without telling you.
I upgraded from $30 plan to a $50 plan not thinking anything of it. I didn't find out until 6 months later that not only was my contract extended, but my ETF went up from $150 to $200.

Contracts are worth something- like a discount on a phone. It was wrong of them to sneak that in there just because I get a more expensive plan.
Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Ahrenl to Rick5

Member

to Rick5
Your analogy stinks. (as most do)

To make it correct, the tennant would only be using half the space, and the landlord would have the ability to dynamically lease the unused space unless the tenant wanted to use it. There would also be minimums on how little space the tenant could pay for, even if they aren't using it.

While I think it should be up to Sprint if they want to let you pay for less minutes, it's certainly in their best interest to let you ammend the contract to pay for more.

Of course the whole point of the contract is to cover the phone subsidy. Since every contract size gets the same subsidy (by length) then, you can argue, Sprint loses nothing, since the contract size doesn't effect the benefit the customer receives.
moonpuppy (banned)
join:2000-08-21
Glen Burnie, MD

moonpuppy (banned) to Rick5

Member

to Rick5
Bad analogy.

You buy the phone for the same price no matter what price plan you get. From the most expensive all inclusive plans down to the lowest per month plans, the phone still costs the same. The ONLY difference in price is with 1 or 2 year contracts.

So if the plan changes, the phone would have still cost the same and the cell phone companies still get a monthly payment. Notice, they did this whether you degraded or upgraded your plan. Under your reasoning, they should get a bigger discount for people upgrading their plans since the cell phone companies would get more money per month.

Thank you, drive through.
boober321
join:2003-07-15
Milwaukee, WI

1 edit

boober321 to Rick5

Member

to Rick5
You're an idiot. As previously stated, it's a crappy analogy. And how about the fact that they are extending plans without telling people? You "free market fixes everything" people are about as retarded as they get.
fiberguy2
My views are my own.
Premium Member
join:2005-05-20

1 edit

fiberguy2 to Rick5

Premium Member

to Rick5
said by Rick5:

If a person negotiates a contract the terms of it should be adhered to on both sides. And, in these types of contracts the number of minutes and price per minute is a key point of those agreements.
There is your problem. This happened to me with Sprint/Nextel, and they wanted to up my contract.. they only told me this AS WE WERE ENDING THE CALL.

Please, tell me, when was anything negotiated?

In fairness, you are correct. When two sides negotiate. This is not a negotiation, rather, this is a policy. Policy and a negotiated contract are two different things.

They got caught with their hands in the cookie jar and now they are getting slapped.

On the other hand, the telephone industry has been regulated for years. This is a good reason to regulate them again. You should NEVER be forced to extend a contract to add minutes or change a plan. (Unless you want to change to a non-qualifying plan that was already agreed to)

Extortion comes to mind in this case. It would be something like this:

customer: "I would like to increase my minutes per month from 400 to 800 because I'm going to use more"..

them: "ok, but I see you have 4 months left, you must re-up a 2 year agreement to do so"..

customer: "I don't want a new contract"

them: "then pay the .40 cents overage.

me: "would you like the $200 ETF now on my credit card? or you just going to bill me. Because your ETF doesn't scare me. You can have the ETF but you will lose the monthly billing.. I'm going to a company that doesn't try extortion.

The ETF fee NEVER scares me. I could have paid the extra up front or on the back side, should I need it. It's a gamble and one that I'm willing to take. Sadly more people don't exercise the ETF and pay it.

On another note. I purchased my own phone on a previous contract.. it expired. (It was on a plan with a business partner and the contract was fulfilled) I took that same phone, to the same carrier, opened up a new line of service, and Nextel told me I had to agree to a 2 year contract with them simply to activate the service.. WTF?! They gave me no phone, they gave me NO promotion, but to simply sign up with them, it was a 24 month commit?

The law suit was LONG over due. These companies can't simply compete and sell their service.. they have to rope their customers in.. it's the only way.

Today, people still bag on Cable TV all the time, but be thankful that they don't require contracts on their service. Even landlines are making it a requirement when you take any promotion these days. SIMPLY WRONG! Contracts are a sign of a poor product.

rosco35
Premium Member
join:2003-11-10
USA

rosco35 to Rick5

Premium Member

to Rick5
No, while the customer would be paying less per minute if increasing their plan, they would also be paying more money every month. so vz then makes more money.

burgerwars
join:2004-09-11
Northridge, CA

burgerwars

Member

Sprint

Sprint extended my plan for another two years after I ported a number to replace my current cellphone number. I only found out about it when I cancelled their service and ported the number elsewhere. Sprint added a $150 early cancellation penalty to my final phone bill. Only after arguing with them on the phone, did they reverse the charge.

Cellphone companies do anything to try to extend your plan.

Ben
Premium Member
join:2007-06-17
Fort Worth, TX

Ben

Premium Member

Re: Sprint

said by burgerwars:

Cellphone companies do anything to try to extend your plan.
This is why we need to get rid of contracts (go mo-to-mo), and segregate the phones from the carriers (use any number of phones with a particular carrier).

Also...answer to phone subsidies: Short term loans. After all the cost to make back the subsidies have to be built into the monthly fees anyway. It would also provide additional flexibility of allowing a full subsidy at a higher monthly loan payment, or no subsidy at all and not needing to pay on a loan.

Unfortunately, this will be difficult given the current implementation of CDMA used by Verizon and Sprint (no RUIM cards, all phones are locked). However, I did hear that Verizon will be going GSM eventually leaving Sprint out in the cold.

pog4
Premium Member
join:2004-06-03
Kihei, HI

pog4

Premium Member

Re: Sprint

Here, a rep at Hawaiian Telcom told me I could go month to month no problem, even as new service... I would just miss out on the free/discounted phone. However, there is (was?) also a pay-as-you go plan with a phone for $30 plus 300 minutes @ 10 cents which are good for 60 days.

IOW, I could test the service out for $60, then use that phone and go with a month-to-month plan... no contract.

Seems attractive since the network is actually leased from both Sprint AND Verizon... I was told that I'd get service from whatever network was strongest.

brian
Premium Member
join:2002-05-02
Mission Viejo, CA

1 edit

brian

Premium Member

I thought they (Verizon) were already doing this

A few years ago, before we were married, my wife and I each had our own separate Verizon Wireless plans. Each of us were less than a year into our two year contracts, with hers ending a few months before mine.

We were looking to save a little money and consolidate some bills, so we called up VZW. We had them change our two separate plans into a family share plan with my wife's line as the master account, and mine as one of the additional lines.

VZW did not charge us a fee to do this. Nor did they extend my wife's contract. In fact, my contract effectively was shortened by about two months, and our total bill reduced by about $10/month. This was in summer of 2005.

Last year, we added my mother-in-law to our account as an additional line. No charges outside of the standard activation. And again, no contract extension.

justaguy
@lmco.com

justaguy

Anon

Re: I thought they (Verizon) were already doing this

My wife and I did the same. However they DID up the contract. I would be curious to see what would happen if you called Verizon and asked to terminate early.

My real horror story came from DirecTV. When I signed up with the service, I explicitly asked them if I could cancel at any time, without any ETF. They said yes. I repeated this several times, in several different formats. At one point I asked "If I call you up in 4 months, cancel the service and return the equipment, and I pay for those four months (200$ total), would that satisfy all of my obligations?" The response, yes, you wouldn't owe anything.

Well, lets fast forward 8 months. Guess what they tried to stick me with. A $15/month early termination fee. They said that it was only $15/3 months so they were cutting me a deal from the normal $175 ETF. I would have none of that.

That was probably the only situation where I ever had a customer service agent yelling at me over the phone that I signed a contract and returned it. The funny thing was, they never sent me a contract to sign. I never ended up paying the fee, but damn if it didn't sour me from any company that requires a contract.

I'm even contemplating terminating with Verizon this Spring. Their service was fine (except for the fact that gouge for services that should be free). It is the contract that simply annoys me. I prefer to be free, not indentured under contracts to every company I ever want to do business with.

DaveDude
No Fear
join:1999-09-01
New Jersey

DaveDude

Member

Verizon is more attractive now

Verizon doesnt realize this makes it more attractive, and the blurring differences between Verizon and ATT are getting more numerous. I can consider Verizon now.

MrMaster
Rum Connoisseur
Premium Member
join:2000-12-16
St Thomas, VI

MrMaster

Premium Member

i just want out of my contract!

I had to sign a new 1 year contract back in march when my family plan ended and all i wanted to do was drop the phone (not in contract) from my plan.

This will still save me money as I can lower my plan now without extending the contract even further. backdating sure would have been nice.

funchords
Hello
MVM
join:2001-03-11
Yarmouth Port, MA

funchords

MVM

No Biggie - Verizon Didn't Extend them Anyway, unless...

No Biggie - Verizon Didn't Extend them Anyway, unless the plan you were switching to was "promotional."

I've switched plans a number of times and I've never been extended.

MrMaster
Rum Connoisseur
Premium Member
join:2000-12-16
St Thomas, VI

MrMaster

Premium Member

Re: No Biggie - Verizon Didn't Extend them Anyway, unless...

like which plans? they're all promotional...and text and data plans are not part of contracts (except the new tiers)

n2jtx
join:2001-01-13
Glen Head, NY

n2jtx

Member

T-Mobile

No mention was made that T-Mobile has not been doing this for a long time.

Welcome to the party Verizon...

•••

FListoohot
@sct.com

FListoohot

Anon

That's funny

One of the ironically funny things here is that when I got my phones from Verizon earlier this year, one of the things that impressed me was when the rep said that I can change my plan at any time and I *won't* be forced to start a new contract at that point.

So this is new???
b10010011
Whats a Posting tag?
join:2004-09-07
united state

b10010011

Member

But what if you want to keep the same plan?

I have found just the opposite to be true...

I just bought a new phone and found out that I can not keep my same plan, but have to get a more expensive one to have the same options as I currently have.

I would certainly extend this plan another two years but noooooooo Verizon will not do that.

jgkolt
Premium Member
join:2004-02-21
Avon, OH

jgkolt

Premium Member

verizon

and i just changed plans a few days ago to less minutes on verizon. at least on tmobile they have been doing this for a long time now.
steveymacjr
join:2001-01-25
Matthews, NC

steveymacjr

Member

Alltel

Eh, maybe they are just responding to competition from Alltel, seeing as they already have it where you can change your plan at any time!

ANyway, i'll stick with my Sprint SERO plan!

ATMW
@att.net

ATMW

Anon

Re: iPhone & ATT

How about us iPhone buyers. Pay full retail and no plan discount and have to sign up for 2 years. I will say one nice thing. I was able to port over the # from my daughters plan that still had 8-9 months to go, with no early term fee just had to sign up for 2 more years on that #.

If you are an ATT customer and also have ATT as a home # you can go to a Unity plan and be able to call anyone on ATT with no minute usage charges,

Hook.... You may loose any accumulated rollover minutes as ATT threats this as a "plan" change and they screw you out of your accumulated minutes so only switch at the end of the month/billing cycle.

Rob A
Adjusting
Premium Member
join:2005-01-17
Pompton Plains, NJ

Rob A

Premium Member

Good move

VZW being more competative.

tc1uscg
join:2005-03-09
Gulfport, MS

tc1uscg

Member

...But we still contineu to nickle dime you to death...

How big of'em. Now, if they would just lower the cost of their plans and stop locking down their phones, they might have something to brag about.