Verizon Won't 'Slavishly Satisfy' You With 100 Mbps FiOSStill believes anything over 50 Mbps is marketing fluff 12:50PM Friday Sep 25 2009 by Karl Bodetags: competition · business · bandwidth · cable · Comcast · Verizon FIOS · CablevisionBack in April we reported how Cablevision was launching 101Mbps+ connection at a $99 price point (albeit with a whopping $300 activation fee), a first for the industry. Given the product is the marketing equivalent of a drop kick aimed squarely at Verizon's face, it wasn't surprising to see Verizon quickly downplay the offering, calling it little more than a "parlor trick." For now, Verizon believes their top offering of 50 Mbps down and 20 Mbps up is more than enough bandwidth for the average user. They're right. Still, hardcore users never have enough speed. Verizon has been testing 100Mbps connectivity in employee homes for some time ( see video), something made a little easier due to their $23 billion+ investment in GPON fiber to the home. However, Verizon has repeatedly claimed the 100Mbps mark is more about marketing than demand until more bandwidth-intensive applications emerge. Verizon's vice president of FiOS TV content strategy Terry Denson had this to say back in 2007: Are customers asking for 100 meg? No. Very few. But it raises the ante on the competitive landscape, so that customers believe that 100 Mb/s is what they need to have. . . A hundred meg ends up being a threshold because it's sexy. I don't think customer behavior is going to get there for several years. Some outliers will demand that and maybe more. But what really drives it isn't so much consumer demand. It's competitive marketing tactics. Jump two years forward and Verizon's position really hasn't changed about the value of offering 100 Mbps. In conversations with the Fiber To The Home Council, Verizon CTO and Senior Vice President Dick Lynch this week discussed the potential of Verizon's GPON network, proclaiming that advanced PON architectures of 10 Gbps down and 2.5 Gbps upstream might enable a multi-gigabit feed to each and every customer. But for now, Lynch is holding tight to Verizon's position that 100 Mbps would just be too damn "slavishly satisfying:" For starters, you’re absolutely right that the speeds we decide to offer reflect market analysis, not broadband capacities. Power users will always want all you can give them, but slavishly satisfying them skews the service and the market unrealistically. We could go to 75 or 100 Mbps and beyond tomorrow, but the larger market doesn’t require that capacity at the moment. We’re watching and planning, though. And we’re ready. In other words, don't expect 100 Mbps anytime soon. Verizon's content to let Cablevision hold the marketing speed crown with the understanding that for now, Cablevision's nabbing only a small number of very speed-obsessed customers. Meanwhile, many other Verizon competitors aren't rushing to 100 Mbps either. While Comcast just launched 100 Mbps service in the Twin Cities, it's intended solely for business users and costs $370 a month. Time Warner Cable only just launched 50 Mbps service in one market. Verizon has no reason to hurry.
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- Pittsburgh, Verizon Haggling Over FiOS
- Comcast DOCSIS 3.0 Hits Denver
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baineschile
2600
Premium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Just do it Just launch a 100mb service. If its about marketing, and you have the network to do it; market it! | |
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Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL
| Re: Just do it I hate to say it, but I agree with the telco here. I have a hard time maxing out my 8/1 connection. In fact, the only time I have sustained peak speeds for more than a few seconds is when I was getting a linux distro off bittorrent. Yes I would like a faster connection, but 100mbps? Unless I tried downloading from all three pc's, the Wii and the PS3, I doubt I could even saturate a 50mbps connection. Until the connections that are sending packets to you can sustain 100mbps to multiple users, I just dont see a real need for it.
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Im Your Boogeyman, Thats What I Am | |
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Vamp
5c077
Premium
join:2003-01-28
MD
 ·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Just do it said by Boogeyman  :I hate to say it, but I agree with the telco here. I have a hard time maxing out my 8/1 connection. In fact, the only time I have sustained peak speeds for more than a few seconds is when I was getting a linux distro off bittorrent. Yes I would like a faster connection, but 100mbps? Unless I tried downloading from all three pc's, the Wii and the PS3, I doubt I could even saturate a 50mbps connection. Until the connections that are sending packets to you can sustain 100mbps to multiple users, I just dont see a real need for it. Hmm I can max my 25mbit from many servers, infact today I have downloaded a 120mb Nvidia driver and a 1GB+ game demo and each went close to my 25megabit (3+ MB/s).. A lot of servers give high speeds for me.
Could it just be that your provider cant properly provide your 8/1?
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20/20 FIOS || MSN Msgr: scott001^gmail_com | |
| | | | ShadezeRO
join:2006-04-24
Fort Lauderdale, FL | Re: Just do it I max my uVerse 18 every day.
I'm ready for more! | |
| | jimbo2150
join:2004-05-10
Youngstown, OH | I'd be happy with a 5/5. I think it's fully realistic to for most companies to provide that at least out to the suburbs (maybe not rural areas).
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- "Techie" Jim | |
| | 
Torrents
@comcast.net
| I cant wait to see more than freaking 1mb upload speeds, just think of what it could do for torrents and file sharing! I hate trying to upload at 100kb/s and my internet running like crap... people who don't upload things obviously do not see the desire for faster internet speeds. | |
| nonymous
join:2003-09-08
Glendale, AZ | IIn what employees house? Sure testing in whose employee home. All the bigwigs and maybe a few other lucky people to make it appear like a real test. Probably more of a way for the CEO and his friends to get the best while the customers get scraps. | |
| Luminaris
join:2005-12-01
Winchester, VA
 ·HughesNet Satellit..
| Keeping pace How about faster speeds to keep pace with the rest of the world? Innovation? How about trying to outpace countries with much faster speeds? I guess that doesn't mean much to ISP's here in the U.S.
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De Do Do Do, De Da Da Da, that's all I want to say to you .. | |
| | WC813
join:2000-12-20
Wesley Chapel, FL | Re: Keeping pace Your points sound more like wants than needs.
Is keeping up with the Jones a reason to do it? | |
| | | Luminaris
join:2005-12-01
Winchester, VA
·HughesNet Satellit..
| Re: Keeping pace said by WC813 :Your points sound more like wants than needs. Is keeping up with the Jones a reason to do it? So what's the point of other countries having 2-3X the speed we have then? Is it a need? That's what I wonder. | |
| | | | WC813
join:2000-12-20
Wesley Chapel, FL
| Re: Keeping pace With the speeds VZ offers now I think it is more important to keep the quality of service up (low/no outages, no slowness during peak times on their network) than trying to provide higher speed rates. If you ever get a chance to switch to Fios you will see what I mean. It just works... | |
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Gbcue
E.I.T.
Premium
join:2001-09-30
Santa Rosa, CA
clubs: 
 ·T-Mobile US
 ·Skype
 ·Dreamhost
 ·Comcast
·AT&T U-Verse
| Re: Keeping pace said by tschmidt :said by Luminaris :So what's the point of other countries having 2-3X the speed we have then? Is it a need? That's what I wonder. Residential speed is a chicken N egg problem. Application and service providers are not going to develop applications that need very high speed until there is a large enough population of users to justify it. If we were all still constrained to dialup most of the applications and services we take for granted today would not be practical. Video libraries and video on demand is very demanding. HD feed requires about 15 Mbps. For a family of four the sweet spot is 100 Mbps. 3-D when it happens will need even more bandwidth. Telecommuting is popular but often limited by how quickly data flows between employee and office. New immersive games and virtual reality all require high capacity fast connections. Ultimately the upper bound is driven by human physiology and compression algorithms. /tom Is it really a Chicken/Egg problem?
Remember when everybody was going from dial-up to broadband? Was it done for fun? No, it was done because application providers were already thinking of the future.
The same needs to be done for broadband speed. When people get fed up of waiting for an HD stream to load over their 10Mbit connection, they'll soon jump, like how we all did to broadband.
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Eat Me
join:2002-09-25
Sussex, NJ
 ·PenTeleData
·Future Nine Corpor..
·VOIPo
·Vonage
| Re: Keeping pace said by Gbcue :said by tschmidt :said by Luminaris :So what's the point of other countries having 2-3X the speed we have then? Is it a need? That's what I wonder. Residential speed is a chicken N egg problem. Application and service providers are not going to develop applications that need very high speed until there is a large enough population of users to justify it. If we were all still constrained to dialup most of the applications and services we take for granted today would not be practical. Video libraries and video on demand is very demanding. HD feed requires about 15 Mbps. For a family of four the sweet spot is 100 Mbps. 3-D when it happens will need even more bandwidth. Telecommuting is popular but often limited by how quickly data flows between employee and office. New immersive games and virtual reality all require high capacity fast connections. Ultimately the upper bound is driven by human physiology and compression algorithms. /tom Is it really a Chicken/Egg problem? Remember when everybody was going from dial-up to broadband? Was it done for fun? No, it was done because application providers were already thinking of the future. The same needs to be done for broadband speed. When people get fed up of waiting for an HD stream to load over their 10Mbit connection, they'll soon jump, like how we all did to broadband. The first people I knew who got broadband (that neat new service from the phone company called a "digital subscriber line") got it to run FTP sites to trade pirated music files.
I honestly didn't begin to see applications that needed broadband until after 2002 or so. Maybe there were, but I didn't see them.
100Mbps isn't really needed for HD streaming video right now. In fact you can do that on a 10M connection with MPEG4 compression. | |
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scoopy03
join:2003-05-06
00000
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: Keeping pace said by Eat Me :100Mbps isn't really needed for HD streaming video right now. In fact you can do that on a 10M connection with MPEG4 compression. one hd tv stream will use all that up in one connection. and say your dad wants his news from a "newsgroup" and mom wants to watch her missed episode of her soap opera and the son wants to download the newest mmorpg or demos. the daughter may want to upload her hundreds of pictures to facebook/myspace or something like that. how frustrated with that family be with a 10M connection. | |
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Nuadormrac
@verizon.net
| There's also the effect this has on P2P networks. If an increased dl limit is accompanied by a subsequent increase in the upload limit, then those who have that higher limit could provide faster uploads through bit torrent and the like. So once more can provide it, that'll push the BT downloads a bit more. Until more can upload faster however, they won't be feeding it.
At least where p2p networks are involved, increasing BW on a residential lines can help the p2p d/l go faster (by providing faster uploads from other peers). | |
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battleop
join:2005-09-28
00000 | It's mostly a my d**k is bigger than yours. Nothing more. | |
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threegsus
No gods, no masters
Premium
join:2001-02-27
Tempe, AZ
| Re: Keeping pace Hey battleop,
said by battleop :...mostly a my d**k is bigger than yours... Of course in my case, mine is... 
Whaddaya want, Corvettes should be banned, too?
Regards
--
Best reason for living in the Now —
"In the long run, we'll all be dead." John Maynard Keynes | |
| | psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX
| said by Luminaris :How about faster speeds to keep pace with the rest of the world? Who gives a shit about the rest of the world? Just because some Korean WoW gold miner demands an 100Gbps optical connection shoved up his ass doesn't mean squat for Billy Bob in the backwoods of Virgina.
Innovation? Is bendable fiber NOT innovation?
How about trying to outpace countries with much faster speeds? See Korean WoW gold miner.
I guess that doesn't mean much to ISP's here in the U.S. Just as the US market means squat to the rest of the world. The Australian and UK markets don't capitulate to demands from the rest of the world telling them to go unmetered. Belgium doesn't give a rats ass that some Sweedish pirate has fiber to the home. Someone from South Africa doesn't care that his neighbor country just to the north doesn't have ANY broadband.
Every market is different. And we are not the typical broadband user. Just because people on dslreports.com are clamoring for the 100Gbps optical link shoved up our asses doesn't mean that the users in Bumblefuck, VA demand it, or even someone next door. | |
| | | Luminaris
join:2005-12-01
Winchester, VA | Re: Keeping pace Wow, just, WOW. Dude, you got issues | |
| | | | psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX
| Re: Keeping pace said by Luminaris :Wow, just, WOW. Dude, you got issues Only issue I got is people demanding ridiculous levels of bandwidth for absolutely no reason.
"People in Korea get 100Gbps shoved up their asses where ever they go, why doesn't AT&T do that for me in Bumblefuck, VA? They ain't being competitive!!"
Do we hear:
"People in Amsterdam get to smoke pot and screw hookers all day. Why doesn't America allow that? They ain't being competitive!!!!"
Every market is different. People need to quit thinking that something half way around the world has any bearing on what we do here in the States.
You don't need 100Mbps. Don't give me crap about video, VPNers, and games driving the need for more bandwidth. Piracy was the killer app for broadband expansion at the beginning of the decade, and piracy is the killer app that will drive broadband expansion into the next. For every bit of bandwidth you spend looking at videos, I bet you there are two or three BitTorrent client running full boar up and down.
Verizon has the ability to provide the mythical 100Gbps fiber run up your ass. Normal people don't need it, normal people don't want it. | |
| | | | | backness
join:2005-07-08
K2P OW2
| Re: Keeping pace said by psx_defector :said by Luminaris :Wow, just, WOW. Dude, you got issues Only issue I got is people demanding ridiculous levels of bandwidth for absolutely no reason. First, who do you think you are that you can tell someone what their reasons for wanting a fast connection are?
Second, the equiment costs are based on a global marketplace.
So if it is possible in Sweeden it is possible in Los Angles.
Please get off your soap box | |
| | | | | | psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX
| Re: Keeping pace said by backness :First, who do you think you are that you can tell someone what their reasons for wanting a fast connection are? Because that's what people do with their connections. Don't act like it's not.
Second, the equiment costs are based on a global marketplace. No, they are not. A good example. I'm buying a Draytek Vigor 2820Vn. I can get it for either $250US or £180GBP. It comes from the same factory in mainland China, but what's the difference in cost? Regulatory difference make for a lot of cost difference between countries. Not only in bandwidth costs, but CPE and core infrastructure.
So if it is possible in Sweeden it is possible in Los Angles. Never said it wasn't, but don't expect to get a 100Gbps fiber drop in Bumblefuck, VA. There is no way that it's cost effective. | |
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Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL
| I'm more concerned with his obsession with having glass fibers inserted rectally.
He has a point though. While piracy was a factor in the jump from 56k to broadband, it was a very small one. I remember waiting minutes for pages to load, especially if they had a lot of graphical content. For me, the ability to check the news and my email and all that in less than an hour was the big draw to broadband.
But now? The only time I have to wait, is when I am downloading large files. Streaming video works great, even on multiple pc's on the same connection. With even a 30mbps you can stream mutiple HD streams. Sure they are crap quality, but until more than just 20% (number was pulled from the same location where Korean WoW gold farmers put there fiber connections) of internet users can even get a connection greater than 10mbps, the content providers really have no incentive to offer it any faster or at a better quality.
--
Im Your Boogeyman, Thats What I Am | |
| | | | | | | psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX
| Re: Keeping pace said by Boogeyman :I'm more concerned with his obsession with having glass fibers inserted rectally. Well, you know those Asians and their freaky ways.
I guess the metaphor was lost on people.
While piracy was a factor in the jump from 56k to broadband, it was a very small one. One word for you, Napster.
The only reason why I went to high speed back in '98 was for warez. That 256/64 pipe kicked ass.
Right now, BitTorrent and it's derivative uses is the killer app driving bigger and bigger pipes. The ease of use drives more and more idiots to sucking down bandwidth. Back in the day, warez was more of an art and required a bit of knowledge, like knowing how to combine news group parts, compression schemes, and multipart archives. Now, you go to Mininova, download a file, and everything comes in.
As more and more pirates get online, they start saturating the pipe. They leave it on while they are away, running full boar all the time. Video, even in it's most crazy uncompressed size, doesn't compare. At least video stops sometimes. | |
| | | | | | | | backness
join:2005-07-08
K2P OW2
| Re: Keeping pace So you have identified 2 issues:
1) More and more people are into online content
2) Existing DSL is not fast enough for peoples needs
The fact that there are limited sources for fairly priced online goods is a misnomer.
As far as I can see, people need a quality connection with no cap to be able to have free access to the content that will eventually come online. Without a state of the art network, what you are saying is true. With a state of the art network a new marketplace forms and content producers can interact directly with their customers. We can remove the whole hollywood value chain model and replace it with direct content delivery.
The linch pin of the whole concept relies on state of the art networks. | |
| | | | | | | | | psx_defector
join:2001-06-09
Allen, TX
| Re: Keeping pace said by backness :So you have identified 2 issues: 1) More and more people are into online content Pirated online content. Don't believe for a second everyone is only streaming Hulu 24x7, both up and down.
2) Existing DSL is not fast enough for peoples needs It's plenty fast for people's current needs with regards to legit online content. You don't need to download a song from iTunes in less than 1 second, you can't stream the video from Hulu any faster than what the video plays at. Where the "demand" is coming from is people "demanding" they download 100GB worth of Steam patches and games, download the song from iTunes in 1 second, and watch full screen HD on three TVs.
People always quote the "Oh, well my family will do all that together." People forget that the majority of the subscribers out there are us single people. Do we need 15 HD streams coming in?
As far as I can see, people need a quality connection with no cap to be able to have free access to the content that will eventually come online. Without a state of the art network, what you are saying is true. With a state of the art network a new marketplace forms and content producers can interact directly with their customers. We can remove the whole hollywood value chain model and replace it with direct content delivery. Considering that the content makers are NOT leaning that way, why spend all that money on building something they don't want to use and the majority of users don't need? People act like online content will change every facet of our lives, online social networking is where we will find our next wife, and CuFme will be how we procreate. It just ain't gonna happen, not in our lifetimes.
Despite what you think, the consumer doesn't control the way content comes to you. Hence why piracy, pirates in it for the content and not the ones who are trying to turn a buck, is a big draw. The providers of content will never concede to giving away their product. Honest users will always be there, so their revenue stream will never dry up. They will never stop in stopping piracy. Just as they will never stop piracy. | |
| | | | | | | | | | backness
join:2005-07-08
K2P OW2 | Re: Keeping pace Because a computer will only ever need 64k of memory. | |
| | | | | | | | | | bsoft
join:2004-03-28
Boulder, CO
·Comcast
| Pirated online content. Don't believe for a second everyone is only streaming Hulu 24x7, both up and down. Go look at actual studies of bandwidth usage rather than what the MPAA/RIAA is spewing. P2P is not the #1 bandwidth category, Internet video (primarily YouTube) is.
Maybe you don't use MLB.tv, CNN's online video, CBS.com, Hulu, Netflix, iTunes, Blockbuster Online Access, or YouTube. But the stats say that there are a hell of a lot more people using legal services than pirating. For one thing, it's considerably easier.
It's plenty fast for people's current needs with regards to legit online content. You don't need to download a song from iTunes in less than 1 second, you can't stream the video from Hulu any faster than what the video plays at. Hulu provides low-resolution, low-bitrate videos because people have shitty DSL connections. Go watch a Blu-ray disc and compare it to Hulu or even Netflix's online "HD". Now tell me why it's unreasonable to want the same level of quality from Internet video.
Where the "demand" is coming from is people "demanding" they download 100GB worth of Steam patches and games, download the song from iTunes in 1 second, and watch full screen HD on three TVs. Oh, I see, we should buy all of our software in cardboard boxes, wait 20 minutes to download an album, and watch crappy low-resolution Internet video.
People demand better service than they did in 2002. My GPU is easily 50x faster than it was in 2002. My CPU is at least 10x faster (depending on how you consider multicore). I have 16x more memory, 20x more disk space, and a monitor that's twice as large and quadruple the resolution.
So, yeah, do I expect to be able to stream HD video? Yes. Do I expect to be able to download games and other software quickly? Yes. Do I expect to be able to download music without waiting for minutes? Yes.
People always quote the "Oh, well my family will do all that together." People forget that the majority of the subscribers out there are us single people. Do we need 15 HD streams coming in? No one needs ANY HD streams. What we *want* is an Internet connection where we don't have to think, "Oh crap, I ran out of bandwidth!". Being able to pull Fedora and watch Netflix at the same time would be a start.
Despite what you think, the consumer doesn't control the way content comes to you. History disagrees. Hollywood fought TV and the VCR. We won. The TV networks fought DVRs. We won. Record companies refused to sell DRM-free music. We won.
Every single time some new technology comes along, the content companies bitch and moan. And then they fold. And of course, the technologies that are supposed to kill them never actually do.
Every time a technological advance is made, someone tries to rain on the parade by claiming that the technology is unnecessary. What would anyone do with a 1GB hard drive? What would anyone do with a 1.5Mbps connection all to themself? What would anyone do with a dual-core CPU?
The thing is, we ALWAYS find a use. Maybe the future is 4x HD resolution, or 3D, or higher color depth. Maybe it's games with better graphics (and larger patches), software as a service, or PCs that boot over the Internet.
The great thing about the Internet is that the people who own the pipes don't get to decide how they are filled. YouTube couldn't have existed in a world of dial-up. Steam doesn't fly on 256k DSL. And Netflix won't be able to stop mailing discs around until we all have 10Mbps+.
We are talking about the end of content distribution as we know it. Now, I don't think that the future of entertainment is teenagers making videos on YouTube. But I do think that you have to be crazy to believe that the future of entertainment is watching one of the 140 channels you subscribe to. The future is anything, anytime. The Internet is the technology that enables that future. That's why 100Mbps matters. | |
| | | | |
AlfredNewman
@bankone.com
| said by psx_defector :Do we hear: "People in Amsterdam get to smoke pot and screw hookers all day. Why doesn't America allow that? They ain't being competitive!!!!" Well it would solve a lot of money issues with our gov. and would have a lot less people in our crowded prisons. Which the people are starting to realize and why there is such a push for re-legalizing pot and don't get me started on hookers. There's a profession that has been there since the dawn of time for men. | |
| | | | | bn1221
join:2009-04-29
Cortland, NY | I need 100 Mbit a second so my people can work from home and free up office space | |
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bender
Bite my shiny metal ass
Premium
join:2005-03-19
Evanston, IL
clubs:
·T-Mobile US
·Vonage
·AT&T U-Verse
·AT&T Midwest
·Mediacom
| said by psx_defector :said by Luminaris :How about faster speeds to keep pace with the rest of the world? Who gives a shit about the rest of the world? Just because some Korean WoW gold miner demands an 100Gbps optical connection shoved up his ass doesn't mean squat for Billy Bob in the backwoods of Virgina. Innovation? Is bendable fiber NOT innovation? How about trying to outpace countries with much faster speeds? See Korean WoW gold miner. I guess that doesn't mean much to ISP's here in the U.S. Just as the US market means squat to the rest of the world. The Australian and UK markets don't capitulate to demands from the rest of the world telling them to go unmetered. Belgium doesn't give a rats ass that some Sweedish pirate has fiber to the home. Someone from South Africa doesn't care that his neighbor country just to the north doesn't have ANY broadband. Every market is different. And we are not the typical broadband user. Just because people on dslreports.com are clamoring for the 100Gbps optical link shoved up our asses doesn't mean that the users in Bumblefuck, VA demand it, or even someone next door. Hi Ignorant America! Haven't talked to you in awhile. | |
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Boogeyman
Drive it like you stole it
Premium
join:2002-12-17
Huntsville, AL
| Re: Keeping pace You must not get out, answer the phone, or especially, read the net, much. 
Remember, ignorance is everywhere. And someone, somewhere, thinks you are ignorant..
--
Im Your Boogeyman, Thats What I Am | |
| | | | | | xlimitx
join:2001-12-31
Wilkes Barre, PA | Hey America, look at our super mega fast network. It sounds as though they're not exactly quite sure how to pay for the amounts of bandwidth that they're dishing out to high end customers.
Do I smell more layoffs? | |
| | openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA | Re: Hey America, look at our super mega fast network. Or maybe, the demand for 100 Mbps tiers simply doesn't exist yet. Given VZ's capacity and GPON architecture, I would expect them to be leading the charge with a $200+/mth tier if the demand actually existed. | |
| | | xlimitx
join:2001-12-31
Wilkes Barre, PA
·ProLog
| Re: Hey America, look at our super mega fast network. I do tend to agree with you on whether or not there is a true mainstream need for 100Mbps of internet bandwidth.
100Mbps is awesome for multiple HD or SD streams which they're using for their TV service, but finding reliable sources of servers willing to push 100Mbps are rare. Even more rare is a typical consumer who would know the difference between 10Mbps and 100Mbps. Usually consumers view services in three different levels. Those levels being; working well, working okay or not working. | |
| | | | Sammer
join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA
| Re: Hey America, look at our super mega fast network. When the FCC presents a national broadband plan next February 2 Mbps should be the immediate goal but 50 Mbps seems about right for an intermediate goal. Verizon is right that anything faster than that for homes (obviously business could use 100 Mbps) is simply marketing hype at this time. | |
| Antonlm
join:2004-09-15
Birmingham, AL | 100 Mbps will.... Only keep people glued to the computer feverishly looking for something, anything to download. | |
| 
Shamayim
I already have a Messiah.
Premium
join:2002-09-23
1 edit | Ultra high entry fee is the reason "Cablevision's nabbing only a small number of very speed-obsessed customers."
Cablevision's absurdly high $300 internet highway tollboth charge is what's keeping the number small. I myself, like many others I'm sure, can easily afford it but refuse on principle to fork over the ransom.
--
Who is Jesus? and Why it matters (to YOU).
| |
| | openbox9
join:2004-01-26
Alexandria, VA | Re: Ultra high entry fee is the reason If a requirement exists, the $300 fee isn't a barrier to entry at all. What does it cost to set up a 100 Mbps port in a carrier hotel? | |
|
Dan Rayburn
@verizon.net
| 50Mbps is overkill I have Verizon FiOS. I used to have 50Mbps but went back down to 25Mbps as I could not find anything that worked better or faster with 50Mbps. For the average consumer, 25Mbps is more than plenty for now. Verizon is right, 100Mbps is simply wasteful and overkill. | |
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See 7 replies to this post | |
amungus
Premium
join:2004-11-26
America
clubs:
| HD is still compressed a LOT Or, allow "work from home" to be almost as if you were actually connected directly to the LAN there (IF the company also has such service, which I would doubt...).
The thought is funny though - some guy thinking he's reached the end of the internet, sweating profusely, eyes bugged out, desperately hoping that he can find that HD transfer of every scrap of footage taken somewhere, for some event, that got bootlegged by somebody, and uploaded to the intarweb
Seriously though, the capability to have better HD (less compressed) feeds to more locations on premises would be pretty nice to have. I don't know what they allocate to video, but if it were, say 100Mbps, you could have quite a few very good quality streams to HD devices (or computers - the difference is becoming silly - an STB or PC ought to be allowed to "tune in").
Blu-ray playback is what, about 40Mbps (compressed)? What if you could have the data side delivering 2 such streams?
That's compressed too... Imagine LESS compression, say instead of that, you could use 80Mbps for video. HD would look even more awesome...
Also, 1080p is NOT the be all and end all of HD. Already, people are looking at "quad HD" - which will require even more bandwidth. 3D video is also on the horizon, which again, will require more bandwidth, even at CURRENT resolution(s)...
Not to mention all the plans for more "interactive" services that may eventually happen. 2-way video would also need good bandwidth to work well (esp. if it were in HD!). The list goes on...
Even compressed at Blu-ray ratios, 3D, quad HD, any future display technology is going to take a lot of bandwidth.
Verizon has fiber - to people's houses. At least they'll be more prepared than others when the time comes to deliver... | |
| | neufuse
join:2006-12-06
Indiana, PA | Re: HD is still compressed a LOT uh no one is ever going to offer uncompressed video when its digital..... MPEG2/4 are always going to be compressed some even at the highest bit rate... and HDTV standard runs at what 18-25 Mbit? | |
| | | iansltx
join:2007-02-19
Golden, CO | Re: HD is still compressed a LOT HD runs between 9-17 Mbit, depending on whether you get it via sat (most compressed), via cable (middling) or via OTA (least compressed).
1080p video is HUGE uncompressed; you need USB 3.0 to transfer it to a computer... | |
| | | | |
dsfdfg
@mts.net | Most can hardly notice the difference between dvd and hd. Anything beyond 1080p is just marketing. ( next pointless craze = 3d ) | |
| | bn1221
join:2009-04-29
Cortland, NY | Verizon won't sell FiOS to any medium or large business aparently. I offered 1200 a month for 20 mb each way and they told me know. Must be they are unable or unwilling to offer an SLA or something. | |
| 
RolteC
0h
join:2001-05-20
Fresh Meadows, NY
| Verizon is Smart! I like what they are doing.
They know tech savy and ping conscience people will stick with FiOS, especially for reliable connections, no offence, I also believe OOL is great from most of my experience using the service.
But now think about this:
They will let the most bandwidth consuming hogs go, and remain on Cablevisions network, bugging them down, and costing them the most $$ while Verizon stays put with what it has and doesn't worry as much as the hogs.
Makes sense doesn't it. SO in the end who is really losing | |
| 
Neyland
join:2003-02-04
USA | It's OK ATT is still offering up to 3mb DSL here. | |
| | 
Van
Premium
join:2009-07-08
Washington, DC | Re: It's OK I am currently forced to have Verizon 3mb DSL
It's so slow....I want to cry | |
| | JesseHarris
join:2008-07-30
Sandy, UT | 100Mbps is too much? Give me a 100Mbps connection and I'll show you just how little it really is. | |
| 
funchords
Hello
Premium,MVM
join:2001-03-11
Washington, DC
·Verizon Online DSL
·Skype
| Cablevision's 101 Mbps+ is a parlor trick! said by Karl Bode's article :
Given the product is the marketing equivalent of a drop kick aimed squarely at Verizon's face, it wasn't surprising to see Verizon quickly downplay the offering, calling it little more than a "parlor trick." It absolutely is a Parlor Trick. If these were doors, Cablevision's product would be made out of mosquito mesh and Verizon's would be made out of oak.
In Cablevision's land, no two customers on the same node can access 101 Mbps at the same time. They've taken the "up to XXX Mbps" concept to it's extreme.
In Verizon's land, consumers can have confidence that they will access the speeds that they are sold, despite their neighbor's use.
Let's reward Verizon for calling a duck a duck when the duck really is a duck!
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- District of Columbia -- KJ7RL
Test your Broadband connection today! -- »measurementlab.net/ | |
| | 
RARPSL
join:1999-12-08
Suffern, NY
| Re: Cablevision's 101 Mbps+ is a parlor trick! said by funchords :said by Karl Bode's article :
Given the product is the marketing equivalent of a drop kick aimed squarely at Verizon's face, it wasn't surprising to see Verizon quickly downplay the offering, calling it little more than a "parlor trick." It absolutely is a Parlor Trick. If these were doors, Cablevision's product would be made out of mosquito mesh and Verizon's would be made out of oak. In Cablevision's land, no two customers on the same node can access 101 Mbps at the same time. They've taken the "up to XXX Mbps" concept to it's extreme. Forget about 2 Ultra (101/15) users on the same node and look at one plus lots of Boost (30/5) users on the node. Although DOCSIS 3 supports 4 bonded frequencies, CV only is supplying 3 right now and one is being shared with the Boost Users on that node. I am not sure if the Bonding uses all the available bandwidth on each frequency or splits the load equally across each frequency (ie: It will only use 3 times the available bandwidth of the currently most loaded frequency instead of attempting to max-out all the frequencies). The net result is that due to the use of the Boost Frequency there is less available for the Ultra user to bond to the dedicated Ultra-Only Frequencies. Eventually/Hopefully CV will go to the full 4 Frequencies as well as making them all Ultra-Only ones (or at least make it 3 Ultras plus the Shared Boost). | |
| | 
Krisnatharok
0311 Scout
Premium
join:2009-02-11
Sterling, VA
| Forget 100 Mbps, I'd be happy with regular Fios! Because, apparently, right smack-dab in the middle of urban northern VA / DC suburbs, I'm too far "out there" to get Fios to my apartment. Comcast internet is something like $55 just for 10/2 where I am; because there is no competition, there are no price breaks. | |
| | jdjbuffalo
join:2004-01-17
Denver, CO
| Re: Forget 100 Mbps, I'd be happy with regular Fios! said by Krisnatharok :Because, apparently, right smack-dab in the middle of urban northern VA / DC suburbs, I'm too far "out there" to get Fios to my apartment. Comcast internet is something like $55 just for 10/2 where I am; because there is no competition, there are no price breaks. This!
I'm stuck on a 5mbit/512kbit cable connection. I can't wait to get off of it! | |
| | | majortom1029
join:2006-10-19
Lindenhurst, NY
| Re: 50 mbps you can use said by thender :beats 100 mbps you can't. If one ran their connection 24/7, Verizon won't care. Cablevision will most likely cut them off. It's not like they don't have a longstanding history of this behavior. Verizon is smart. They don't want to expand too quickly and leave themselves thin in the case that people actually want to use the 100 mbps. I bet you havent been with cablevision in the past 2 years. Cablevision stopped with the capping. | |
| patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| BPON So what about all the existing BPON homes prior to 2008? Verizon going to go back and force every customer to go through an ONT replacement to GPON so they can sell 100 in the neighborhood? Or 1 block that is BPON won't have 100, the other block that is newer has GPON and it will have 100? | |
| | 
jmn1207
Premium
join:2000-07-19
Reston, VA
·Verizon FIOS
| Re: BPON They would only have to replace the equipment as necessary. This has been covered in the Verizon forums before. Most of the CO's have both BPON and GPON OLT's, if you can believe what the FiOS tech's are saying. If more capacity is required, Verizon has stated that new equipment would be installed, and those few customers ordering the faster tiers might need to have their ONT's replaced.
They could also reduce the number of node spits, in some cases. Last I saw, my area is GPON with 16 splits. We shouldn't have any problems here if they ever decide to offer faster speeds.
Also, it would not be too surprising for Verizon to only offer faster speeds in specific areas where GPON was exclusive. They already break their speed offerings into segregated niches, such as a 35/20 tier only to NY metro area customers. | |
|
ScrewVerizon
@optonline.net | You know it's funny... That the fios fanboys are trying hard to downplay OOL's offering just so they can feel better. Meanwhile these are the same punks complaining about speed. | |
| | WC813
join:2000-12-20
Wesley Chapel, FL | Re: You know it's funny... Yep, I'm a fan of Fios because it is the best service I have ever had with a ISP. I have used Cox, BellSouth, BrightHouse, RR, VZ DSL, Embarq DSL.
Can't downplay OOL because I can't get it.
So what was your point? | |
| | ravensfan55
join:2008-06-16
Severna Park, MD | Good luck getting your full 101mbps all the time. | |
| | margaf77
join:2000-12-22
Bayonne, NJ
·Optimum Online
·RoadRunner Cable
| said by ScrewVerizon :
That the fios fanboys are trying hard to downplay OOL's offering just so they can feel better. Meanwhile these are the same punks complaining about speed.
I have 30/5 Boost in NJ and when they can actually deliver what they offer at a time other than 3am then talk until then your just an OOL fanboy talking out of his a@@. | |
| SteveK
Premium
join:2001-11-12
Kensington, MD
·Verizon FIOS
| Happy with 25/15 I had 5/2 service with FIOS (somehow I missed the free upgrade to 10/2). I was on a triple-play package with TV Essentials, and found that I could upgrade to Extreme HD for only $10 a month more. That gives me MANY more HD channels, and in addition the very knowledgeable customer service rep told me that upgraded package would give me 25/15 Internet at no extra cost. The only catch was that I had to agree to a new one-year commitment, but I also have a two-year price guarantee.
I could hardly believe it, but it happened as she described. I'm extremely happy with 25/15, which is more than I can foresee needing anytime soon. | |
| majortom1029
join:2006-10-19
Lindenhurst, NY |  hmm
| |
| | 
Agent Smith
join:2008-07-07
New York | Re: hmm But it cant keep a 100mb |99% QOS| 99.9% consistent speeds that FiOS can day and night can it?. | |
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