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Videotron Unveils 30Mbps, 50Mbps Tiers
First North American Pre-DOCSIS 3.0 deployment
by Karl Bode 03:33PM Wednesday Feb 06 2008
As was predicted yesterday, Canadian cable provider Videotron is the first North American cable operator to offer their customers pre-DOCSIS 3.0 speeds. According to the company, they'll be offering 30Mbps ($64.95) and 50Mbps ($79.95) speeds under the "Ultimate Speed Internet 30" and "Ultimate Speed Internet 50" tier names. The service will see limited deployment at first -- available only to some 112,000 homes in Laval, Quebec.

A few caveats (and aren't there always); you'll notice the press release goes out of its way to avoid mentioning the new tiers' upstream speeds (1Mbps for both). That's because while pre-certification DOCSIS 3.0 vendors have mastered downstream channel bonding, upstream channel bonding has yet to be perfected. That's why we're seeing strangely top-heavy tiers like 100Mbps/2Mbps in some other markets like Singapore where pre-cert gear has been deployed.

The two new tiers also have total file transfer limits (that includes upstream and downstream totals) of 30 GB and 50 GB per month respectively. Given that a 2GB HD movie can be download in around five minutes with a 50Mbps connection, heavy video junkies will burn through those caps rather quickly. The company charges customers of these two new tiers $1.50 per additional gigabyte.

Click for full size
Some existing customers are feeling a little bit burned, given that Videotron is charging the same amount for their previously fastest 20Mbps tier as they are for the new 50Mbps tier. Employee posts to our forums have confirmed that Videotron has no plans to change the pricing of existing tiers. Users of the 20Mbps tier also pay $7.95 per additional gigabyte past their caps with no limit on how much Videotron can charge them per month. Slower tiers do have either $50 or $100 overage limits.

Videotron started beta-testing Cisco's pre-certification DOCSIS 3.0 Wideband technology last year, and achieved speeds up to 98Mbps in trials. The company also stated that through bonding eight channels, they should be able to achieve speeds of 320Mbps. As always, discussion of the new tier can be found in our Videotron forum (speaking French helps).

We'll note that while no cable operator in the United States has yet to launch a pre-cert DOCSIS 3.0 product, no cable operator in the United States employs these types of overage charges. As Broadband Reports was the first to report, Time Warner Cable is testing a very similar overage system in their Beaumont, Texas market.

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Tikker_LoS

join:2004-04-29
Regina, SK

Woot

used up my monthly allotment in 18 minutes!

TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

Kudos?

I suppose I can give kudos to Vidéotron for releasing the first pre-DOCSIS 3.0 services, but when we crunch the numbers, it's easy to realize this is simply an e-peen contest for lack of a better word, and claim they're the fastest.

I'm currently subscribed to their regular high-speed and until my contract renews, I only pay 30$ extra for unlimited, which means 58,95$ plus taxes for unlimited 7mbit connection (which isn't too bad). For new cliens and anyone renewing the contract, this will increase to 78,95$ plus taxes.

But others users who pay 68.95$ for 10mbit with a 100GB combined cap (without overcharge limits), or 78.95$ for 50mbit with a 50GB cap (no overcharge limit either), what is the point???

I think this is incredibly disapointing.

Raptor
Not a Dumptruck

join:2001-10-21
London, ON
Reviews:
·Rogers Hi-Speed

Nice, but hard caps.

Great speeds and all, but 50GB both ways?

50GB = 51 200 MB
50Mbps = 6.25 MBps

51 200 / 6.25 MBps = 8192 s = 136.5 min = 2 hours 16 minutes

Yes, you could argue who has 50gigs of data to download in a month, and some might say that they run/test that many Linux Distros. But what's the point of that speed then?

This seems like a 'who's got the biggest balls' game. The people who don't download large amounts of media who won't go near this cap would be happy surfing their sites and checking their mail with a 10Mb connection such that they'll never see any hickups.

For $80/month i would expect at least 100GB if not more. Cap the damn upload if you have to, not the upload. Oh wait, it's already a 50/1 ratio. That's capped enough.
--
....where's my fiber?

TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

Re: Nice, but hard caps.

said by Raptor:

This seems like a 'who's got the biggest balls' game.
I went with penis in my analogy, you went with balls.
Same thing

Raptor
Not a Dumptruck

join:2001-10-21
London, ON

1 edit

Re: Nice, but hard caps.

We were typing at the same time. Looks like we completed the set.

*edit*
(yes they're 10 mins apart, but i had the window open or something)
tmc8080

join:2004-04-24
Brooklyn, NY
Reviews:
·ooma
·Optimum Online
·Verizon FiOS

silly cannucks

when will providers realize they are making a mistake putting restrictions on what would otherwise be worthy of our attention.. there is NO POINT of even buying docsis 3.0 gear if these kinds of usage terms of service are part of the deal.
why is it that the consumer is always LAST when it comes to products & services in Canada?

jessegr

join:2005-03-05
Gatineau, QC

Re: silly cannucks

Less competition. Higher deploy costs.

milnoc

join:2001-03-05
H3B
kudos:2
Plus, Canadian cable operators have a monopoly over the territory they cover. Even going through a reseller may not get you a better deal. And chances are Vidéotron will keep the new technology for themselves.

elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2

Re: silly cannucks

I don't think they can keep the tech to themselves, while the CRTC doesn't explicitly regulate ISP's they have forced the ISP's to open their "lines" to competition
t0KE

join:2003-07-03

What's so strange about top-heavy tiers like 100Mbps/2Mbps?

This is as much for the poster Karl as everyone.

The article mentions this will be available for 112,000 Laval Homes and presumably the ones in Asia are also homes.

What can a residential customer do, within their ISP's AUP, to warrant more upstream? Outside of hosting game servers, which might not be permitted in all ISP AUPs, upstream is for sending DNS requests, HTTP GETs and SMTP; nothing terribly bandwidth intensive, even for the most robust www sites.

P2P is obviously the driver to consider this "Strange". Should ISPs bend to the demands of P2P and their users, or should ISPs offer whatever they want to offer and let folks decide what they want to buy?
blips

join:2001-04-17
Addison, IL

Re: What's so strange about top-heavy tiers like 100Mbps/2Mbps?

said by t0KE:

What can a residential customer do, within their ISP's AUP, to warrant more upstream? Outside of hosting game servers, which might not be permitted in all ISP AUPs, upstream is for sending DNS requests, HTTP GETs and SMTP; nothing terribly bandwidth intensive, even for the most robust www sites.
Online backups is one thing but what I really want fast upstream for is when I VPN in to my local network and try to control my home computer with VNC. It is brutally slow. I need more upstream!!

NOYB
St. John 3.16
Premium
join:2005-12-15
Forest Grove, OR
kudos:1

Re: What's so strange about top-heavy tiers like 100Mbps/2Mbps?


And multi-GB video uploads.


jb

@roche.com

Re: What's so strange about top-heavy tiers like 100Mbps/2Mbps?

and video chat. Video iChat at 1600kbps is really really nice!!
Skippy25

join:2000-09-13
Hazelwood, MO
A 1mb connection for VNC is plenty.

Dogfather
Premium
join:2007-12-26
Laguna Hills, CA
Slingbox.
drewbeaud

join:2003-01-19

bargain

I posted this in the canadian broadband and Veidotron forums...
little bit ridiculous..

50 mbps = about 6 megs per second.
360 megs a minute
60x360 megs = 19.6 Gigs per hour
so 19.6G x 24 hours = 470.40$ per day in potential overage fees.
470.40 x 30 = 14112$ in potential overage fees.

Sounds like a good deal to me.
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1

Re: bargain

For 14K a month I would want a dedicated SLAed 100mbit or 1 gigabit line straight to my house.

En Enfer
This account has been compromised

join:2003-07-25
Montreal, QC
kudos:4

The internet is for web-browsing and e-mail

Sounds good for press conferences...
The 20Mbps package is at the same price as the 50Mbps, only difference would be the modem hardware.

But frankly, which one is more attractive between:
- paying 65$ for 10Mbit with a 100Gb monthly cap
and
- paying 80$ for a 50Mbit with a 50Gb monthly cap

???
ldisimino

join:2004-08-17

Re: The internet is for web-browsing and e-mail

Are they joking!?? Whats the point in paying so much for just getting a 50mbit pipe if you can't use it? They could offer a 1gbit connection, but with any sort of bandwidth cap, its just fake advertising in my opinion. Funny how the new tiers actually offer less download bandwidth than the high speed 10mbit service offered by videotron (100gb up/down), and cost double.

espaeth
Digital Plumber
Premium,MVM
join:2001-04-21
Minneapolis, MN
kudos:2
Reviews:
·Vitelity VOIP

1 recommendation

Re: The internet is for web-browsing and e-mail

said by ldisimino:

Are they joking!?? Whats the point in paying so much for just getting a 50mbit pipe if you can't use it?
Nearly all networks (except those specifically built for data replication) are not built to be run at 100% 24x7. Speed and quantity are only loosely related; using the car analogies that everybody loves that's like saying "Why should dealers lease cars capable of 120mph if you can only drive 12,000 miles a year penalty-free under the lease? You can use that up in just 100 hours of driving!"

If you download less than 50GB of data today, with the higher speed connection you can download the same quantity of data in less time. That's the benefit - saving time.
Done_Posting
Shoot to kill
Premium
join:2003-08-22
Toledo, OH

Re: The internet is for web-browsing and e-mail

said by espaeth:

Nearly all networks (except those specifically built for data replication) are not built to be run at 100% 24x7. Speed and quantity are only loosely related; using the car analogies that everybody loves that's like saying "Why should dealers lease cars capable of 120mph if you can only drive 12,000 miles a year penalty-free under the lease? You can use that up in just 100 hours of driving!"

If you download less than 50GB of data today, with the higher speed connection you can download the same quantity of data in less time. That's the benefit - saving time.
That is, without a doubt, one of the cleverest and most open minded uses of "the car" analogy I think I've ever seen here. You deserve the thumbs up I gave you!

- Tate

--
Happiness is an OC-48 in your basement...

adisor19

join:2004-10-11
Reviews:
·Acanac

Absolute BS

I can't wait to cancel ALL my services with Videoblows. This is a slap in the face to customers that have been using their services for YEARS.

Goodbye VL, i rather get an unlimited DSL account then get raped by overcharge fees every month.

Adi

TigerLord
UEE Citizen
Premium,Mod
join:2002-06-09
Canada
kudos:8

Re: Absolute BS

I made some calculations fore when my contract expires:

Primus VoiP
49,95$+ tx, unlimited across USA and Canada with 10 options

Starchoice TV
55,96$+ tx with TNM (same as my current Videotron plan, perhaps with a few channels missing which costs 57,00$)

Teksavvy DSL Dry
49,95$+tx unlimited 7mbit DSL line

Total is 176,71$ including taxes.

I currently pay 181$ per month with Videotron, and it will be 201$ once contract renews, providing I keep going over the 20GB cap. Teksavvy also has a 39,95$ plan with 200GB which is more than enough for my needs (I currently do around 80GB per month) and would then pay 166,71$ versus 201$ witn Videotron.

I thought bundling meant savings? The only extra hassle is actually suscribing to each individual company rather than one, but for almost 40$ a month in savings, you can be damn sure I'll do it!

adisor19

join:2004-10-11
Reviews:
·Acanac

Re: Absolute BS

In my case it will be :

Acanac DSL for 18.95$ a moth if payed in 1 shot for the whole year

and a regular Bell phone line in special for 1 year at 20$ a month.

All this for a grand total of roughly 40$/month.

That's it. No TV needed since all my shows are on BT

Adi

Anon2008

@mc.videotron.ca

Re: Absolute BS

"In my case it will be :

Acanac DSL for 18.95$ a moth if payed in 1 shot for the whole year

and a regular Bell phone line in special for 1 year at 20$ a month.

All this for a grand total of roughly 40$/month.

That's it. No TV needed since all my shows are on BT

Adi"

I thought the minimum Bell phone charge was ~$25.60? Also, what do you do when Acanac bumps up their fees the following year? And 'BT' for TV?

adisor19

join:2004-10-11
Reviews:
·Acanac

Re: Absolute BS

Bell offers a rebate for the first year if you sign a contract.

As for Acanac, once the 1 year expires, i'll look for an alternative. Hopefully by then, some ADSL2+ provider will be available at my place.. or maybe, Videotron gets some sense and offers something decent.

Adi

SHARPSHARK

join:2002-05-10
Woah, there are cheaper alternatives than Primus for VoIP.

For example, since I don't talk much on the phone, I use »www.unlimitel.ca and www.voxalot.com for the voicemail. Clear voice and no lag.
My bill never goes over $10 a month. Yay! \o/

»www.callcentric.com/ has an unlimited plan for $19.95 and for the few calls I did with them I never had issues.

And to come back to the main topic, yeah, Videotron kind of rapes your wallet when you download alot of content and don't take the cable TV to save $10 of your bill. :X
--
SHARPSHARK

elwoodblues
Elwood Blues
Premium
join:2006-08-30
Somewhere in
kudos:2
Teksavvy DOES offer a 7mb connection, BUT it probably only reaches that speed if you live next door to the CO.

I really REALLY hate DSL and all it's limitations

Moonlight_x

@mc.videotron.ca

Re: Absolute BS

said by elwoodblues:

Teksavvy DOES offer a 7mb connection, BUT it probably only reaches that speed if you live next door to the CO.
At the moment, Bell only offers 5Mbps to third-party ADSL providers such as TSI. TSI subscribers who get more than that are either 1) ex-Sympatico subscribers whose Total Internet 7/1 profile has not been downgraded to 5M/800k yet or 2) DSLAM configuration slip-ups Bell will fix as they come across them as people request upgrades to fast-path or anything else that may cause Bell to review the line's DSLAM config.

TSI is currently working on offering ADSL2+ in Bell-land but it is not a done deal yet.
Lexxion

join:2006-11-22
Ridgewood, NY

1 Mbps UPLOAD???

Oh great... You can download at 50Mbps and upload at 1Mbps only!!!!

When do they learn that people are using a lot of upload bandwidth too...

I rather have FiOS 20/20 Mbps... sheesh..

JohnDrenZ
Premium
join:2000-04-03
Phoenix, AZ

Re: 1 Mbps UPLOAD???

I was thinking the same thing. At least a 5Mbps upload to start!

justmy2cents

@centurytel.net

Re: 1 Mbps UPLOAD???

What does it matter anyway what speed they offer with those loooow caps.
CWO333

join:2005-02-24
Chicago, IL
As they pointed out, these speeds are only achieved by channel bonding in DOCSIS 3.0. Pre-cert gear supports downstream channel bonding which makes the higher download speeds possible but you're still sharing 27Mbps with everyone else on your node up the upstream side because pre-cert doesn't support upstream channel bonding yet. Thats why pre-cert isn't certified.

cmc0

join:2001-08-03
Bowie, MD

Only 30GB?

Only 30GB? LOLOL. I download more on a 3Mpbs Verizon DSL line. This as gotta be the broadband joke of the century and I don't know anyone who would be stupid to sign up for this POS service.

astokes

join:2000-08-11
Bangor, ME

Re: Only 30GB?

Holy crap that 1meg upload makes me lol, is that even enough for acks when downloading?
vasta

join:2003-04-07
Orlando, FL

Re: Only 30GB?

i predict a news story on this very site in a few weeks or months about someone who went over the cap and has a bill of $20,000
i can see it
sinwi

join:2001-11-15
Lake Geneva, WI

A leased internet connection?

Sure it all sounds attractive... till the FINE print to those of us USERS isn't so "fine"...
patcat88

join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
kudos:1

1 edit

redlining

quote:
available only to some 112,000 homes in Laval, Quebec.

Thats a nice suburb across the river. Redlining is all that I can say. Just as bad as Verizon FIOS.

Edit: sp

adisor19

join:2004-10-11
Reviews:
·Acanac

Re: redlining

I wouldn't say that. Usually Videotron tests their new technology in small cells in the suburbs and then they deploy them throughout the entire network. They initially offered telephony Voip only in Brossard but once they tested it ok, it was deployed network wide. I think the same thing is happening here.

Adi

nydwarf1

@gpc.ca

Re: redlining

Well it's nice to see that the Canadian ISPs are losing their minds just like their cousins to the South.
TheMG
Premium
join:2007-09-04
Canada
kudos:3
Reviews:
·NorthWest Tel

LOL

Wow. The upload speeds and bandwidth caps makes the service pretty much USELESS.

I mean, 50GB download cap, SERIOUSLY!

The 1mbps upload speed, WTF, even DOCSIS 2.0 is capable of 30mbps upstream. Is pre-DOCSIS 3.0 really that bad at doing upstream or is Videotron just using it as a LAME excuse to why they're not offering a faster upload?

Bottom line, even if this was available here, I'd still stick to my DSL. 6mbps down 1mbps up, 200GB cap for $35/month and $0.25/GB overage charge. Which would you pick, the cable or the dsl?

•••

Gabeddrf

@mc.videotron.ca

d

Like everyone else, I find it pointless to offer a fast service when what we want is a no caps service.

The "only pirates need that much transfer" is bogus since VPN, HD content, online games and so on now allow for a demanding user to go over the limit.

If their limits made more sense, like 500-700 GB, it wouldnt be as bad.

Don't offer a faster service, offer a no caps, slower service.

But it doesnt matter. They can change their contracts midway when they want anyways, so the client will ALWAYS get f*cked. Demoralizing.