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West Virginia: A Broadband Black Hole
Governor vetoes proposal, says Cisco has plan

West Virginia is one of the least saturated markets when it comes to broadband access (45th). It's a state where many residents still only have access to dial-up and satellite. In 2005, a bill was proposed that would have enabled municipal broadband competition, but it was derailed by Verizon lobbyists. Last month, a bill that would have mapped broadband access in the state and fostered deployment was vetoed by Governor Joe Manchin.

Manchin supported the bill in session, but at the last minute he said Cisco approached him with free advice on how to proceed, so he felt the bill wasn't necessary. While the move surprised the backers of the bill, Manchin insists that the goal remains to get broadband to all West Virginians by 2010, though details on accomplishing this are scarce.

Verizon has been accused of letting State telco infrastructure fall apart in order to spend that money on FiOS deployments elsewhere. An ex Bell Atlantic exec-turned-competitor recently bashed the company for manipulating the public in West Virginia and having absolute control over state politicians.

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pinot noir6
Premium Member
join:2007-04-23
Columbus, OH

pinot noir6

Premium Member

West Virginia

West Virginia is probably a difficult state to wire, with its mountainous terrain. Wireless would probably be even harder.

TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ

TScheisskopf

Member

Re: West Virginia

said by pinot noir6:

West Virginia is probably a difficult state to wire, with its mountainous terrain. Wireless would probably be even harder.
Amazingly, they have a modern convenience called "Telephone Poles" that border most of the roads there. These modern conveniences have been scientifically shown to be very effective when deploying telecommunications infrastructure upgrades.

On the other hand, many areas of WV have the triple whammy going against them: low population density, remarkably aged infrastructure and low per capita income. A red-liner's paradise.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

Re: West Virginia

said by TScheisskopf:



On the other hand, many areas of WV have the triple whammy going against them: low population density, remarkably aged infrastructure and low per capita income. A red-liner's paradise.
They all can get POTS at an affordable price. How did the government manage that?

TScheisskopf
World News Trust
join:2005-02-13
Belvidere, NJ

TScheisskopf

Member

Re: West Virginia

said by batterup:

said by TScheisskopf:



On the other hand, many areas of WV have the triple whammy going against them: low population density, remarkably aged infrastructure and low per capita income. A red-liner's paradise.
They all can get POTS at an affordable price. How did the government manage that?
That rural telephone program.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

Re: West Virginia

said by TScheisskopf:

said by batterup:

said by TScheisskopf:



On the other hand, many areas of WV have the triple whammy going against them: low population density, remarkably aged infrastructure and low per capita income. A red-liner's paradise.
They all can get POTS at an affordable price. How did the government manage that?
That rural telephone program.
Before divestiture The Phone Company didn't use the USF.
fgoldstein
join:2003-01-21
Newton Highlands, MA

fgoldstein

Member

Re: West Virginia

said by batterup:

Before divestiture The Phone Company didn't use the USF.
Uh, sure it did. Just not as an explicit federal tax.

Before divestiture, Ma Bell and the Independents had a kludgey system called Separations and Settlements, in which toll revenues were divided between AT&T Long Lines and the LECs at either end of a call based upon a complex set of formulas. The last ones used were called the Ozark Plan, which based the LECs' share upon relative investment in plant. Plus it weighted interstate calls at (eventually) about 3.2 times a local call, when determining what share of the local loop's usage was interstate. That share (PIU) times the multiple (SPF) was compared with the local usage, and the LD share of common, fixed costs was covered out of toll revenues. The bottom line was that a high-cost rural telco could collect more than 100% of the toll charge, just for its end of the call.

This didn't work with LD competition so the system of Switched Access Charges was ordered as a replacement. Divestiture happened to occur around then, so the effective date was set to be the same. That was actually a coincidence.

TA96 says that subsidies (USF) are supposed to be explicit and portable, but that's often honored in the breach.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

Re: West Virginia

Before divesture Ma Bell was long distance and the ILEC and every thing else. A company operating with its own funds. Universal service at an affordable price.

Of course it is much better now just as MCI/WorldCom promised.
openbox9
Premium Member
join:2004-01-26
71144

openbox9

Premium Member

Riiiiight.....

Cisco is not selling a product or competing with current broadband providers, Schafer said, but rather lending its expertise to the state.
I don't know how much WV's bill to map broadband access would have cost the state, but it might have been nice to have those results. I find it very difficult to believe that Cisco will map out the state and provide a way-ahead with no strings attached and no monetary benefit to the company. I wonder when Cisco will expect that return of favor?

morbo
Complete Your Transaction
join:2002-01-22
00000

morbo

Member

Re: Riiiiight.....

knowing cisco, bizarre sex.
meta
join:2004-12-27
00000

meta

Member

Re: Riiiiight.....

HAHAHAHAHA wow.

calvoiper
join:2003-03-31
Belvedere Tiburon, CA

calvoiper

Member

Re: Riiiiight.....

The Baby Bells have a long history of using their equipment vendors to lobby for them. I have little doubt that possible VZ purchases of Cisco equipment were mentioned in the same conversations that covered VZ's desire to kill this bill.

calvoiper
nnaarrnn
join:2004-09-30
Charleston, WV

nnaarrnn

Member

Cisco

You do know the founder of Cisco is from WV right?

Titus
Mr Gradenko
join:2004-06-26

Titus

Member

Re: Cisco

I'm still waiting for the inbreeding jokes ...
--
Here kitty kitty ...

idjk
@sprintlink.net

idjk

Anon

Re: Cisco

How about this- I heard on radio yesterday(seriously) that WV has the highest # of toothless people in US.

jslik
That just happened
Premium Member
join:2006-03-17

jslik

Premium Member

Add it to the list....

I expect we'll see the "Robert C. Byrd Broadband Network" in WV added to the following list:

Robert C. Byrd Academic and Technology Center at Marshall University, Huntington
Robert C. Byrd Addition to the Lodge at Oglebay Park, Wheeling
Robert C. Byrd Appalachian Highway System part of the Appalachian Development Highway System
Robert C. Byrd Auditorium at the National Conservation Training Center, Shepherdstown
Robert C. Byrd Biotechnology Science Center at Marshall University, Huntington
Robert C. Byrd Bridge, between Huntington and Chesapeake, Ohio
Robert C. Byrd Cancer Research Laboratory of West Virginia University, Morgantown
Robert C. Byrd Center for Legislative Studies at Shepherd University, Shepherdstown
Robert C. Byrd Center for Pharmacy Education at the University of Charleston, Charleston
Robert C. Byrd Clinic at the West Virginia School of Osteopathic Medicine, Lewisburg
Robert C. Byrd Clinical Addition to Veteran's Hospital, Huntington
Robert C. Byrd Community Center, Pine Grove
Robert C. Byrd Conference Center at Davis and Elkins College, Elkins
Robert C. Byrd Drive, from Beckley to Sophia (Byrd's hometown)
Robert C. Byrd Expressway, U.S. Highway 22, near Weirton
Robert C. Byrd Federal Building & Courthouse, Beckley
Robert C. Byrd Federal Building & Courthouse, Charleston
Robert C. Byrd Green Bank Telescope, Green Bank
Robert C. Byrd Hardwood Technologies Center, Princeton
Robert C. Byrd Health and Wellness Center of Bethany College, Bethany
Robert C. Byrd Health Sciences Center of West Virginia University, Morgantown
Robert C. Byrd High School, Clarksburg
Robert C. Byrd Hilltop Office Complex, Rocket Center
Erma Ora Byrd Conference & Learning Center
Robert C. Byrd Industrial Park, Moorefield
Robert C. Byrd Institute for Advanced Flexible Manufacturing; Huntington, Charleston, Bridgeport & Rocket Center
Robert C. Byrd Intermodal Transportation Center (and Parking Garage), Wheeling
Robert C. Byrd Library & Robert C. Byrd Learning Resource Center at Mountain State University, Beckley
Robert C. Byrd Locks & Dam, Gallipolis Ferry
Robert C. Byrd Metals Fabrication Center, Rocket Center
Robert C. Byrd National Aerospace Education Center, Bridgeport
Robert C. Byrd National Technology Transfer Center at Wheeling Jesuit University, Wheeling
Robert C. Byrd Rural Health Center at Marshall University, Huntington
Robert C. Byrd Science and Technology Center at Shepherd University, Shepherdstown
Robert C. Byrd Technology Center at Alderson-Broaddus College, Philippi
Robert C. Byrd United Technical Center
Robert C. Byrd Visitor Center at Harpers Ferry National Historical Park, Harpers Ferry
(For Byrd's Wife) Erma Ora Byrd Center for Educational Technologies at Wheeling Jesuit University, Wheeling
Robert C. Byrd Rooms in the Capitol Building (the office of the Senate Minority Leader)

scrummie02
Bentley
Premium Member
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA

scrummie02

Premium Member

Re: Add it to the list....

He is a shameless porker. A lot of those projects were federal funds as well that you and I pay taxes for regardless if we live in that state.

jester121
Premium Member
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL

jester121 to jslik

Premium Member

to jslik
No mention of the

Robert C Byrd KKK Museum, or the
Robert C Byrd Memorial Lynchin' Tree, or the
Robert C Byrd White Hood Factory, or the
Robert C Byrd Cross Burning Vocational Tech Institute

???

»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ro ··· lux_Klan
dsless
join:2001-05-16
Pittsburgh, PA

dsless

Member

Reading the aritcle from the Huntington Paper

"Kyle Schafer, the state's chief technology officer, said the plan will tackle how to build up the infrastructure necessary for broadband, how to get more Internet subscribers connected and how to link schools and homes using the technology."

This is speakeze for we don't know how we will do this. Kyle is nice person but with the WV state government involved it will not happen.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

Do you want the government controlling your interweb?

Read some of the posts about government supported or supplied broadband and you will not want it.

There was a time when affordable communication was available to all. Ma Bell is dead and yet the people bitch.

scrummie02
Bentley
Premium Member
join:2004-04-16
Arlington, VA

scrummie02

Premium Member

Re: Do you want the government controlling your interweb?

With all of the "privacy" advocates here as well, I'd think a state run broadband plan would be the last thing they would want. Think the government taps lines now...
openbox9
Premium Member
join:2004-01-26
71144

openbox9

Premium Member

Re: Do you want the government controlling your interweb?

But the people here on BBR want privacy and 100/100 Mbps service for $19.95/mth Besides, most people "advocating" something have no idea of what they are speaking out about. They read the headline, drink the Kool-Aid, and fall in line to demand that the govt regulate and/or compete against corporate America to save the poor and tax the hell out of the wealthy.

LOL
@charter.com

LOL to batterup

Anon

to batterup
You're kidding, right?

The price of phones services has fallen so much since Bell was shattered, and even more with the advent of digital communication. If Bell still ran things, your phone bill would be hundreds per month, long distance would still be insanely expensive, and you would still have a phone company owned rotary dial behemoth of a phone.

Stop thinking some more.

batterup
I Can Not Tell A Lie.
Premium Member
join:2003-02-06
Netcong, NJ

batterup

Premium Member

What Black Hole?

»Re: Come and get your ISOs!

Not if it make sense and dollars.

West Virginian
@bellatlantic.com

West Virginian

Anon

Not perfect but not terrible....

If any of you have a great, affordable solution to wiring rural areas, speak up. But make sure you have all the facts. There is actually quite a bit of broadband here. 77% access and growing. Every wire center has DSL -- including many very, very small mountain communities -- and there are several hundred remote locations with DSL. The issue is not Verizon or the cable guys -- they are opposed only to government telecom overlaying existing areas, undermining them and NOT taking care of rural folks or the unserved. Government will have to help where incumbents or others cannot make BB work, and we have plenty. This is THE most rural state in the US. Distances are enormous for wireline and wireless can be impossible in mountain valleys. Add to that 48th per capita income, and that 43% do not own computers, and it is tough to find workable solutions. Cisco is welcomed. All solutions that help are welcomed. Not going to happen without all of us working on it
Ahrenl
join:2004-10-26
North Andover, MA

Ahrenl

Member

Re: Not perfect but not terrible....

I would think Montana is a little more Rural. At least you have states NEXT to you that have those city things..

FutureMon
Dude Whats mine say?

join:2000-10-05
Marina, CA

FutureMon to West Virginian

to West Virginian
Whatever happened to the idea of using stationary blimps or balloons to provide the signal. High enough up they should be able to provide bandwidth of some sort to all sorts of mountainous terrain.

- FM
dekerfman
join:2004-10-07
Weirton, WV

dekerfman to West Virginian

Member

to West Virginian
I live in Weirton, W.V. in the northern panhandle of the state. We have cable, dsl and wireless available to us. The cities always make out better than rural areas.
dsless
join:2001-05-16
Pittsburgh, PA

dsless

Member

Re: Not perfect but not terrible....

And Weirton has no employment either. People live in Weirton and work in Pittsburgh.

TechieZero
Tools Are Using Me
Premium Member
join:2002-01-25
Lithia, FL

TechieZero

Premium Member

Telco Bashing

Whats with all this Telco bashing lately? Cable companies trying to win the dirty way?

I am sure like everything else, this is MARKET DRIVEN. People don't want to pay for it and/or no one wants to spend the money to wire it.
patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY

patcat88

Member

2010 yeah right

And how exactly does a state wire itself for broadband unless its Muni something, or the plan is Interest Free Loan and Grants to Verizon?

McLovin
Chicka chicka yeah
Premium Member
join:2005-06-12
Fairbanks, AK

McLovin

Premium Member

List?

Where is this list of broadband saturation, I would like to see this.