 hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
 ·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Won't be hard It won't be hard to convince anyone. And how says they'll have to do it to start off with?
All VZ will do is pass around some money they'll get a few conditions and the deal will be done. Especially with Ohio and Michigan who will be glad to see VZ go and someone else take over.
Since GTE merged with VZ service went down hill and prices went up. | |
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baineschile
2600
Premium
join:2008-05-10
Sterling Heights, MI | Re: Won't be hard Verizon doesnt have a footprint at all in the metro detroit area, only more rural areas far north of Detroit. They were never going to do Fios here, so there is no point in keeping the system | |
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| | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Won't be hard VZ offers service in south eastern MI as well. Former GTE areas. In Blissfield they actually have a CLEC that is deploying VDSL IPTV to compete against them. | |
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| | | PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
1 edit | How is this a bad thing? Frontier is sure to increase broadband availability in the acquired areas (which is at about 60% today, whereas Frontier's is 92%), ... Great, I say "bring it on".
BTW, I think DSL Prime says the broadband availability in these areas with Verizon is more like in the 40's.
The worst possible thing that could happen is that Frontier goes out of business, and I lose landline voice service. BFD, everyone in the family has a cellphone. I wouldn't have landline broadband, but Verizon was never going to provide that to me, anyway. So there's a potential upside to this deal (92% chance of getting broadband from Frontier), and no downside. | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
| said by hottboiinnc  :Since GTE merged with VZ service went down hill and prices went up. What hasn't gone up in the past decade. Looking back at their prices, you could get smoking fast 1.5mbit DSL for $215! Now I get 20/5 service for about $50/month. Then I could have gotten DirecTV's Total Choice Sports Package for around $40 that had over 100 (!!!) channels. Now I can get over 100 (!!!) HD channels, plus a few hundred Sd channels, VOD, etc for a little more. | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA
 ·Verizon Online DSL
·Verizon west (ex G..
| Re: Won't be hard said by cdru :said by hottboiinnc :Since GTE merged with VZ service went down hill and prices went up. What hasn't gone up in the past decade. Looking back at their prices, you could get smoking fast 1.5mbit DSL for $215! Now I get 20/5 service for about $50/month. Then I could have gotten DirecTV's Total Choice Sports Package for around $40 that had over 100 (!!!) channels. Now I can get over 100 (!!!) HD channels, plus a few hundred SD channels, VOD, etc for a little more. Oh lucky You. | |
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cdru
Go Colts
Premium,MVM
join:2003-05-14
Fort Wayne, IN
| Re: Won't be hard said by SuperJoker :Oh lucky You. Even if I didn't have FiOS, the same argument applies. Current DSL rates are $20/30/43 per month for 1/3/7.1 service. All far less then what they were a decade ago. And if you don't have FiOS available, the price of TV through Verizon hasn't really changed as it's still not available to you. | |
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| | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Won't be hard and with VZ areas still pay out the ass for DSL. Try ~$50 for basic in some areas of Ohio. VZ rapes their customers and makes the cities they service to find other service providers that are willing to service. | |
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| | | | | jester121
Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL
 ·surpasshosting
 ·ViaTalk
| Re: Won't be hard said by hottboiinnc :and with VZ areas still pay out the ass for DSL. Try ~$50 for basic in some areas of Ohio. VZ rapes their customers and makes the cities they service to find other service providers that are willing to service. Oh, companies like Hawaii Telecom and Fairpoint that flounder around and declare bankruptcy? 
If I had a choice between paying less to an incompetent company that can't manage their business or a bit more to a proven provider like Verizon, the choice is pretty clear -- at least to rational people who aren't jaded to hate any big company just because. | |
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TKJunkMail
Enjoy the sun
Premium
join:2002-03-03
Avalon, NJ
 ·Sprint Mobile Broa..
·Comcast
| Re: Won't be hard said by jester121 :Oh, companies like Hawaii Telecom and Fairpoint that flounder around and declare bankruptcy? . They went in to bankruptcy because they caved in to regulators and agreed on rates that couldn't earn a profit. Stupid move by them, but also on the regulators for forcing terms that guaranteed bankruptcy. | |
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| | | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Won't be hard Right. | |
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| | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| And I WOULD NOT do business with VZ. I'd pick Hawaii Telcom and Fairpoint over them.
By the way have you ever used Fairpoint services? Has anyone on here used Fairpoint besides the New England states that they picked up from VZ?
Well I can tell you that in Ohio the areas that have them, have NO problems at all. | |
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| | | | | | | jester121
Premium
join:2003-08-09
Lake Zurich, IL
·surpasshosting
·ViaTalk
| Re: Won't be hard said by hottboiinnc :Well I can tell you that in Ohio the areas that have them, have NO problems at all. Wonder why they even have a customer service phone number, since things run so smoothly?
Hyperbole much? | |
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| | | | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Re: Won't be hard Gotta have it to order products and pay your bill if you want to do it on the phone.
But FairPoint doesn't have the issues there like everyone claims in the New England States. People knew from the get go there would be problems. The people that did not take the steps to be ready are stupid and deserve what they get. you can't tell me that none of them knew that they would end up getting a new email address and that there would be no downtime. Anyone that is dumb enough to believe that doesn't even deserve the right to have email to start off with, let alone use their ISP for email. | |
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CaptainRR
Premium
join:2006-04-21
Blue Rock, OH
| I have at&t here in Ohio with nothing better than dailup. My mother has Fairpoint DSL in Alburg, VT for the past 5 years and it has been excellent for her. I been up there few times visiting and I have clocked it and it gives her the tier speed she it paying for. | |
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| | | | | | ashworth
join:2001-10-06
Pittsburgh, PA | You hit it on the head, you get what you pay for. In Frontier's and Fairpoint's defense I thought they were providers that could handle the load. Frontier better have a big differentiation from the Fairpoint merger. | |
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| | | | | | PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
| said by jester121 :If I had a choice between paying less to an incompetent company that can't manage their business or a bit more to a proven provider like Verizon, ... LOL, "proven provider"? Verizon doesn't provide anything that people want in a landline service in my area. All they provide is voice, which no one cares about since cellphones are better for that type of thing. What folks want is broadband, and Verizion here is the Great "Proven Unprovider". | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA
·Verizon Online DSL
·Verizon west (ex G..
| Re: Won't be hard said by PDXPLT :said by jester121 :If I had a choice between paying less to an incompetent company that can't manage their business or a bit more to a proven provider like Verizon, ... LOL, "proven provider"? Verizon doesn't provide anything that people want in a landline service in my area. All they provide is voice, which no one cares about since cellphones are better for that type of thing. What folks want is broadband, and Verizon here is the Great "Proven Unprovider". Cellphones are neat, But not everyone can afford them and My income is limited and I live within My means, Which is better than living paycheck to paycheck and being heavily in debt. | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA
·Verizon Online DSL
·Verizon west (ex G..
1 edit | said by cdru :said by SuperJoker :Oh lucky You. Even if I didn't have FiOS, the same argument applies. Current DSL rates are $20/30/43 per month for 1/3/7.1 service. All far less then what they were a decade ago. And if you don't have FiOS available, the price of TV through Verizon hasn't really changed as it's still not available to you. Who says I even want TV through VZ? I like Dish Network very much thank you.
VZ customer service has been a nightmare. | |
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| | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Won't be hard Id pick anything over Telco TV any day. | |
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| | | | | | vinnie97
join:2003-12-05
Mesquite, TX | Re: Won't be hard Except TelcoTV (in the case of Verizon) looks the best. | |
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| | | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Re: Won't be hard like i said. VZ can keep their over products. People wanted their services several years ago but they decided to wait, now they're losing out on it and cable is ahead by miles. | |
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UnhappyTVFan
@verizon.net
| Because we don't want to lose our trees, we can't go the satelite route. And, we don't want to go back to Comcrap, so that leaves us with whatever Frontier wants to give us.
The newspaper says we will likely loose the all the online perks and benefits we get with Verizon FIOS internet, as well as settling for far fewer TV channels than we have now, losing our fantastic picture quality, our multiroom DVRs, and other FIOS TV benefits that no one else offers.
This will be the first big degradation of service that we've ever had since getting cable TV in the 80s. How can we fight this I don't know but I'm not caving in yet. | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA | Re: Won't be hard Good for You, I hope You don't lose too much. Of course here in the desert trees normally are planted by People and I don't have any blocking the southern view of the sky, Only snow on Dish will do that sometimes. | |
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| | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| And your local news paper knows this how? LMAO
Things VZ gives you is by Yahoo! Internet anyway. Yahoo! provides a lot of the backend shit on the portal if you didn't know that.
if you're news paper can tell the future then I wanna know who it is. I need to have my future told me me and tell me when i'm going to win the lottery! | |
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| | | | | Mark F
join:2007-08-01
Fort Wayne, IN
| Not everyone is willing to sacrifice their trees to get satelite service. And, I like FIOS VOD very much.
As for Comcast, we were glad to leave their awfull service and bad equipment and get FIOS TV. FIOS is, by far, the best that we've ever had. Nothing came close. They have a good many channels that Comcast doesn't have and many other features.
And, even though we've had FIOS for less than two years, we love the many hundreds of SD channels (the highest channel is ch. 1951), the over 100 HD channels, Urge and Music Choice, their outstanding movie package (with VOD) and especially the ability to record something in one room and watch it in another room with the MRDVR.
We don't want to lose any of that, but we may lose it all when Frontier takes over and decides that they can run a TV service like we have now. Or, anything close to what we have. That's both sad and scary.
Mark F. | |
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| | | | | | Mark F
join:2007-08-01
Fort Wayne, IN | Re: Won't be hard The last line should read "We don't want to lose any of that but we may lose it all when Frontier takes over and decides they CAN'T run a TV service like we have now"."
Mark F. | |
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| | | | | | hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH | Frontier won't get rid of it. they just probably won't repair much if anything if it breaks. Especially since they'll still be getting the feeds from VZ. they will cost them to buy it wholesale.
Frontier will prolly not expand FiOS either. | |
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terd
@rr.com | amen to that. seen thier service on the land side slide to hell years back since they did not invest the needed capital nor did they do the needed updates to even run pri/bri service, sold to cities ..... | |
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rdmiller
join:2005-09-23
Richmond, VA | Why? Does anyone understand why Verizon bought GTE in the first place? Never made any sense to me. | |
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| cyclone_z
join:2006-06-19
Ames, IA | Re: Why? They wanted GTE's wireless assets, so they could become the biggest wireless carrier. | |
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| Dolgan
Premium
join:2005-10-01
Sun Prairie, WI | They wanted GTE's backhaul capacity--which is the same reason they bought out MCI. | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA | VZ and the California PUC Verizon is a regulated Utility here in California for their landlines, I imagine the CPUC will get quite a few complaints/calls about this as word spreads. | |
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See 13 replies to this post |
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patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
2 edits | timid PUCs Well, timid PUCs will cave like a deck of cards when Verizon threatens to bribe the governor to fire all the PUC members, or hire detectives to find out how many of them are gay wife beaters or child molesters, or sue the state for human rights abuses, or just sue the state as long as it can and try to bankrupt its AG office until the state settles.
Also most PUC commissioners live off buzzwords and powerpoints, with transitions and gradients, and will rubber stamp anything with a catchy video and powerpoint.
Edit:
this video convince any typical PUC commissioner, most meet once a month for a day and just watch presentation from the regulatED.
»www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZb0avfQme8 | |
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See 9 replies to this post |
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MichaelWacey
OwlSaver
Premium
join:2005-01-30
Berwyn, PA
 ·Verizon FIOS
·Comcast
| How can they stop this? Without considering the merits of Verizon or Frontier, how can anyone stop this? Obviously, it is not anti competitive. If anything, it creates some level of competition.
As far as regulation goes, does it not have to be based on health and safety? What is the health and safety argument for forcing Verizon to keep assets that it does not want?
If Frontier is a viable concern that can legally run a phone system, it would seem hard for this or any divestiture deal to be blocked. And even if you do block it, won't Verizon just neglect the assets? They don't want them. | |
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| hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Re: How can they stop this? yep! VZ will let the areas rot or file at the State PUCs they're going to abanden the areas and let the states deal with it.
Ohio is one of the many states that give that option, and includes the option for ILECs as well. I'm suprised VZ and ATT hasn't used it by now. | |
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| viperlmw
Premium
join:2005-01-25
·Qwest.net
| This same thing happened 2000 when USWest/Qwest was going to sell a bunch of exchanges to Citizens Communications(now Frontier). Citizens was going to buy exchanges in every USWest state, except Utah. The Utah PUC insisted USWest had to allow the other independents in the state to bid on the exchanges being sold. It turned out Citizens got NO exchanges in Utah, and subsequently the rest of the deal fell through, but the Utah sales still happened. So the states can have some major impact. | |
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Nuts
join:2006-04-27
Forest, OH
| A Little at a time I don't have much problem with VZ selling off my landline to another company, especially if that other company will push DSL out to our area, and keep up with good service.
Based on how things happened in the NE with the Fairpoint sale, I would like to see OHIO PUC not allow all of the VZ assets to be turned over at the same time. Work with VZ and Frontier and come up with a schedule to turn over X number of CO's at a time. Thus having to deal with a few 10's of thousands at a time instead of several million at once. | |
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| hottboiinnc
ME
join:2003-10-15
Cleveland, OH
·Time Warner Cable
·buckeye cable
| Re: A Little at a time the Ohio PUC doesn't care about anyone. You should know that by living here. They only care about the money that is given to them by the companies they regulate. We see how far that went when ATT was allowed to be a video provider here.
And we see how much VZ has been held up to anything they advertise and promise as well.
pay off Ohio and get what you want done. Especially since the PUC hasnt had anyone new in it for a while. | |
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spewak
R.I.P Dadkins
Premium
join:2001-08-07
Elk Grove, CA
·SureWest Internet
·FrontierNet Intern..
| No, No, No! When Verizon divested their landline networks in Maine, New Hampshire and Vermont last year, the result was a largely dysfunctional company named Fairpoint Communications that struggled under the load and has very serious problems.
One could theoretically replace the above named dysfunctional company as "Frontier Communications".
Frontier is good at marginalising communications in the Rural market. They are stingy in their upgrades, and are overpriced due to the lock they have on their markets. Well, that is until a FIOS type company comes along and hits them in their wallets.
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The weekend is here, grab a can of beer! | |
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See 6 replies to this post |
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KDog
@comcast.net
| Poor Northern NE Fairpoint can't even take out the trash. The migration from VZ to them was horrible. Some businesses were shut down for a few weeks because of the backhaul issues. Millions of dollars lost.
The only question is when is it going to end. Fairpoint is still a disaster.
This whole divesture is a typical VZ fraud to dump debit and unprofitable markets so they don't have to waste money upgrading equipment that will never pay for itself.
Fairpoint will never recover.
And if you don't live in the areas effected by VZ's trash dumping on fairpoint your opinion doesn't matter since you clearly have no idea until you live it.
I think the cable companies are the better of the 2 evils personally. | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA | Re: Poor Northern NE No I don't, But I do live in a Rural area that VZ possibly wants to take to the dump and bury like the Dog they are possibly looking like.  | |
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Sammer
join:2005-12-22
Canonsburg, PA
| West Virginia may be key to approval! Neither the WV Public Service Commission or Governor of WV seem to really like Verizon and it's very possible the WV public doesn't either. It would be easy for them to tell Verizon where to go except for one thing, Verizon has been pulling profits out of the state for several years and not maintaining their WV network. Before the very distant second largest phone company in the state becomes the largest you can bet they want that cash Verizon took out back (as in real cash not just stock or Frontier debt obligations) in WV. The other 13 states may have a relatively small proportion of their population effected but WV is in exactly the same boat as Hawaii and the northern New England states were. | |
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| | patcat88
join:2002-04-05
Jamaica, NY
| Re: West Virginia may be key to approval! said by mikedz4 : He did assure me that when they do there will be 5 or 6 public hearings and I told him I wanted frontier to assure verizon customers that they will continue to upgrade verizon's lines in the state, that they will offer comparable service for comparable prices and that within 5 or 6 years they will bring fiber services to the state. I've been to these public hearings with the PUC, its just for citizens to scream like the mentally ill in an insane assylum in a padded cell in a straight jacket. Unless you work with minority elementary school children (and actually bring a bunch of them to read bias speeches the kids wrote supporting some corporation or business model after watching indoctrination videos at school/after school/community centers by PR reps), or your a representative from a fortune 100, they will not say a word except "thank you, you time is up, the next speaker is ___________". | |
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dhudson1984
join:2008-01-04
Charleston, WV
| WV my contact at vz told me that it could still go the other way and don't read too much into this right now and just wait for the details. he said there are also other companies out there who could do fiber. the main one could be fibernet (wv owned company). if this deal goes through, fibernet could take the chance and run fiber to the last mile and do fttp. wvfibernet.net | |
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yolarry
join:2007-12-29
Creston, WV
 ·HughesNet Satellit..
| Re: WV said by dhudson1984 :my contact at vz told me that it could still go the other way and don't read too much into this right now and just wait for the details. he said there are also other companies out there who could do fiber. the main one could be fibernet (wv owned company). if this deal goes through, fibernet could take the chance and run fiber to the last mile and do fttp. wvfibernet.net I have Fibernet over verizon line. They are real people and GREAT Tech Support! WV will have a treat because frontier HQ is in this state gets along with legislatures very well. | |
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rims
join:2000-10-22
Phoenix, AZ
| Dream On Anybody who thinks Frontier will improve the general state of these networks doesnt understand that running rural networks is not and never has been profitable. Rural networks have always been subsidized. The only game to play here is run the copper for cash, until it is dead. | |
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spewak
R.I.P Dadkins
Premium
join:2001-08-07
Elk Grove, CA
·SureWest Internet
·FrontierNet Intern..
| Re: Dream On said by rims :Anybody who thinks Frontier will improve the general state of these networks doesnt understand that running rural networks is not and never has been profitable. Rural networks have always been subsidized. The only game to play here is run the copper for cash, until it is dead. Hey rims,
hotboiinc is all confused. He is under the delusion that Frontier will actually upgrade or change directions away from copper. I had a good laugh at his preposterous statement.
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The weekend is here, grab a can of beer! | |
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Neoistheone
join:2007-01-13
Tornado, WV
·Verizon Online DSL
| Damn So this means that West Virginia will be stuck in the dark ages then.
I'm just wondering how bad/good frontier will be because I really don't want to call siddenlink, plus techs and people working for the local verizon call center was (was) hinting around to a small deployment of FIOS in Charleston.
I really dont like being told that my money is good enough. And that's how I feel about that or better yet, being sold like live stock.
I really liked my Verizon service....
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When you ASSUME, you make an ASS out of U and ME. | |
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Aspus
@verizon.net
| Who should be worried.. The people that should be worried in this are the CLECS.. Frontier will not have to play nice with all the companies that currently leach off the VZ Network in these markets. Frontier will raise the rates on the CLECS and run them out of business.. Cable will still be a threat, but they can only handle so many customers on the network and that will be a far less impact once Frontier starts taking back all the CLEC customers.. WV was only 1 of 3 profitable States that VZ has, so this was not about selling off non-profitable networks, this is about getting rid of all the regulation they have to deal with. | |
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Omne
join:2000-09-22
Dunbar, WV | Re: Who should be worried.. WV wasn't supposed to be part of the deal. But,Frontier wouldn't do it unless WV was included god help us. I hope the PSC looks at the other deals Verizon has done lately and refuses to sign off on this all this does is make sure WV never sees FIOS. | |
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yolarry
join:2007-12-29
Creston, WV
·HughesNet Satellit..
| Re: Who should be worried.. said by Omne :WV wasn't supposed to be part of the deal. But,Frontier wouldn't do it unless WV was included god help us. I hope the PSC looks at the other deals Verizon has done lately and refuses to sign off on this all this does is make sure WV never sees FIOS. Even with Verzion we wont see fios until 2100
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HN7000S - 99 West 1370 MHz - Pro - installed October 2007 - Linksys WRT54G V8 - Xbox 360, PSP-1001 CFW - 2 Vista Desktops - 1 XP Desktop - 1 vista Acer Aspire 3680 laptop | |
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SuperWISP
join:2007-04-17
Laramie, WY
1 edit | The regulators should scotch this deal. Frontier is known to be one of the ILECs which is the most hostile to all competition — be it from wireless ISPs or cellular carriers or cable operators. It has, in particular, been known to gouge them on backhaul — AKA “special access.” The government should not regulate broadband, but it should step in to prevent anticompetitive behavior. If Frontier takes over these areas, competitors' bandwidth costs will be astronomical and there will be no competition. Frontier must not be allowed to snuff out broadband or wireless competition via anti-competitive tactics, as it has done to date. Therefore, it should not be allowed to take over these regions from Verizon. | |
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| PDXPLT
join:2003-12-04
Banks, OR
| Re: The regulators should scotch this deal. said by SuperWISP :The government should not regulate broadband, but it should step in to prevent anticompetitive behavior. Uh, "stepping in to prevent anticompetitive behavior" is called "regulation", dude.
You mean government should regulate in ways that you consider favorable to you, and not regulate in ways that doesn't give you any economic gain. | |
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golfball11
@ipfw.edu
| Thoughts Regulators will approve the deal even though the vast majority of consumers who are knowlegeable about these things are in the minority. All consumers would have to put a vote to the regulators to get them to change there actions.
Money = power
power = greed
greed = wanting more
wanting more = ????? | |
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SuperJoker
join:2005-11-21
Yermo, CA | Of course If It were to happen, Frontier Jokes Of course If It were to happen, Frontier Jokes might start happening, If It hasn't already that is.  | |
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vzengineer
join:2009-06-18
Wheeling, WV
| fibernet,fronteir,verizon It's over Johnny for wv if this deal goes through. Fibernet will not bring any type of FIOS, they probably won't survive, rumor they are filing suit to stop this deal. Fronteir unless given free stimulus money won't further DSL in WV. VZ has not upgraded the last areas for dsl because to remote to expensive, not enough customers. Vz would have brought FIOS to WV's more densely populated metro areas. If deal goes through big winner Comcrap,fronteir aka 2 cans and a string will raise rates,will have far worse service than vz has now. 40% of wv vz workers retiring between now and next yr.fronteir will be slow to replace if at all. fronteir will go same route as fairpoint, teetering on bankruptcy as line loss to cable and cell depletes them | |
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Will Regulators Approve Verizon/Frontier Deal?
