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 |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA edit: November 23rd, @01:39PM
| Re: NAB says emails legit Washington Post only got a hold of 1 out of 60 that would confirm they sent the email. Looks like the NAtB is full of crap as usual. | |
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 |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA | Re: NAB says emails legit More like if the RIAA pirated their own stuff then said "See...look how many pirates there are!" | |
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  ztmike Premium join:2001-08-02
·Comcast
·AT&T Midwest
| bah Sadly i see them merging sooner or later, when that happens you can probably hear more ads and more cost of service, not to mention probably prices of radios will up go. -- "I am the worst president in U.S history, I'm either stupid or dumb most of the time, but people still believe me." George W. Bush | |
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join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| Re: bah said by kfsutops :said by ztmike :Sadly i see them merging sooner or later, when that happens you can probably hear more ads and more cost of service, not to mention probably prices of radios will up go. Oh but no...everyone says that this is good. It will lower prices. Bullshit. I agree. It is going to raise rates considerably. I hadn't even thought of the commercial free aspect until you mentioned it. I hate this even more now. But unfortunately, it will go through. I can't wait to hear all the crying idiots when they start raising prices after six months. You do realize if there isn't a merger within a few years one if not both will be out of business anyways. Then what will happen to prices? | |
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 |  |  |  |  BF69
join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| Re: bah said by kfsutops :said by BF69 :You do realize if there isn't a merger within a few years one if not both will be out of business anyways. Then what will happen to prices? So what? Prices will be an non-issue then. If they can't survive in the market they chose, then their business models were flawed from the beginning. My point was if one did happen to survive then the so called price protection of "competition" would be gone anyways. This is one of the few circumstances where a monopoly would not necessarily mean higher prices.
A merged company would still have to abide by the market. If they price their radios and subscription fees to high then people would look for other sources for radio because they do exist. | |
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 |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA
| Which begs the question...why would the NAtB not want the merger. If what you say is true, a merger would result in higher prices which would be good for the terrestrial broadcasters.
The fact that the NAtB is fighting this tooth and nail tells me the opposite would be the case. XM and Sirius could save a bundle combining resources and not having to advertise against each other. Satellite would still have to compete with not only OTA radio, but all the other sources of mobile entertainment (eg iPods). | |
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 |  |  |  UofMiamiGrad Premium join:2001-02-03 Great Neck, NY
| Re: bah said by DotMac :The fact that the NAtB is fighting this tooth and nail tells me the opposite would be the case. XM and Sirius could save a bundle combining resources and not having to advertise against each other. Satellite would still have to compete with not only OTA radio, but all the other sources of mobile entertainment (eg iPods). I agree, the more NAB fights the merger, the more the merger makes sense. The NAB doesn't want competition that a combined XM/Sirius company would give them & they know it. This is just the latest crap the NAB is pulling. | |
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join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| said by DotMac :Satellite would still have to compete with not only OTA radio, but all the other sources of mobile entertainment (eg iPods). Don't forget HD radio which gives you the same sound quality as satelite except it's FREE. | |
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 |  |  |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA
| Re: bah I was going to list it but figured someone would post that HD-Radio is still OTA radio 
I like HD-Radio in terms of quality, but unfortunately it still suffers from all the commercials and idiot program directors that have totally trashed Los Angeles radio. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  Austinloop
join:2001-08-19 Austin, TX
| Re: bah Also, let us not forget, in addition the the ills that BF69 mentions, after you drive a certain distance, it is back to the hunt for a station that has the type of music/entertainment that one wants. The hunt can be a frustrating experience in some of the more rural portions of the country. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  BF69
join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| said by DotMac :I was going to list it but figured someone would post that HD-Radio is still OTA radio  I like HD-Radio in terms of quality, but unfortunately it still suffers from all the commercials and idiot program directors that have totally trashed Los Angeles radio. No such thing as a free lunch. Don't like commericials go pay service. Want free radio put up with ads. Just the way it is. Radio, TV, internet with very few exceptions no one is trying to entertain you just to be nice. It's about making money. Always has been always will be. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA | Re: bah Ads are fine but some stations run 20 minutes of commercials an hour and to me that is excessive. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  BF69
join:2004-07-28 Camden, TN
| Re: bah said by DotMac :Ads are fine but some stations run 20 minutes of commercials an hour and to me that is excessive. That's actually less than TV. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |   aaron8301 I can't get myself to go away.
join:2005-01-03 Clarkston, WA | Re: bah Actually the typical one hour TV show is about 44 minutes long (download an ep off the internet, commercial-free, and they are about 44 mins, depending on the show), leaving 16 minutes of commercials. So that is much MORE than TV. | |
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 |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| said by kfsutops :said by ztmike :Sadly i see them merging sooner or later, when that happens you can probably hear more ads and more cost of service, not to mention probably prices of radios will up go. Oh but no...everyone says that this is good. It will lower prices. Bullshit. I agree. It is going to raise rates considerably. I hadn't even thought of the commercial free aspect until you mentioned it. I hate this even more now. But unfortunately, it will go through. I can't wait to hear all the crying idiots when they start raising prices after six months. Hey tool , costs always go up. So does your pay , to think they can keep the prices the same for the next 20 years is both idiotic and down right deficient of you.
First the RIAA is getting paid hand over fist by the sat rad providers. And they are still making a profit. It is only a matter of time before they want more and the sat providers have to raise rates.
With that being said most people against the merger don't have common sense. Right now the RIAA is collecting double regular radio on both providers. Now we shut down one company and we get a major cut in costs. We don't keep all the channels and we merge the content down to get the content on both sets of radios , they still own the birds and the bands. So they can max out both as well as thier local repeater network and provide the customers who actually pay for the service a better bang for your buck.
I bought a new Honda it's locked in with XM no converter yet. I have a 3 year free sub to XM , it sucks. I installed sirius at a big cost. Most customers are like me and don't want to be tied to one manufacturer. But wait this is bad for us customers. I mean really when the xm module on my honda is $1200 and the sirius one for a car of the same size and cost is $250.
Yeah this is bad for consumers geez what was I thinking. -- "It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" | |
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 |  |  |   kfsutops Premium join:2002-08-19 Brandon, FL clubs: 
·RoadRunner Cable
| Re: bah said by BosstonesOwn :[ I bought a new Honda it's locked in with XM no converter yet. I have a 3 year free sub to XM , it sucks. I installed sirius at a big cost. Most customers are like me and don't want to be tied to one manufacturer. But wait this is bad for us customers. I mean really when the xm module on my honda is $1200 and the sirius one for a car of the same size and cost is $250. Yeah this is bad for consumers geez what was I thinking. How are you locked in when buying a Honda? You just tell them you don't want it installed. If they want to sell the car, they would take it out. You aren't locked in to shiat.
Personally, I don't care about the RIAA and what they get paid. Why should satellite radio be any different than satellite TV. They wouldn't let the satellite TV companies merge, so why should this be any different. With DirectTV and Dish you are required to by separate equipment. What's the difference?
Just because they throw the argument "one of us will be out of business" shouldn't be the only reason to allow these companies to merge. They have already issued what the price structure would be. Guess what? It's already basically a price increase. You are paying less for lesser content, but if you want the supposed benefits (dual programming) it's going to cost you a lot more. Oh yeah, and don't forget the stuff you just put in your honda won't work either. So you are going to have to pay more for equipment again. -- "There are no stupid questions, but there are a LOT of inquisitive idiots" | |
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 |  |  |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
edit: November 23rd, @03:41PM
| Re: bah You must not have ever bought a new car. You can only sit down and look at what you want if they can't find one like it they don't just pull what you don't want out. They try and find one like it or you order one.
And I wasn't waiting 3 months for a new CRV from japan just over a satellite tuner , when my other car was totalled.
Oh yeah and the same equipment will work for quite some time. They would have to purchase all new equipment for the subs. And it's called planned obsolescence lots of companies do it. You want the newer features you buy the newer gear you don't then you don't get them. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Re: bah My Bmw 5 sucked compared to this Honda. They wouldn't take the Sirius out because they had to deprogram the computer , all because I wanted to keep the navigation.
And yes it was a 2008 5X series.
Don't get so high and mighty about a car because it is a BMW. Because you don't know what else we drive 
BTW don't feel to bad for being made a fool of. But That is what different from a heavy populated place like metro Boston compared to Florida. Here you don't get stuff taken out or even the programming removed. Because some one is right behind you ready to plunk down more for the same car.
Unlike Tampa Metro where people actually have a choice in what they buy and get in a car. -- "It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Re: bah Depends. I bought the BMW having driven only a 525 from 2001 figured they would be the same. Until I drove it and figured I didn't like it , so I gave it to my wife.
I bought a Honda CRV because I drive 40 miles each way to work and I am a vital employee, so I must be there even in blizzard conditions. I needed all wheel drive and decent gas mileage. Gas here is hitting 3.15 a gallon and a BMW that gets 18 if it's lucky is much better suited to my wife's short drives.
Plus I find the people who both sell and drive them tend to be stuck up ass holes who think they are gods for owning a BMW. Needless to say I am still looking for a dealership willing to take that thing off my hands in favor of a Acura MDX or Mercedes M class. I will miss the I drive but it's a small loss to get away from such a car. -- "It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA
edit: November 25th, @04:25PM
| said by kfsutops :Funny. I don't feel like I have been made fool of. Especially from a guy that has to use a North versus South argument. And...people that by BMW's don't buy Honda's. I had a BMW before I bought my Acura. The BMW was overpriced and it's fit and finish sucked ass but bought it shopping with my d!ck. I'm much happier with my Acura. The only 2 things I don't like about it are FWD and XM. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Re: bah Well I hate XM too , but I love the AWD Honda makes some damn fine cars. Especially compared to the new BMW's and Jaguars whose quality has really fell as of late. -- "It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA
| Re: bah I had a 98RL and then made the mistake of leaving for BMW but came back for the 04 TL + later a Comptech supercharger so I haven't yet had a taste of SH-AWD. But I only have a couple of payments to go on the TL so a return to the RL may be in my future. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |  |  |  |  thevorpal
join:2007-11-16 Endicott, NY
| And...people that by BMW's don't buy Honda's.
Care to explain that statement? I'm looking into purchasing a BMW and a CRV this Spring.
Well, either a CRV or an F-150. But I'm sure the pickup truck doesn't fit into your comparison either. | |
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 |  |  |  |   bleearg13
join:2001-03-03 Gaithersburg, MD
| said by kfsutops :Personally, I don't care about the RIAA and what they get paid. Why should satellite radio be any different than satellite TV. They wouldn't let the satellite TV companies merge, so why should this be any different. With DirectTV and Dish you are required to by separate equipment. What's the difference? The difference between the two cases may not be clear initially, but there are differences. One issue, from what I understand in the DirecTV/Echostar deal, had to do with price discrimination. With satellite TV, they beam into local markets, competing directly with cable. This presents different pricing structures for satellite TV, depending upon the market into which they are broadcasting. If cable has deep market penetration, rates could be lowered; if cable his weak market penetration, rates could be increased. With satrad, this issue of localization is non-existent. Satellite radio competes the same way in Chicago as it does anywhere else in the country, against several radio stations, iPods, CD players, tape decks, and cellphones.
There are other minor differences, mostly focusing around the type of competition in the market. With DirecTV and Echostar, the competing product itself was defined as "television services". With satrad, the product is defined as "mobile entertainment", which consists of everything I mentioned above. If the two satellite radio companies were mainly competing against *other* satellite radio companies, then there would be major cause for concern that this newly merged company would create an unfair advantage. If satrad's only competition was terrestrial radio, then there *could* be a case against the merger. But again - they don't compete only with radio, but other forms of entertainment. | |
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 |  |  |  |  thevorpal
join:2007-11-16 Endicott, NY
| Re: bah is a big cost? Wow, how the hell did you afford the CAR?!?
Aside from your smartass remark, I'd like to point out that you can buy an entire vehicle for the cost of the two satellite receivers.
$1500 wasted is nothing to sniff at. | |
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 |  |  |  |  |   aaron8301 I can't get myself to go away.
join:2005-01-03 Clarkston, WA
·CableOne
edit: November 26th, @12:31PM
| Re: bah Did you go to the link that I included? There is no reason to pay that much for a satellite receiver. $1500 wasted is just that: wasted.
Edit: I see the link I included didn't work... he he he... HERE IT IS... stupid HTML code... | |
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 |   hobgoblin Sortof Agoblin Premium join:2001-11-25 Orchard Park, NY clubs:
| said by ztmike :Sadly i see them merging sooner or later, when that happens you can probably hear more ads and more cost of service, not to mention probably prices of radios will up go. As opposed to one of them going out of business.
Hob -- "A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds." - Ralph Waldo Emerson
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 |  |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA | Re: bah Or both going out of business. | |
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 |   bleearg13
join:2001-03-03 Gaithersburg, MD
| I will gladly pay $12.95 to get only 5 channels out of the 100+ on my Sirius radio. In fact, I would probably pay even more money just to not have to suffer through the garbage that terrestrial radio plays, should satellite radio tank, as an industry. | |
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  AtomicZero
join:2004-11-24 West Palm Beach, FL
·Comcast
| IMHO: I don't mind Do people care/ oppose this merger? why? I don't think I care one way or the other since I don't have a subscription to either. I do care tho if it means no satellite radio at all since listen to XM once in a while with my Winamp, and I like the fact that they have an anime SDTK station... I think that's cool and maybe I'd be upset if that was gone.....maybe. I think the whole satellite radio thing was a great idea since people could play stuff on there that the boring regular radio stations would not or refused to play. | |
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 |  fiberguy My views are my own. Premium join:2005-05-20
| Re: IMHO: I don't mind If you don't have the service then why are you spouting up about it with "I don't care?" seems silly ..
XM isn't all about "just something new that others don't play".. there's many reasons why XM is nice to have.
1) It's clear 2) You can carry the same signal all over the country. Some of us who drive like to listen to talk programming and not have to change the station every 90 minutes or less. 3) Access to programming that ISN'T available on the air. 4) Subscription to lines of music that people may like but don't want to pay to buy only to wear tired of. 5) Sports 6) Being able to have access to the data when something comes on that you've never heard before so you know the artist and album..
..just to name a few.
In my opinion, I get value out of it.. but on the other hand, I find the price to be a wee bit to high... I think they need to bring the price down to about half. They'd make up in volume what they'd lose in revenue and bring more consumers to the brand.
There are also many people out there that are fed up with the radio and are not MP3 people - usually the older crowd above 30, so XM provides a good alternative.
In the end.. I really don't think most people will care about the merger OTHER than the fact that it's "here we go again.. another change I have to deal with" situation.. I think people are burned out with their providers changing. -- "Complaining is the least path of resistance for the self-serving, the lazy, and Im told its a womans prerogative..." | |
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 |  |  BosstonesOwn
join:2002-12-15 Everett, MA clubs:
·Comcast Formerly ..
| Re: IMHO: I don't mind This has to be one of the first times I have ever agreed with you 100 %. This may be some sort of record breaking event.
One thing I never got about sat radio is why not sell the radios for a profit. Charge licensing on the logos and collect like that.sort of like how the dvd empire works.
Once it's thrown onto every single radio id imagine the costs coming in from radio sales all over would make much more profit.
But then I think it falls under the rules and has to be censored like current terrestrial radio. -- "It's always funny until someone gets hurt......and then it's absolutely friggin' hysterical!" | |
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  DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA
edit: November 23rd, @01:35PM
| NAtB Why the NAtB should have any say in this merger is perplexing. The National Association of terrestrial Broadcasters is the organization representing XM and Sirius' competitors...of course they're against anything that would make XM and Sirius more competitive.
They bitch about the merger and they want full FCC censorship of satellite radio.
Screw the NAtB. OTA radio sucks.
Meanwhile it's shocking to me that the Exxon Mobil merger gets through in near record time and Sirius or XM still can't get a yes or no answer after months and months. Just goes to show exactly who runs Washington. Looks like Mel needs to pony up some big bribes if he ever wants to see an answer. | |
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  Maggs Premium join:2002-11-29 Woodside, NY clubs: | Why doesn't the NAB buy Sirus and XM They can have their cake and eat it too. | |
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 |   DotMac Shill H8r Premium join:2007-10-26 Huntington Beach, CA | Re: Why doesn't the NAB buy Sirus and XM The NAtB is an organization like the MPAA or RIAA. They can't buy anything...they're just a lobbying outfit. Individual radio operations like Clear Channel could I suppose, but even when losing money Sirius and XM would be very expensive. | |
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  XM25TheBlend
@comcast.net | Screw the NAB! I stopped listening to broadcast radio years ago. Gobdam broadcasters pump the volume up on the commercials and their obnoxious djs are always talking over the music. Screw that! I'll gladly pay for commercial-free music. | |
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 |  See 10 replies to this post |
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  homenode Premium join:2007-11-18 Bullhead City, AZ
| SatRad, the NAB and who messed up I wrote an editorial in the Radio Broadcasters Review about a year ago castigating the NAB members for their stupidity in getting into a fight against SatRad in the first place.
Terrestrial radio has had the opportunity for several years to embrace multi-channel digital broadcasting and have a tool to compete against the SatRad providers. Instead the NAB fought HD radio tooth and nail (just like the NAB fought OTA HDTV) until SatRad grew to be a serious competitor.
Terrestrial radio had the opportunity to craft the HD radio laws to permit them to offer subscription services, to design the receivers to buffer/replay or alert when songs or genres were broadcast, to use a FREE subscription model with the buffer/replay system to utilize demographic data for target advertising to nearly a 1:1 audience, and to make use of the already predominant broadcast syndicates to provide - effectively - nearly 50 channels of targeted radio nation wide. It's not like they didn't know about these opportunities - I, for one, explained it in print to the industry.
Here's a consumer view of what they chose to throw away:
* Local market subscriptions for special programming like Jazz or blues, etc. that are not generally available;
* Reduce advertising to less than 10% of airtime by providing advertisers a more precise market audience than a Nielsen cume (allowing higher advert rates because of greater sales generation);
* Provide seamless nationwide coverage for the major genres - effectively creating a new nation-wide market segmentation model - that is only NOW becoming understood.
And, to answer the question "Why doesn't the NAB just BUY XM/Sirius:
The terrestrial radio market is nearly DEAD. Value of broadcast stations both in and outside of major markets has plummeted. Yes, there are still some "mega-deals" occurring in the top 5 markets (NYC, LAX, CHI, WDC, SFO), but outside of these markets you can buy an AM station for well under $100k and an FM for just a little bit more.
There is NO MONEY in the terrestrial broadcast pot to buy out competitors.
Finally, my Spring 2006 "prediction" of the future of Broadcasting in 2015:
The "Big Four" broadcasters - AT&T, Sprint, Verizon and Microsoft - provide 70% of all terrestrial broadcast content;
30% of broadcast content is obtained by consumers from "local" content providers via Bluetooth and WiFi "zone" broadcasts operated by individuals, clubs and retailers;
95% of the US population gets its entertainment via "real-time Pod-casting" on their broad-band/Bluetooth/WiFi mobile phones that "dock" in their vehicles and homes;
The US Department of Commerce's Traffic Watch and Navigation satellites "Rock" and "Roll" are replaced after 20+ years of service with new satellites "Lost" and "Found";
The AM and FM spectrum is reallocated to Amateur Radio to develop a use for this "unused and useless low-information-density" spectrum;
Hope this throws a different perspective on things... -- Brett Brennan VP/CITO Homenode Group Inc. | |
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 mikabl Premium join:2002-09-29 Rockford, IL | Merger or Bankruptcy, only one company in a few years! Merger approved?
one company.
Merger denied? 1 company goes under and it's bought out by the other (or a third party front).
one company!
that's what I see happening | |
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 |  Lysis
join:2005-03-30 Brooklyn, NY
| Re: Merger or Bankruptcy, only one company in a few years!< |
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