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Bicephale
join:2005-09-24
canada

1 edit

Bicephale to TilhasBB

Member

to TilhasBB

Re: RF Choking (on the WAN side)

About using the lower spectrum, i bet it would be nice to read
TakeTheFifth about it. As you know, the TP-Link TD-8841 (A)
allows its owner to deallocate bins and i read recently that this
might have a similar effect than RF Choking...
planiwa
join:2009-02-19
Toronto M5S

1 edit

planiwa

Member

And perhaps without the negative (side-)effects of RF choking on the high-end RF-signal being choked.

(RF-choking of RF-signals to combat RF-noise seems like radiation therapy trying to kill the disease faster than the host. )

TilhasBB
Premium Member
join:2000-08-05
canada

TilhasBB to Bicephale

Premium Member

to Bicephale
Can you resync get your line stats.
Then put a normal phone cable (no RF chokes) just on the power. and resync.

I have a feeling the ST516 Power is whats causing a few of the gaps. If RF choking cleans them up, it would be a no brainer to do one very modem

Bicephale
join:2005-09-24
canada

1 edit

Bicephale

Member

Click for full size
GNet BB0060B vs 'DMT v2.20' capture (2009-Jul-20)
Hi TilHasBB,

I guess you may not have noticed this but the ST546v6 records
made using 'DMT v7.35' are over one year and a half old as it
was done during the 2007-2008 winter. My phone-line has some
different characteristics now because i've moved to another city
one year ago (in July 2008). My measuring method has changed
as well since i no longer trust single 'DMT' readings, even if there
was only one "reset" event as displayed on additional captures.

This month's records show that the Error Rate counter doesn't
represent the situation accurately at all times. For example, the
evening of July 10 was real "quiet" while the early morning of
July 9 proved to be extremely "noisy". The same is true of my DS
SNR Margin level which varied somewhere between 4 and 7.5 dB.

Consequently, it seemed to me that one reasonable solution was
to use six-days "averaged" curves for my late comparison. It's a
time-consuming process but i no longer have to worry because
of marginal events which might corrupt my captures otherwise.



If i follow that same logic, the 'DMT' spectral response shown
in a capture will vary as a function of the date and time when
it was taken. This could give rise to a stimulating project but
the SpreadSheet averaging work involved can be overwhelming.

I'm inclosing a 'DMT' capture of my un-tweaked GNet BB0060B,
i put it on-line around 20:30 last night and looking at it you'll
see what i mean by "variations": it's like i've moved elsewhere!

I'm now trying to imagine a way to shield my damned drop-line,
actually: it seems it keeps degrading while i keep cleaning it up!



In any case, to answer your questions, there's an RF Choke on
every transformer used by my MoDems already. There's a strong
AM station around here (CHRC 800 KHz), i'll try to find out if RF
Choking as a significant effect on the corresponding bins...

...stay tuned...


TilhasBB
Premium Member
join:2000-08-05
canada

1 edit

TilhasBB

Premium Member

If your really into noise.
Make sure you have None of these fluorescent light bulbs.
»steadfastfinances.com/bl ··· bulb.jpg

LOL, they are the worst enemy.

»www.gelighting.com/na/ho ··· pact.htm

Can compact fluorescent bulbs create interference with electronic equipment, such as radios?
Many electronic devices, such as radios, televisions, wireless telephones, and remote controls, use infrared light to transmit signals. Infrequently, these types of electronic devices accidentally interpret the infrared light coming from a compact fluorescent bulb as a signal, causing the electronic device to temporarily malfunction or stop working. (For example, your television might suddenly change channels.) Fortunately, this only happens when light is produced at the same wavelength as the electronic device signals, which is rare.

To reduce the chance of interference, avoid placing compact fluorescent bulbs near these kinds of electronic devices. If interference occurs, move the bulb away from the electronic device, or plug either the light fixture or the electronic device into a different outlet.

check this out
»brneurosci.org/fluoresce ··· nce.html
"This RFI appears at 30-40 kHz intervals up to about 500 kHz. "
Ooo wait thats where you have the best frequencies for your DSL..lol

Bicephale
join:2005-09-24
canada

Bicephale

Member

Hi again,

Error Rates aka "noise" have been the focus point of my efforts
for quite a while now... Here's the 1st piece of evidence which
confirmed my doubts about a dimmer located downstairs: this is
the instant when i've predicted & captured what was comming:

http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1352229~64a8c9aafedbc90f6f6961a9c2db05e4/VelCom%20-%20Beast%20Away!%20@%2023%20h%20(Voice%20Print,%202008-Sep-20)%20.GIF
From the ground up!, Bicephale, 2008-Sep-21


All my dimmers are from Cooper Wiring Devices (Catalog #6441)
as i get no problem with these. In the begining, i thought they
were auto-transformers but it's not the case: their decoupling
is simply done properly, i guess. Perhaps fluorescent lamps do
include bad apples indeed, i'm happy not to have experienced it
1st hand. In fact, i welcome the next generation of LED lamps...

Bicephale

Bicephale to TilhasBB

Member

to TilhasBB
Click for full size
Siemens SS4200 - 15 Turns (2009-Jul-22 2h09)
Click for full size
Siemens SS4200 - No Choke (2009-Jul-22 1h33)
Click for full size
Thomson ST516 Lin-PSU - 15 T (2009-Jul-22 1h45)
Click for full size
Thomson ST516 Lin-PSU - No Choke (2009-Jul-22 1h06)
Click for full size
Thomson ST516 Sw-PSU - 15 T (2009-Jul-22 1h52)
Click for full size
Thomson ST516 Sw-PSU - No Choke (2009-Jul-22 1h14)
Click for full size
Thomson ST546 Lin-PSU - 15 T (2009-Jul-22 0h45)
Click for full size
Thomson ST546 Lin-PSU - No Choke (2009-Jul-22 0h54)
Click for full size
TP-Link TD-8841 - 15 Turns (2009-Jul-22 2h02)
Click for full size
TP-Link TD-8841 - No Choke (2009-Jul-22 1h26)
Hi TilHasBB,

It seemed tonight my phone-line was going to remain quiet so
here are 'DMT' captures with and without RF Choking. All of my
MoDems have RF Chokes on their power leads. I'm using some
five inches of wiring between the RJ-11 connector box and my
POTS Splitter, the WAN-side feed cable is about the same (if
you exclude what's wound around the toroïdal core, when such
a core is being used, of course!)...

I couldn't generate captures with zero settle time so i got that
roughly equal to five minutes for all of the samples. In my opinion
that's simply insufficient: personally i'd have prefered at least a
few hours but then the test would have required too much time!


TilhasBB
Premium Member
join:2000-08-05
canada

TilhasBB

Premium Member

Great work !

I am not seeing the choke do much difference as much as the first pictures. Your right it might only make a difference with errors in the long run which we won't see.

But your line is no longer as bad as it was before. I don't think the chokes are even necessary. Your line is pretty good.

Bicephale
join:2005-09-24
canada

1 edit

Bicephale

Member

Hi TilHasBB,

The problem is it takes time for noise to knock down a few bins,
fresh captures like these may be useful to compare the devices
but it doesn't tell much about RF Choking... Most unfortunately,
i'm afraid the situation has got worst since i began to work on
my phone-line, last year, as i no longer see "flat-liners" like this:

http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1333667~81932eded03933f888f9ff949f52065a/VelCom%20-%20DMT%20(GNet%20GBB2060-Xi,%202008-Jul-30)%20.GIF
From the ground up!, Bicephale, 2008-Jul-31

I wish those days had lasted forever, here's what i get instead:

http://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/1451684~53f1a4136832ced03f580a2b633badf5/VelCom%20-%20Limoilou%20-%20The%20Next%20Summer%20.GIF
From the ground up!, Bicephale, 2009-Jul-22


That's why i've reached a stage where shielding is an option
i'm now seriously considering... Other than that, i'd need the
drop-line to be changed for a twisted-pair!!!



In the meantime, i don't believe RF Choking has no effect, as
i've demonstrated previously:

»/r0/do ··· )%20.GIF