Topic 'Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights' in forum 'Home Improvement' - dslreports.com

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Tue, 01 Jul 2014 13:13:15 EDT

nunya posted : Thanks, I edited that.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Tue, 01 Jul 2014 12:58:14 EDT

iknow_t posted :

said by nunya:

You can stick a new MH lamp on a MV ballast. The ballast has to match the lamp. In this case, it would be silly to do (financially). If you are talking about swapping ballasts, you may as well get a new fixture.

you mean can't, right?

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Tue, 01 Jul 2014 11:17:51 EDT

nunya posted : You cannot stick a new MH lamp on a MV ballast. The ballast has to match the lamp. In this case, it would be silly to do (financially). If you are talking about swapping ballasts, you may as well get a new fixture.
--
...or the sheriff will grab ya and the boys will bring you down. The next thing you know, boy - oh you're prison bound...

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Tue, 01 Jul 2014 06:36:23 EDT

rody_44 posted : I can still outdo most 20 year olds as far as work goes. But trust me. Its a PIA, hauling them lights up and installing them. Its everything one handed and just plain akward as hell to work with.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Tue, 01 Jul 2014 06:32:30 EDT

rody_44 posted : I usally get the bulbs from a electronics supply company. Guess i will just take a bulb in and see what they say about changing bulb and ballast.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Tue, 01 Jul 2014 01:50:44 EDT

anon posted : The ballast would need to be changed as well... you could likely use the same fixture but the ballast and bulb would need to be replaced... if you go pulse start, the socket should be changed as well to a pulse start rated one (they go to 5kv when starting)

You maybe able to stick a MH bulb (same wattage but should be ~2x as bright) on the MV ballast if the ANSI(?) rating is the same but I would defer that to someone with more experience.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Mon, 30 Jun 2014 21:36:38 EDT

jrs8084 posted :

said by nunya:

Eh. It's not that bad. I can still outdo most 20 year olds.

You are lucky. I have a hard time going up on a step stool now without clinging to solid objects in total fear.

Last time I got up in a scissor lift I screamed to my coworker to "get me down!"

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Mon, 30 Jun 2014 21:28:56 EDT

Jack_in_VA posted :

said by nunya:

Eh. It's not that bad. I can still outdo most 20 year olds.

I bet you can't in thumb strength :D

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Mon, 30 Jun 2014 21:21:59 EDT

nunya posted : Eh. It's not that bad. I can still outdo most 20 year olds.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Mon, 30 Jun 2014 11:26:02 EDT

iknow_t posted :

said by rody_44:

Metered rate, You are saying i can just swap the bulbs and save money? The lights are heavy and while i installed them its out of the question for me to do it now. I just couldnt physically do it now. They were a bastard to do in my 30s. Impossible for me to do it now in my 50s because i must work off a ladder.

a boom lift is the way to go, carrying something like that up a ladder up that high is unsafe for any age. you can rent one from home depot for 4 hours minimum rental.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Mon, 30 Jun 2014 06:35:52 EDT

rody_44 posted : Metered rate, You are saying i can just swap the bulbs and save money? The lights are heavy and while i installed them its out of the question for me to do it now. I just couldnt physically do it now. They were a bastard to do in my 30s. Impossible for me to do it now in my 50s because i must work off a ladder.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Sun, 29 Jun 2014 18:52:34 EDT

anon posted : I can't really follow if you pay a flat rate or the metered amount...

If you pay the metered about, while you are up there you may want to take the MV out and replace them with LED or PSMH. PSMH is something like 2x as efficient... Not counting replacement cost but you could have 2 lights same brightness 1/2 the power usage...

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Sun, 29 Jun 2014 17:09:46 EDT

rody_44 posted : Thats a good idea. I think im going to go that route.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Sun, 29 Jun 2014 14:54:10 EDT

robbin posted : Since you have to climb again anyway, why don't you put a switch at the base of the pole which allows you to switch from one to two lights. You will still be able to use the house switch to turn them on and off.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Sun, 29 Jun 2014 09:21:02 EDT

rody_44 posted : They dont pay the electric, i do. Look at the pole, it has conduit that runs down to my house which is where the switch is. The second pole is a result of them saying i am NOT allowed to install lights on there pole and me saying if you place something on my property i get the final word.

Basically i installed them and they came and said i had to take them down. I said not happening without a court order. Since they were unable to supply me with a law stating i cant place a light on there pole. The answer was for them to install a second pole next to the original one and just insist i leave that one alone which i agreed to do.

I could have rented the light from them. But at the time they were only willing to supply one light and at the time i wanted 2 lights on the pole. Well i use to be able to rent it from them. They discontinued offering that now at all. the lights were put up at least twenty years ago by me. I was a little younger and while i dont mind climbing up to change out bulbs i was hoping to avoid actually making any wiring changes. Fiberglass ladder gets really heavy when you get well into the 50s. While they are regular mercury vapor lights. they are mercury vapor with flush mount bases which allows me to use a ladder to service them. While i originally wired them direct about ten years or so ago i wired a switch into the kitchen. Both are on the same switch tho and i only want one off as of now. I dont want to remove one as next year i might want two again.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:54:44 EDT

DataDoc posted :

said by rody_44:

any lights installed on poles have to be supplied by them and cost 75 dollars a month payable to them.

WOW! $75 a month! I rent an identical looking lamp on the pole in our front yard and it cost $5 a month. On from dusk to dawn and plenty bright over my 1 acre yard.
--
"Scientifically, no single episode of extreme weather, no storm, no flood, no drought can be said to have been caused by global climate change." - White House science adviser John P. Holdren

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:02:44 EDT

iknow_t posted :

said by rody_44:

No i dont own the pole. Electric company supplied both poles. But according to them i am not allowed to install lights on a pole owned by them. I argued the point and the end result was they came and installed a second pole next to the original pole. They claimed any lights installed on poles have to be supplied by them and cost 75 dollars a month payable to them. They just put up a second pole and said that under no condition can i put lights on it.They said for the 75 a month tho they pay electric for it and maintain it. Electric 20 years ago wasnt near as much tho plus they were only willing to put one light on it.. Verizon transferred both the cable and phone lines over.

I dont really know how many watts they are. I do know they have black solid cores and i thought thats what was used to identify the wattage. Lights are over 20 years old tho so now im wondering if i could cut the bill via changing the bulbs. Still leaves my original question tho of does the starter draw current even if the bulb is out of it. 20 years ago i wanted it lit up like daytime as i was reaching out to the road. Now i dont much care as long as its lit

now here's where it gets really confusing.. if they own both poles, and only they can install lights on it, and they pay for the electricity, how can you have a switch in your house to turn them off? and how could you be paying for the electric to run the lights? something don't make sense... if the pole that the light is mounted on is not yours, then you should NOT be climbing up it for anything!.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 17:38:56 EDT

rody_44 posted : Thanks. Guess that means another trip up than.

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 14:06:04 EDT

nunya posted : Yes, there is open circuit loss with any ballast. You should disconnect the fixture completely if you aren't using it.
You can't change the lamp wattage without changing the ballast to match. E.G., you'd be throwing good money after bad.
--
...or the sheriff will grab ya and the boys will bring you down. The next thing you know, boy - oh you're prison bound...

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 13:33:24 EDT

rody_44 posted : No i dont own the pole. Electric company supplied both poles. But according to them i am not allowed to install lights on a pole owned by them. I argued the point and the end result was they came and installed a second pole next to the original pole. They claimed any lights installed on poles have to be supplied by them and cost 75 dollars a month payable to them. They just put up a second pole and said that under no condition can i put lights on it.They said for the 75 a month tho they pay electric for it and maintain it. Electric 20 years ago wasnt near as much tho plus they were only willing to put one light on it.. Verizon transferred both the cable and phone lines over.

I dont really know how many watts they are. I do know they have black solid cores and i thought thats what was used to identify the wattage. Lights are over 20 years old tho so now im wondering if i could cut the bill via changing the bulbs. Still leaves my original question tho of does the starter draw current even if the bulb is out of it. 20 years ago i wanted it lit up like daytime as i was reaching out to the road. Now i dont much care as long as its lit

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 09:24:28 EDT

nunya posted : I haven't seen a 1000W MV lamp in about 10 years. I've never seen one in an open "street light" type fixture. I think the last place I saw them was a ball field - and they've long since been changed to MH.
Most of the "street lamp" type MV fixtures use a 75W - 175W lamp. I have seen 250W in larger fixtures. Can't say I recall finding a 400W MV street lamp fixture - but they probably exist.

Once they quit working, it's probably time to move on to something more efficient - Maybe LED, fluorescent, or HPS. MV lamps and ballasts were part of the 2008 "bulb ban".

Do you own the new pole next to it (with the extremely sloppy and improperly run CATV / phone wiring)? Is it time to do a pole transfer anyway? It might be an opportune time to upgrade.

My thing is this: I always hate to throw a good working fixture away. I'm cheap. It used to almost always cheaper to keep 'er. These days, it makes sense to let some fixtures go, even if they still work.
--
...or the sheriff will grab ya and the boys will bring you down. The next thing you know, boy - oh you're prison bound...

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 08:14:35 EDT

Jack_in_VA posted :

said by rody_44:

I only want one off. I light it up out there like its daylight. They are mercury vapor lights. They have the black core which means they are 1000 watt lights.

Most likely they are 175 watt if that. Definitely not 1000 watt

What to Do About Those Evil 175W Mercury Vapor Security Lights

Re: [Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 07:39:37 EDT

rody_44 posted : I only want one off. I light it up out there like its daylight. They are mercury vapor lights. They have the black core which means they are 1000 watt lights.

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 06:14:16 EDT

whizkid3 posted : Even if you are paying 18c per kWh; assuming the lights are 400W and on 10 hours a day, each light is only going to cost you $21.60 a month.

The first thing I wondered here (as did nunya), is why not simply disconnect one of the wires to the one light fixture to turn it off? If you are going to disect the light fixture, you might as well remove it. Put it back together and disconnect the one wire. Or better yet, wire it up with a switch so you can turn one or two fixtures on anytime you like.

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Fri, 27 Jun 2014 01:00:07 EDT

nunya posted : Unless those are both 400W fixtures (kind of doubt it), those lights are not using $50 worth of electricity each month.
If you want them off, why not do it correctly and disconnect the wire going to them?
Why not just use the switch? Seriously?

You could also update to fluorescent or LED.
--
...or the sheriff will grab ya and the boys will bring you down. The next thing you know, boy - oh you're prison bound...

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 23:49:29 EDT

Corehhi posted :

said by telco_mtl:

said by rody_44:

But thats probably because he gets to listen to me bitch about my 325 dollar electric bills.

the more i hang around here i thank my stars for cheap quebec power, my 150$ electric bill... and we heat with electricity

Wow. I use a heat pump year round and I'm luck to hit $160 without running the heat or AC.

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 23:24:25 EDT

telco_mtl posted :

said by rody_44:

But thats probably because he gets to listen to me bitch about my 325 dollar electric bills.

the more i hang around here i thank my stars for cheap quebec power, my 150$ electric bill... and we heat with electricity

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 23:10:03 EDT

JoelC707 posted : $325 a month? I'd love to have a power bill that small. Mine average $500 a month and based on some math, I pay 10.5C/kWh in winter and 12ish in summer months.

FWIW, I know they make CFL options for those lights. We had one like that on a detached shed when I was growing up. I know at one point we put a CFL bulb in it but I can't remember if we replaced the entire unit or not.

The CFL option is 65W vs 400W for the mercury vapor bulb. Some quick math on your estimated kWh rate shows that should save you about $40 a month. You'd pay for the replacement bulb/fixture in no time with that kind of savings (one month or less if all you need to do is replace the bulb).

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 22:00:08 EDT

rody_44 posted : Yea they are regular street lights. Im guessing i pay a little more than you. Turning both off yields about 50 bucks a month saving. Its just to dam dark for that tho. Wife already shredded this months electric bill. But i believe i am paying 9 cents for electricity supplier and than a distribution charge of around the same. So somewhere around 15 to 18 cent per kwh. Them babies suck the electric down. I put them up 20 years ago. No power saving with this vintage light. I did install a switch in the house to turn them off about 10 years ago. But in the first week of having them off someone stole my wifes car so that idea got kicked to the back burner. My son works for the electric company he figures they cost me 75 a month. But thats probably because he gets to listen to me bitch about my 325 dollar electric bills.

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 21:42:18 EDT

flaughs2000 posted :

said by iknow_t:

you're not going to save much with lighting. unless you have large grow bulbs operating 24/7.. in that case, that's what's drawing a lot of power. but it's true the starter will draw something without a bulb. much less than with a bulb though.. CFL or LED bulbs draw much less than a mercury vapor or sodium bulb, that's for sure..

If that's a 400W fixture @ 12Hrs a day @ $.12 that is roughly $17 a month.

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 21:39:57 EDT

flaughs2000 posted : I would pull the starter out of the top of it and cover the connection.

[Electrical] Re: outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 19:41:47 EDT

iknow_t posted : you're not going to save much with lighting. unless you have large grow bulbs operating 24/7.. in that case, that's what's drawing a lot of power. but it's true the starter will draw something without a bulb. much less than with a bulb though.. CFL or LED bulbs draw much less than a mercury vapor or sodium bulb, that's for sure..

[Electrical] outside lights

Thu, 26 Jun 2014 19:25:01 EDT

rody_44 posted : Im trying to cut down on my electric bill and i have these two lights mounted on my pole outside. I decided to cut down on my electric bill by climbing up and removing one of the bulbs. Somebody now told me the starter in the light still draws a current even without a bulb in it. Does anyone know if thats true? I would think no bulb would equal no draw on the starter. I really dont want to climb up at dusk to check and thought maybe someone would know.