Topic 'Looks like the Sens are moving downtown' in forum 'Canadian Chat' - dslreports.com

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 05 Jan 2016 19:41:10 EDT

kingb71 posted :

I can hardly wait for Rogers/Bell to start screaming that the ACC/Skydome are no good and they need a new one, please pay for it taxpayer.

I'm amazed this hasn't happened already! The SkyDome is already 25 years old & is a crappy facility.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 05 Jan 2016 18:53:27 EDT

bobnoxe posted : On the topic of Corporate welfare , there are 3 NFK teams looking to move to LA for the 2016 , all owned by billionaires. The 3 cities in jepoardy of losing their team are Oakland, St Louis and San Diego.

Each City is ready to pony up 100's of millions for a new stadium to keep the teams in town.

In St. Louis, the Rams’ stadium, Edward Jones Dome, is only 20 years old, and was renovated five years ago, but city and state officials are ready to flush that US$300-million investment and replace it with a new building just to keep the football team from decamping for the west coast.

San Diego officials, meanwhile, are promising to give him $350-million toward a new stadium to stay, which Chargers officials have sniffed at because there would have to be a public vote on the matter. The Chargers’ line is essentially that the San Diego voters won’t go for it — the referendum wouldn’t happen soon — so they would rather just move the team to L.A. now, thanks.

Just a joke, really it is, in the story Minnesota put up $500m for a new stadium for the Vikings (this is the team that the roof of their stadium collapsed due to all the snow and they couldn't play at home) financed by somebody playing an app(gambling) in a bar.. the money wasn't there.

I can hardly wait for Rogers/Bell to start screaming that the ACC/Skydome are no good and they need a new one, please pay for it taxpayer.

»news.nationalpost.com/sp ··· ts-teams

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 15:55:25 EDT

BigSensFan posted :

said by bt:

said by milnoc:

Access to a sports stadium is NEVER free!

I've attended a number of free events at the CTC. Those events certainly aren't as often as the free hours at museums, but they definitely do exist.

Plus all the things the team does in the community in regards to youth hockey and even the Sens Plex arenas
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"The hardest thing about any political campaign is how to win without proving that you are unworthy of winning." ~ Adlai E. Stevenson

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 15:27:14 EDT

bt posted :

said by milnoc:

Access to a sports stadium is NEVER free!

I've attended a number of free events at the CTC. Those events certainly aren't as often as the free hours at museums, but they definitely do exist.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 15:21:23 EDT

bt posted :

said by btech805:

Our city's $500M investment in Landsdowne, was a similar project (sports + commercial and residential) and while it wont pay the dividend we expected, it is still on track to make money for the city.

Has that changed again? As of the end of November, they were reporting all potential profit for the city had been wiped out.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 11:43:28 EDT

milnoc posted : Plus, access to the museum would be free on Thursday evenings after 4 PM, just as it already is in Ottawa's other museums. Access to a sports stadium is NEVER free!

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 11:06:47 EDT

Oldster posted :

said by milnoc:

I would prefer seeing a new Science and Technology museum built in the available space.

Big +1 on that!

Why build something that spends most of its time sitting empty, then costs a small fortune to get into when there's an event - when a museum would see a steady flow of visitors. With the War Museum nearby, it would make a 'Smithsonian - like' atmosphere in downtown Ottawa.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 08:57:53 EDT

HiVolt posted :

said by btech805:

said by HiVolt:

I wonder why... the current arena isn't that old... 20 years or so?

From what i have read, the arena (CTC) was built with a life-span of 30 years. it opened in 1996, so going into it's 20th year, the time is at least ripe to begin talking about what to do in the future. The arena is designed to be upgradeable and refurbished if desired, however in a government town, and with so many stakeholders, things move molasses so.

I began dating my girlfriend when the NCC first started cleaning up the land there to remove contaminated soul, prior to releasing a RFP, that was coming up on 4 years ago this March. I know this because her dad owns one of several trucking companies tasked with hauling that soil out of there at the time. There is still quite a bit of contam. Left from what I've heard, however that will be part of this contract. So that shows how long it takes just to get to this part where we can begin talking about what may go here.

With 10 years to go in the lifecycle of the CTC, the Sens & Melnyk must decide whether they move the building or undertake massive renos in 7-9 years time to bring the building to life. These reno's cost approximately what it would cost to build an entirely new arena. To put into perspective, the Sens put $15M into the rink just this past summer for upgrades & regular maintenance. That $15M is expected to grow over the next 10 years with on-going work required until the big "go or go home" time comes where they either renovate the arena or abandon it.

Yep, makes perfect sense... Never thought of it that way.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 08:21:47 EDT

milnoc posted : The reason the LRT is being built is because the Transitway was already reaching its maximum capacity. And unlike a high priced privately owned sporting venue that only benefits the wealthy a few nights per week, affordable mass transit benefits everyone on a constant basis.

I would prefer seeing a new Science and Technology museum built in the available space.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 08:01:18 EDT

MacGyver posted : The arena the Sens play in, whatever it's called this week, was built in the City of Kanata because what was the pre-amalgamation City of Ottawa at that time didn't want it.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 07:34:38 EDT

btech805 posted : John oliver does have an excellent show on publicly funded sports venues. I think the error up until now with the funding model is that the profits from this publicly invested venue stay private. If the government were to kick in 10% of the funding, they should be entitled to 10% or a similar portion of revenues until that debt it paid plus interest. When politicians speak of "investments" & "infrastructure" they've become catch words they throw around for everything under the sun when all we hear is "higher taxes".

A sports venue can be a true investment for government, one that actually makes money back for the funders and at medium-term cost to the payers. Rather than comparable to a $200M library, it is more similar to a $2.1B train we are building that will span all of...12 km. A train that once built will cost taxpayers on going monies because transit is always heavily subsidized by non-riders in order to keep up ridership. I am all for transit, however we had a bus transitway before that kept buses out of traffic for the most part and delivered a service with similar wait times we'll see from this train, and no employees will be laid off as a result of not needing buses along this stretch so where is the value or money making endeavor for tax payers vs. What we had before?
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My opinions are my own and do not represent the opinions or wishes of BCE or any of it's subsidiaries.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Wed, 16 Dec 2015 00:26:35 EDT

shaner posted :

said by bobnoxe:

The Calgary deal stinks to high heaven, very slop sided.

Don't get me started on CalgaryNext. It's ridiculous, overly ambitious, and 3/4 taxpayer funded.

I have a serious issue with public funding going towards generating revenue streams for private businesses. Ken King of the Flames keeps comparing his boondoggle to paying $200M for a new Central Library. Well, no Ken. A public library is exactly that, public. This arena/field house deal will not be free and open to the public. All events at the facility will be generating revenue for a private company, and the city will never recoup its investment. If Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver can all build their own arenas (ie: office buildings) then so can anybody else.

I think John Oliver had an excellent piece on Stadium Funding that I have yet to hear a reasonable rebuttal to.
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I'm a man, but I can change. If I have to. I guess.

»shaner38.blogspot.com/

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 20:51:35 EDT

btech805 posted : I know. :(

Unfortunately Melnyk isn't a billionaire any longer, and even if he were there's no way he has the money for a $1B+ project so the money is going to has to come from somewhere.

There will be quite a bit coming from commercial & residential leases and property sales on the site. If there ever was a cause for taxpayer injection, this has one of the few chances to actually make money. Our city's $500M investment in Landsdowne, was a similar project (sports + commercial and residential) and while it wont pay the dividend we expected, it is still on track to make money for the city.
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My opinions are my own and do not represent the opinions or wishes of BCE or any of it's subsidiaries.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 20:42:07 EDT

bobnoxe posted : It never works that way, and you know it. Governments consistently make bad deals, from the 407 ",Lease" to a request for a new type of tp.

No way Melkynk will give up parking revenue, thats pure gravy for him,the increased booze revenue and increased economic acvtivity, is partially offset by the losses from the previous location.

In Toronto th we Leafs moved down the street, sadness economic areas . The Blue Jays moved downtown , with the old location for Soccer. Big bucks.

I don't think ACC cost us anything, but we dowen to our skivvies on that deal. Toronto built "BMO," field , sold the naming rights cheap , and MLSE runs it for them.

The Calgary deal stinks to high heaven, very slop sided.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 20:36:58 EDT

btech805 posted :

said by HiVolt:

I wonder why... the current arena isn't that old... 20 years or so?

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 20:25:02 EDT

btech805 posted : I believe taxpayers have a role to play in sports entertainment complexes. We now finance and bankroll that makes so little sense, we might as well pay for a least a portion of something people will actually use.

I don't have a problem with taxpayers footing a portion of the bill, so long as it is a small portion of the total cost, and it brings value to the taxpayer. This project i would imagine will surpass $1B, if taxpayers were to kick inn say, $100M across 3, 4 or 5 levels of government, individually that doesn't amount to much, and the value $100M could bring back in parking revenues to the cities of ottawa & gatineau, provincially in liquor sales across the complex, and federally in business and payroll income, it wouldn't take long to payoff. Again the idea of Lebreton is more than an arena, but rather an entire "destination" which creates a multi-purpose zone year-round which will attract tourists, which will spread the tax burden from just an arena, compared to Edmonton and Mr. Katz's endeavor. Either way, $100M to bring in several hundreds of millions of dollars in revenue makes far more sense than any carbon tax, bicycle lane or turtle fence.
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My opinions are my own and do not represent the opinions or wishes of BCE or any of it's subsidiaries.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 19:50:13 EDT

HiVolt posted : I wonder why... the current arena isn't that old... 20 years or so?

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 19:28:52 EDT

Thane_Bitter posted : 100% if the owner could have it his way.

Re: Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 19:24:40 EDT

bobnoxe posted : I wonder how much the taxpayers on thge hook for that .

Looks like the Sens are moving downtown

Tue, 15 Dec 2015 19:22:31 EDT

btech805 posted : Both bids for lebreton flats to the NCC include an arena. While, not great for me because it'll be further away, All along the team should have been in the downtown area.

Lebreton flats has been an empty field other than bluesfest once a year for far too long in the absolute prime real estate. I can't think of any other major city in the world, let alone a capital city that has a 10 acre field right downtown prime for development. Unfortunately government moves slow, let alone 4 levels of government (municipal, provincial, federal & the NCC, a 5th & 6th if you count quebec & gatineau a bridge away) that have been attempting to redevelop this for as long as I have been alive.

If you ask me if Landsdowne were redeveloped properly, and not with a sole-sourced contract to Minto, that would have been the best spot for the Sens, provided the parking situation could have been solved. However we spent $500B developing Lansdowne and got half a new football stadium and the old arena, so Lebreton Flats will make the most sense.
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My opinions are my own and do not represent the opinions or wishes of BCE or any of it's subsidiaries.