Topic 'Re: It took only 3 seconds!' in forum 'Security' - dslreports.com

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Sat, 21 May 2016 18:37:02 EDT

EGeezer posted :

... remember the aborted switch to the metric system in the 1970s. The rest of the world had no trouble with that, either.

Sheldon: No. No, no, no, no.
Amy: What's wrong?
Sheldon: I've made a horrible mistake.
Amy: What are you talking about?
Sheldon: This table. It's in square centimeters. I read it in square meters. Do you know what that means?
Amy: That Americans can't handle the metric system?

--
If no mistake have you made, yet losing you are a different game you should play
- Yoda

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 22:09:31 EDT

Nanaki posted : Yeh postal carriers use to get a kick out of my bricks. Best your gona be able to do now is a letter sized 1/8 inch sheet of lead etc. It has to fit in the envelope now else they wont accept it.

The heaviest i heard about was like 250 pounds of rocks or some such. That was decades ago though. I know after mailing out around 8 or 10 regular bricks the amount of junk mail that we got at my house went way way down i wonder if i got black listed lol

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 21:42:32 EDT

Snowy posted :

said by jap:

Man after my own heart. Mine returns were rusty old nails, washers & bolts, padded by whatever paper crap they'd provide minus the identifying bits. I hope there were many thousands of us but I doubt it.

hmm, maybe I'm not as strange as I ...
I know a lot of people wanted to but didn't for a lot of good reasons but I laughed for a week about it.
American Express received a 17.5" x 11" x 10" carton that previously held 10 reams of white #20 bond paper.
Nothing toxic or disgusting, just office trash with a few items added for extra weight.
Post office even picked it up from the office with the 'regular' mail :)

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 21:15:55 EDT

jap posted :

said by Nanaki:

Oh jap there was a entire forum that use to exist dedicated to the practice...

What grand news! You've elevated my affection and sense of hope for humanity. :D

It was a 1980s thing for me so no safe online comradery.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 21:01:28 EDT

jap posted :

said by mackey:

nothing to do with collecting signatures for transactions.

Correct those were entry point links to the site. This CardFellow page, PIN debit vs. Signature Debit compares transaction costs of the two. None of which appears to be a one-size-fits-all calculus. Dunno if they've a similar page for CCs.

I'm content to not read more on the topic anytime soon. Have learned enough to alter my payment practices: more debit payments for consumables, use CC for durable goods over ~$50 to get the loss insurance. Also have more sympathy for retailers.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 20:46:08 EDT

Nanaki posted : Oh jap there was a entire forum that use to exist dedicated to the practice lol That and data fuzzing by emailing bank scammers fake info and filling in fake log in info on phising sites etc. They had a photo thread for people to post the most ridiculous items mailed to junk mail spammers. One guy mailed 50 pounds of lead others were like ten pounds of dog poop mixed with fish guts. All sorts of whacked stuff lol. Now any thing mailed has to fit in the envelope. But a letter sized 1/8 sheet of lead is still around 1 pound plus. So not as effective today as it was 15 years ago give or take but still yeh 1k people mail 1 pound lead sheets to junk mail clearing houses in buis reply it will sting a little.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 20:41:33 EDT

Nanaki posted : well just because it is a scam morally don't make it one in the legal sense. For it to be illegal when you send money you get nothing for it or it is bait and switch. Direct tv is a scam imo because they say 19.99 a month. But after fees taxes and more fees it is 70+ per month.

Im talking more along the lines of supposed charities that pocket 90% of the money Or my fav was a abortion clinic trying to get donations under the guise of a pregnancy center. I used their postage paid to send them a cinder block with the wholes filled with cement also. I figured out the cost of mailing the sucker and even back then it was like 30 bucks lol

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 20:34:21 EDT

jap posted : Man after my own heart. Mine returns were rusty old nails, washers & bolts, padded by whatever paper crap they'd provide minus the identifying bits. I hope there were many thousands of us but I doubt it.

said by kevinds:

Scammers usually didn't use Postage-Paid-Reply envelopes

Spammers = legal scammers ... sort of. :)

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 17:48:46 EDT

kevinds posted :

said by Nanaki:

Almost forgot im one of those guys who use to tape buis reply postage paid envelopes to bricks and mail them back to scammers

Scammers usually didn't use Postage-Paid-Reply envelopes, too easy to track them down.. Some junk mail groups, oh yes.

Too bad we can't do the same thing by email.

Receiver paid overnight courier bags to just mail the *taxes due for $27 billion deposit* as cash?

Humm that is an idea

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 17:06:18 EDT

Nanaki posted : No skin off my back lol. Id love to see all that postal junk mail in the dead letters pile at the post office generated by my fake address has to be pretty damn big :\

Almost forgot im one of those guys who use to tape buis reply postage paid envelopes to bricks and mail them back to scammers :)

So yeh defo not against wasting junk mailers money.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 16:57:02 EDT

mackey posted :

said by Nanaki:

Lit what i give them every time. I also use stuff like that for online accounts prepaid cell phone etc.

They don't care, they just want something to track you by. As long as you give them the same info every time their tracking system works and they're happy.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 12:24:31 EDT

Kearnstd posted : And this attitude is exactly why the US is laughed at. Switching to metric would not have made America any less great. Nor would switching to Chip and Pin.

But alas like the stupidity we are in the USA we cling to old ways just to try and look like we know better or something. Really its that too many Americans hate change.

Personally I think we need Chip&Pin and Metric... The Imperial system sucks.
--
Filan - Aurin Spellslinger - Pago - Team Legacy

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 06:33:18 EDT

Nanaki posted : I had walmart tell me i had to give them a real name before. I walk in buy something they ask for name etc so i say

Nanaki seto
address: 111 none street nowhere ohio 44203
Phone 3301234567

Lit what i give them every time. I also use stuff like that for online accounts prepaid cell phone etc.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 01:12:20 EDT

Snowy posted :

said by jap:

... but rather a retailer who collects signatures for CC transactions pays a lower overall transaction fee...

That's correct.
A pet peeve of mine too.
The rule of thumb is the more data a retailer captures from card holder the lower their fees will be.
Personally I'd rather pay a retailer the few cents they save instead of standing at a terminal waiting for the extended signature process to complete.

If the merchant saves a nickel by adding 15 seconds of my time to the checkout process it works out to $12 every hour saved by the merchant but costing 240 customers 15 seconds of extra terminal time.
A penny wise but pound foolish decision for retailers that go this route, IMO.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 01:06:44 EDT

mackey posted :

said by jap:

the fees vary by business and region on a number of criteria: one of them being signature versus no signature transaction plans. Seems there is no line item fee, per se, but rather a retailer who collects signatures for CC transactions pays a lower overall transaction fee

That's not what it says at all. "Signature" and "Signature Preferred" in this context is the type of credit account and is related to the rewards or perks that come with a particular card; it has nothing to do with collecting signatures for transactions.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 18 May 2016 00:49:16 EDT

mackey posted : The company I work for. We're much too small to negotiate with Visa and friends directly, so we get what's known as "interchange plus pricing" - basically Visa's published fees (we fall under "CPS/Retail") plus a small additional markup by our provider. If you read that price list you will see there's no "signature authorization fee" listed, and our provider does not have such a fee either; it must be something in the agreement Walmart negotiated with Visa.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Tue, 17 May 2016 23:54:45 EDT

jap posted : The article mentions such a fee and reader discussion is where the amount of 5cents comes from. Someone also mentioned that small retailers fees are structured differently than negotiated deals with large retailers. It's not an area I know much about so am relying upon that one Ars page and Wiki's entry for the Durbin Amendment and interchange fees.
»en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Du ··· mendment

With your word 'we' do you reference the U.S. or some retailer you work for?

edit:
Transaction Fees go to issuing bank, not the card company. According to the below CC processing consulting & contract "plan" brokering company the fees vary by business and region on a number of criteria: one of them being signature versus no signature transaction plans. Seems there is no line item fee, per se, but rather a retailer who collects signatures for CC transactions pays a lower overall transaction fee; the difference being buried in tiered plans.
»www.cardfellow.com/inter ··· nge-fee/
»www.cardfellow.com/tiere ··· ge-plus/

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Tue, 17 May 2016 22:00:46 EDT

mackey posted :

said by jap:

U.S.-based brick&mortar retailers are levied a five cent 'signature authorization fee'.

We do not get charged any such fee, my guess is Walmart demanded such low rates from Visa et al that they were forced to accept this "signature authorization fee" due to the increased chance of fraud for those transactions (vs PIN).

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Tue, 17 May 2016 21:59:40 EDT

Nanaki posted : They clip on to the bezel and can be pulled off with little effort. The way they work is the skimmer reads the mag strip and copies the data from the strip to internal memory. Meaning the crook has to retrieve the device at some point to download it. Some likely use nfc or wifi to transmit but most are usb and need to be plugged in to a computer to download the stored data.

Meaning yes you can pull them off pretty easy. When ever i use a atm i pull on the card reader slot same for pos terms.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Tue, 17 May 2016 21:14:24 EDT

jap posted :

said by jap:

said by kevinds:

Yes, I also don't understand what the issue is...

Cultural exceptionalism in action: we have nothing to learn from your experiences. We'll do it our way.
Seriously. That's all it is: an unfortunate form of collective stupid.

Whoops!, I was wrong: it's good ol' American grade-A greed & regulatory capture. Duh! We shoulda known.

In addition to the usual percent-of-sale cut paid to card issuers, U.S.-based brick&mortar retailers are levied a five cent 'signature authorization fee'. You know, for paying the poor sap who may have to authorize that touch-screen scrawl you made.

Now I want to know the average number of daily U.S. face-to-face credit card transactions.

Kudos to Senator Dick Durbin (D,IL) for kicking up some dust on this. Turns out he's also the guy who inserted the amendment which disallowed authorization fees to be changed on debit cards when they first emerged.

»arstechnica.com/business ··· ersight/

I hope the retailers get a massive pay-out award from the courts. They've been totally screwed on this one.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 07 Apr 2016 11:03:31 EDT

CylonRed posted : The back-end processors have to get inline for the change as well. Once businesses realized the need and such - some maybe waiting to jump directly to chip/pin rather than chip/signature and then chip/pin.
--
Brian

"It drops into your stomach like a Abrams's tank.... driven by Rosanne Barr..." A. Bourdain

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 07 Apr 2016 08:21:41 EDT

scross posted : The truly wise man profits from the mistakes of others. And a "sharp" one will find ways to help nudge those mistakes into fruition. :)

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 06 Apr 2016 22:00:47 EDT

OZO posted : Only a fool learns from his own mistakes. The wise man learns from the mistakes of others -- Bismarck, Otto von
--
Keep it simple, it'll become complex by itself...

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 06 Apr 2016 19:00:16 EDT

jap posted :

said by kevinds:

Yes, I also don't understand what the issue is...

Cultural exceptionalism in action: we have nothing to learn from your experiences. We'll do it our way.

Seriously. That's all it is: an unfortunate form of collective stupid.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 06 Apr 2016 12:20:05 EDT

kevinds posted : And when they have the terminals and still don't use them?

Why to the terminals with a chip reader need a software update? More likely just a configuration change, somebody turned it off...

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 06 Apr 2016 10:03:20 EDT

CylonRed posted :

said by kevinds:

I don't understand what the issue is.. Seems like many are just making excuses, it isn't that hard to accomplish.

It is very simple - business does not want to pay for the new terminals. This is one of the problems with the 'open' market. More important to make money and to hell with consumers. The longer they can put it off the more potential profits for the shareholders. This is the same basic reason why a lot of regulations exist - most should no be needed but they are so cost adverse that they have to be forced to do the right thing many times
--
Brian

"It drops into your stomach like a Abrams's tank.... driven by Rosanne Barr..." A. Bourdain

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 06 Apr 2016 01:20:49 EDT

kevinds posted : My dad still gets funny looks in the US when he has to punch in his PIN after inserting his chip card...

Yes, I also don't understand what the issue is...

Was done in the past 5 years for credit cards.. Debit cards always had a PIN, credit cards, just a got told, you will need a PIN to do most transactions from now on.. Choose your PIN when activating your card or your PIN will come in the mail in a couple days (depends on the issuer)

Bit of confusion for a couple months by some customers (but staggered for when they got the new cards, not everybody at once), and the switch was done.

I don't understand what the issue is.. Seems like many are just making excuses, it isn't that hard to accomplish.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Fri, 01 Apr 2016 13:59:57 EDT

Phoenix22 posted : ya, not cool, bro...........lol

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 31 Mar 2016 17:10:59 EDT

Snowy posted :

said by Mele20:

This nation is now a bunch of sissies that won't stand up for themselves.

Yeah, hiding behind the safety of anonymous posting via pseudo name on public forum is how the few remaining real patriots stand up for themselves.
/sarcasm

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 31 Mar 2016 11:18:37 EDT

AsherN posted : Just, wow. Canada switched to metric.

The system makes a lot more sense, leads to a lot fewer mistakes. Recipe calls for 8 oz of flour. By weight or by volume? 1 quart of milk. US or Imperial?

Not switching also means a lot of industries need to keep 2 sets of tools.

There does reach a point where being pig headed just for it's own sake makes no sense.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 31 Mar 2016 09:40:55 EDT

Mele20 posted : Most of the rest of the world has always used the metric system so how could they have had or not had trouble switching since they didn't switch?

This nation is now a bunch of sissies that won't stand up for themselves. I grew up when we were the greatest nation on the face of this earth and we were proud to NOT adopt the metric system. Now we are afraid of our shadows and lost our will to be the world's dominant power so we have to adopt the stupid metric system. Damn shame. At least it was killed in the 70's because we still believed in ourselves and were powerful enough to forge OUR OWN path but now we are a pitiful shell of what we were until 9/11.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 31 Mar 2016 07:25:17 EDT

DrStrange posted : Some of us understand only too well, having been around long enough to remember the aborted switch to the metric system in the 1970s. The rest of the world had no trouble with that, either.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Tue, 29 Mar 2016 14:40:32 EDT

AsherN posted :

said by Mele20:

said by voxframe:

We converted to chip and pin in Canada and it was quick, easy, flawless, and works 10 times better

But of course and the facts you state have zero to do with perceived Canadian superiority over hapless Americans. The reason most of the world (Canada included) had little problem in the beginning or later with the switch over has been stated many times here. Are you just pretending to not understand? Seems that way.

We're not pretending to not understand. We truly don't understand why it seems that the move to chip-and-pin in the US appears to be so complicated and a virtually impossible task when it has been accomplished in the rest of the world so easily.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Tue, 29 Mar 2016 12:52:28 EDT

planet posted : Just got a new card from Target and they are using chip & pin. Wonder why others haven't gone there too.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 23 Mar 2016 10:01:19 EDT

garys_2k posted :

said by MPScan:

Sadly, the current implementation of chip cards only get us part of the way there. Chip cards should be two-factor like they are overseas. Our implementation requires the card and a signature. That's no more secure than in decades past.

I wouldn't go that far. Chip and signature is better because there's no way for a fake card to properly respond to the encrypted query required for the transaction to go through. Even if your card's chip transaction is skimmed, like that Mexican scanner in that other thread does, that data is useless for other transactions requiring the chip.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 23 Mar 2016 08:49:30 EDT

Mele20 posted : Yeah, there was a link to the Consumerist article in another thread here. It was quite interesting.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 23 Mar 2016 08:48:13 EDT

Mele20 posted :

said by voxframe:

We converted to chip and pin in Canada and it was quick, easy, flawless, and works 10 times better

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 23 Mar 2016 08:36:41 EDT

MacGyver posted :

said by Mele20:

Why? Most of the terminals are Verifone so are they the culprit?

The answer is complicated.
»consumerist.com/2016/03/ ··· r-fraud/

»www.nytimes.com/2016/03/ ··· rss&_r=0

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 23 Mar 2016 07:50:18 EDT

voxframe posted :

said by scross:

I don't really buy all of the excuses being given, though; some of them just sound like stalling tactics to me.

Bigtime!
We converted to chip and pin in Canada and it was quick, easy, flawless, and works 10 times better. Been that way for over 5 years now I think.

As an added laugh, I took a trip to the US last week... ALL of my cards were demagnetized (Probably for months and I didn't know it because chips worked perfectly). So that was interesting. But it's like the stone-ages going down there, so much possibility of skimming that it's scary.

Anyone complaining that it's a bad move, or so complicated that it will melt the system, is nothing more than one of those people barking Y2K. Chip came in, and poof, nothing crazy happened. They just worked.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 23 Mar 2016 05:20:19 EDT

scross posted : I can think of a few simple potential defenses against what's shown in the video. I'm not sure why the industry isn't being more proactive on this stuff.

As for delays in implementing chip-enabled terminals, there are several links in the following thread which cover this in some detail. I don't really buy all of the excuses being given, though; some of them just sound like stalling tactics to me.

»Chip Card and Readers at Rite Aids

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 10:12:39 EDT

MPScan posted : Sadly, the current implementation of chip cards only get us part of the way there. Chip cards should be two-factor like they are overseas. Our implementation requires the card and a signature. That's no more secure than in decades past.

Once we all finally get to chip and PIN, now we're talking. :)

.. but I believe there is something crazy like a ten year buffer period to transition. :uhh:

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 10:12:28 EDT

beck posted : So, how hard is that thing to take off? Can you combat this by trying to rip the pos apart?
--
Are YOU just a turkey voting for xmas?

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 10:03:44 EDT

timcuth posted : I would think stores would want to go to the chip card acceptance. My understanding is that if they don't, they are liable for any fraudulent cards they accept (i.e., they would not receive payment for whatever they sold). But if they use a chip reader, the card issuer accepts some or all of the responsibility.

Tim
--
"Life is like this long line, except at the end there ain't no merry-go-round." - Arthur on The King of Queens
~ Project Hope ~

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 09:32:06 EDT

Mele20 posted : Yes, I see that here in Hawaii also. I don't understand it. Even with Target, it was almost a YEAR after our store got new terminals that could take chip cards before the software was operable. Tractor Supply is another company that got the new terminals months ago but no software yet. Ross is another one that has had the terminals for about six months but no software. Why? Most of the terminals are Verifone so are they the culprit?
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 09:22:33 EDT

nwrickert posted :

said by Mele20:

The article is poor as it tells readers to use the ATM in a bank. What does that non-sequitur have to do with that terminal that was for PAYING for items bought in the store? The article should have told readers to NOT use POS terminals in stores that cannot take chip cards.

The problem that I am seeing, is that many stores have POS terminals that can take chip cards, but have not updated their software so as to use that chip card capability.
--
AT&T Uverse; 2Wire 3800-HGV router; openSuSE 42.1; Plasma 5; firefox 44.0.2

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 01:50:20 EDT

Mele20 posted : That's interesting that no one noticed even when the second guy reached out and adjusted it as it was loose.

The article is poor as it tells readers to use the ATM in a bank. What does that non-sequitur have to do with that terminal that was for PAYING for items bought in the store? The article should have told readers to NOT use POS terminals in stores that cannot take chip cards. Protest to the clerk, walk out and take your business to a store that has modern terminals.
--
When governments fear people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. Thomas Jefferson

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Thu, 17 Mar 2016 00:10:56 EDT

Oregonian posted :

»youtu.be/y83ZgzuFBSE

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 16 Mar 2016 23:44:37 EDT

Black Box posted :

said by jaykaykay:

http :// mangled address /watch-thieves-install-fake-card-scanner-in-seconds.html

Be careful, very careful, when you use these things. Might not even be a bad idea to shake them or move it around a bit before using it.

Be careful, very careful visiting that website! I have no less than 20 untrusted domains blocked in NoScript on that page!

You should find a better source for you postings. Not cool, bro!
--
Keep It Safe, Stupid!
Yes, I CanChat. Can You?

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 16 Mar 2016 22:04:37 EDT

jaykaykay posted : Truly remarkable. I had to do the same thing. If it can be installed like that, we're all in for trouble.

Re: It took only 3 seconds!

Wed, 16 Mar 2016 21:52:43 EDT

Snowy posted : It installed so quickly I had to view the video twice to see the skimmer get attached. Completely missed it first time around.